Skoda handbrake woes
Discussion
Evening all, apologies for the lurking...
Got an interesting one here And I just wondered what others opinions were.
Before Christmas, a friend parked their car on their driveway, them and their family got out and proceeded into their house before the car rolled back into their garage door/bins- a good 60 to 120 seconds after switching the ignition off and them leaving the car.
The handbrake was on and the car was not in gear, the driveway is a slight slope but nothing major and this is how for 15 years they have left their cars on the driveway without any incident- always out of gear.
Car in question is a 65 plate skoda Octavia- manual box with a proper mechanical handbrake, which the owner always pulls right up.
After said incident, they did test whether, A the car would hold in place with no handbrake (it rolled straight away) or B it would hold with only a few clicks- again it rolled back straight away.
The long and short of this is that the car went to the dealership who investigated it but have ultimately said its the owners fault as the guide book states it should always be parked whilst in gear.
It's now moved onto getting quotes for repair- there's a sizeable dent in the bootlid, but we are perplexed as to the outcome- is this typically correct? The car remained still for a good minute or two before rolling back, with a family getting out of it rocking it about- if the handbrake was off, surely it would have begun to roll at this point?
And to counter the handbooks point, this does deviate from Highway Code which I believe states only to leave a car in gear on a steep hill- which their driveway certainly is not. Surely this should be read to customers before sale/on hand over?
Anyway, just wondered what thoughts and experiences were. Not my car like I say, I've just been following this from a friend and am confused by both the outcome and what could have caused it. A quick google suggests it's not an isolated incident however I couldn't find any resolved cases- it does seem to spread across all the VAG group vehicles
Cheers!
Got an interesting one here And I just wondered what others opinions were.
Before Christmas, a friend parked their car on their driveway, them and their family got out and proceeded into their house before the car rolled back into their garage door/bins- a good 60 to 120 seconds after switching the ignition off and them leaving the car.
The handbrake was on and the car was not in gear, the driveway is a slight slope but nothing major and this is how for 15 years they have left their cars on the driveway without any incident- always out of gear.
Car in question is a 65 plate skoda Octavia- manual box with a proper mechanical handbrake, which the owner always pulls right up.
After said incident, they did test whether, A the car would hold in place with no handbrake (it rolled straight away) or B it would hold with only a few clicks- again it rolled back straight away.
The long and short of this is that the car went to the dealership who investigated it but have ultimately said its the owners fault as the guide book states it should always be parked whilst in gear.
It's now moved onto getting quotes for repair- there's a sizeable dent in the bootlid, but we are perplexed as to the outcome- is this typically correct? The car remained still for a good minute or two before rolling back, with a family getting out of it rocking it about- if the handbrake was off, surely it would have begun to roll at this point?
And to counter the handbooks point, this does deviate from Highway Code which I believe states only to leave a car in gear on a steep hill- which their driveway certainly is not. Surely this should be read to customers before sale/on hand over?
Anyway, just wondered what thoughts and experiences were. Not my car like I say, I've just been following this from a friend and am confused by both the outcome and what could have caused it. A quick google suggests it's not an isolated incident however I couldn't find any resolved cases- it does seem to spread across all the VAG group vehicles
Cheers!
I would ha e thought you're only going to get best guesses unfortunately. I'd say that ratchet on the handbrake hadn't quite engaged correctly and popped open after a minute or two, letting the car go for a little adventure.
I have an inherent distrust of handbrakes thanks to working with tvr's for a few years, everything is left in gear!
I have an inherent distrust of handbrakes thanks to working with tvr's for a few years, everything is left in gear!
A Honda Civic rolled into my front wall on Bonfire night. As soon as it happened, I went to see the owner. Other side of the road, approx ten houses along.
His wife told me he had gone out 30 minutes ago! So the car had stayed still for half an hour before making its move. Handbrake was clearly on when I looked through the windows so I can only assume it was applied hot and the rear discs subsequently cooled. Combine that with a very very slight gradient and it was away..:
His wife told me he had gone out 30 minutes ago! So the car had stayed still for half an hour before making its move. Handbrake was clearly on when I looked through the windows so I can only assume it was applied hot and the rear discs subsequently cooled. Combine that with a very very slight gradient and it was away..:
kambites said:
Does it heave discs on the back? Most likely the brakes were hot when the car was parked; as the brakes cool the disc contracts and the brakes come off.
A well reported issue with a number of cars. Google 'handbrake failing as discs cool'.Personal experience with my wife's 307 not long after we bought it. Our drive slopes down to the road - not a steep angle - & the car rolled back onto the road, fortunately we're in a Close & no-one was affected. She'd parked it on the drive pointing towards the house with the handbrake on as she's always done with previous cars - none of which had handbrakes acting on discs. First I knew about it was when she asked why I'd moved her vehicle onto the road! Consequently it's now always parked in gear.
Handbrakes should always be fully applied, I note reference is made to 'a few clicks' in the OP's post which suggests it either wasn't fully applied or needs adjustment & neither is going to help.
FWIW I've always parked with handbrake on and in gear in a manual transmission vehicle & 'P' in an automatic
Edited by paintman on Monday 2nd January 20:28
Had this phenomena occur on Marlborough High St. Luckily I parked with the steering half turned. I was facing uphill at the higher north end of the street, it was a Sunday and unbeknown to me there was to be a Lord Mayors style procession an hour later. All dignitaries, Oompah band, Cadets, Scouts, fancy dress peeps and an enormous crowd to follow.
Cue hand brake cooling and the car drifts slowly from parking position right round to the centre of the road where the car settled. All the traffic just assumed some daft twit had created a car shaped chicane and got on with it. As did the Lord Mayors procession and is wasn't until I saw the last of the crowd 'reforming ranks ' after the familiar looking red sports car that I had that sinking feeling.
In good old fashioned stiff upper lip-ness people just carried on shopping and didn't notice my cherry red face as I slipped into the drivers seat...
Cue hand brake cooling and the car drifts slowly from parking position right round to the centre of the road where the car settled. All the traffic just assumed some daft twit had created a car shaped chicane and got on with it. As did the Lord Mayors procession and is wasn't until I saw the last of the crowd 'reforming ranks ' after the familiar looking red sports car that I had that sinking feeling.
In good old fashioned stiff upper lip-ness people just carried on shopping and didn't notice my cherry red face as I slipped into the drivers seat...
Happened to my 13 Fiesta ST. Parked it on the drive, all good, half an hour later, someone told me it had rolled into the road. Luckily, it never hit anything. First and last time it has done it.
I can only surmise:
1. I didn't apply the handbrake quite enough and gravity eventually took over - the car had rolled down the slope of my driveway, into the road, maybe ten feet.
2. The hillstart may have engaged as I edged it up the drive and maybe I thought I had fully applied the handbrake when the hillstart was doing the work - I have no idea how it works.
I always make sure the handbrake is fully applied now and the last service I had seems to have tightened the cable too.
I can only surmise:
1. I didn't apply the handbrake quite enough and gravity eventually took over - the car had rolled down the slope of my driveway, into the road, maybe ten feet.
2. The hillstart may have engaged as I edged it up the drive and maybe I thought I had fully applied the handbrake when the hillstart was doing the work - I have no idea how it works.
I always make sure the handbrake is fully applied now and the last service I had seems to have tightened the cable too.
Not unknown for cars with rear discs. I'm aware of it happening on Ford Sierras and Rover 800s years ago, generally put down to brakes contracting as they cool. It always sounds better than 'failed to apply properly' 
It is possible that a simple act such as slamming a door or bootlid might just be enough to start the initial movement on a car where the brake is only just holding.
If you take it to an MOT station and ask them if you can to put it on the rolling road brake tester, you will know whether it works properly or not, rather than guesswork or the dealer just saying put it in gear. The handbrake should meet minimum requirements, only a test can confirm whether it does.
Some cars require handbrake to be checked/adjusted at 1st service, no idea whether the Skoda is one of them.
It is possible that a simple act such as slamming a door or bootlid might just be enough to start the initial movement on a car where the brake is only just holding.
If you take it to an MOT station and ask them if you can to put it on the rolling road brake tester, you will know whether it works properly or not, rather than guesswork or the dealer just saying put it in gear. The handbrake should meet minimum requirements, only a test can confirm whether it does.
Some cars require handbrake to be checked/adjusted at 1st service, no idea whether the Skoda is one of them.
MJK 24 said:
A Honda Civic rolled into my front wall on Bonfire night. As soon as it happened, I went to see the owner. Other side of the road, approx ten houses along.
His wife told me he had gone out 30 minutes ago! So the car had stayed still for half an hour before making its move. Handbrake was clearly on when I looked through the windows so I can only assume it was applied hot and the rear discs subsequently cooled. Combine that with a very very slight gradient and it was away..:
A very similar incident happened to us a year ago. A black Focus rolled into our fence, and having a concrete foundation it had written off the car.His wife told me he had gone out 30 minutes ago! So the car had stayed still for half an hour before making its move. Handbrake was clearly on when I looked through the windows so I can only assume it was applied hot and the rear discs subsequently cooled. Combine that with a very very slight gradient and it was away..:
Poor guy had the handbrake up, and was parked on a slight gradient. Even payed to fix our fence.
Alucidnation said:
I would have thought that if the handbrake was applied fully and to the instructions, that disc cooling wouldn't be an issue, otherwise they would be many stories from all manufacturers.
I think there are stories from most manufacturers. "The instructions" in this case include leaving the car in gear. ETA: IIRC a few manufacturers get around the problem by integrating a small drum into the rear disc but obviously that adds cost and unsprung mass. A better solution is to integrate the hand-brake into the diff but again it's expensive and I'd imagine it's a maintenance headache if it goes wrong.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 3rd January 07:44
Oilchange said:
Had this phenomena occur on Marlborough High St. Luckily I parked with the steering half turned. I was facing uphill at the higher north end of the street, it was a Sunday and unbeknown to me there was to be a Lord Mayors style procession an hour later. All dignitaries, Oompah band, Cadets, Scouts, fancy dress peeps and an enormous crowd to follow.
Cue hand brake cooling and the car drifts slowly from parking position right round to the centre of the road where the car settled. All the traffic just assumed some daft twit had created a car shaped chicane and got on with it. As did the Lord Mayors procession and is wasn't until I saw the last of the crowd 'reforming ranks ' after the familiar looking red sports car that I had that sinking feeling.
In good old fashioned stiff upper lip-ness people just carried on shopping and didn't notice my cherry red face as I slipped into the drivers seat...
I work in Marl and this has been happening about once a week for the last 20 years!Cue hand brake cooling and the car drifts slowly from parking position right round to the centre of the road where the car settled. All the traffic just assumed some daft twit had created a car shaped chicane and got on with it. As did the Lord Mayors procession and is wasn't until I saw the last of the crowd 'reforming ranks ' after the familiar looking red sports car that I had that sinking feeling.
In good old fashioned stiff upper lip-ness people just carried on shopping and didn't notice my cherry red face as I slipped into the drivers seat...
Indeed common issues, discs constrict when they cool and handbrake slips off
I never trust handbrakes and always leave my car in gear , in fact on my slight slope of a drive I used to leave my HB off and just leave it in gear, but since ive seen kids playing next to it I out the handbrake on as well
Chalk it up to experience but never trust a handbrake, owning a MX5 taught me this (bloody rear calipers)!!!
Alucidnation said:
Do rear disc brakes do much in the course of normal driving to get that hot?
Don't forget rear brakes are generally smaller than fronts so it takes less energy to heat them up; they also typically get less air-flow - I'd imagine manufacturers size the brakes to keep front and rear disc temperatures as near the same as possible in order to maintain optimal brake balance.To add my tuppence worth make sure you have your foot on the foot brake when applying the handbrake too & you'll notice that the lever travels up further than it would otherwise. Which helps apply the brakes that little bit firmer to allow for cooling contraction. & not forgetting leaving it in gear & wheels towards the kerb if on an incline.
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