Drones... harmless boy toys or perverts new choice...?

[surveyor]

djc206 said:

CrutyRammers said:

DJI have done it to pre-empt government action, which I suspect will come at some point.
Otherwise, it's pretty trivial. Airspace files are widely available (many flying gps instruments come with them already built in, or available from the manufacturer). Mine warns me when if I get close to uk airspace out of the box. Not exactly hard to use that data to implement geofences for drones.

I'm sure it checks the relevant NOTAM's each day to check for temporary airspace restrictions etc doesn't it?

That is the responsibility of the Pilot. I'll do it before heading it out, and again on-site via an app, as well as getting the CAA email updates. I suspect that many hobbiests will not be aware of such a thing.

[Robb F]

DEF CON 23 - Robinson and Mitchell - Knocking my neighbors kids cruddy drone offline

[J4CKO]

Are perverts really that hard up for a photo of a woman in a bikini when there is the internet that caters for every specialist interest ?

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

Some of this seems a bit hysterical, the Daily Mail "I dont do, like or understand something, so it must be banned" even if the justification is tenuous and over stated.

I think by and large drones are used for businesses or recording stuff, but mainly crashed or just the novelty wears off.

[djc206]

J4CKO said:

Are perverts really that hard up for a photo of a woman in a bikini when there is the internet that caters for every specialist interest ?

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

Some of this seems a bit hysterical, the Daily Mail "I dont do, like or understand something, so it must be banned" even if the justification is tenuous and over stated.

I think by and large drones are used for businesses or recording stuff, but mainly crashed or just the novelty wears off.

A buzzard is made of squishy stuff not lithium ion batteries

[surveyor]

J4CKO said:

Are perverts really that hard up for a photo of a woman in a bikini when there is the internet that caters for every specialist interest ?

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

Some of this seems a bit hysterical, the Daily Mail "I dont do, like or understand something, so it must be banned" even if the justification is tenuous and over stated.

I think by and large drones are used for businesses or recording stuff, but mainly crashed or just the novelty wears off.

My thinking is that one day there will be a collision. It will then be down to luck as to what and where it hits and whether it causes the plane to come down. It's not really on...

Having said that.... If a drone goes in an engine... It's going to break some turbine blades, and may even cause the lipo battery to catch fire. But engines are designed to be hot places... Probably not going to harm the plane as a whole... Bigger issue is if it hits the windscreen at a critical phase in my opinion. Pilots could end up with a lump of metal and whirring blades in their face...

[Shakermaker]

J4CKO said:

Are perverts really that hard up for a photo of a woman in a bikini when there is the internet that caters for every specialist interest ?

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

Some of this seems a bit hysterical, the Daily Mail "I dont do, like or understand something, so it must be banned" even if the justification is tenuous and over stated.

I think by and large drones are used for businesses or recording stuff, but mainly crashed or just the novelty wears off.

They can "cope" with a bird going through the engine in that the probably have to spend a few quid getting the engine repaired. plus all the cost of disruption to that aircraft not being able to operate for a while. So whilst it is unlikely to result in a big ball of fiery death like the end of Die Hard 2, it is likely to result in a few hundred thousand/million pounds worth of cost and inconvenience

Airports spend a lot of money to get rid of birds as well to mitigate that risk

[AndrewGP]

J4CKO said:

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

The problem is the scale of factors involved is huge - how big a drone? How many? Where specifically does it hit the aircraft? What are the impact speeds?

A small drone hitting an A320 or larger passenger aircraft might *just* take an engine out as other posters suggest. Equally, a bigger, heavier drone or several hitting an aircraft on the nose, a wing leading edge, control surface, vertical tail or extended landing gear could cause substantial damage which may or may not bring an aircraft down. And a large drone vs a Cessna could end very badly indeed.

I spend a great deal of my life flying military aircraft at low level (250ft) and at the speeds we travel, hitting a drone (especially a heavy one or multiple drones) scares the st out of me. I treat the risk of bring an aircraft down extremely seriously.

[Dr Doofenshmirtz]

I suspect news sensationalism rather skews what real damage a drone could do...I imagine hitting a Goose or other large bird would do far more damage than your average drone.

[djc206]

Dr Doofenshmirtz said:

I suspect news sensationalism rather skews what real damage a drone could do...I imagine hitting a Goose or other large bird would do far more damage than your average drone.

Than your average drone yes but then a goose is not an average bird. In fact you may recall what happened when a couple of geese hit a plane, the Hudson found itself with a new accessory and a film was made. If a large drone hits a plane in the wrong place we may get another blockbuster with Mr Hanks in it

[andrewrob]

djc206 said:

Dr Doofenshmirtz said:

I suspect news sensationalism rather skews what real damage a drone could do...I imagine hitting a Goose or other large bird would do far more damage than your average drone.

Than your average drone yes but then a goose is not an average bird. In fact you may recall what happened when a couple of geese hit a plane, the Hudson found itself with a new accessory and a film was made. If a large drone hits a plane in the wrong place we may get another blockbuster with Mr Hanks in it

But (contrary to over the top reports in the press) large drones aren't going to be the ones hanging around airports being piloted by yobbos. The biggest you'd find is a phantom which is tiny and would just be smashed to bits as its mostly plastic.
Recent reports from pilots seeing large octos at 5000+ft are very hard to believe. Then there was the one a while back that was reported in all the major news outlets, only for a month later when the investigation concluded that it was most likely a carrier bag (which wasn't reported so widely)

[S13_Alan]

Not all of them are designed to fly around slowly and take video remember.

It's the absolute best hobby I've ever tried, and somewhere above RC Planes but below collective pitch RC Heli's in terms of difficulty (ie - still bloody difficult) with a pretty steep barrier to entry due to the technical knowledge needed.

Everyone who watches along (I've a spare cheap set of goggles for them) seems to love it.

[djc206]

andrewrob said:

djc206 said:

Dr Doofenshmirtz said:

I suspect news sensationalism rather skews what real damage a drone could do...I imagine hitting a Goose or other large bird would do far more damage than your average drone.

Than your average drone yes but then a goose is not an average bird. In fact you may recall what happened when a couple of geese hit a plane, the Hudson found itself with a new accessory and a film was made. If a large drone hits a plane in the wrong place we may get another blockbuster with Mr Hanks in it

But (contrary to over the top reports in the press) large drones aren't going to be the ones hanging around airports being piloted by yobbos. The biggest you'd find is a phantom which is tiny and would just be smashed to bits as its mostly plastic.
Recent reports from pilots seeing large octos at 5000+ft are very hard to believe. Then there was the one a while back that was reported in all the major news outlets, only for a month later when the investigation concluded that it was most likely a carrier bag (which wasn't reported so widely)

I work in aviation I'm well aware that most reports of drones are possibles not definitelys , it used to be that everything was a weather balloon, now it's a drone. Some are drones though and they most definitely pose a very real threat.

Youre assuming that just because someone can afford a fancy drone or have the correct licence that they aren't going to do something monumentally stupid or illegal with it. The GA community in this country do monumentally stupid things everyday such as infringing control zones, flying through active Danger Areas without clearances etc why would the drone lot be any different?

[CrutyRammers]

djc206 said:

I'm sure it checks the relevant NOTAM's each day to check for temporary airspace restrictions etc doesn't it?

Right. So its possible to handle 99% of air space automatically, but because of the remaining 1%, it's not worth doing?

[djc206]

CrutyRammers said:

djc206 said:

I'm sure it checks the relevant NOTAM's each day to check for temporary airspace restrictions etc doesn't it?

Right. So its possible to handle 99% of air space automatically, but because of the remaining 1%, it's not worth doing?

That's not what I said at all

[Cold]

[blueg33]

I have a drone with a camera, I bought it to take landscape pics after being inspired by the Drone Pics thread on here, and to use on my road trip through Northern Spain to take pics of the cars in the mountains etc

Its only a small drone, but I take its use seriously, I check via the NATS app whether its safe to fly it and each flight is registered with NATS via the app. I have only overflown other peoples houses with their express permission (so I could get a pic of the flashings on my chimney). I carry insurance and feel that it is 100% my responsibility to avoid causing people annoyance or distress. I also live in a rural area with lots of space.

My drone is also geo fenced so that it cant go more than 100m up and 100m away horizontally

As a matter of interest, just because a drone is overhead doesn't mean that the camera is looking down. IMO looking straight down is pretty boring.

I have no objection to registering the drone as I think that there are plenty of irresponsible users that means that the rest of us get tarred with the same brush.


Edited to add - I have seen my neighbour in a bikini long before I had the drone, what's been seen can't be unseen!

[bimsb6]

I believe the drone haters here ( i don't have one) need to get used to the idea of seeing them about , amazon are looking at doing deliveries by drone , a fast food outlet near me were trialling deliveries by drone and on the news the other day ( in nevada ) they are trialling dropping off defibrillators to people that needed them in remote locations by drone . They are going to be massive in the future .

[anonymous-user]

These things should registered and transmit a unique ID when flying so if one is causing trouble e.g. at an airport the owner can be identified and prosecuted.

The issue of privacy or unwanted intrusion should be dealt with individually using the most efficient method.

If these things transmitted an ID then it should be something that an app on a phone can receive and decode.

[surveyor]

blueg33 said:

I have a drone with a camera, I bought it to take landscape pics after being inspired by the Drone Pics thread on here, and to use on my road trip through Northern Spain to take pics of the cars in the mountains etc

Its only a small drone, but I take its use seriously, I check via the NATS app whether its safe to fly it and each flight is registered with NATS via the app. I have only overflown other peoples houses with their express permission (so I could get a pic of the flashings on my chimney). I carry insurance and feel that it is 100% my responsibility to avoid causing people annoyance or distress. I also live in a rural area with lots of space.

My drone is also geo fenced so that it cant go more than 100m up and 100m away horizontally

As a matter of interest, just because a drone is overhead doesn't mean that the camera is looking down. IMO looking straight down is pretty boring.

I have no objection to registering the drone as I think that there are plenty of irresponsible users that means that the rest of us get tarred with the same brush.


Edited to add - I have seen my neighbour in a bikini long before I had the drone, what's been seen can't be unseen!

You take it seriously - but unless your in the country with no neighbours, you've broken the rules. No matter what the distances are you are not allowed to fly in a Congested Zone unless you hold a PfCO. Not having a go, but it is so easy to break what are relatively simple rules.

Even with a PfCO operating in a Congested Zone is not easy.

I'm unclear what the NATS flight log does. It's certainly not something that the CAA are pushing out in their PfCO permissions. I suspect it's for research purposes, and maybe referenced if you knock a plane out the sky or something. I'm pretty sure it's does nothing in 'real time'.

[J4CKO]

AndrewGP said:

J4CKO said:

Now I dont think they should be anywhere near air traffic, but would a drone really be able to bring down a plane of that size, I mean they cope ok with several pounds of wildfowl by and large and even if there is legislation I dont think your average Buzzard or Guillemot really takes much notice and prefers to take the chance to be ingested by a high bypass turbofan for teh lolz, so will a drone actually cause that much damage ?

The problem is the scale of factors involved is huge - how big a drone? How many? Where specifically does it hit the aircraft? What are the impact speeds?

A small drone hitting an A320 or larger passenger aircraft might *just* take an engine out as other posters suggest. Equally, a bigger, heavier drone or several hitting an aircraft on the nose, a wing leading edge, control surface, vertical tail or extended landing gear could cause substantial damage which may or may not bring an aircraft down. And a large drone vs a Cessna could end very badly indeed.

I spend a great deal of my life flying military aircraft at low level (250ft) and at the speeds we travel, hitting a drone (especially a heavy one or multiple drones) scares the st out of me. I treat the risk of bring an aircraft down extremely seriously.

Slow down, go higher and be careful around peoples drones for gods sake, reckless plane jockeys going too fast causing havoc for drone owners