Return to office - your situation
Discussion
As restrictions start to ease across the UK I'm just wondering what orders/requests others are receiving or giving (since there are so many powerfully built company directors on here) with regards to returning to the office.
This is probably only relevant to those who work an office/desk job that can be done as effectively from home. People who have quite possibly worked right through the last year. Will you return full time if given the option? Would you rather continue to work from home? If you are essentially told where you have to work and it doesn't suit you what do you plan to do?
This is probably only relevant to those who work an office/desk job that can be done as effectively from home. People who have quite possibly worked right through the last year. Will you return full time if given the option? Would you rather continue to work from home? If you are essentially told where you have to work and it doesn't suit you what do you plan to do?
Well since my initial post I've actually received a UK wide RTO email saying a target of 50% occupancy starting 21st June.
Like many here I work in a role that has continued uninterrupted since last March. None of the team I work with are co-located in my local office (1 hour commute from me). It seems it's being left to line managers discretion to some extent but I don't see the point in going to the office unless there's a reason. I dread the though of going back to public transport even just once or twice a week. Never mind trading the tranquility of my home office for a noisy open plan office and the horror of sharing a toilet again.
Like many here I work in a role that has continued uninterrupted since last March. None of the team I work with are co-located in my local office (1 hour commute from me). It seems it's being left to line managers discretion to some extent but I don't see the point in going to the office unless there's a reason. I dread the though of going back to public transport even just once or twice a week. Never mind trading the tranquility of my home office for a noisy open plan office and the horror of sharing a toilet again.
anxious_ant said:
Wow, surprised there is no "your job will be replaced by someone else willing to work for less money remotely post" yet. 
As someone in Scotland working for a multi billion $ worldwide company I think I might already be considered the cheap help. There's no secret made about the fact that this location offers a valuable resource of high technical skill staff at less than half the cost of the US locations and as there's less employer competition there's greater staff retention than the India centres.The last year I've probably had more recruitment people getting in touch than ever before. Where it used to only be local offers there have been a lot of worldwide ones offering full remote positions. I doubt I'm the only one seeing this and suspect that if it continues it may become very difficult for employers who aren't willing to be versatile to attract and retain talent.
I worked in the creative industry for over 20 years as an agency graphic designer then creative director. The number of times I experienced spontaneous creative and collaborative ideation sessions during that time was precisely ermmmm zero.
The creative process is a lot like chronic constipation. It's a difficult process that fills you with dread and you don't really want people there to witness the pain you will need to endure to get it out.
Its only senior managers that seem to think spontaneous world changing ideas are being scribbled on the walls of offices every day.
The creative process is a lot like chronic constipation. It's a difficult process that fills you with dread and you don't really want people there to witness the pain you will need to endure to get it out.
Its only senior managers that seem to think spontaneous world changing ideas are being scribbled on the walls of offices every day.
crofty1984 said:
... and I don't have to give up a room in my house to my employer.
That got me thinking.I don't have the luxury of a spare room so initially the dining room was given up as my work space. That proved tricky with the kids home schooling so I set up in a corner of the bedroom. Built a desk I can fold away on Friday and store out of sight. It's working well.
For me it's a small sacrifice compared to 2hrs per day, 40hrs per month, that's almost 2 full days (more if they have faults, which are a regular occurrence) sat (more likely standing with someone else breathing right in my face) on trains. Not to mention the money I have to pay for the privilege.
The commute money could probably go to a bigger house. Or better yet a bigger garage with space for another car and a small office.
Lord Marylebone said:
This is a really interesting thread. Good to have an insight in to what different employers are deciding is the way forward.
It seems like it raises more questions than answers though.
My thoughts are that an awful lot of people have jumped the gun and assumed that they will not have to return to the office. They have moved house, moved further away, and so on. Many employers are now seemingly deciding that some mandatory time back in the office is the way forward (in many cases they seem to be asking for 50% or even 3/4 days per week) and clearly this will cause issues to those that have moved away.
It’s perfectly fine for people to say “Let me work from home or I’m leaving” but they may find themselves competing against an awful lot of people for the next job if everyone is thinking this way.
Will be interesting to see how it pans out.
I'd agree that a lot of people have possibly moved without really thinking about the long term. What happens when and if they are forced back full time is another matter. Like you say, it's a lot easier to say you will move on than it is to actually secure that perfect job.It seems like it raises more questions than answers though.
My thoughts are that an awful lot of people have jumped the gun and assumed that they will not have to return to the office. They have moved house, moved further away, and so on. Many employers are now seemingly deciding that some mandatory time back in the office is the way forward (in many cases they seem to be asking for 50% or even 3/4 days per week) and clearly this will cause issues to those that have moved away.
It’s perfectly fine for people to say “Let me work from home or I’m leaving” but they may find themselves competing against an awful lot of people for the next job if everyone is thinking this way.
Will be interesting to see how it pans out.
Edited by Lord Marylebone on Friday 14th May 10:04
The flip side is that I do wonder if employers who force people back notice a drop in productivity and subsequently decide versatility might actually be better. My teams productivity is all easily tracked, I'm sure many others are the same. We dropped off a cliff last March but everyone seemed to adjust very quickly and by mid April productivity was about 30% higher where it has remained since. Following our year end appraisals its pretty common for us to have a lot of people switching teams internally. This usually leads to several months of rehiring and people getting up to speed. We seemed to have almost none of that this year and our staff satisfaction survey had it's highest score ever.
Edited by nunpuncher on Friday 14th May 11:57
ro250 said:
Aunty Pasty said:
ro250 said:
It's the 50% thing which worries me if my employer pushes for it.
Living in a commuter belt for London, going in 3 days a week costs about the same as every day (if buying annual season ticket) so although it will save time and energy I am not inclined to do 3 days.
I am hoping for 1-2 days (or just ad-hoc which would seem most sensible).
Same here. The whole weekly/monthly/yearly season ticket pricing model just doesn't suit ad-hoc or irregular commuting. I wish they'd switch to something a bit more flexible such as bulk buy tickets to be used more flexibly.Living in a commuter belt for London, going in 3 days a week costs about the same as every day (if buying annual season ticket) so although it will save time and energy I am not inclined to do 3 days.
I am hoping for 1-2 days (or just ad-hoc which would seem most sensible).
If I was forced to do a 50% in-office routine I'll try to angle for an alternate Mon, Tue, Wed one week followed by a Thur, Fri the other week.
Edited by Aunty Pasty on Friday 14th May 11:52
Annoyingly, the flexible ticket does exist for some operators. C2C do it and it looks great value. Greater Anglia also do but the discount is pennies so not worth it. Guess which line I use...
If people go back on these hybrid work/home timetables maybe some of them will look to offer more flexible ticketing to ensure they retain more commuters. My suspicion is that they will just raise the prices further and no doubt the drivers/inspectors etc will be shouting for their pay rise. I think my ticket price is already at the point where a single day return in peak time is about the same as driving a gas guzzler in to work and parking for the day. If I'm only required to go in 1 or 2 days I'd rather travel in my own metal bubble.
CheesecakeRunner said:
One thing I hope to see... for those orgs whose productivity went up when they moved to working from home, I hope they do some research into why it went up.
For example, as an IT consultant, a huge amount of the work I do is thought work. To do this best I need a quiet place with no distractions. The kind of thing that simply doesn't exist in a modern office. I'd be more inclined to be in favour of returning to an office full time, if said office gave me the ability to quietly concentrate as my home office does. There is nothing worse than open plan hot desking.
I've often thought in a modern office, the 'private offices' should be given to the technical producers of thought-based work, not the execs.
I've always worked roles that require thought or generation of solutions and ideas. I've worked several places that have had "ideas rooms" or solo working booths but I've always found there's either never enough for the staff, they're not actually set up for working ie some sort of uncomfortable bench, crap monitor, couple of bean bags etc or they are always occupied by someone visiting from another office or someone on a (no doubt personal) call. When they start putting booking systems in for them the whole thing just stops working.For example, as an IT consultant, a huge amount of the work I do is thought work. To do this best I need a quiet place with no distractions. The kind of thing that simply doesn't exist in a modern office. I'd be more inclined to be in favour of returning to an office full time, if said office gave me the ability to quietly concentrate as my home office does. There is nothing worse than open plan hot desking.
I've often thought in a modern office, the 'private offices' should be given to the technical producers of thought-based work, not the execs.
All sounds a bit far fetched.
We have staff (financial institution) who's working environment and activities are closely controlled and monitored by regulatory bodies. We just found solutions to the challenges to keep them safe, working and within the restrictions of law. There have been no major issues for us.
We have staff (financial institution) who's working environment and activities are closely controlled and monitored by regulatory bodies. We just found solutions to the challenges to keep them safe, working and within the restrictions of law. There have been no major issues for us.
austina35 said:
Having worked every day since last march, I'm hoping the company directors get all the office staff back this week. I mean, come on, it's a joke. When you call anyone, they never answer the phone. They are either at Tesco or out in the garden.
Having worked from home in previous jobs, I know how it works so they all think we fell off the moon last week.
Its about time companies put their foot down and got these lazy people back in the office where they can be monitored properly and productivity can get back to where it was before all this nonsense started.
I want my shares back where they were at the start of 2020.
One of the most cleverly constructed pieces of humour I've read in years.Having worked from home in previous jobs, I know how it works so they all think we fell off the moon last week.
Its about time companies put their foot down and got these lazy people back in the office where they can be monitored properly and productivity can get back to where it was before all this nonsense started.
I want my shares back where they were at the start of 2020.
The bitterness at having to be in work as by your own admission you do SFA when at home and therefore assume everyone is as lazy as you if given the opportunity.
Superb work.
Latest from my employer is that they hope to start bringing people back in to my local office around 6 July. Nobody will be forced back, maximum will be 50% capacity each day.
Over the last few weeks I've started to feel like I would actually like to go back in. Not so much on a regular basis as its not really needed. more just to have the option. However, there are a few things that make me wonder if it's really worth it. We'll have to complete an online health survey each day before we come in, masks in communal areas as the building I'm in has several other companies, In person meetings are to be limited and a max number of people will be set for each room, you will only be able to use certain desks and there will be at least 1 empty desk either side of each person.
So TBH I don't really see the point other than it being a day out.
Over the last few weeks I've started to feel like I would actually like to go back in. Not so much on a regular basis as its not really needed. more just to have the option. However, there are a few things that make me wonder if it's really worth it. We'll have to complete an online health survey each day before we come in, masks in communal areas as the building I'm in has several other companies, In person meetings are to be limited and a max number of people will be set for each room, you will only be able to use certain desks and there will be at least 1 empty desk either side of each person.
So TBH I don't really see the point other than it being a day out.
Our CEO is taking quite a hard line on the return to office policy. It's a US company and as they are slightly ahead of most countries in terms of being "over it" they have been slowly returning over the last 2 months with increasing pressure coming down from the top for middle managers to "insist" people come back in.
It's a very narrow stance to take as we have a wide range of roles, some of which require or benefit from in office work and some where it really shouldn't make a difference. It'll be interesting to see how it pans out as in the last week alone we have lost 10% of our team in the US.
It's a very narrow stance to take as we have a wide range of roles, some of which require or benefit from in office work and some where it really shouldn't make a difference. It'll be interesting to see how it pans out as in the last week alone we have lost 10% of our team in the US.
stumpage said:
Company coming out of lock down, probably need to take care of cash reserves until all back to normal. Insist people come back to the office and lose 10% who hand their notice in. Save on headcount while also saying goodbye to staff that don't want to tow the company line making managing the situation going forward a lot easier. The company may suffer in the short term but I've yet to see a business, especially largish, go under due to staff turnover.
As you say interesting times and I can see many employee/ employer battles. It's who wins the war that I'm trying to figure out.
We've done ok throughout the pandemic. It's one of those "too big to fail" companies and profits over last year and first quarter of this year were good. We've also been continually hiring for the last year so don't think losing staff is part of the plan. We do lose a percentage of staff every year but take more on that we lose so this is the first time we've seen a deficit. Also worth considering that real estate is a far greater cost than people so why not take the opportunity to cut the greater expense?As you say interesting times and I can see many employee/ employer battles. It's who wins the war that I'm trying to figure out.
No single individual is bigger than the company but when your staff survey says 60% want hybrid working, 25% want permanent WFH and only 15% are desperate to return it just seems a bit short sighted to insist they should all return.
I know every company is different. This is just my own situation.
My place (large international co I'm on the tech/IT side with around 40k people) has went from "you will all get back to the office ASAP" to "some roles will be back, some will be hybrid".
However, they don't seem to be connecting the dots. Yesterday we had a departmental meeting where they said they were aiming for 50% of staff in office each day on a hybrid working model but currently only hitting 20%. They went on to review whether teams were hitting targets with the results ranging from 17% over to 6% below. The 6% was our targeted headcount for this year. The reason given for it being below? Because although we are constantly hiring we are haemorrhaging staff who want more versatility in how they work.
However, they don't seem to be connecting the dots. Yesterday we had a departmental meeting where they said they were aiming for 50% of staff in office each day on a hybrid working model but currently only hitting 20%. They went on to review whether teams were hitting targets with the results ranging from 17% over to 6% below. The 6% was our targeted headcount for this year. The reason given for it being below? Because although we are constantly hiring we are haemorrhaging staff who want more versatility in how they work.
Sporky said:
Our new CEO (we have recently been bought, and our new corporate overlords are trying to assert themselves) keeps banging on about how my team (of pre-sales system designers) would be more effective if we all trouped up to the office in London to collaborate.
I keep pointing out that:
(a) the work we do is non-collaborative in nature
(b) the work we do requires quiet and a lack of interruptions
(c) they are all argumentative and unsociable and would spoil the office for everyone else
Thus far I'm winning. Hopefully I will continue to win, otherwise I'm going to have to hire a lot of new people.
I also work in a technical design type of role. Our overlords seem to think all our best work comes from us wondering aimlessly around the office only to randomly bump in to a colleague who suggests "grabbing a room" so we can instantly ideate a revolutionary solution.I keep pointing out that:
(a) the work we do is non-collaborative in nature
(b) the work we do requires quiet and a lack of interruptions
(c) they are all argumentative and unsociable and would spoil the office for everyone else
Thus far I'm winning. Hopefully I will continue to win, otherwise I'm going to have to hire a lot of new people.
The reality of the office was that you sat struggling to focus on a solution due to the racket of so many folk on calls with their cross location colleagues. Any chance of "bumping into" someone who had any knowledge of your project was probably while frantically trying to locate a vacant toilet and even you did happen to meet the right person, the meeting rooms were so scarcely vacant that spontaneity didn't stand a chance.
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