AMG V8, Water Damage to Ignition Coils and Plugs
Discussion
( I've posted this in a few different forums trying to cast a wider net.)
I have a 2019MY Vantage. After 3 1/2 years, 7000miles and kept in a garage, the ignition coils and plugs corroded. See pic below.
I am posting to find out if others have had a similar issue with their V8 cars.
(I had the Timeless Warranty and Aston gave me a terrible hassle about covering the repair. Even though the repair was ultimately covered, only due to the efforts of the dealer, Aston corporate aggravated me so much that I will never buy another Aston product. My view of the Timeless Warranty being “ultra-luxury”toilet paper will be for a post on another day.)
The damage was caused by water getting into the engine bay and sitting on an area of the engine that doesn’t drain properly. The dealer couldn’t find out how the water got in. They refit the cowl, checked the drains…everything fine. They said they have seen this problem before but I didn’t get specifics ( I know the v12 DB11 has had issues and is apparently unresolved but I am specifically focused on the AMG V8 Unit) . Considering how many miles are typically put on these cars and the favorable conditions they are driven in, that is not a great endorsement.
Obviously given some cars have vents, this is not a completely sealed area. It seems like, as many places where water can get into an area of a car, it should be designed to drain if it gets wet. Apparently that is not so for this specific engine installation.
Since it was never determined exactly how it happened, I have little confidence that it won’t happen again. I asked why this wasn’t evaporated by the heat of the engine, worst case, and this was unknown.
To make a long story short, I’m trying to find other owners that have had the same issue. From everything I can tell, this is either the fault of the design or a poor installation. We all know( well except for Aston Martin) that coils and plugs are not a maintenance item after 7000 miles. I’m confident there was nothing singularly peculiar about my car. If this happened to me it will happen to others.
I’m posting this on a few sites to get as many owners as I can. Please let me know if you have had this problem as I am keeping data.
I am trying to get an idea of just how widespread this problem is. In the meantime be forewarned about driving your car in the rain.
I have a 2019MY Vantage. After 3 1/2 years, 7000miles and kept in a garage, the ignition coils and plugs corroded. See pic below.
I am posting to find out if others have had a similar issue with their V8 cars.
(I had the Timeless Warranty and Aston gave me a terrible hassle about covering the repair. Even though the repair was ultimately covered, only due to the efforts of the dealer, Aston corporate aggravated me so much that I will never buy another Aston product. My view of the Timeless Warranty being “ultra-luxury”toilet paper will be for a post on another day.)
The damage was caused by water getting into the engine bay and sitting on an area of the engine that doesn’t drain properly. The dealer couldn’t find out how the water got in. They refit the cowl, checked the drains…everything fine. They said they have seen this problem before but I didn’t get specifics ( I know the v12 DB11 has had issues and is apparently unresolved but I am specifically focused on the AMG V8 Unit) . Considering how many miles are typically put on these cars and the favorable conditions they are driven in, that is not a great endorsement.
Obviously given some cars have vents, this is not a completely sealed area. It seems like, as many places where water can get into an area of a car, it should be designed to drain if it gets wet. Apparently that is not so for this specific engine installation.
Since it was never determined exactly how it happened, I have little confidence that it won’t happen again. I asked why this wasn’t evaporated by the heat of the engine, worst case, and this was unknown.
To make a long story short, I’m trying to find other owners that have had the same issue. From everything I can tell, this is either the fault of the design or a poor installation. We all know( well except for Aston Martin) that coils and plugs are not a maintenance item after 7000 miles. I’m confident there was nothing singularly peculiar about my car. If this happened to me it will happen to others.
I’m posting this on a few sites to get as many owners as I can. Please let me know if you have had this problem as I am keeping data.
I am trying to get an idea of just how widespread this problem is. In the meantime be forewarned about driving your car in the rain.
That info about the C63 is good info to know. Sure looks like the same type of issue to me. I knew this couldn’t be some freak accident.
I think the Vantage engine is an M178. I’ll have to check if the coils are the same for both the m177 and m178 and see if any changes were made.
Aston gave me a terrible time about covering this under the Timeless Warranty. To the point where I would never buy another Aston product. ( I’ll write about that hassle sometime later.). For two weeks they denied the claim. After a couple weeks I told the shop I would pay for the repair out of my pocket and I started prepping to sue Aston after it was fixed and I got my car back. ( That’s how I ended up with the photos and such as I was gathering the info.)
At the eleventh hour, the dealer told me there was no charge for the repair. It was getting nasty. The dealer never told me there was a redesign for the Aston coil. I’ll have to contact them and see if the Aston coil has a newer revision like the m177 coil.
I think the Vantage engine is an M178. I’ll have to check if the coils are the same for both the m177 and m178 and see if any changes were made.
Aston gave me a terrible time about covering this under the Timeless Warranty. To the point where I would never buy another Aston product. ( I’ll write about that hassle sometime later.). For two weeks they denied the claim. After a couple weeks I told the shop I would pay for the repair out of my pocket and I started prepping to sue Aston after it was fixed and I got my car back. ( That’s how I ended up with the photos and such as I was gathering the info.)
At the eleventh hour, the dealer told me there was no charge for the repair. It was getting nasty. The dealer never told me there was a redesign for the Aston coil. I’ll have to contact them and see if the Aston coil has a newer revision like the m177 coil.
I don’t know if it is as difficult as some other cars but I will tell you that the estimate for the job was about $5k from the dealer. Sounded outrageous to me but that is what I was quoted when I authorized the repair. Never saw the final itemized invoice when I picked up the car because it was eventually covered.
From conversations throughout the process. Over $1500 for coil packs, about $493 for plugs and they said it was 5 or 6 hours labor…I think labor rate is $239/hr.. no doubt a huge Aston tax in my area. Not sure how they got to $5k.
( Annual Service with oil change is about $1800. ( maybe that includes a brake flush, don’t remember.). Oil change alone is $1k. Only brought it to the dealer because it was under warranty. Not sure if there are any Aston independents in my area so next oil change will be DIY.)
From conversations throughout the process. Over $1500 for coil packs, about $493 for plugs and they said it was 5 or 6 hours labor…I think labor rate is $239/hr.. no doubt a huge Aston tax in my area. Not sure how they got to $5k.
( Annual Service with oil change is about $1800. ( maybe that includes a brake flush, don’t remember.). Oil change alone is $1k. Only brought it to the dealer because it was under warranty. Not sure if there are any Aston independents in my area so next oil change will be DIY.)
Edited by GreasyHands on Thursday 30th June 04:44
My car is a MY19 shipped to Canada originally.
It appears the coils for the M177 c63s and the M178 AMG GT are the same.( I mention this because I think Aston calls this the M178 engine regardless of the modified/alternative sump. I’m guessing there are multiple subvariants of the M178. I’m just trying to get the best apples to apples information.)
I fired off an email to my dealer to find out if the newly installed coils had the updated rings along the boot. They never mentioned that there was a part update. Given how ticked off I was about this not being covered they may not have wanted to confirm my belief this was caused by a poor design and not some freak issue. Of course, Mercedes could have updated the part and Aston could still be using the original part for some reason. I haven’t heard back from the dealer yet.
As I mentioned this car had the Aston Martin Timeless Warranty for which I paid about $4000 USD for an additional year. Undoubtedly expensive and I expected it to be comprehensive. I was shocked when Aston denied the claim saying it was caused by “water ingress” and not covered. Aston was complete A-holes about it. At one point, they said “ as a courtesy, they would cover 60% of the costs”. I paid 100% of a warranty and wasn’t settling for a 60% payout under any circumstances on something I saw as either a manufacturing defect or a faulty installation. At one point, they even claimed it wasn’t really an Aston Warranty because it was “ administered” by a third party and they had no control over it. Every word out of the mouth of the Aston rep was foolishness. When I asked to speak to his supervisor, he claimed he didn’t have one. I asked who he reported to and he said no one. “Everybody had quit!” What a joker. Clearly the inmates are running the asylum.
I called a few US numbers for Aston. All of them either went to general voicemails or were covered by a company called Morley who claim they are just hired to answer the phone and relay messages in the US for Aston. Anyway, I digress and the warranty shenanigans will be taken up later.
For now, I’m just tracking down if this was a freak one off issue or if others have experienced it. It’s looking like it’s a known issue. Plan to swing by the Mercedes service department at some point soon for a chat.
I’m not letting this one go. I think Aston were pretty shabby in their treatment of this issue.
It appears the coils for the M177 c63s and the M178 AMG GT are the same.( I mention this because I think Aston calls this the M178 engine regardless of the modified/alternative sump. I’m guessing there are multiple subvariants of the M178. I’m just trying to get the best apples to apples information.)
I fired off an email to my dealer to find out if the newly installed coils had the updated rings along the boot. They never mentioned that there was a part update. Given how ticked off I was about this not being covered they may not have wanted to confirm my belief this was caused by a poor design and not some freak issue. Of course, Mercedes could have updated the part and Aston could still be using the original part for some reason. I haven’t heard back from the dealer yet.
As I mentioned this car had the Aston Martin Timeless Warranty for which I paid about $4000 USD for an additional year. Undoubtedly expensive and I expected it to be comprehensive. I was shocked when Aston denied the claim saying it was caused by “water ingress” and not covered. Aston was complete A-holes about it. At one point, they said “ as a courtesy, they would cover 60% of the costs”. I paid 100% of a warranty and wasn’t settling for a 60% payout under any circumstances on something I saw as either a manufacturing defect or a faulty installation. At one point, they even claimed it wasn’t really an Aston Warranty because it was “ administered” by a third party and they had no control over it. Every word out of the mouth of the Aston rep was foolishness. When I asked to speak to his supervisor, he claimed he didn’t have one. I asked who he reported to and he said no one. “Everybody had quit!” What a joker. Clearly the inmates are running the asylum.
I called a few US numbers for Aston. All of them either went to general voicemails or were covered by a company called Morley who claim they are just hired to answer the phone and relay messages in the US for Aston. Anyway, I digress and the warranty shenanigans will be taken up later.
For now, I’m just tracking down if this was a freak one off issue or if others have experienced it. It’s looking like it’s a known issue. Plan to swing by the Mercedes service department at some point soon for a chat.
I’m not letting this one go. I think Aston were pretty shabby in their treatment of this issue.
Edited by GreasyHands on Wednesday 6th July 23:13
After two weeks of getting nowhere with the claim, the dealer had me contact the AML representative directly.
( I think I'm not allowed to give specific names and phone numbers on here so for now I won't)
I don't remember the specific title of the person I spoke to at AML but I do have his name. He said he was a regional rep. He said he had no supervisor and didn't report to anybody else. I did try to call the "After Sales Manager, Aston Martin of the Americas" but that person ( who I happened to have the cell phone contact from last year) had apparently resigned just a few days previously and no other person returned the call in his place. I left a message with the main operator ( Morley) for the "new" After Sales Manager" ( unknown name at this point) and got no call back. I then left two messages for the President of Aston Martin, Americas and got no call back. ( Given the revolving door at Aston, I'm not even sue who the current president is. I called the one who was appointed a few months back, LOL)
The regional rep said he had no say with the claim. He said the Timeless Warranty was NOT actually an Aston Martin product and the claim was denied by a third party. When I asked him the name and number of the third party he then said he didn't have that info and could not supply it to me. So, essentially, according to Aston, AML rep is the interface to the administrator and I can't speak with them myself. Aston rep is the gatekeeper. If I have an issue, take it up with....nobody. It was all very vague and unconvincing. It was a classic runaround.
The Aston rep said it was being denied because it was " water ingress" and the contract doesn't cover "water ingress" ( My interpretation of the catchall term "water ingress" refers more to flooding and deep puddles in the context which it is used in the contract. Very different than poor design of the ignition coils, manufacturing defect or faulty installation)
He said, "as a courtesy, and we are being generous, we will offer 60% coverage". I said I don't need your generosity, I need you to do the right thing and pay the claim. I bought a warranty that was represented as an Aston Martin product, from an Aston Martin dealer and was sold as comprehensive. I paid 100% for the warranty and I expect 100% payment. I said instead of hassling your customers, you should be talking to the person who is denying the claim and tell them this should be covered. He thought that was funny.
So from the best I can tell, the claim was denied by Aston Martin Lagonda of North America. I don't know if it ever made it to Gaydon. When I told my servicing dealer and my local sales rep that AML claimed that the Timeless Warranty/Extended Service Contract was a "third party product", they all found that to be a bit of a head scratcher. The Aston dealer interacts directly to Aston corporate, not a third party intermediary. The dealer does not deal with the administrator either.
This is the only sponsored, and marketed product Aston sells in the US. The "Provider" is "Aston Martin Lagonda of North America" ( The number to reach customer service, which doesn't get answered is Aston Martin in Irvine, CA) There is a an "Administrator", called "Care Care North America". This number also goes directly to voicemail and no return calls. An email to Car Care also went unanswered. As an interesting note, the "Car Care" number for the Administrator on the Aston Website is incorrect, having only six digits and it needs seven in the US. When I looked up the corporate records for Car Care, the people listed were all based in the UK, although the phone number is a Florida number, for what that is worth.
( The Extended Service Contract itself lists "Warrantech" as the "Administrator", but the website and rep I spoke to said it was "Car Care". I don't know or care who these entities are because my Extended Service Contract is made with the "Company" in the document. In the 28 page contract, the term "Company" refers to "Aston Martin Lagonda of North America, Inc."
Anyway, this is "The" Aston Martin warranty we all think about when getting the best protection, regardless of how Aston has structured it. It is the one advertised all over Aston's website and the one sold by Aston dealers in North America. It is clear to me that Aston corporate has ultimate control over this product.
( I think I'm not allowed to give specific names and phone numbers on here so for now I won't)
I don't remember the specific title of the person I spoke to at AML but I do have his name. He said he was a regional rep. He said he had no supervisor and didn't report to anybody else. I did try to call the "After Sales Manager, Aston Martin of the Americas" but that person ( who I happened to have the cell phone contact from last year) had apparently resigned just a few days previously and no other person returned the call in his place. I left a message with the main operator ( Morley) for the "new" After Sales Manager" ( unknown name at this point) and got no call back. I then left two messages for the President of Aston Martin, Americas and got no call back. ( Given the revolving door at Aston, I'm not even sue who the current president is. I called the one who was appointed a few months back, LOL)
The regional rep said he had no say with the claim. He said the Timeless Warranty was NOT actually an Aston Martin product and the claim was denied by a third party. When I asked him the name and number of the third party he then said he didn't have that info and could not supply it to me. So, essentially, according to Aston, AML rep is the interface to the administrator and I can't speak with them myself. Aston rep is the gatekeeper. If I have an issue, take it up with....nobody. It was all very vague and unconvincing. It was a classic runaround.
The Aston rep said it was being denied because it was " water ingress" and the contract doesn't cover "water ingress" ( My interpretation of the catchall term "water ingress" refers more to flooding and deep puddles in the context which it is used in the contract. Very different than poor design of the ignition coils, manufacturing defect or faulty installation)
He said, "as a courtesy, and we are being generous, we will offer 60% coverage". I said I don't need your generosity, I need you to do the right thing and pay the claim. I bought a warranty that was represented as an Aston Martin product, from an Aston Martin dealer and was sold as comprehensive. I paid 100% for the warranty and I expect 100% payment. I said instead of hassling your customers, you should be talking to the person who is denying the claim and tell them this should be covered. He thought that was funny.
So from the best I can tell, the claim was denied by Aston Martin Lagonda of North America. I don't know if it ever made it to Gaydon. When I told my servicing dealer and my local sales rep that AML claimed that the Timeless Warranty/Extended Service Contract was a "third party product", they all found that to be a bit of a head scratcher. The Aston dealer interacts directly to Aston corporate, not a third party intermediary. The dealer does not deal with the administrator either.
This is the only sponsored, and marketed product Aston sells in the US. The "Provider" is "Aston Martin Lagonda of North America" ( The number to reach customer service, which doesn't get answered is Aston Martin in Irvine, CA) There is a an "Administrator", called "Care Care North America". This number also goes directly to voicemail and no return calls. An email to Car Care also went unanswered. As an interesting note, the "Car Care" number for the Administrator on the Aston Website is incorrect, having only six digits and it needs seven in the US. When I looked up the corporate records for Car Care, the people listed were all based in the UK, although the phone number is a Florida number, for what that is worth.
( The Extended Service Contract itself lists "Warrantech" as the "Administrator", but the website and rep I spoke to said it was "Car Care". I don't know or care who these entities are because my Extended Service Contract is made with the "Company" in the document. In the 28 page contract, the term "Company" refers to "Aston Martin Lagonda of North America, Inc."
Anyway, this is "The" Aston Martin warranty we all think about when getting the best protection, regardless of how Aston has structured it. It is the one advertised all over Aston's website and the one sold by Aston dealers in North America. It is clear to me that Aston corporate has ultimate control over this product.
Edited by GreasyHands on Saturday 2nd July 16:06
I did hear back from the servicing dealer. Aston does have a new part number for the coils and the new Aston coils have the three ribs.
Not sure why I wasn't informed of this when the repair was made and I picked up the car. I did query why this happened and why it won't happen again but was never told that the part was redesigned. They searched for how the water got in and never found a culprit. Maybe the service advisor didn't know about the part redesign until I brought it to his attention. Maybe they didn't want to admit that there really was a design issue rather than this being some freak accident given how livid I was about Aston denying this as a warranty repair.
So the good news is I have a bit more faith this won't happen in the future. I guess we'll see if the new design does a better job. The bad news is Aston knew this was a design fault with the car and I think it was rather unfortunate they refused to cover the claim for weeks. So much for this being the "ultra-luxury" brand Stroll tries to portray. In my experience, higher end brands go above and beyond trying to rectify a problem. It left such a bad impression regarding Aston customer service that I will never buy another Aston product. Well, I'm off to my test drive an Arturo in a couple days.. Aston who?
Thanks again to @Ninja59 for pointing me in the right direction.
Not sure why I wasn't informed of this when the repair was made and I picked up the car. I did query why this happened and why it won't happen again but was never told that the part was redesigned. They searched for how the water got in and never found a culprit. Maybe the service advisor didn't know about the part redesign until I brought it to his attention. Maybe they didn't want to admit that there really was a design issue rather than this being some freak accident given how livid I was about Aston denying this as a warranty repair.
So the good news is I have a bit more faith this won't happen in the future. I guess we'll see if the new design does a better job. The bad news is Aston knew this was a design fault with the car and I think it was rather unfortunate they refused to cover the claim for weeks. So much for this being the "ultra-luxury" brand Stroll tries to portray. In my experience, higher end brands go above and beyond trying to rectify a problem. It left such a bad impression regarding Aston customer service that I will never buy another Aston product. Well, I'm off to my test drive an Arturo in a couple days.. Aston who?
Thanks again to @Ninja59 for pointing me in the right direction.
Edited by GreasyHands on Thursday 7th July 02:30
I found this to be interesting so I thought I would add it to this thread
It's from a review by evo magazine regarding their long term use of an Aston Martin Vantage for review.
"After living with one on the evo Fast Fleet for six months, we can also confirm that while the powertrain and transmission are largely bulletproof, some of the Aston Martin-specific changes do have a lead-on effect. The Vantage’s single-opening front end design doesn’t appear to have the same efficiency in cooling the inherently hot-running V8 engine (it is called a hot-V, after all).
Over our experience, aside from a sticky passenger-side window, the only other issue we had was a fault with the coil packs, which were replaced under warranty."
Bulletproof? Well maybe they should have dug a little deeper about why there was a coil pack issue on a new car considering it was a review of the vehicle. They just seemed to gloss over it as if it was SOP. I suppose if you are a reviewer for a magazine Aston is less finicky about paying for warranty work.
It's from a review by evo magazine regarding their long term use of an Aston Martin Vantage for review.
"After living with one on the evo Fast Fleet for six months, we can also confirm that while the powertrain and transmission are largely bulletproof, some of the Aston Martin-specific changes do have a lead-on effect. The Vantage’s single-opening front end design doesn’t appear to have the same efficiency in cooling the inherently hot-running V8 engine (it is called a hot-V, after all).
Over our experience, aside from a sticky passenger-side window, the only other issue we had was a fault with the coil packs, which were replaced under warranty."
Bulletproof? Well maybe they should have dug a little deeper about why there was a coil pack issue on a new car considering it was a review of the vehicle. They just seemed to gloss over it as if it was SOP. I suppose if you are a reviewer for a magazine Aston is less finicky about paying for warranty work.
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