RE: Reasons to be cheerful: PH Blog
Wednesday 13th March 2013
The way a lot of talk, both editorially and on the forums, has been going of late I was wondering about organising a PH Luddites tour. While not, perhaps, going to the extremes of a trip to Getrag to smash up every dual-clutch gearbox in the place with lump hammers or burning down ZF's electric steering development department it could take in a slightly more civilised approach of handing in petitions. Or polite tutting. The itinerary could take in a ferry crossing to Dieppe to have a moan about five doors and flappy paddles on Renaultsport Clios. Thence to Stuttgart to express displeasure at the 991 GT3's new focus on tech over tactility. Before heading over to Garching to play the sound of classic M engines over loudspeakers to jolly well see how they like it.
Clio's new direction has inspired soul searchingOf course, the trip should really return via Harwich to drop by Lotus to celebrate the business case for playing strictly to the purist, enthusiast elite and see how well that's served the boys from Norfolk.
'Too fast, too fat, too fake!' comes the cryThose of us in that noisy one per cent will moan we're being sold out to the marketeers by the very cars whose iconic status we've helped forge. That we're at a tipping point where technology means these cars have outpaced the ability of drivers to enjoy them, let alone roads or even racetracks contain them.
There's much to celebrate about the new ageDoesn't mean to say we can't argue the toss though. Soapboxes will be clambered upon on occasion. But after last week's self-indulgent 'they don't make 'em like they used to' paean to GT3s of old I've come round to a more optimistic view. That, far from the end of proper driving as we know it, we could actually be on the cusp of a technologically exciting age of amazing cars that really push the boundaries of what's possible. Be they million-pound hypercars or cleverly engineered 100mpg runabouts.
Reasons to be cheerful: PH Blog
Why we need to take the rose tints off and embrace the future with both flappy paddles!
Clio's new direction has inspired soul searching
You may, by now, have spotted the flaw in this argument...
Yep, if manufacturers listened to us we'd now be on our next generation of stupidly thirsty M cars with high-revving engines and jerky gearboxes. Lethal 911s that prove our manliness by demanding Rohrl-like hand-eye coordination and commitment. Or a fiery demise at Schwedenkreuz. Clios with powerbands 500rpm off the redline and mid-20s fuel consumption.
Actually they did listen to us. And the latest technology means they can build cars that deliver the visceral thrills all but a noisy one per cent demand while making them liveable with and appealing to a vast new audience. Let us not forget, manufacturers exist to build cars they can sell to us in numbers sufficient to turn a profit according to their particular business model. Not satisfy some romantic dream. And most of them are getting better at it.
'Too fast, too fat, too fake!' comes the cry
Thing is, it's not really reason to feel gloomy. New GT3 too tech heavy to be fun? Drive an old one then. Don't want a turbocharged five-door Clio with flappy paddles? Cash in on the majority turning their back on high-revving, manual ones and pick up a bargain. New cars too much about power and grip? Buy a Toyobaru or MX-5. There are enough cars of all vintages to go around and suit all tastes and budgets.
Dual-clutch apologists are no more wrong than manual die-hards are right. Technology enhanced speed at all costs no less valid a goal than going a little slower but feeling more involved.
There's much to celebrate about the new age
And if that doesn't float your boat we've still got the classifieds.
Dan
Discussion
"Yep, if manufacturers listened to us we'd now be on our next generation of stupidly thirsty M cars with high-revving engines and jerky gearboxes. Lethal 911s that prove our manliness by demanding Rohrl-like hand-eye coordination and commitment. Or a fiery demise at Schwedenkreuz. Clios with powerbands 500rpm off the redline and mid-20s fuel consumption.'"
Sounds like bliss.
Cars should scare you, not lull you into a false sense of security.
They should be demanding to drive, otherwise there's no satisfaction in driving them well.
Yup, luddite and proud. I certainly doubt I'll buy another new car lets put it that way. To this day the thing that pisses me off in the Cayman is that f**king bright yellow light that comes on right in the middle of the rev counter when you switch PSM (Please Save Me) off. It's like the car saying "ARE YOU MAD, YOU'RE GOING TO DIE IF I LET YOU DO THIS YOURSELF!". Most annoying feature EVER on a car that really, really doesn't warrant it.
Sounds like bliss.
Cars should scare you, not lull you into a false sense of security.
They should be demanding to drive, otherwise there's no satisfaction in driving them well.
Yup, luddite and proud. I certainly doubt I'll buy another new car lets put it that way. To this day the thing that pisses me off in the Cayman is that f**king bright yellow light that comes on right in the middle of the rev counter when you switch PSM (Please Save Me) off. It's like the car saying "ARE YOU MAD, YOU'RE GOING TO DIE IF I LET YOU DO THIS YOURSELF!". Most annoying feature EVER on a car that really, really doesn't warrant it.
juansolo said:
To this day the thing that pisses me off in the Cayman is that f**king bright yellow light that comes on right in the middle of the rev counter when you switch PSM (Please Save Me) off. It's like the car saying "ARE YOU MAD, YOU'RE GOING TO DIE IF I LET YOU DO THIS YOURSELF!". Most annoying feature EVER on a car that really, really doesn't warrant it.
Really? A yellow light annoys you? I'd be more worried about the yellow check engine light on a cayman dashboard if I'm honest 
I think this article nails the real win for us luddites ... loads of people going for the new models means the old ones become a cheap way of getting some old school fun.
For a while at least ... the secret is noticing the sweetspot when a car is too old to be desirable to the masses but not so old as to be desirable to the purists (for want of a better word) - ie that lovely time when a really good 2 door E30 325i was under a grand because they were perceived as chavvy (again for want of a better word).
Now if only this theory applied at the top end and the imminent P1 meant that F1s were in reach
For a while at least ... the secret is noticing the sweetspot when a car is too old to be desirable to the masses but not so old as to be desirable to the purists (for want of a better word) - ie that lovely time when a really good 2 door E30 325i was under a grand because they were perceived as chavvy (again for want of a better word).
Now if only this theory applied at the top end and the imminent P1 meant that F1s were in reach
TheHeretic said:
Crusoe said:
Thinking about what to replace my 130i with next, nothing similar that I can think of that has a NA 6 cylinder 3lr petrol engine, manual gearbox and rear wheel drive in a smallish body - unless I go for something older.
370z.Infiniti G37 coupe
Fantuzzi said:
Pushing boundaries is fine, but not at the expense of driver involvement.
The trouble with that argument is that, taken to its logical conclusion, you would seem to be advocating cabins still full of knobs for adjusting mixture, ignition etc. along with unassisted brakes and steering and no syncro on our gearboxes.All these things are 'driver involvement' with many providing real satisfaction in their correct use, yet all have disappeared for one reason or another and not many are seriously lamented.
We are on a ease-of-use continuum; what seems normal now would have seemed impossibly simple to the driver of a 1940s saloon and positively magical to the driver of a vehicle from 1900.
Similarly, in 50 years time, if we are still allowed to have personal transportation, the controls of a 2013 GT3 will surely be looked upon as quaint and anachronistic.
What I'm basically saying is that there is no 'ideal' level of driver involvement, just what we are used to. Things change, as they always must, and although the natural result is to feel that we will be losing out as part of this progress it doesn't always pan out that way.
in case you haven't guessed I'm a bit of an optimist about such things. We live in a golden age of motoring and while some developments may raise concern, the variety and quality of cars available to us today and in the near future has never been equalled.
andyp03 said:
Oh dear, it looks like Dan's boss has had an unhappy phone call/email from Porsche for daring to write his original article!
Far from it! I spent the weekend mulling it over and decided to try being less of an old curmudgeon and move with the times. I even threw away my Betamax video player and decided to try these Blu-whatnots. Apparently the movie is on a disc and you don't have to rewind it once you're done! Amazing!Dan
Mark-C said:
Alternatively ask yourself "why replace it?"
Warranty and peace of mind I guess?My 250 is three years old in September. Best car I've owned by a long way, does everything really well, practical and fast, and brilliant on a wet trackday! But could potentially cost me a lot if things start to go wrong out of warranty. Still, it's likely I'm going to be keeping it...
TheHeretic said:
370z.
Infiniti G37 coupe
2 seaters and didn't like the lazyness of the 350z when I tried one (had a E46 M3 at the time). Don't think there are any infiniti dealers this far north plus 370z is £460 a year road tax and rated at a thirsty 26mpg, I'd be better off going back to an M3 or something older and V8. Infiniti G37 coupe
Crusoe said:
2 seaters and didn't like the lazyness of the 350z when I tried one (had a E46 M3 at the time). Don't think there are any infiniti dealers this far north plus 370z is £460 a year road tax and rated at a thirsty 26mpg, I'd be better off going back to an M3 or something older and V8.
The G37 is a 2+2. Decent back seats as it happens. As go for something older, you may as well stick with the 130?Crusoe said:
2 seaters and didn't like the lazyness of the 350z when I tried one (had a E46 M3 at the time). Don't think there are any infiniti dealers this far north plus 370z is £460 a year road tax and rated at a thirsty 26mpg, I'd be better off going back to an M3 or something older and V8.
what about a GT86 or BRZ? not as powerful, not as many cylinders but ticks some of the boxes
I don't want to push the boundaries.
I don't want paddle shift, I don't want auto, I don't want auto lights and wipers nor bloody LEDs, I don't want stop-start and I particularly don't want an electronic handbrake. I don't want boots that close themselves either, i just want a car that i enjoy driving and can play with and adjust and get some feedback from.
Of course,someone will have to design a modern car I actually like the look of before any of that becomes an issue.
I don't want paddle shift, I don't want auto, I don't want auto lights and wipers nor bloody LEDs, I don't want stop-start and I particularly don't want an electronic handbrake. I don't want boots that close themselves either, i just want a car that i enjoy driving and can play with and adjust and get some feedback from.
Of course,someone will have to design a modern car I actually like the look of before any of that becomes an issue.
It's not like you can really drive hard these days anyway, to do so would be foolish, risky and immature, not to mention macho. Cars in the past were all dangerous, witness the semi trailing arm fitted to the BMW E30, it was well reported that it was bloody lethal. The vast majority of PHers just want a sporty economical car, to get from A to B.
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