Does front mid-engine exist?

[jagfan2]

stickleback123 said:

That VAG engine position is why they need a W12 rather than V12 - when you hang the thing mostly in front of the axle you can't really stand the extra length of a real V12.

Edited by stickleback123 on Monday 9th August 10:14

The V10 RS6 is probably the worst, while heavy at least ist only 3cyl long, the V10 has 5 cylinders and 2 turbos hanging well infront of the front axle

[Robmarriott]

kambites said:

Front-mid engined FWD cars are extremely rare. I can't think of any recent ones.

Toyota iQ

[Pan Pan Pan]

sociopath said:

How many cars do you know of with the engine in front of the wheels, because I can't think of any.

To me that's front engined.

The term mid engined is used to describe a vehicle, where the engine is either just ahead of the rear wheels, or just behind the front wheels. Where the engine is, in relation to the cockpit (either behind it or ahead of it), is not quite so relevant with regard to how the term mid engine is used..

[TypeRTim]

Pan Pan Pan said:

The term mid engined is used to describe a vehicle, where the engine is either just ahead of the rear wheels, or just behind the front wheels. Where the engine is, in relation to the cockpit (either behind it or ahead of it), is not quite so relevant with regard to how the term mid engine is used..

I would disagree, I would say to the majority, the term mid-engined is used to describe a car where the engine is between the passenger compartment and the rear wheels.

If you asked someone to draw the silhouette of a mid-engined car, it would come out like a SF90, not an 812.

[APontus]

If the engine's within the wheelbase it's mid engined.

Some really hard to fathom snobbery about a matter of fact phrase.

[kiseca]

Pan Pan Pan said:

sociopath said:

How many cars do you know of with the engine in front of the wheels, because I can't think of any.

To me that's front engined.

The term mid engined is used to describe a vehicle, where the engine is either just ahead of the rear wheels, or just behind the front wheels. Where the engine is, in relation to the cockpit (either behind it or ahead of it), is not quite so relevant with regard to how the term mid engine is used..

I would say that is totally incorrect. Mid engined has always been used to describe a vehicle with the engine behind the passenger compartment (and obviously in front of the back wheels.

Cars with engines in front of the passenger compartment have always, in magazines, by manufacturers and in general discussion, been described as front engined, and in some cases by the manufacturers as front-mid. Even Formula 1, which always had the engine behind the front axle line, only started describing the cars as mid engined when it moved behind the driver.

[TypeRTim]

APontus said:

If the engine's within the wheelbase it's mid engined.

Some really hard to fathom snobbery about a matter of fact phrase.

Entirely or only partially?

I think that is where the debate really comes in. Personally, I would say a car is only truly 'mid-engined' if the engine (and associated ancillaries) is ENTIRELY within the wheelbase of the car

[kambites]

Robmarriott said:

kambites said:

Front-mid engined FWD cars are extremely rare. I can't think of any recent ones.

Toyota iQ

Interesting, I had no idea the iQ was laid out like that. The engine isn't strictly entirely behind the front wheels because it leans forwards so much, but it's close:

[thegreenhell]

kambites said:

Front-mid engined FWD cars are extremely rare. I can't think of any recent ones.

At least one of the BTCC cars from the 1990's, I think the Renault Laguna built by Williams was one, moved the engine so far back against the bulkhead that they had to flip the gearbox and run the driveshafts in front of the engine.

[HorneyMX5]

As a multiple MX5 owner I am well aware it’s a thing, but many disagree with me.

[Clem2k3]

It's only mid engined if it comes from Le Mid region of France, otherwise its just a sparkling front engined car...

[Sensei Rob]

As far as I'm concerned, the only mid-engined cars are the ones where the engine is literally in the middle, like the fantastical Toyota Previa and the legendary Mazda Friendee Bongo.

[saaby93]

Sensei Rob said:

As far as I'm concerned, the only mid-engined cars are the ones where the engine is literally in the middle, like the fantastical Toyota Previa and the legendary Mazda Friendee Bongo.

Honda Acty too for some planted road holding
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/274834351714?
Especially the 4wd version

[e-honda]

Sensei Rob said:

As far as I'm concerned, the only mid-engined cars are the ones where the engine is literally in the middle, like the fantastical Toyota Previa and the legendary Mazda Friendee Bongo.

except the previa's engine is nowhere near the middle of the car



its about 3x as far from the rear axle as it is the front
the gearbox is the thing that is right in the middle

[Hugo a Gogo]

kambites said:

Front-mid engined FWD cars are extremely rare. I can't think of any recent ones.

Renault 4 and early 5 were front mid FWD, transaxle gearbox was out front, longditudinal engine behind it (with a gearshift linkage snaking over the engine)

[saaby93]

e-honda said:

except the previa's engine is nowhere near the middle of the car



its about 3x as far from the rear axle as it is the front
the gearbox is the thing that is right in the middle

At first glance that looks pretty much as mid engine as mid engine can be

[Chris944_S2]

Slingshot dragsters
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_engine_drags...

[Milkyway]

Interesting debate...
Is this beast Front, mid... or both? @ (Confused..com)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jFS83GUMTCc

Edited by Milkyway on Sunday 22 August 12:39

[Milkyway]

aeytr5 said:

thegreenhell said:

There was a Mini Cooper built for racing in the 1960's that had a Buick V8 in the back driving the front wheels through a reversed Jaguar gearbox and differential. It looked particularly odd as it had 13" front wheels and standard 10" rear wheels.

Green - you are a fountain of knowledge.

Thanks for this… very surprised such a thing has ever existed… lots of FWD power with no weight on it is sure to be uncontrollable and pretty awful… but I suppose a wheelbase as short as an old Mini would make it just as bad having that much power with RWD. Anyway… I’m a lover of all things quirky, but I’m not even sure that I could muster the courage to drive that around!

I remember reading about this... I dint think it performed that well.
Rear engined FWD without 4x4... can’t understand why it never caught on.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/classic-c...

Edited by Milkyway on Sunday 22 August 13:13

[donkmeister]

I've now seen a few articles that say the ICE in the Koenigsegg Gemera drives only the front wheels... I've not seen anything suitably technical that confirms this.

But, that would be a stablemate for the mid-engined FWD Mini, if it's true. Sort of.