Debunking the PH Supercar Badge of Honour
Discussion
Some on the PH Supercar Forum take it as a Badge of Honour to state that their supercars have been driven xxxx miles within a timeframe of yyyy weeks , OR suggest of their supercars : '' Just Drive it '' .
I suggest that neither of these approaches has much to recommend for themselves .
Instead I would suggest that driving a car in its most appropriate setting , and when the driver is in the correct mindset , allows the driver to best extract the essence of that car .
This might mean that the car is used a lot less than it otherwise would be , but at least the car is being used appropriately .
There is little to learn , or enjoy , from driving a supercar in Mayfair .
When I am driving to work , all I want is a car that will get me there in the most unstressed condition possible , so that I can get on with the day's job .
Now , unlike 20 years ago , I find that I can best enjoy my cars abroad --- because the roads are less congested , and because legislation in some countries allow for the cars to be exercised .
This automatically means less mileage covered in the UK , but I am entirely unfussed by this .... the anticipation simply stokes the desire .
And when I am driving for pleasure , I will take the time to find out the most appropriate road for the chosen car , and more importantly the best time of the day to enjoy that road .
Simply looking at mileage covered , or seat time , gives little indication of the enjoyment that can be extracted from a car .
This thread was a long time coming , but I am initiating this thread now after I reading the '' Low mileage and Values '' thread that was posted on Monday .
In response to that thread I wrote :
'' The OP's primary message is that the are distinct disadvantages in not enjoying your car for the moving vehicle that it is because of a fear of losing money .
I entirely agree with that .
The secondary unspoken message is that the car should be used a lot , and this is where I entirely disagree .
The car should be used APPROPRIATELY .
And if circumstances dictate ( time , roads , state of mind ) , and the car is driven little so be it .
I have no experience of the rarefied world of Hypercars , but using any car in an ‘’ inappropriate “ setting purely to use it , and to simply give credence to being a “ Supercar Enthusiast Driver ‘’ , is almost as much of a folly as being the victim of the “ Tyranny of Low Mileage “ club that the OP so enthusiastically denigrates .
Sorry to spoil the party .
Incidentally if you buy a car to keep , mileage and depreciation are totally irrelevant ..... and simply dont appear on the radar .
I think that there might be value in a new thread to examine the PH badge of honour that is
“ just drive it “
OR
“I drive it xxxx miles every yyyy weeks “
I would say “ drive a car ( for pleasure ) in the appropriate setting , so that you have the best chance of extracting some special essence of that particular car “
This ethos is as applicable to an MX5 as it is to a Chiron . ''
Surely it is time we stopped worshipping at the altar of using a microsurgical scalpel for a job where a chainsaw would be more appropriate ?
I suggest that neither of these approaches has much to recommend for themselves .
Instead I would suggest that driving a car in its most appropriate setting , and when the driver is in the correct mindset , allows the driver to best extract the essence of that car .
This might mean that the car is used a lot less than it otherwise would be , but at least the car is being used appropriately .
There is little to learn , or enjoy , from driving a supercar in Mayfair .
When I am driving to work , all I want is a car that will get me there in the most unstressed condition possible , so that I can get on with the day's job .
Now , unlike 20 years ago , I find that I can best enjoy my cars abroad --- because the roads are less congested , and because legislation in some countries allow for the cars to be exercised .
This automatically means less mileage covered in the UK , but I am entirely unfussed by this .... the anticipation simply stokes the desire .
And when I am driving for pleasure , I will take the time to find out the most appropriate road for the chosen car , and more importantly the best time of the day to enjoy that road .
Simply looking at mileage covered , or seat time , gives little indication of the enjoyment that can be extracted from a car .
This thread was a long time coming , but I am initiating this thread now after I reading the '' Low mileage and Values '' thread that was posted on Monday .
In response to that thread I wrote :
'' The OP's primary message is that the are distinct disadvantages in not enjoying your car for the moving vehicle that it is because of a fear of losing money .
I entirely agree with that .
The secondary unspoken message is that the car should be used a lot , and this is where I entirely disagree .
The car should be used APPROPRIATELY .
And if circumstances dictate ( time , roads , state of mind ) , and the car is driven little so be it .
I have no experience of the rarefied world of Hypercars , but using any car in an ‘’ inappropriate “ setting purely to use it , and to simply give credence to being a “ Supercar Enthusiast Driver ‘’ , is almost as much of a folly as being the victim of the “ Tyranny of Low Mileage “ club that the OP so enthusiastically denigrates .
Sorry to spoil the party .
Incidentally if you buy a car to keep , mileage and depreciation are totally irrelevant ..... and simply dont appear on the radar .
I think that there might be value in a new thread to examine the PH badge of honour that is
“ just drive it “
OR
“I drive it xxxx miles every yyyy weeks “
I would say “ drive a car ( for pleasure ) in the appropriate setting , so that you have the best chance of extracting some special essence of that particular car “
This ethos is as applicable to an MX5 as it is to a Chiron . ''
Surely it is time we stopped worshipping at the altar of using a microsurgical scalpel for a job where a chainsaw would be more appropriate ?
Edited by carspath on Wednesday 16th September 18:48
TCruise.... Thank you for your considered response copied below :
( '' I only raise this as you've been so detailed in your evaluation of language and phrases concerning driving cars and car ownership.
Firstly, surely this goes against your own views that a car should only be driven when "appropriate"? If you have no concern about future value, you are actually more likely to drive it when INappropriate, driving around town centres (Mayfair as you put it), putting considerable mileage on the car, getting shopping trolley dings etc because you are not thinking of residuals every time you get into the drivers seat.
Conversely, a car that is not a keeper, and is an investment, if you drive it at all you're more likely to only drive it on special occasions. Something you would seem to define as more "appropriate".
"Buying a car to keep, " aka "a keeper, " is a phrase that I have found to be mostly overused and mostly incorrect. Very very few of us would own a car for 25+ years.
That phrase "keeper" is often used prior to purchase, or in the first year of ownership, when the novelty has not warn off, the warm feelings of achievement remain and the car has not become just another fixture of your life.
I wonder how many "keepers" are sold within 5-7yrs of purchase. '' )
I too don't like the term ''keeper '' , simply because you don't know what tomorrow will throw at you , so you can never be sure that you will be able to hang on to anything material ... especially something as inconsequential as a toy car .
I think that one should see any and every car as a depreciating asset .
When i talk about using a car ''appropriately '' what i mean is using it in circumstances where I can
1) really enjoy the experience OR
2) learn something about its dynamics
And for me , I get little of either , pottering about in a supercar to the supermarket , or in a city centre .
A supercar at 20 mph in a traffic jam , or manoeuvring around pedestrians pushing trolleys in a car park , neither entertains me , nor educates me .
Why anyone would one to use a supercar for these purposes totally eludes me ..... unless one likes posing , I suppose .
To me its simply using an inappropriate tool for a given job .
Moving on to your second point -- I have to very seriously consider each car purchase simply because I cannot afford to buy all the cars I like , or indeed even a tiny proportion of the cars I adore .
So I have to save up , and buy only what I really , really want .
And once i have done that , I find that I never want to sell , unless really , really forced to .
I have only ever sold 2 cars for money or garage space ... and on each occasion it was only because something that I had lusted for even more finally turned up , or finally became affordable on the second hand market .
The first car I bought ( or more accurately , thank you Mum and Dad ) was just about the first Fiat UNO to come into the UK , and I researched that car more than I did my studies .
I kept it for 11 years , drove it around the Fens to and beyond its rev limit in every gear , cornered it onto 2 wheels without toppling over ( thank you car ) , and practically cried when rust finally took it away from me .
Ditto a Triumph Spitfire that I should have sold the day after I bought it , but instead persevered with for 10 years . British Leyland in 1975 was not a manufacturer to buy from , but Michelotti had designed a beautiful body , and you could tuck the rear wheel under the body during cornering without trying too hard . Only sold it because I had to go to Toronto for a Fellowship .
Ditto my beloved Series 1 MX5 , now 28 years old , and 18 years in my custody , although rust is trying to steal her from me .
Every car I have bought has stayed for at least 9 years , some for over 2 decades .
Everyone of my everyday cars have left me only for the scrapyard
The whole point of starting this thread was :
1) simply to say to people that supercars can give a really concentrated hit of joy and pleasure when used in their ideal environment .
And so much frustration when used in a setting when a more mundane car could have done a better job .
2) to expose the hypocrisy that simply driving a supercar lots , in whatever the circumstances , is in itself a good and commendable thing .
( '' I only raise this as you've been so detailed in your evaluation of language and phrases concerning driving cars and car ownership.
Firstly, surely this goes against your own views that a car should only be driven when "appropriate"? If you have no concern about future value, you are actually more likely to drive it when INappropriate, driving around town centres (Mayfair as you put it), putting considerable mileage on the car, getting shopping trolley dings etc because you are not thinking of residuals every time you get into the drivers seat.
Conversely, a car that is not a keeper, and is an investment, if you drive it at all you're more likely to only drive it on special occasions. Something you would seem to define as more "appropriate".
"Buying a car to keep, " aka "a keeper, " is a phrase that I have found to be mostly overused and mostly incorrect. Very very few of us would own a car for 25+ years.
That phrase "keeper" is often used prior to purchase, or in the first year of ownership, when the novelty has not warn off, the warm feelings of achievement remain and the car has not become just another fixture of your life.
I wonder how many "keepers" are sold within 5-7yrs of purchase. '' )
I too don't like the term ''keeper '' , simply because you don't know what tomorrow will throw at you , so you can never be sure that you will be able to hang on to anything material ... especially something as inconsequential as a toy car .
I think that one should see any and every car as a depreciating asset .
When i talk about using a car ''appropriately '' what i mean is using it in circumstances where I can
1) really enjoy the experience OR
2) learn something about its dynamics
And for me , I get little of either , pottering about in a supercar to the supermarket , or in a city centre .
A supercar at 20 mph in a traffic jam , or manoeuvring around pedestrians pushing trolleys in a car park , neither entertains me , nor educates me .
Why anyone would one to use a supercar for these purposes totally eludes me ..... unless one likes posing , I suppose .
To me its simply using an inappropriate tool for a given job .
Moving on to your second point -- I have to very seriously consider each car purchase simply because I cannot afford to buy all the cars I like , or indeed even a tiny proportion of the cars I adore .
So I have to save up , and buy only what I really , really want .
And once i have done that , I find that I never want to sell , unless really , really forced to .
I have only ever sold 2 cars for money or garage space ... and on each occasion it was only because something that I had lusted for even more finally turned up , or finally became affordable on the second hand market .
The first car I bought ( or more accurately , thank you Mum and Dad ) was just about the first Fiat UNO to come into the UK , and I researched that car more than I did my studies .
I kept it for 11 years , drove it around the Fens to and beyond its rev limit in every gear , cornered it onto 2 wheels without toppling over ( thank you car ) , and practically cried when rust finally took it away from me .
Ditto a Triumph Spitfire that I should have sold the day after I bought it , but instead persevered with for 10 years . British Leyland in 1975 was not a manufacturer to buy from , but Michelotti had designed a beautiful body , and you could tuck the rear wheel under the body during cornering without trying too hard . Only sold it because I had to go to Toronto for a Fellowship .
Ditto my beloved Series 1 MX5 , now 28 years old , and 18 years in my custody , although rust is trying to steal her from me .
Every car I have bought has stayed for at least 9 years , some for over 2 decades .
Everyone of my everyday cars have left me only for the scrapyard
The whole point of starting this thread was :
1) simply to say to people that supercars can give a really concentrated hit of joy and pleasure when used in their ideal environment .
And so much frustration when used in a setting when a more mundane car could have done a better job .
2) to expose the hypocrisy that simply driving a supercar lots , in whatever the circumstances , is in itself a good and commendable thing .
OP here -- thank you for ALL the comments -- its good to hear different opinions , it stimulates discussion , and gives food for thought .
The ''hypocrisy'' word has, as anticipated , drawn attention and comment , and was used deliberately .
None of the contributors who have so proudly posted photos of their supercars in supermarket car parks etc , have been able to explain why anyone half sensible would willingly want to take a very wide bodied supercar with limited outward visibility to a supermarket of all places !
I mean WHY ?!
Other than for posing , why would you want to parade around in a supercar in a supermarket car park ?
And yes , I know that a supercar can be driven to a supermarket ( after all some of you have proven that with photos ) , but exactly what does that prove ?
It seems to suggest nothing more than that either the driver has only one car , the driver has not chosen the most appropriate tool for the job , or that the driver is badly in need of an ego-boost ..... or am I missing something else , in which case please enlighten me .
I would choose , were I fortunate enough to have a supercar , to drive my supercar solo ( ie not in a convoy ) , in the very early hours of the day , when the roads are clear and the traffic non-existent .
I would never willingly choose to drive it to a supermarket, which is the antithesis of all of the above ..... a Fiesta or a MX5 would be more suitable .
Driving a supercar to supermarkets and the like , merely to accumulate mileage , and then to hold up said mileage as a PH Badge of Honour seems either misplaced or hypocritical , hence the use of the word , and the title of the thread .
Considered , well argued replies would further this discussion , and keep us all informed and amused .
The ''hypocrisy'' word has, as anticipated , drawn attention and comment , and was used deliberately .
None of the contributors who have so proudly posted photos of their supercars in supermarket car parks etc , have been able to explain why anyone half sensible would willingly want to take a very wide bodied supercar with limited outward visibility to a supermarket of all places !
I mean WHY ?!
Other than for posing , why would you want to parade around in a supercar in a supermarket car park ?
And yes , I know that a supercar can be driven to a supermarket ( after all some of you have proven that with photos ) , but exactly what does that prove ?
It seems to suggest nothing more than that either the driver has only one car , the driver has not chosen the most appropriate tool for the job , or that the driver is badly in need of an ego-boost ..... or am I missing something else , in which case please enlighten me .
I would choose , were I fortunate enough to have a supercar , to drive my supercar solo ( ie not in a convoy ) , in the very early hours of the day , when the roads are clear and the traffic non-existent .
I would never willingly choose to drive it to a supermarket, which is the antithesis of all of the above ..... a Fiesta or a MX5 would be more suitable .
Driving a supercar to supermarkets and the like , merely to accumulate mileage , and then to hold up said mileage as a PH Badge of Honour seems either misplaced or hypocritical , hence the use of the word , and the title of the thread .
Considered , well argued replies would further this discussion , and keep us all informed and amused .
Edited by carspath on Monday 5th October 16:17
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