Timing belt/camshaft issue

[Vagabondrobb]

Hi guys,

First post on here, hoping someone might be able to enlighten me on a timing belt/cam problem...

Basically while my volvo v70 was awaiting parts (steering knuckle and tie rods etc) I decided to put a new timing belt on, seeing as the kit was lying around and I didn't know when/if it had been done (we're at the 120,000 mark).

Anyway, due to monumental stupidity, while attempting to remove the crankshaft bolt (without the correct tool, and after failing to keep it locked by brake/gear), I shoved a bolt into the camshaft pulley (right through) to lock it that way... After a big push on the breaker bar, the crank jumped forward with a clanging noise. With the bolt still not cracked I realized I'd done something stupid.

Put it all back together and now engine just turns and won't fire. No catastrophic noises, but obviously I've done something not good.

Possibly jumped timing? Or sheared camshaft dowel?

I'm worried I've buggered the rods etc.

Is there a way to tell without taking the rocker case etc off (Volvo haven't made that easy).

Mechanic told me if I could peer down the oil fill with a torch while someone turned the engine over, I could see if camshaft turns, butt of course Volvo have put the oil filler on the side!

Anyone a lot smarter than me have any ideas/advice? (Other than buying a new engine!)


Cheers!

Robb

[Vagabondrobb]

stevieturbo said:

I don't understand how you could "put it back together" without actually realising something was wrong long before you actually finished the job ?

Was anything/everything actually aligned correctly with all marks ? Surely when rotating the crank by hand ( bar obviously ) after belt fit....you would feel or see a problem long before you ever even thought about making an attempt with the starter ?

It has to be said, if it's a D5 like mine was, it really is an extremely easy vehicle to do a belt on.

Sorry my bad. Crankshaft pulley had to come off in order to remove belt… so that’s as far as I got. It’s a 2.0d, not sure how similar they are?

[Vagabondrobb]

bearman68 said:

OP have you put the timing back to the marks? As StevieT says it's not the most difficult cambelt to change, but it clearly won't work when the timing is out.
Do you have compression on all 5 when you turn the engine by hand?

If you only have compression on a number of cylinders less than 5, then bad things have happened.

If it's any consolation, we've all done stupid things, and buggered the engine while doing a cam belt. A colleague mistimed a V12 and bent everything.

Thankyou, I do feel pretty stupid!

[Vagabondrobb]

Polly Grigora said:

Taking it that you put it back together without replacing the belt because you couldn't get the crank pulley off

Full breaker bar load was applied to the cam belt and onwards to the camshaft pulley

Either the teeth of the belt will have been dragged over one of the pulleys, belt teeth been stripped, belt snapped or the pulley broken

Exactly yes! Although I’m pretty sure the belt didn't get stripped (and definitely didn’t snap), and the pulley seemed fine. Thought maybe a camshaft dowel got sheared, but don’t know much about how that would work, and not sure if the engine has gears for timing etc. I also read that there is a chain linking the intake cam (which is driven by timing belt) and the outake cam… possibly that slipped?!

I think I will have to get the rocker case off today. Looks a bit more complicated than on an old Land Rover…

[Vagabondrobb]

stevieturbo said:

you can be sure the chain is not the problem.

First things first, get it apart and check if anything is aligned correctly with any timing marks.

Can't comment on the 2.0, only worked on the 5cyls

Although as with most things these days...Youtube has someone showing how to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxKyvvinTdw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGs_QuNSB2c

I’ve just aligned the camshaft pulley and with the timing pin inserted, the flywheel is about 12 degrees off where it should be (the timing holes in both the flywheel housing and the wheel itself do not align).

So I’ve knocked the timing off. I’m imagining while moving crankshaft with timing pin in camshaft pulley I’ve broke the camshaft dowel that keeps it all aligned?!

Can anyone tell me how easy it is to take rocker cover off? Don’t have time now to try, but it looks fidgety.

Edited by Vagabondrobb on Saturday 23 April 16:46

[Vagabondrobb]

I'm fairly confident the belt did not jump any teeth, and I heard a horrible clunk, hence the dowel theory. It's a theory i am certainly not wedded to.

So you're saying correct timing and THEN check for compression by hand turning?

Robb

[Vagabondrobb]

Haha ok. Thanks to all for the advice, I will report back!

Robb

[Vagabondrobb]

Fairly sure that's what these forums are for. Workshop manual (which I have) is one thing, but no substitute for asking knowledgeable people for advice. I messed up, it was cold and pissing with rain - I was rushing a job I shouldn't have rushed. Life goes on.

[Vagabondrobb]

InitialDave said:

What kind of tensioner do these have for the cambelt? If you were undoing the crank bolt and turning the crank backwards, with the cam pulley locked, you'd be loading up the "non drive" run of the belt where the tensioner sits, and the noise you heard could have been the tensioner being forcibly backed off as the belt received far more load than it ever would normally on that side.

Hmmm that’s a good thought! It’s manually torqued up I believe - there’s an alignment tooth on the tensioner. I’m waiting for the flywheel locking tool and an extra long extension for my 3/4 drive breaker to get the crank pulley off (the only way to get a bar on it is out the side of the wheel arch), so I will have a closer look when it all gets here!

[Vagabondrobb]

stevieturbo said:

Surely there are visible markings that you do not need to waste money on locking tools just yet ?

You've said the alignment is out...so there must be markings ? Just correct it for now and rotate by hand and see how it feels.

I know it sounds simple, but timing belt runs behind the crankshaft pulley, which has to come off for belt to be removed. The reason I got into this mess in the first place was because I didn’t have a tool to lock the crankshaft (via flywheel) so that I could remove pulley bolt, which is torqued extremely tightly, and foolishly locked the camshaft pulley as a substitute, which led to the problem. So I never got the belt off…

Edited by Vagabondrobb on Monday 25th April 21:08

[Vagabondrobb]

Well the locking tool arrived today and an extension to get at the bolt arriving tomorrow (although Hermes are delivering so God only knows)... I have a fat breaker with a 3/4 drive and half a scaffolding pole so hoping that will do the job!

[Vagabondrobb]

Thanks, great tip!

[Vagabondrobb]

So realligned the timing and got the new belt on, physically cranked a few rotations and all seemed ok, got to starting her up and... no start. Got around to inspect cams and found the first valve lifter I could see on intake was limp and wobbling about.

Not taking it any further and looking for a second hand engine. Lesson learned the hard way

Thanks to all who tried to help, much appreciated.

Robb

[Vagabondrobb]

For what it's worth, I've swapped engines, changed clutches and gearboxes and all sorts of exciting things over the past 15 years, and saved a lot of money in doing so. It's also (mostly) fun and I like getting my hands dirty. I may have more or less fked my engine but I've walked away having learned about timing and camshafts, which is evidentially a part of a car I have neglected for too long.

Again thank you to all who have given advice. On a side note though, I've also gotten some contempt on this thread, which is actually totally fine, because it has reminded me why I sacked off social media all those years ago. Cheers!

[Vagabondrobb]

Love you too

[Vagabondrobb]

I've sourced a replacement engine, with injectors, seems the sinplest way forward.

[Vagabondrobb]

Jeff J said:

Sorry to resurrect this thread, I've only just read it.

Is this the Peugeot 2litre HDI engine ?

If it is, it is designed to break the cam followers, rather than bending the valves when they strike the pistons.

Hi, yes the 2.0d is the same engine - also same as the ford 2.0 Tdci I think.

Interesting . I haven’t had a chance to investigate the engine yet - I swapped it for a used one so it’s just sat in the barn where I lifted it. Bloody job getting it out.