Thursday 6th April 2017

Toyota GT86: PH Videoblog

Why 200hp and not a lot of weight is still just fine for the new '86

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Even five years after its launch, few cars divide opinion like the Toyota GT86. To some it's terribly underpowered, rather overpriced and not much to look at. To others it's a return to a simpler time of performance cars, where you relied on revs and well timed gear changes for performance and the limits were lower.

Typically the PH editorial team falls on the latter side of the argument, because we're quite old-fashioned really. Sure, it has some flaws - which Dan will discuss in this video - but then no car is perfect...

You may have seen Dan's Blyton lap already; here he drives the car on the road and discusses the MY17 changes in more detail. Basically, if you thought it didn't look much different, there's much more to it than meets the eye!

Watch the video here.

[Baddie]

Do you like to drink smaller amounts of finer, more balanced wine, or larger quantities of plonk? More wine = more high followed by a bigger hangover.

Most modern cars are too fast to enjoy in modern road conditions, turbos, fat tyres and aids blunt the nuances of the experience so are not particularly fine to drive slowly either. I don't want a diesel automatic 3 series that gets to 60 in less than 5 seconds, I want the clotted cream howl of an e36 328i.

GT86 seems only a musical engine note away from perfection.

Of course, lots of very fine wine would be nice too...

[mikey P 500]

Good review, spent Monday driving my pre facelift gt86 round Bedford autodrome (a circuit with quite a bit of run off) and would totally agree with your opinions of it being fun, and providing options of how you drive it, neat lines or messing around both good fun on circuit.

[great_kahn]

Nobody is buying your car, so you change nothing and expect it to sell?

[WCZ]

drove one, felt slow on the road and very slow on track - out accelerated on straights by £2k clio 172's

[V8 TEJ]

No body buying them?

According to this there are over 5200 of them on the UK roads alone.

https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk/family/toyota_gt86

It also seems to be quite a capable car on track and not as slow people like to think. 131.3 on this list..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_tes...

[graham22]

As a previous Jap Coupe owner I like the idea of these but also having owned a couple of Imprezas feel with the joint venture with Subaru and using the flat 4 motor that surely they could have easily made a turbo version (even 4WD?).

Appreciate there's probably many reasons why this hasn't been done but I'm sure it would fit in the market better if it had a 280hp linear turbo power.

When I had my CRX & Celica 190, their power output was at the top of the hatchback levels, 280-300hp would do the same with the GT86/BRZ.

Like someone said above, it's all very well having a fun car but you get left trailing by hatchbacks and the MX5 does the same for considerably less.

[Mogul]

A good little review. I could see myself getting along just fine with one of these as I am sure that I would 'get it' - but is the rear seat accommodation (for kids up to early/mid teens) better or worse than in a 996/997?

[spikyone]

Good review, and sums up very well what the GT86 is all about. I may be a little biased though!

Even sitting watching the vid had me smiling about the driving experience. Some will always complain but I'd rather be enjoying my car than pointing out the flaws in other people's criticisms. I had to laugh at the comments about keyboard warriors complaining that the GT86 needs a turbo, whilst being the same ones who say turbocharging has ruined the Boxster and Cayman - you weren't the only one to notice that...

Frankly, the price seems like a bargain when comparing to a FWD TT that's based on the ubiquitous MQB and looks the same as every other Audi. You'd need to have a pretty serious fetish for soft-touch plastics to buy one of those, IMO.

[Trophy-GTA]

Bravo Toyota!

What a great car! One of the very few new cars that appeals to me.

[re33]

I think the power is fine, it is the lack of RPM and terrible noise that let the GT86 down. I know emissions regulations have a big part to play but this engine is much worse than Honda's F20 released in 1999 and I would argue not even as good as the original AE86 twincam engine which had a lot less weight to pull around.

S2000 (1999) F20 2L Power 237BHP, MAX RPM 8800/9000 (soft and hard cut)
AE86 (1983) 4AGE 1.6L Power 128BHP, MAX RPM 7500
GT86 Power 197BHP, MAX RPM 7400

I still like the car though I just feel like it could have been really good and engine lets it down. Think I'll just have to buy a hardtop for S2000...

Edited by re33 on Thursday 6th April 12:50

[gashead1105]

Bloody hell Dan, could you talk any more quickly at the start?! As with any other public speaking if you speak at a pace which you feel at the time is too slow, you will probably find it turns out on camera just fine (eg around 2 mins 40 you definitely slow down ...)

I do like the GT86, enough to have made an offer for the demonstrator that my local dealer has at Christmas time. 2k less than they wanted though and they still have it up for sale now!

[Dan Trent]

gashead1105 said:

Bloody hell Dan, could you talk any more quickly at the start?! As with any other public speaking if you speak at a pace which you feel at the time is too slow, you will probably find it turns out on camera just fine (eg around 2 mins 40 you definitely slow down ...)

Haha, fair one. Was probably just keen to crack on and get on with driving it!

Dan

[gashead1105]

Dan Trent said:

Haha, fair one. Was probably just keen to crack on and get on with driving it!

Dan

I get that! It's a good review otherwise and I for one would like to own one. Think it would be a great daily to complement my Exige.

[RBH58]

It's very good car but it would be a great car with a sweeter powerplant. Sure, a few extra HP wouldn't go astray but only a few. It's not massively underpowered. If the engine had an ND MX5's linearity (no torque dips) and sweetness when revved, even if it only produced the same 205hp as now, the car would be elevated to 5* status. Unfortunately the FA20's respectable output comes with a big hole in the mid-range, it sounds like a bucket of bolts, and whilst you can drive it all day between 5000 and 7400 you'd only do it to make rapid progress...certainly not so you could revel in the intoxicating engine noises. The FA20 is a bit of a lump and it stops the car from being a "great" car

[Trophy-GTA]

The reason they went with the boxer is for its lower centre of gravity. This car is all about handling finess.

[Stig]

RBH58 said:

It's very good car but it would be a great car with a sweeter powerplant. Sure, a few extra HP wouldn't go astray but only a few. It's not massively underpowered. If the engine had an ND MX5's linearity (no torque dips) and sweetness when revved, even if it only produced the same 205hp as now, the car would be elevated to 5* status. Unfortunately the FA20's respectable output comes with a big hole in the mid-range, it sounds like a bucket of bolts, and whilst you can drive it all day between 5000 and 7400 you'd only do it to make rapid progress...certainly not so you could revel in the intoxicating engine noises. The FA20 is a bit of a lump and it stops the car from being a "great" car

But by the same token, the engine is what helps it handle so well. The boxer results in a much lower C of G than you'd get with teh MX5 lump, so you trade 'performance' with handling.

I'm with Dan on this one. Those who criticise the engine output are really missing the point and, contentiously, perhaps using it as a 'torque fill' for their own lack of talent

[V8 TEJ]

Indeed, the cornering grip is sublime

[Fire99]

I can see why some people like the car.. However, for as long as this car has been around, nearly every article I've read has been attempting to explain why the car doesn't have very much power. This one even mentions it in the title.
It may deliver the designers brief but it's a car that is almost dictating to the market what they want and what they should have. It's a tricky avenue to go down and the seeming stubbornness by the manufacturer not to deliver a 'halo' model with what a lot of people are crying out for, isn't where I'd go with it.

How many cars are there which have a high powered top end model but a significant number of folk think the lesser powered model is the sweeter driver etc? Jaguar F-Type etc. Even going way back with the old E39 BMW there were folk that thought the V8's were OTT with less direct steering and the IL6 was the sweeter driver.. Didn't stop the 540i and dare I say M5 being in the range.

This will rattle around until the car stops rolling off the production line but I see no benefit in rejecting a F.I. 280(ish) bhp model... (Without having to go to an aftermarket tuner)

Edited by Fire99 on Thursday 6th April 14:21

[MustardCutter]

The GT86 not having a turbo and the cayman/boxter getting turbo charged argument/comparison doesn't fully hold together for me; the porsches have lost a charismatic sounding 6 cylinder na engine and "gained" two less cylinders (donwsizing in the process) and a turbo. The Gt86 isn't going to lose 2 cylinders by turbocharging it and isn't really held in the same regard as a na porsche 6 cylinder performance or sound quality wise; i.e. it has less to lose by going turbo'd. Personally I prefer NA engines so I think the real solution is to put an na 6 cylinder boxer in the 86!

[Fire99]

MustardCutter said:

The GT86 not having a turbo and the cayman/boxter getting turbo charged argument/comparison doesn't fully hold together for me; the porsches have lost a charismatic sounding 6 cylinder na engine and "gained" two less cylinders (donwsizing in the process) and a turbo. The Gt86 isn't going to lose 2 cylinders by turbocharging it and isn't really held in the same regard as a na porsche 6 cylinder performance or sound quality wise; i.e. it has less to lose by going turbo'd. Personally I prefer NA engines so I think the real solution is to put an na 6 cylinder boxer in the 86!

For me it's not a F.I vs N/A issue.. The Cayman / Boxter was already a quick car and the 'S' very quick. It went F.I for different reasons (whilst keeping power output up)

The GT86 has started with a small 2 litre boxer and the only practical method without extensive and costly re-engineering, to offer this engine a decent output is to F.I it.

They're coming from different angles.