Wednesday 3rd June 2015

Honda Civic Type R: the tech

Driving impressions to follow; first some background from the engineers on the technology

---

The third-generation Honda Civic Type R is FINALLY arriving in showrooms in July, costing from £29,995, and we've had a good poke around the car ahead of driving it on the launch event taking place right now. More on that to follow but we've also grilled the engineers who built it. So, just how much of a tech revolution is the Type R?

Civic Type R NOT pictured at 'ring shocker

Answer: not a huge one. As ever with Honda, progress comes in incremental steps. That means the specs are tasty if a little over familiar thanks to considerable pre-launch hype. 310hp, 296lb ft of torque from a 2.0-litre turbocharged engine and put to the road through a six-speed manual gearbox. It's front-wheel drive rather than 4WD as the forthcoming Ford Focus RS will be, but you get a passive limited slip differential and modified front suspension struts to cope with that power.

We asked the chief engineer (whom we've metbefore), Hisayuki Yagi, why he didn't feel the need to go four-wheel-drive and he told us it went against the Honda philosophy of "mecha minimum, man maximum". Meaning it would rob too much space from passengers. Honda also loathes engineering inefficiency and reckoned the extra power you'd have to add to overcome the weight difference still wouldn't change the Nurburgring time that much. And, yes, these guys are OBSESSED with the Nordschleife. If you're not ... tough!

Dual-axis struts reduce torque steer

Instead of four-wheel drive you've got a 'dual-axis' front suspension strut like that employed by Renault for the Megane Renaultsport (called PerfoHub) and Vauxhall Astra VXR (HiPerStrut) that adds another fork to the standard Civic's Macpherson strut. Indeed, the Megane Renaultsport 275 was held up as a benchmark for this car, the chassis engineer told us. Which isn't surprising given this was the car it wanted to beat around the Nurburgring for the title of fastest front-drive production car.

Essentially this set-up means the damper and spring can go about its business of dealing with the road surface while the dedicated knuckle connection to the wheel hub copes with the steering forces. Honda reckons this reduces torque steer by a very precise 55 per cent. The rear suspension meanwhile is the same twist beam, but tweaked to improve roll rigidity by 177 percent, no less. Power understeer meanwhile is quelled by a helical limited slip differential, again of a type used by the Megane, that Honda reckoned gave it an extra three seconds round ... go on, guess where.

Megane, unsurprisingly, high on Honda's hitlist

Since we're talking about that track (again), the R button that stiffens the dampers, dials back the electronic oversteer catcher, and reduces the steering assist sets the car up for the Nordschleife. Seriously. "It might be a bit hard for a normal track but for the Nurburgring it's perfect," Honda's German-based tech spokesman said of the R engaged damper settings.

The engine, meanwhile, is the first from Honda to combine a turbo with VTEC, presumably meaning you get a double 'Yo!' (YoYo?) when the two elements kick in. It also has an electronic wastegate that Honda reckons will allow them to control the boost more precisely. It should combine the best of both worlds, given it revs to 7,000rpm but makes peak torque from 2,500rpm.

The six-speed gearbox is refreshing in a world of dual-clutches and Honda reckons it has the shortest shift stroke in its class. Hisayuki Yagi said he chose a manual rather than auto because he wanted to "maximise man-machine engagement" and we say amen to that.

The Type R’s confident aerodynamic addenda are only there to help roadholding and airflow, we’re told. Those vents behind the front wheels push out air used for cooling that would have otherwise slowed it down. What the engineers were very clear on was that elements like that dual rear wing (slightly reduced from the concept) are not there for show. This is purely about go. “This is not a product that has been brought by marketing demands,” says Yagi. “It is a present from Honda to the world, combining the ultimate driving performance with a certain racing DNA.”

Bold words. Read the drive story to follow find out whether they succeeded.

 

[Actus Reus]

• counts exhausts*

This won't end well.

[Oddball RS]

Sounds like it would have been a fantastic car, 2 or 3 years ago.....

[Happyjap]

Honda is an honourable company and has reputation for engineering integrity. I do not hate this car but having driven it I can say it is very loud car, making a bit of noise, but not in a nice way , not tunefu (if this makes sense?) l, not nice to listen to. you get the feeling that the car is not happy to be going the speed limit and has to be faster. Interesting to know that in Japan it failed nice tests and company fined to make it quite for roads! For me this is only okay!

[otolith]

Top Gear mag have had one, and figured it.

http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/new-honda-civic...

It's fapping quick;

TG said:

Since we had the Civic for a couple of days we took the opportunity to strap our timing gear on. Honda says 0-62mph takes 5.7 seconds. We did 0-60mph in 5.3 seconds and 100mph in 11.2 seconds. 167mph top whack? Yep, reckon it could do that.

But;

TG said:

However, if you were expecting Honda's engineering nous to have eradicated all lag, you're in for a disappointment. At low engine speeds there's quite a bit of it and it's not until past 3,000rpm that it really hits its stride. It's better at picking up quickly at high revs, and once away and blowing hard the Civic is massively fast. Massively.

The Civic Type R makes noise. Quite a bit of noise, and it goads you on, but it's not tuneful, not nice to listen to. Instead you get the feeling that the car's only intent is to get to the next gear as soon as possible, and that it views sounding good as superfluous small talk.

It's a shame, because you get a bit of exhaust woofle on start-up, and on light throttle openings around town the turbo wastegate chatters audibly.

Looks like they've chucked away everything characteristic of the brand but the gearbox, in an attempt to nail that Nurburgring time so important for marketing purposes.

[Happyjap]

Correct on the above but it still has positives and great to drive on open highway!

[hughcam]

My level of want is high on this one

[HeMightBeBanned]

Wanted: proof-reader for Pistonheads articles, so that the following mess can never happen again.

"Those vents behind the front wheels push out air used for coolingon was that elements like that dual rear wing (slightly reduced from the concept) are not there for show"

[otolith]

I bought my last Type-R for the engine and gearbox. This one has lost half of the attraction for me.

[Thunder18]

HeMightBeBanned said:

Wanted: proof-reader for Pistonheads articles, so that the following mess can never happen again.

"Those vents behind the front wheels push out air used for coolingon was that elements like that dual rear wing (slightly reduced from the concept) are not there for show"

Might be just my concentration level but I had to read that three times to make sure I wasn't misreading it, phew!!

[redroadster]

Does not sound like it is a great product ,pity as one of the best parts of the v tec was its screaming noise this has been lost in this new model which has come 3 years too late golf r and focus rs moving game on with 4 wheel drive for better traction for big tuning potential, hope they don,t screw up new nsx.

[Martin_M]

The finance deal I saw advertised for it a while ago required a bloody big deposit and still the payments were high. My interest in it subsequently dwindled. Love the look of it though.

[bigaoi]

Well ... Car, evo, Top Gear, autocar, autoexpress have first drive reviews up. They say slightly different things, for instance Car thinks the engine is rather good :

Car said:

That turbo 2.0-litre is quite something, as well. Fears that turbocharging it would kill the VTEC character are unfounded. Yes, there's some turbo whistle - and plenty of wastegate chatter as you back off - but the thing just wants to rev to the 7000rpm redline and beyond with an insatiable appetite for revs. From 3500rpm on, it charges to the redline and they've somehow kept a degree of switchover character, just like on Type Rs of old. It doesn't sound too industrial, either.

Which is almost the exact opposite of Top Gear.

[Nezquick]

Martin_M said:

The finance deal I saw advertised for it a while ago required a bloody big deposit and still the payments were high. My interest in it subsequently dwindled. Love the look of it though.

Hmm.....£10k down and £299 a month apparently.

You'd have to be bonkers.

[griff7]

Went to geneva with a friend and had a good look at the one there and were both in agreement that the front wing extensions were the worst we had ever seen from all angles.looked like a bolt on kit from Halfords

[Richair]

PH said:

The third-generation Honda Civic Type R

You should know better PH!!!

[mickytruelove]

Do people really look at the time around the nurburing (by a proffesional race driver) and think thats 0.1 second faster i will buy it.

[Crafty_]

I saw a boggo model on a 15 plate a week or two ago, it really is rather ugly - I'd say worse than the pictures. All the type-R tat doesn't improve it either..

[Evolved]

redroadster said:

Does not sound like it is a great product ,pity as one of the best parts of the v tec was its screaming noise this has been lost in this new model which has come 3 years too late golf r and focus rs moving game on with 4 wheel drive for better traction for big tuning potential, hope they don,t screw up new nsx.

I totally disagree; the VTEC scream to my ears sounded bloody awful and while it was clearly an engineering marvel, in all iterations of VTEC powered cars I've been in they all felt absolutely gutless. Lots of noise and not much go, least with the increased torks this might actually feel quick.

As I said in another thread though, it looks like a teenagers wet dream.

[Ali_T]

Nezquick said:

Hmm.....£10k down and £299 a month apparently.

You'd have to be bonkers.

Honda don't have German banks propping up they're overambitious final values.

[rich85uk]

Well that looks awful, and 310bhp through the front wheels?! seems like alot of effort has gone into making sure it can put the power down but i just don't see it coping that well on a slightly damp average British road. Competition is pretty stiff too with the amount of 4 pot turbo high powered hot hatches out there at the moment, good luck Honda

Its a shame BMW are the only ones willing to brake away from this trend with the 135i