No more Crackle and pops after update.

[beemarman]

My 2016 Jaguar F-type 5.0 R AWD was bought from Jaguar's main dealer in 2019. One of the main reasons for buying the car was the noise. The pops and cracks on overrun make me smile all the time. I wanted to keep the car forever, until last month when I took the car into Jaguar to resolve the battery drain issues that I've had for months.

They decided to update the software, doing this has now reduced the exhaust noise, and completely killed off the pops and cracks the exhaust used to make. When I complained to the dealer I was told they didn't know updating the software would have any effect on the noise. They said they would look into it for me.

A week later they came back and said due to noise regulation JLR is now reducing the noise produced by these cars to meet the strict noise regulation introduced a few years back. They said I would need to raise the issue with JLR themselves.

I did contact JLR and they refused to reverse the update siting the same noise regulation as the main reason for not reversing it

My question is this, why are they still selling these cars (2013-2017) models with 100% pre-update noise level, and then when you take it to the dealers for any work they can apply the software that would reduce it without prior warning? We buy these cars for the looks and noise. Knowing the noise can be reduced without any prior warning from the dealer is unfair to the owner. Why doesn't JLR make it know that this is happening, and why are they still allowing their dealers to sell these without applying the update?. The same dealer has two F-type that still have the pre-update exhaust noise.

I can see on Facebook and other Jaguar forums that this happens a lot more than it's broadcasted.
Anyone here experienced this before? I want to know if legally I can do anything about my car?

[beemarman]

kippertie said:

Good, go buy an island and pollute your own space not mine, you have no right to impose your selfish and childlike wish on my ears.

Well done JLR.

Why well done? They sold the car that way in the first place. Why release a car and sell it on the noise, then decide to force the new noise regulation on people without prior notice.

[beemarman]

Smurfsarepeopletoo said:

Is the car under warranty? if not, then why not just take it somewhere to get it mapped, maybe a different exhaust, that way you will get more power, and the sound that you want.

Yes the car is still under warranty.

[beemarman]

Time for me to head over to a proper petrolhead forum.

Too many boring old farts on here now.

Hope you oldies enjoy your boring retirement and may you die in peace.

Bye.

[beemarman]

LunarOne said:

Equus said:

It's a road car. The pops and bangs don't make it any more powerful, faster, or more efficient. They're just anti-social, end of.

This is all true. But so is owning a 5.0 V8 in the first place. Where does antisocial stop? As long as you are consuming food, oxygen and farting in bed, you're being antisocial too. The OP bought a car with certain characteristics including performance, sound, fuel consumption, all of which were within the regulations at the time the car was built. The dealership has now changed a key characteristic of the car without the owner's permission and without a mandate from the government. If I were the OP I'd be suing the dealership.

Imagine if you bought an electric guitar, and you took it back to the dealer because it kept going out of tune. When you got it back it sounded like a violin, but at least now it stayed in tune. You'd have every right to complain until the dealer fixed the guitar or replaced it. Even if everyone hates the sound of you playing because you're a bit st.

OP you have every right to have the car in full working order with all the features you bought it for. If one of them is no longer present (even if it is considered antisocial by some people) then the car is now faulty. I suggest you explain this to the dealership and tell them that you will make a claim against them if they refuse to fix the problem. If that doesn't make them budge, contact some consumer groups or ask a solicitor to write them a letter.

Thank you for understanding. It seems a lot of people on here don't get it. The car was SOLD TO ME by a Jaguar dealership with the full exhaust noise including all the pops and crackles. I took the car to another dealer to have some other issues looked at. They decided to update the software to see if it would resolve the issue that I took the car in for. Unfortunately (dealer didn't know) updating the software removed the pops and crackles. The dealer is saying I would need to contact JLR for a fix. JRL is saying it's due to noise regulation that was put in place a few years back in 2016. So, why sell the car to me in the state it was in?
You knew in 2016 you had to limit the noise but they still carried on producing these cars with all the crackles and pops
Why are they STILL selling all 2016-2018 F-types with the full noise? Why not update the software to remove the pops and crackles for every used Jaguar F-type before they sell to a customer. I understand the newer (2019 upwards) models are now limited, but it's not fair for people that bought the older cars to have one of the main features removed without any prior knowledge or warning.

I'm definitely going to take this further. It seems the guys in the US are having their cars reverted once they've made a fuss to the dealer. Not many in the UK have had this done to their cars.

[beemarman]

roadsmash said:

Those berating the OP clearly haven’t heard the pops and bangs that the OP describes.

That particular V8 Jag’s pops and bangs are glorious, and not in anyway the same as the “council” straight-piped Golf R that Barry down the road from you drives.

Those claiming the previous noises that the OP’s car made are evidently just demonstrating they know nothing about cars, because if they did, they’d know why the OP wants those noises back.

Shame on you all.

Thanks. I really do miss the pops and bangs.

[beemarman]

davidd said:

OP, my 2016 v8 has the latest firmware and still makes the right noises. I'm sure I read somewhere that it was only 2018 cars and onwards that impacted the sound.

Not all software updates impact on the noise.

[beemarman]

angusfaldo said:

Did OP get any kind of resolution for this?

I got fairly pally with my local main dealer who sold me my 2018 R AWD in the summer and ask him for the inside story on the rumours. I believed him when he replied that he'd not hard anything about a systematic/enforced software update designed to reduce noise levels in the V8s. If such an update was part of their programme then it would seem odd they sold me a car that still creates the full sound track.

JLR customer service is still adamant that the noise reduction was due to EU regulation. Unfortunately, due to Covid I haven't really been able to pursue this any further. I'm hoping to maybe take it further by going to see a solicitor once this is all over. Even the dealer that did the update was very surprised with the outcome. He said he's never had it happen before

[beemarman]

Starfighter said:

I suspect that compliance with EU regs will figure very highly in the requirements for JLR. Whatever your opinions on Brexit may be, industry will be very pragmatic when it comes to design with 2 sets of regulatory requirements to pass.

I suspect that as earlier poster got this right, JLR updated the ECU map to comply with the the newer regulations and are not running 2 parallel sets of software for the same engine.

OP - did the software update fix the original problem?

Nope, didn't fix the original issue.

[beemarman]

Pursyluv said:

Can't you just take it an indie and get it sorted, I know it's not big or clever, but I didn't stop playing with my TVR exhaust until I'd got the illusive 130dB.

The car is still under warranty. Any modification would make the warranty void.

[beemarman]

Pursyluv said:

Yes of course, have you heard from any other owners that this has happened to?

A few on FB and in the US version of F-type forums.

[beemarman]

ExecutiveAction said:

Can I add a small comment. I understand that the pops and bangs are created by injecting extra fuel to detonate in the exhaust cycle. Apparently this can cause the injectors to clog up, requiring attention or use of additives. Is it possible that they are changing the software to prevent this problem arising?

This is true. In fact, in the US Jaguar is offering an extended warranty on the Co2 Sensor if you agree to apply the software that reduces the pops.

[beemarman]

Ikemi said:

Wow. This thread started out as a bit of a dumpster fire! It certainly seemed as though there was some jealousy on display. The pops and bangs are not an illegal feature.

Depending on who you listen to, the software update removes the pops and bangs in order to conform to UK Goverment noise regulations and/or to save the catalytic converters and O2 sensors.

Jaguar have replaced a fair few of these under warranty and have suggested the pops and bangs reduce the life of these components, thus the pops and bangs are removed to prevent further warranty claims. O2 sensors are now covered for up to 15 years (I think?!) with or without warranty - providing you’re a US owner!

The software update is real. It affects the V8 models. A few V6 owners have suggested their cars have been muted, but it’s mainly V8 owners. A good reason to choose an independent; cheaper, friendlier, probably do a better job and no mandatory updates!

Apparently, "Those of you with 2014-2016 Rs who are having reduced pops/crackles after the K309 software update need the JTB495 patch".

Ergo, head back to your dealership and ask for JTB495 to be applied to reinstate pops and bangs.

New 2020/2021 cars ... Remove fuse 15, apparently! I think it’s a bit like removing fuse 22 on a Vantage.

Jaguar wouldn't reapply the JTB495 software that brings the pops and bang back. Also, why would they do so if it's going to cause the issues that made them apply it in the first place?