Cancelled Virgin...what do I need with a new BB provider?

[98elise]

I've finally given up with Virgin after them made me change to the Superhub3. The Wifi was terrible (very slow and constant drop outs) and their customer service even worse. I cancelled on Sunday so i have a month to find a new broadband provider.

The issue is I've been with Virgin for about 15 years, and was Telewest before that. My phone and internet has always been fiber and I don't even know if I have a normal line installed. Its got to be 20 years since I had a normal phone line.

Can the Virgin fiber be reused by another provider, or do i have to have a normal line installed for all other providers?

[98elise]

Countdown said:

The Virgin fibre network is completely different to BT. You might emember them digging up all the streests 20+ years ago to instal their own cabinets and cables. As such it can't be used by any other rprovider. I would have thought that you need to get BT to instal a line and then choose a provider.

I thought that was the case, yes I remember the cables going in.

So if I go with say Plusnet i will still need to get Openreach to install a line first as a seperate exercise?

If I do have a normal line somewhere in the house is that all I need or do I need new cables regardless?

[98elise]

WinstonWolf said:

Personally I'd reinstate it and ditch the SH3. Put it in modem mode then get your own access point. You won't match VM 'fibre' for speed.

I don't need speed, I need a reliable service. I'm paying a high price for what I thought was a premium service.

I want a working service, and some form of customer support. I've been trying to to get this from VM for about 3 months now and I've run out of patience. I would rather do without BB than pay them any more money.

[98elise]

Had to call them again tonight when it dropped 3 times while trying to watch a movie. After waiting in a queue for 20 minutes I again explained what was happening.

They told me that the problem was that it was in "auto mode" and they were changing that. I asked multiple times what exactly they were changing and they just kept repeating that it was in auto mode which means the internet will keep dropping.

I kept asking what they meant by that as I wanted to know what was being changed. They then hung up on me leaving me with no internet service at all.

I'm currently sat in a queue again waiting to speak to yet another person who will not understand then problem or how to fix it.

[98elise]

Whoozit said:

98elise said:

Had to call them again tonight when it dropped 3 times while trying to watch a movie. After waiting in a queue for 20 minutes I again explained what was happening.

Over wifi or LAN cable? If the former, the Superhub 3 has st wifi and network issues. I was forever losing connection whether direct (2.4 and 5ghz), and also via powerline.

I put it in modem mode, added a cheap TP-Link hub and Bob's my uncle.

Chromecast, so WiFi.

The call centre keep suggesting I use wired but in the main we have tablets for internet, and Chromecast for smart TV. That means I need WiFi.

An engineer that came out basically said the WiFi is not part of the service so it's down to us to sort that out.

[98elise]

WinstonWolf said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

Personally I'd reinstate it and ditch the SH3. Put it in modem mode then get your own access point. You won't match VM 'fibre' for speed.

I don't need speed, I need a reliable service. I'm paying a high price for what I thought was a premium service.

I want a working service, and some form of customer support. I've been trying to to get this from VM for about 3 months now and I've run out of patience. I would rather do without BB than pay them any more money.

The virgin fibre service is very reliable and fast as a rule, the SH is a bit pants at wi-fi. You will get the best internet by using the Sh in modem mode and providing your own wi-fi. Most of the supplied routers with all providers aren't very good.

You're probably moving from one problem to a different one.

The adverts for BT seem to be saying their WiFi is significantly better than VM. I don't mind paying a top money for a decent service.

I have no issue with VM wired BB. It's the WiFi and their customer service that sucks.

I had an automated call from VM today to check how the support call went. I gave them a crap score and left a polite message about not fixing the issue, and the call handler hanging up on me.

Their calls are recorded so I hope they go back and listen to the support call.

Edited by 98elise on Friday 26th May 20:29

[98elise]

dmsims said:

The Hub3 is a POS and I wouldn't use it for anything - wired or wireless

Make them give you a Superhub 2AC and buy an Asus/TP-Link router (other are available ) router

If the former you can put Merlin's firmware on it

Oddly they did offer a "downgrade" as part of the retention conversation. Give that it was probably my 20th call to them I was in no mood to give them any more chances to fix the problem.

I cannot overstate how crap their offshore support is. Shortly after the initial installation VM called me to confirm all was ok, I honestly thought is was a scam because they were not listening to what I was saying, and just wanted to install their antivirus on my devices.

There is no continuity with their support and they only treat your current symptom. If you call 20 times (as I have) they will just try to get you working and off the phone. There is no concept of it being a persistent problem. It's just treated as 20 seperate issues, all resolved and finished with.

[98elise]

TheDrBrian said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

Personally I'd reinstate it and ditch the SH3. Put it in modem mode then get your own access point. You won't match VM 'fibre' for speed.

I don't need speed, I need a reliable service. I'm paying a high price for what I thought was a premium service.

I want a working service, and some form of customer support. I've been trying to to get this from VM for about 3 months now and I've run out of patience. I would rather do without BB than pay them any more money.

The virgin fibre service is very reliable and fast as a rule, the SH is a bit pants at wi-fi. You will get the best internet by using the Sh in modem mode and providing your own wi-fi. Most of the supplied routers with all providers aren't very good.

You're probably moving from one problem to a different one.

The adverts for BT seem to be saying their WiFi is significantly better than VM. I don't mind paying a top money for a decent service.

I have no issue with VM wired BB. It's the WiFi and their customer service that sucks.

I had an automated call from VM today to check how the support call went. I gave them a crap score and left a polite message about not fixing the issue, and the call handler hanging up on me.

Their calls are recorded so I hope they go back and listen to the support call.

Edited by 98elise on Friday 26th May 20:29

Their router might be better at wifi but the speed is wk and if you roll your own router you get a bunch of neat features that nether company offer on their own routers. It doesn't matter if the wifi is 802.11ac if you're connecting to the wider world via a 56k modem.

I just need enough speed to play Netflix. I've had all manner of speeds from VM over the years and it's never been a problem before.

The two things I want are:

1. Decent WiFi
2. Decent customer service

I get neither of those from VM. I tried to ring them again last night as I was getting 1 meg. The queue was 30+ minutes and the call handler just did the usual switch it off and on, and ignored my requests to fix the problem.

My mother has talk talk and she has no issues with netflix and WiFi. She is on their cheapest unlimited service.

[98elise]

MissChief said:

Some good advice, some terrible in here.

Your chosen Openreach network provider will check your address details and then decide if a line exists to your house or not and if an Engineer visit is required.

Do you want to keep your landline number? If so you'll need to get Virgin to revert your telephone service, as a minimum, back to 'active' (rather than pending cancel/termination) so your chosen new provider can port the number. if you don't have or care about your landline number, just approach your new provider.

First of all, check here: https://www.homeandwork.openreach.co.uk/when-can-i... to see if Fibre is available. Unless you're less than a mile from your exchange your speeds will likely be less than 10 meg which for 4k Netflix just won't do!
You can also check here: http://dslchecker.bt.com/adsl/ADSLChecker.address with house number/name and postcode to get an idea of speeds. Post up the results (remembering to remove/edit your address details from the top of the results)

Both BT, PlusNet and EE have terrible customer service. the latest OFCOM survey shows they have far more complaints about them than any other provider, even taken individually rather than as a whole group. Plusnet also have the longest average wait time as well at over 7 minutes.

While Virgin have great headline speeds there are many and numerous threads on the Virgin official forums and elsewhere about terrible contention issues across the country with reports of supposed 200Meg connections struggling to get into double figures at peak times. i.e. when you're most likely to be settling down to watch something on Netflix.

Regarding Wi-Fi, if you have an Apple device (and I'm sure someone in the house does) download the Airport Utility on it. It's an official Apple app and free. Then: enable Wi-Fi scan mode for the iOS AirPort Utility, as follows:
Settings > AirPort Utility > Wi-Fi Scanner and enable it
 
Now when you run the AirPort Utility, you will find a Wi-Fi Scan option in the upper right-hand corner. Select this, and then choose the scan duration, I recommend 20-30 seconds. Select Scan and let the scanner run. Depending on the duration time set, you should get a number of results that includes the channel your Router and your neighbours are on. Then you can change your wireless channel to a free or less congested one, using the instructions here: https://help.virginmedia.com/system/templates/self...

Edited by MissChief on Wednesday 31st May 09:50

Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

The fibre checker says its in my area

the dsl link says:

"There is no data available for this number. This could be either because it is not a BT line or it is a new BT number that has just been provided. Most new numbers will appear on the checker 24 hours after BT has installed the line."

obviously its a VM line!

We don't have any apple devices in the house. Laptops are windows, phones and tablets are Android, and TV's are google chromecast.

We're in a detached house and only have 1 neighbour who's Wifi we can see. VM have tried changing the channels a few times, and they have split the two frequencies so that our devices don't switch back and fourth. We still struggle every day with disconnections and very very slow speeds.

[98elise]

WinstonWolf said:

MissChief said:

dmsims said:

Bu that still leave him with the SH3 (if he stays on Virgin) which is no solution at all!!

I've never used one but yes, I haven't heard good things about the Wi-Fi it's true. At least it might help improve things.

The SH3 is fine as a modem, just don't use the wi-fi. I've got Virgin with a Ubiquiti AP and all is well with the world.

Wait until you need to use their help line for anything!

I've had everything from from "Its being cause by a virus on your TV" to "we're not trained to deal with that". I was particularly impressed with their offer of putting me in touch a third party (at my cost) who could fix my problems, or the time they hung up on me when i asked what they changing on the router.

[98elise]

techiedave said:

OP
You can take this as its intended.

First up analyse what the wi fi channels are in your house There are apps available both for android and windows users
If you find that there are several wifi users SSIDS on the same frequency as your wifi that will cauyse issues
on 2.4ghz wifi the main channels to use are 1/ 6 /11 this is because they have the least overlap of any of the channels

If you can find one of these channels that is not being used by anyone else then switch your superhub to transmit on that channel
Auto means that the suoerhub is changing its wifi channel to avoid conflict with other users it sounds great but it isn't

I too have had issues with VM though mine are of the network issue side I don't use their own wifi I use their superhub in modem only mode and have also used other wifi routers as wireless access points

That's all been done. There is only one other user I can pick up, and they are at the other end of the spectrum. The support desk have changed things many times. We have had a Virgin engineer around who has also split the frequencies into different SSID's so my devices won't try jumping between them.

The WiFi remains dire and pretty much unusable. Even normal surfing is pretty crap (which was witnessed by the engineer). I measured 1.6Meg a couple of days ago when watching Netfix became a constant 2 seconds of video followed by 30 seconds of buffering! The distance between my hub and my TV is about 20ft

19 days to go until I'm free of this crap

[98elise]

WinstonWolf said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

MissChief said:

dmsims said:

Bu that still leave him with the SH3 (if he stays on Virgin) which is no solution at all!!

I've never used one but yes, I haven't heard good things about the Wi-Fi it's true. At least it might help improve things.

The SH3 is fine as a modem, just don't use the wi-fi. I've got Virgin with a Ubiquiti AP and all is well with the world.

Wait until you need to use their help line for anything!

I've had everything from from "Its being cause by a virus on your TV" to "we're not trained to deal with that". I was particularly impressed with their offer of putting me in touch a third party (at my cost) who could fix my problems, or the time they hung up on me when i asked what they changing on the router.

I have, I do this sort of stuff for a living hence my frustration. The problem isn't their service, it's the poor wi-fi performance on the SH. Swap that and never need to call them again.

How would you rate their customer service when you have called them? The only time you get through to somebody that want to help is when you ring to cancel.

I don't see why I'm paying so much for a service that I need to fix. The kit is a WiFi router, and it doesn't work. If I'd just bought it from Curry's it would be returned as not fit for purpose. Nobody else in my office is having issues with their providers, and only one is using his own router. He's a gadget freak though with a decent NAS, WiFi lights and camera's etc.

[98elise]

WinstonWolf said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

98elise said:

WinstonWolf said:

MissChief said:

dmsims said:

Bu that still leave him with the SH3 (if he stays on Virgin) which is no solution at all!!

I've never used one but yes, I haven't heard good things about the Wi-Fi it's true. At least it might help improve things.

The SH3 is fine as a modem, just don't use the wi-fi. I've got Virgin with a Ubiquiti AP and all is well with the world.

Wait until you need to use their help line for anything!

I've had everything from from "Its being cause by a virus on your TV" to "we're not trained to deal with that". I was particularly impressed with their offer of putting me in touch a third party (at my cost) who could fix my problems, or the time they hung up on me when i asked what they changing on the router.

I have, I do this sort of stuff for a living hence my frustration. The problem isn't their service, it's the poor wi-fi performance on the SH. Swap that and never need to call them again.

How would you rate their customer service when you have called them? The only time you get through to somebody that want to help is when you ring to cancel.

I don't see why I'm paying so much for a service that I need to fix. The kit is a WiFi router, and it doesn't work. If I'd just bought it from Curry's it would be returned as not fit for purpose. Nobody else in my office is having issues with their providers, and only one is using his own router. He's a gadget freak though with a decent NAS, WiFi lights and camera's etc.

Fine, I very rarely need to call them. You might want the wi-fi to work well but it won't. You will have problems with other providers and their wi-fi still won't be as good as a dedicated box of your own.

What do I know, I've only been doing this for a quarter of a century.

I'm not disputing your experience and I thank you for taking the time to reply, but I don't need the best I just need WiFi good enough to stream Netflix over a distance of more than 20ft. From friends, family and work mates that seems an entirely normal service that most providers can to achieve (a mix of Sky, Plusnet, VM and Talk Talk).

VM even managed it before I moved to SH3.

I've found VM's customer service to be dire. I've honestly had to call them about 20 times and they still do not seem to understand that this is an ongoing problem. Resetting the box will not fix it any more then it did the previous 20 times they did it.

[98elise]

The_Jackal said:

I know its a bit late but did they replace it at all with a new one?

No.

The engineer said thats what they would do that if it was no better after his visit. Someone was supposed to call back to check but they never did, so I'm back to phoning India so they can turn it off and on again.

They also lied to me about the cancellation period so I've ended up paying an extra month. I was supposed to be able to cancel from the first time I called to cancel, but they have since said that there are no notes about that so I've go to do the whole month.

[98elise]

Jimboka said:

My SH3 wifi is fine. Speedtest on my iphone is 110 Mbps at this time, 20 ft away.
Can't believe they can't fix/replace yours.

I'm sure they can, but the customer service is dire. The call handlers have no desire to fix the problem, just the current symptom. The cancelling/retention people have no technical knowledge so can only offer to cut your bill or up your speed. Neither of those are any use to me if i get 1.6meg at my tablet/TV

[98elise]

megaphone said:

OP, have you tried a wired connection into the hub from a laptop or pc? If so what speeds do you get, is it reliable?

Wired is fine, but the majority of our use is chromecast and tablets/phones. I probably use a laptop once per week.

[98elise]

techiedave said:

Just as a pointer Mr Elise what speeds do you get on the mobile phone laptop can you measure that ?
Could you then unplug the chrome cast and do the same

I get very variable results anyway so i don't think chromecast is the issue. its problematic when the chromecasts are off, and its problematic when they are on. I can see 30meg regularly, sometimes 50meg, sometimes 1meg, sometimes my devices are no longer connected so have to be disconnected and reconnected.

We're way beyond fault finding now anyway. There is clearly a problem and VM don't seem to want to deal with it, so we're parting company on the 20th

[98elise]

Jimboka said:

My SH3 wifi is fine. Speedtest on my iphone is 110 Mbps at this time, 20 ft away.
Can't believe they can't fix/replace yours.

I think we"ve got to the bottom of why they won't replace it.

Their retention department rang me today to ask why I was leaving. It turns out they won't replace the SH3 unless I sign up for another year.

They then put me through to someone in the UK to take a look at my hub again, and he said that we have about 18 devices connected and that's why its slow (even though only a couple as actually using the internet at any one time).

He couldn't explain why it was fine when I only had 20meg vs the current 50 (upgraded around the same time as the hub).

[98elise]

Kev_Mk3 said:

98elise said:

They then put me through to someone in the UK to take a look at my hub again, and he said that we have about 18 devices connected and that's why its slow (even though only a couple as actually using the internet at any one time).

this wouldnt affect your service would it?

He was trying to say that each device is allocated some bandwidth even if it's not actively using it. The fact we were fine with 20meg before didn't change his stance.

[98elise]

MissChief said:

Tablets and mobiles are awful for hogging some bandwidth, constantly polling the email server of your choice to see if there's any new emails, checking for any updates, reactions to your latest Facebook/Snapchat/Instagram posts etc. as well as the relevant App/Play store for any updates. As well as feeding back all your cookies and personal information to Facebook, Google, MI5 etc. It's not a huge amount of data in itself, but if you have half a dozen of these devices it can easily add up. Add to that games consoles downloading updates when they're not being used etc and you can 'lose' quite a bit of bandwidth.

The best way to test, if you have one, is a wired PC or Mac and get onto the Router status page and turn your wireless off then run a wired test on a reputable site. Speedtest.net is OK outside Peak times but often can't cope if the chosen server is busy or saturated. I've always used http://speedtest.btwholesale.com which I find really consistent but it uses Flash so won't run on tablets or mobiles.

Prior to the SH3 we had all the same devices, less than half the capacity, and an ancient router.

This has all started since we upped our capacity by 150% and got their latest router.

The problem is not with our gadgets.