Star Wars: The Last Jedi (CONTAINS SPOILERS)

[Daniel1]

I forgot about the milking scene

[glazbagun]

Chemical Ali said:

Cant blame Rian. The execs would have known he's just an arrogant tt who couldn't care for the subject matter. Bays the same for transformers.

This was coming the moment George Lucas sold up.

I also kind of blame JJ a bit for it. While he made a good fist of TFA, it was also a pretty generic rip off of ANH and he obviously made and then left the Snoke, Luke and Rei's parents mysteries with no clue or idea as to how they'd be resolved. Maybe I'm still just pissed off about Lost.

I still think Rian should have done a lot better but I don't think it's all down to him. I also suspect lots of interfering from above, especially in Finn's role given how plain strange it was.

[Chemical Ali]

The longer this film is out the more I get the feeling we are watching an emperors new clothes moment. Little people like me call it for what it is - average film that urinates on Star Wars. the critics and writers, even though they see it, can't believe it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-42424...

One excerpt reads: Rian Johnson has "mounted a bonafide insurrection against an industry that's fuelled by nostalgia", wrote Ehrlich, adding: "If you really love something, you have to let it go."

Why? I love walking my kids to school, having a coffee in the morning, watching a Star Wars film with the family at Christmas. Why do I have to let these things go? Especially if its just 2 hours of escapism.

Its as if some humourless beige politically correct morally superior council worker is ending my fun because "Star Wars isn't real so you need to stop this nonsense, grow up and accept you average job and pay your taxes".

[glazbagun]

Chemical Ali said:

The longer this film is out the more I get the feeling we are watching an emperors new clothes moment. Little people like me call it for what it is - average film that urinates on Star Wars. the critics and writers, even though they see it, can't believe it.

Some of the articles on the backlash are even worse than the ridiculous praise the film initially received from critics. According to what I've read, all those poor scores on Rotten Tomatoes from viewers are because SW people don't like equality or had their own fan theories ruined.


I don't think I've seen one retrospective piece from a big media outlet mention that it has the most boring and nonsensical central plot of any film ever, with the most recent characters destroyed, the only new character given any development killed off half an hour after she appears, the whole Finn plot being pointless and boring, Finn nearly dying meaningfully but then being saved from certain death only to face certain death (and now the certain death of his friends, thanks Rose!) on the battlefield. I mean really- what did Rose think would happen next?

The way that Luke , like everyone else, had their previous character and motivation binned and spent 40 years sulking on an island because he couldn't see the good in his own, obviously conflicted, nephew (but could see good in the genocidal monster who'd killed an entire planet, murdered children with his own light sabre and just murdered his lifelong friend Obi Wan).

I mean there's pages, volumes, of what's nonsensical about this movie, but all that the press can pick up on is that some people think there's too many women and that Sci Fi fans are upset that it had some plot twists? This must be how conservatives feel when they read in the papers about what nasty stupid racists they all are for believing in reduce borrowing.

Like someone above said, parts of it seemed like they were from Spaceballs!

I really don't think I'll be seeing the next movie in the cinema. Being lied to is bad enough, but being lied about is even worse.

[Halb]

I guess only the numbers tell the truth, too early to see if the downward spiral is unusual or a trend.

Jedi daily takings in the biggest opening weekend of recent years, TFA
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view...


Jedi daily takings against TFA and R1
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view...

Edited by Halb on Thursday 21st December 10:02

[Pebbles167]

That BBC article sucks. I feel it's suggesting people don't like the film because it took a different direction. When in truth it's because the film had lazy scriptwriting and trashed characters.

Fans will watch any plotline, and whilst they might not love the story, they'll not bh too much if it's feasible within the universe and not a total cop out.

[57 Chevy]

Pebbles167 said:

That BBC article sucks. I feel it's suggesting people don't like the film because it took a different direction. When in truth it's because the film had lazy scriptwriting and trashed characters.

Fans will watch any plotline, and whilst they might not love the story, they'll not bh too much if it's feasible within the universe and not a total cop out.

Amazing. Every word of what you just said was wrong.

[chris watton]

57 Chevy said:

Amazing. Every word of what you just said was wrong.

In what way?

[57 Chevy]

chris watton said:

In what way?

I'm just quoting Luke

This thread has just become an echo chamber of people justifying why they don't like the film. There's far more going on in it than is being discussed. Most people have turned to the dark side, focusing on the negative and not on the good parts of the film.

I like the fact that it's disruptive to the canon, my biggest criticism of TFA was it was a copy of ANH. The minute Snoke buys the farm all bets are off, the story can go where it wants.

Anyone want to question Adam Savage's Star Wars fan credentials?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNdk7JJY6mg&t=...

[bitchstewie]

57 Chevy said:

This thread has just become an echo chamber of people justifying why they don't like the film. There's far more going on in it than is being discussed.

Quite.

For every video/link that "proves" they've stolen someone's childhood there are plenty of other articles that support what they're doing and the reasons they should, and almost have to do it i.e. http://www.indiewire.com/2017/12/star-wars-the-las...

I liked it and the stuff in that link makes sense to me, and I'm old enough to have grown up with the original trilogy.

You can't keep everyone happy but some of the stuff on this thread about "PC gone mad" and "inclusive" and what does come across as a bit of a chip on the shoulder about the role women play is... strange

[anonymous-user]

Everyone has their own views. If outside websites or the bbc or whoever agree or disagree with me or you it makes no difference to the validity of our opinions.

If someone posts it was great and someone else says it was PC gone mad or whatever they’re both right as they’re just stating how they see it.

What’s certain is that if someone doesn’t like it, someone else who did, isn’t going to change their opinions.

[ben5575]

Pebbles167 said:

That BBC article sucks. I feel it's suggesting people don't like the film because it took a different direction. When in truth it's because the film had lazy scriptwriting and trashed characters.

Fans will watch any plotline, and whilst they might not love the story, they'll not bh too much if it's feasible within the universe and not a total cop out.

Agree entirely, as evidenced by TfA and R1. Both with strong female leads and a multi racial cast, all set within the SW universe. I really enjoyed both, others not so much, either way it didn't spark the backlash that TLJ has done.

It's easy for hack journalists to adopt the Disney fed narrative that it's all geeks and misogynistic racist white men that hate on the film. Attack the critics, not the points they make.

Somebody previously posted a link to the (excellent) Half Bag review earlier (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9hwGZFPSmw) and to bdize one of their comments, it's a bit like making a new Back to the Future where there isn't any time travel because it was all a dream.

Or as somebody else on here said (I annoyingly can't find the comment to give it the credit it's due) it's like spending 2 hours watching Murder on the Orient Express for Poirot to turn round and say the victim died of natural causes.

No character achieved anything in the movie. Who are the rebels now rebelling against? The daft lad on the space ship who's put on hold? The teenager with anger issues? Was there any set up or structure that makes anyone care about the next film? It's like watching the current series of The Walking Dead.

'Skipping stones' my arse

[Halb]

THe RLM take is really very good. THe skinny one says, at one time Star Wars was a great trio of films, people loved. Now, people like the brand, and get defensive over it.

article with Rian defending his choice on Snoke
http://epicstream.com/news/Rian-Johnson-Explains-W...

[Pebbles167]

57 Chevy said:

Pebbles167 said:

That BBC article sucks. I feel it's suggesting people don't like the film because it took a different direction. When in truth it's because the film had lazy scriptwriting and trashed characters.

Fans will watch any plotline, and whilst they might not love the story, they'll not bh too much if it's feasible within the universe and not a total cop out.

Amazing. Every word of what you just said was wrong.

I see what you did there

As I've said before, I didn't hate the film, it was just needlessly disappointing.

[Guvernator]

It's DIsney's modus operandi, if fans don't like a film, they get their media shills to start attacking the fan-base saying they are racist,sexist or just geeks with a grudge. The exact same thing happened with the new Ghostbusters, those who didn't like it were immediately accused of being sexist and threatened by "girl power" to try to take focus away from the fact that the film was rubbish. What an absolute crock of bullcrap.

I may get annoyed if a film tries to preach to me, especially if it's out of context or too blatant as I go to a cinema to be entertained, not lectured at BUT more important to me is that it tells a coherent, interesting and entertaining story. Sure there were definitely 2 or 3 stand out scenes in TLJ but overall it was a mess and because I think that, I'm being labelled as a middle aged, racist white geek with a grudge against women. There is only one party here that has a political agenda about this movie Disney and it isn't me. What's worse is they aren't being PC because of trying to uphold some shining principle, they do it because a focus group has told them it will make more money.

[p1doc]

I saw it on sunday with family-felt it really dragged in places like casino scene and how did rebel fleet suddenly become so small and force powered space floating characters but had good points but weakest film since phantom menace

[dino_jr]

P-Jay said:

Oh and I cannot forgive "Laser Sword", it's a Light Sabre FFS - why try so hard to ruin the whole "A long time ago In a Galaxy Far, Far Away" part of it by making it so Earth Centric, I'm sure one of them said "God Willing" too - God Willing? GOD WILLING? Hang on a minute, after 40 years of Jedi and Sith being the only mentioned, and little know religion in the Star Wars Galaxy, we're suddenly introducing Middle Eastern Religions eh?

This isn't quite true. Han Solo said " I'll see you in Hell!" in ESB.

[GravelBen]

Pebbles167 said:

I didn't hate the film, it was just needlessly disappointing.

I enjoyed it, it was fun, but it was lacking something that a Star Wars movie should have... a story maybe?

I came away with the impression that they started with a list of scenes they wanted to include and then mashed up a plot to squeeze in as many of them as possible, instead of starting with a story and filling in the scene details from there. There was no flow, no depth or discovery, no real tension, just... hollywood. It looked like Star Wars and sounded like Star Wars but to me it didn't feel like Star Wars.

[Rumblestripe]

My but there's some nonsense on this thread.

Film was fine, I enjoyed it (yeah the Leia in space thing was ridiculous and the casino bit went on too long). More humour in it than previously I suppose but that I guess is simply a different director.

As someone above said people bhed that TFA was a retread of ANH (not without justification) but once Snoke was killed the story is no longer replaying the first trilogy and we no longer know where we are going. The characters all made logical choices driven by their own rationale and character.

Yeah, it'll do.

[p1doc]

Rumblestripe said:

My but there's some nonsense on this thread.

Film was fine, I enjoyed it (yeah the Leia in space thing was ridiculous and the casino bit went on too long). More humour in it than previously I suppose but that I guess is simply a different director.

As someone above said people bhed that TFA was a retread of ANH (not without justification) but once Snoke was killed the story is no longer replaying the first trilogy and we no longer know where we are going. The characters all made logical choices driven by their own rationale and character.

Yeah, it'll do.

I have to say I enjoyed the hux on hold scene with Adrian Edmondson smirking in background