RE: PH Footnote: Aussie car industry demise
Tuesday 17th October 2017
For at least five years, it's been as plain as that gargantuan grille on the latest Roller that the Australian motor manufacturing industry - which officially dies this month in favour of a string of importerships - was a goner.
Besides, Aussie buyers themselves have shown they want the variety and modernity the rest of the world is routinely offered, and manufacturers' only way of meeting that is to send bulk sea carrier-loads of new models Down Under.
There was a glorious moment, just as I was leaving Oz to seek my fortune in Europe, when Opel Commodores under test to become Holdens suffered cataclysmic structural failures barely halfway through a traditional 10,000 mile torture-test on Holden's legendary "rough track", which all new Holdens were effortlessly supposed to survive. It was life-affirming.
PH Footnote: Aussie car industry demise
The business of building models for the Australian markets has finally been wound up. It was a long time coming...
The combination of globalisation, fragmentation of models, the improving durability of cars and a smallish market by world standards means the idea of separate Aussie factories making models specially adapted "for Australian conditions" is no longer sustainable. Chuck in the coming electrification era and you have an even greater reason for globalisation.
The death is still a shock, though. I was born around the time Australia's mass production industry officially began with "Australia's Own" Holden in 1948. The fact that this was a GM product with strong links to America wasn't perceived. What my Dad knew was that the car was made in Australia and every serviceman (rarely woman) recently returned from the war wanted - even deserved - to have one on the drive
For 30 years, Holden reigned, joined in 1960 by the Ford Falcon, a more blatantly American car yet also regarded as Australian because its US equivalent wasn't familiar: we didn't travel much in those days. All we knew was that the (rare) European cars we saw, and especially those Pommy Austins, Morrises, Rovers, Hillmans and Humbers "fell to bits" on tough Aussie roads, which featured hundreds of miles of washboard surfaces the foreigners were never engineered to tackle. We loved that - foreign cars falling to bits while the rest of us just drove on.
But we should have known: this, as far back as 1980, was the beginning of the end. The Holden Commodore (though we couldn't admit it) was a strengthened European - and a better car for its roots.
When the European taste for such big cars finally died, the Aussie versions - even the specialist high performance V8 still spoken of in hushed tones - had to go. Like all Australian cars they lived a good long life, though, and will be fondly remembered.
Steve Cropley
[Commodore photo: LAT photo]
Discussion
Aussies do love their own mythology about how they're the toughest people in the world and how their cars are built to suit. Of course the reality these days is that most Australians live in the suburbs, rarely have to drive on poorly surfaced roads and would never contemplate driving anywhere truly remote.
That said, Australian Holdens and Fords of the muscle car era were glorious iconic cars. My father in law has photos of some the company cars he had when he worked for Holden in 70s, really really cool looking cars.
That said, Australian Holdens and Fords of the muscle car era were glorious iconic cars. My father in law has photos of some the company cars he had when he worked for Holden in 70s, really really cool looking cars.
Steve, that first Commodore was a thinly reworked Opel Rekord. Check out the google pics.
I hate to say it, but for me, the old Ford versus Holden thing was a stupid tribal thing the manufacturers used to try and drum up sales of a s
tty product. Mores the pity that a bunch of knuckle dragging idiots actually fell for it. And I include myself amongst that number as, when I was younger, I fell for the so-called charms of v8 goodness. A shame it was surrounded by a car that literally shook itself to death. My VK SS commodore broke almost every second time I took it out, and my local mechanic literally cried when I sold it to someone from out of town.
If the cars were any good, they'd be selling in sufficient numbers to warrant their continued existence.
They aren't. So they don't. Good riddance to these buckets of crap.
And another thing not mentioned in the article. ADR's... What a load of st these are. (Australian Design Rules). Where do the muppets in government get the big idea that, a car which is designed for safe use in, say, Japan, needs a different set of rules for them to be okay for use in Australia???
This is just another way for manufacturers to block parallel imports, and protect their margins, while jacking up the price of cars. Because...Australian model...
Seriously, we call it the Australia Tax for a reason, essentially being rip-off prices. I hope now that all manufacturing is gone, the pricing structure and controls around the cars (now, ALL imported), will reflect overseas pricing and availability.
Not to mention, the rules were such that it precluded manufacturers from bringing in niche versions of a car; too expensive to get past the gate-keepers of public safety (notwithstanding these cars were judged as safe as their siblings in their domestic market...).
Hopefully now we will get the full complement of cars without the jobsworth attitudes of the gatekeepers.
I hate to say it, but for me, the old Ford versus Holden thing was a stupid tribal thing the manufacturers used to try and drum up sales of a s
tty product. Mores the pity that a bunch of knuckle dragging idiots actually fell for it. And I include myself amongst that number as, when I was younger, I fell for the so-called charms of v8 goodness. A shame it was surrounded by a car that literally shook itself to death. My VK SS commodore broke almost every second time I took it out, and my local mechanic literally cried when I sold it to someone from out of town.If the cars were any good, they'd be selling in sufficient numbers to warrant their continued existence.
They aren't. So they don't. Good riddance to these buckets of crap.
And another thing not mentioned in the article. ADR's... What a load of s
t these are. (Australian Design Rules). Where do the muppets in government get the big idea that, a car which is designed for safe use in, say, Japan, needs a different set of rules for them to be okay for use in Australia???This is just another way for manufacturers to block parallel imports, and protect their margins, while jacking up the price of cars. Because...Australian model...
Seriously, we call it the Australia Tax for a reason, essentially being rip-off prices. I hope now that all manufacturing is gone, the pricing structure and controls around the cars (now, ALL imported), will reflect overseas pricing and availability.
Not to mention, the rules were such that it precluded manufacturers from bringing in niche versions of a car; too expensive to get past the gate-keepers of public safety (notwithstanding these cars were judged as safe as their siblings in their domestic market...).
Hopefully now we will get the full complement of cars without the jobsworth attitudes of the gatekeepers.
The XR6 Turbo is on my list of cars to own, it's a shame but as models are now global having a niche model for one country was never going to last also the demise of the saloon in the USA which in turn lead to slow sales of the Chevrolet SS meant the demise of the Commodore was always going to happen.
ZX10R NIN said:
The XR6 Turbo is on my list of cars to own, it's a shame but as models are now global having a niche model for one country was never going to last also the demise of the saloon in the USA which in turn lead to slow sales of the Chevrolet SS meant the demise of the Commodore was always going to happen.
Yes indeed!My step son owns one, “FG” series XR6 Turbo,they are “ballistic”. to drive.They “run rings” around any Commodore V8.Better still the “F6 310” is one hell of an animal.Commodore SS is not even in the running against one of these!Cheers
I think to refer to the Holdens and HSVs as "Good riddance to these buckets of crap." is a little strong and unnecessary.
I currently own a Monaro VXR and frankly love it. Is it as polished and developed a car as previous ones I've owned from the likes of BMW and Porsche? No. What it has in spades that those previous cars lacked though is character. To some this elusive "Character" is quite possibly a sure fire sign of the cars being "Buckets of crap" and if so I strongly suggest you stick to the mainstream and lease a new inoffensive and impressively built new car every three years but for some of us that's just a bit... well... dull.
I think perhaps I'm not alone in this (Albeit minority) opinion. The Monaro was built and sold in Australia but also sold into the UK and the US (As the Pontiac GTO). Likewise the R8 that came afterwards was also sold into the UK and US and while not selling in huge numbers both models have a loyal fan base.
It's also my belief (And I'm happy to be told I'm wrong here) that the R8 chassis that was developed solely by Holden forms the basis of the current Chevrolet Camaro range.
So to be clear I'm with Steve. I think it's a shame to loose such characterful models and such a unique outlook on what a car might be.
I currently own a Monaro VXR and frankly love it. Is it as polished and developed a car as previous ones I've owned from the likes of BMW and Porsche? No. What it has in spades that those previous cars lacked though is character. To some this elusive "Character" is quite possibly a sure fire sign of the cars being "Buckets of crap" and if so I strongly suggest you stick to the mainstream and lease a new inoffensive and impressively built new car every three years but for some of us that's just a bit... well... dull.
I think perhaps I'm not alone in this (Albeit minority) opinion. The Monaro was built and sold in Australia but also sold into the UK and the US (As the Pontiac GTO). Likewise the R8 that came afterwards was also sold into the UK and US and while not selling in huge numbers both models have a loyal fan base.
It's also my belief (And I'm happy to be told I'm wrong here) that the R8 chassis that was developed solely by Holden forms the basis of the current Chevrolet Camaro range.
So to be clear I'm with Steve. I think it's a shame to loose such characterful models and such a unique outlook on what a car might be.
I think I read somewhere in a similar article that production line workers in the Australian car factories get paid £42,000. If that's right, then that might also have something to do with it. I wonder if trade union agreements etc led to that. In any event, that type of expenditure on basic staff wages is just not sustainable unless you're very, very efficient indeed, and are producing models that other countries buy in huge numbers. I think the Toyota Corolla/Auris is, and has been for a very long time, the best selling car in the world, and the Japanese have very high wages. But .... with the Japanese being a very honourable people, both factory workers and managers have a work ethic and loyalty to the company most other countries can only dream of. Continual improvement is the attitude they all live by and strive for. This, and massive export business, is how they've made it work despite their high wages.
But the rot started decades ago, instead of meeting the challenges of other cars in the market by expanding into the American market. They chose to fight this by issolating themselves. The early mod 80s early 90s Group A races were a good example of this, they did well in some race circuits and other car makes did better in others. They didnt win at Bathurst so they changed the rules so it was just a Ford/Holden reach around.
They then did what most car makers do is have the big kahuna double cheese version become everything and when you walk into a car dealership there is a sea of bland cars.
This niche version becomes more extravigant and the sales of volume cars declines because they only appeal to one demographic of the driving popualtion.
The Ute version breathed some life into Holden, but they over cooked that and so it became the work truck that is basically a 2 seater sports car.
Like a bogun version of Brexit
They then did what most car makers do is have the big kahuna double cheese version become everything and when you walk into a car dealership there is a sea of bland cars.
This niche version becomes more extravigant and the sales of volume cars declines because they only appeal to one demographic of the driving popualtion.
The Ute version breathed some life into Holden, but they over cooked that and so it became the work truck that is basically a 2 seater sports car.
Like a bogun version of Brexit
Dagerous said:
It's also my belief (And I'm happy to be told I'm wrong here) that the R8 chassis that was developed solely by Holden forms the basis of the current Chevrolet Camaro range.
Hi there. I believe that you're referring to the Zeta platform.From 2010 through 2015 the Camaro used a chassis that was initially developed by Holden in Australia. From 2016 onward, the Camaro has used a smaller and more sophisticated chassis that was developed by Cadillac.
sisu said:
But the rot started decades ago, instead of meeting the challenges of other cars in the market by expanding into the American market. They chose to fight this by issolating themselves. The early mod 80s early 90s Group A races were a good example of this, they did well in some race circuits and other car makes did better in others. They didnt win at Bathurst so they changed the rules so it was just a Ford/Holden reach around.
They then did what most car makers do is have the big kahuna double cheese version become everything and when you walk into a car dealership there is a sea of bland cars.
This niche version becomes more extravigant and the sales of volume cars declines because they only appeal to one demographic of the driving popualtion.
The Ute version breathed some life into Holden, but they over cooked that and so it became the work truck that is basically a 2 seater sports car.
Yes.They then did what most car makers do is have the big kahuna double cheese version become everything and when you walk into a car dealership there is a sea of bland cars.
This niche version becomes more extravigant and the sales of volume cars declines because they only appeal to one demographic of the driving popualtion.
The Ute version breathed some life into Holden, but they over cooked that and so it became the work truck that is basically a 2 seater sports car.
sisu said:
Like a bogun version of Brexit
Er... No. James Dyson, world-class innovator and global trader is hardly a bogan. And his argument for Brexit is erudite, classical liberalism writ large.
It was a non-starter to ask the people who created parliamentary democracy to now abandon this in favour of a vast federal superstructure -- one based elsewhere and with notably less democracy.
sisu said:
But the rot started decades ago, instead of meeting the challenges of other cars in the market by expanding into the American market. They chose to fight this by issolating themselves.
What an utterly stupid statement. Ford and Holden were actively BLOCKED for decades from entering the American market to protect American jobs. AU Falcon was meant to be a global platform, to the extent it converged closely with Mustang (You can swap the rear subframe and suspension) but it was prevented from being released in LHD to protect the Crown Victoria.Again Aussie exports were blocked by the Thai government even when the so called "free trade agreement" was in place, Aussie cars were still taxed at 50%. Time and again the Australian government failed to support the automotive industry and now its gone never to return.
Did you know that in 2013 Germany subsidised its car industry at a rate five times (per capita!) than that of Australia and the USA at over twenty times. Witness the amount of export money it earns them and the amount of jobs it supports and realise that in heavy manufacturing these days if you want to play you have to pay. Countries that do get the jobs and the investment, those that don't get left behind.
The Aussie car industry was world class until politics both petty and calculated ran it into the ground.
Just dig more holes in the ground Aus.
Wayoftheflower said:
sisu said:
But the rot started decades ago, instead of meeting the challenges of other cars in the market by expanding into the American market. They chose to fight this by issolating themselves.
What an utterly stupid statement. Ford and Holden were actively BLOCKED for decades from entering the American market to protect American jobs. AU Falcon was meant to be a global platform, to the extent it converged closely with Mustang (You can swap the rear subframe and suspension) but it was prevented from being released in LHD to protect the Crown Victoria.Again Aussie exports were blocked by the Thai government even when the so called "free trade agreement" was in place, Aussie cars were still taxed at 50%. Time and again the Australian government failed to support the automotive industry and now its gone never to return.
Did you know that in 2013 Germany subsidised its car industry at a rate five times (per capita!) than that of Australia and the USA at over twenty times. Witness the amount of export money it earns them and the amount of jobs it supports and realise that in heavy manufacturing these days if you want to play you have to pay. Countries that do get the jobs and the investment, those that don't get left behind.
The Aussie car industry was world class until politics both petty and calculated ran it into the ground.
Just dig more holes in the ground Aus.
For example, to help me (if nobody else here), I was wondering about the following. Apologies in advance if the answers are obvious.
- Are you saying that the Ford Falcon was created and engineered in Australia -- and that this Australian car was then rejected in some way by Ford US?
- What exactly is a subsidy to the car industry? Are we talking about a government sending taxpayer monies directly to manufacturers?
unsprung said:
I've been waiting for this, partly because nothing to do with mass employment is easy to make sense of, and partly because you or others have levied similar complaints (vis a vis manufacturing in Oz) in the past. I do believe it's worth going into a bit further, here.
For example, to help me (if nobody else here), I was wondering about the following. Apologies in advance if the answers are obvious.
Bit of a brief history on some of Ford Australia's attempts to get approval from Detroit to export into America Article For example, to help me (if nobody else here), I was wondering about the following. Apologies in advance if the answers are obvious.
- Are you saying that the Ford Falcon was created and engineered in Australia -- and that this Australian car was then rejected in some way by Ford US?
- What exactly is a subsidy to the car industry? Are we talking about a government sending taxpayer monies directly to manufacturers?
Subsidies can be a range of measures often subtly done so as not to violate free trade agreements. It would almost never be as explicit as "have some cash", research grants, tax rebates, low interest loans, infrastructure investment etc.
Johnny5hoods said:
I think I read somewhere in a similar article that production line workers in the Australian car factories get paid £42,000. If that's right, then that might also have something to do with it. I wonder if trade union agreements etc led to that. In any event, that type of expenditure on basic staff wages is just not sustainable unless you're very, very efficient indeed, and are producing models that other countries buy in huge numbers. I think the Toyota Corolla/Auris is, and has been for a very long time, the best selling car in the world, and the Japanese have very high wages. But .... with the Japanese being a very honourable people, both factory workers and managers have a work ethic and loyalty to the company most other countries can only dream of. Continual improvement is the attitude they all live by and strive for. This, and massive export business, is how they've made it work despite their high wages.
Australia is a much richer country than the UK, so those £42k wages are not as high as they seem at first glance. A German worker gets paid even more and their car industry is in fairly good shape.Australia's car industry went bellyup mostly because they designed too many niche models with little global scale. There's not much demand for utes with cargo trays.
Wayoftheflower said:
What an utterly stupid statement. Ford and Holden were actively BLOCKED for decades from entering the American market to protect American jobs. AU Falcon was meant to be a global platform, to the extent it converged closely with Mustang (You can swap the rear subframe and suspension) but it was prevented from being released in LHD to protect the Crown Victoria.
Again Aussie exports were blocked by the Thai government even when the so called "free trade agreement" was in place, Aussie cars were still taxed at 50%. Time and again the Australian government failed to support the automotive industry and now its gone never to return.
Did you know that in 2013 Germany subsidised its car industry at a rate five times (per capita!) than that of Australia and the USA at over twenty times. Witness the amount of export money it earns them and the amount of jobs it supports and realise that in heavy manufacturing these days if you want to play you have to pay. Countries that do get the jobs and the investment, those that don't get left behind.
The Aussie car industry was world class until politics both petty and calculated ran it into the ground.
Just dig more holes in the ground Aus.
This. The global playing field is far from level. US states actively bidding for car plants is an example.Again Aussie exports were blocked by the Thai government even when the so called "free trade agreement" was in place, Aussie cars were still taxed at 50%. Time and again the Australian government failed to support the automotive industry and now its gone never to return.
Did you know that in 2013 Germany subsidised its car industry at a rate five times (per capita!) than that of Australia and the USA at over twenty times. Witness the amount of export money it earns them and the amount of jobs it supports and realise that in heavy manufacturing these days if you want to play you have to pay. Countries that do get the jobs and the investment, those that don't get left behind.
The Aussie car industry was world class until politics both petty and calculated ran it into the ground.
Just dig more holes in the ground Aus.
And to add to that.
Ford Territory exported to Thailand but slapped with a huge % import duty despite a supposed free trade agreement.
The fact that, yes a Commodore Ute could have been the new Chevy El Camino but the US have a 25% duty on imported light trucks to protect their local production.
The Chev SS was volume limited because of CAFE regs - one Chev SS = one huge Chev pick up. Guess which one makes more $ and is therefore the one they'd rather sell.
big_rob_sydney said:
And another thing not mentioned in the article. ADR's... What a load of st these are. (Australian Design Rules). Where do the muppets in government get the big idea that, a car which is designed for safe use in, say, Japan, needs a different set of rules for them to be okay for use in Australia???
What about European regs? Or North American regs? Or Japanese regs? There is no global standard.t these are. (Australian Design Rules). Where do the muppets in government get the big idea that, a car which is designed for safe use in, say, Japan, needs a different set of rules for them to be okay for use in Australia???Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff