£195 fine with Ealing Council
Discussion
I got a £195 fine for being in a bus lane (that was accidental) 6 months ago. I don't want to contest it but I don't understand why it's so much as their site says it's £65 if paid within 14 days, then £130.
It looks like I never got the original letter giving me a chance to pay that amount (which I would have done), nor £130 for that matter.
I have written to them 4 times without answer and left 3 messages for call backs within 3 days which they ignored (they can't comply with their own SLAs).
It is IMPOSSIBLE to speak to anyone. The switchboard is manned by a computer says no type who has zero interest.
Do they set the amount of the fine ? How come a council is allowed to do stuff like this without any due process ?
If anyone could recommend a course of action, I would appreciate it.
It looks like I never got the original letter giving me a chance to pay that amount (which I would have done), nor £130 for that matter.
I have written to them 4 times without answer and left 3 messages for call backs within 3 days which they ignored (they can't comply with their own SLAs).
It is IMPOSSIBLE to speak to anyone. The switchboard is manned by a computer says no type who has zero interest.
Do they set the amount of the fine ? How come a council is allowed to do stuff like this without any due process ?
If anyone could recommend a course of action, I would appreciate it.
That sounds like it has gone to charge certificate stage, and you have not received the original penalty notice.
When the Notice to Owner is issued, it is £130, or discounted to £65 if paid within 14 days.
If no payment is received after 28 days, it goes to the charge cert stage, and up to £195. There is not a lot you can do at this stage, besides a call in to their PCN team and hope you find someone understanding who will accept £130.
The next stage is Notice of Enforcement from Northampton TEC, and it will go up to £212. There is an appeal at this stage which is the PE3 statutory declaration form - get a court to countersign it, return it to TEC in Northampton, and it will revert back to £130. The £65 offer is long since gone though. - http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/HMCTS/GetFor...
Edit to Add - Ealing are one of the London Authorities that I struggle with too, but I have got a lot of email correspondence with parkingservices@ealing.gov.uk so it seems they do respond to emails.
When the Notice to Owner is issued, it is £130, or discounted to £65 if paid within 14 days.
If no payment is received after 28 days, it goes to the charge cert stage, and up to £195. There is not a lot you can do at this stage, besides a call in to their PCN team and hope you find someone understanding who will accept £130.
The next stage is Notice of Enforcement from Northampton TEC, and it will go up to £212. There is an appeal at this stage which is the PE3 statutory declaration form - get a court to countersign it, return it to TEC in Northampton, and it will revert back to £130. The £65 offer is long since gone though. - http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/HMCTS/GetFor...
Edit to Add - Ealing are one of the London Authorities that I struggle with too, but I have got a lot of email correspondence with parkingservices@ealing.gov.uk so it seems they do respond to emails.
Edited by S11Steve on Wednesday 8th November 12:53
Thank you Steve - sadly I never got the £65 offer (which I would have taken immediately), which is my main issue.
Communication is literally impossible as they have not replied to 4 emails / 3 messages.
Is it even legal for such ill-equipped organisation to be allowed to play at law enforcement ?
I will admit I come from a different country where it's the Police and the courts who do that and have to give a chance to appeal or at least a chance to communicate.
I live in rural Sussex so visiting in person is not cost effective either, and besides, I avoid London at all costs.
Communication is literally impossible as they have not replied to 4 emails / 3 messages.
Is it even legal for such ill-equipped organisation to be allowed to play at law enforcement ?
I will admit I come from a different country where it's the Police and the courts who do that and have to give a chance to appeal or at least a chance to communicate.
I live in rural Sussex so visiting in person is not cost effective either, and besides, I avoid London at all costs.
Councils are permitted to do this since the offences are non-endorsable on your licence and decriminalised, but there is very little accountability when things go wrong.
It's only because of the volume of tickets I deal with that I have made some contacts with various local authorities and agencies, but most of the London authorities are unionised jobsworths.
It is reassuring to know that if ever one of us suffers a significant injury and find ourselves devoid of all personality, humour and common sense, there will always be a job waiting for us in the local authority parking services team.
It's only because of the volume of tickets I deal with that I have made some contacts with various local authorities and agencies, but most of the London authorities are unionised jobsworths.
It is reassuring to know that if ever one of us suffers a significant injury and find ourselves devoid of all personality, humour and common sense, there will always be a job waiting for us in the local authority parking services team.
I had this off Bath Council
Got back from holiday, opened the door and there were court papers waiting for me, Bath council were taking me to court for driving down a bus lane and they had claimed I had ignored all previous letters, the new cost was £200 not the £60 original.....
I phoned them up, guy answered straight away and heard me out and goes "oh year we had some post stolen, your letters were probably in that "
I got the original fine in the post a week later and paid that , heard nothing since
Not much help as I got hold of the relevant department straight away
I would try going down there , or seeking out heir official complaints procedure
Got back from holiday, opened the door and there were court papers waiting for me, Bath council were taking me to court for driving down a bus lane and they had claimed I had ignored all previous letters, the new cost was £200 not the £60 original.....
I phoned them up, guy answered straight away and heard me out and goes "oh year we had some post stolen, your letters were probably in that "
I got the original fine in the post a week later and paid that , heard nothing since
Not much help as I got hold of the relevant department straight away
I would try going down there , or seeking out heir official complaints procedure
Cheers TMM. Sadly they are refusing any direct contact. Their complaint procedure is very opaque. I was expecting my experience to be similar to the one you had with Bath, ie civilised.
Is there an authority to report them to and who can step in ? Surely their incompetence and inability to allow basic judiciary due process needs to be reviewed.
Is there an authority to report them to and who can step in ? Surely their incompetence and inability to allow basic judiciary due process needs to be reviewed.
In a roundabout way they are answerable to the Traffic Penalty Tribunal - https://www.trafficpenaltytribunal.gov.uk/ - but there has to be an appeal and rejection to enable this process. Perhaps after you have submitted the PE3, you could appeal, but it's not an slick process.
Beyond that, there is the council internal complaints process, which for ealing is here - https://www.ealing.gov.uk/info/201033/council_and_...
Finally, if you have deep pockets, lots of spare time and strong principles, you can apply for a judicial review at the courts - http://www.publiclawproject.org.uk/data/resources/...
Beyond that, there is the council internal complaints process, which for ealing is here - https://www.ealing.gov.uk/info/201033/council_and_...
Finally, if you have deep pockets, lots of spare time and strong principles, you can apply for a judicial review at the courts - http://www.publiclawproject.org.uk/data/resources/...
nickfrog said:
Is there an authority to report them to and who can step in ? Surely their incompetence and inability to allow basic judiciary due process needs to be reviewed.
Yes and yes.You have to follow the correct process. Ealing's 3 stages are designed to delay responses as much as possible.
They have form for not responding to e-mails and have been criticised for it in several LGO Annual Reviews.
In the private sector a complaint to the top gets passed swiftly down to the person charged with departmental responsibility.
Often with an accompanying memo "sort it".
You may find these links useful.
The Chief Executive - http://directory.londoncouncils.gov.uk/directory/e...
The Leader of the Council - http://ealing.cmis.uk.com/ealing/Councillors/tabid...
If you don't get satisfactory responses take it to the LGO - http://www.lgo.org.uk/make-a-complaint/how-to-comp...
Ealing had the second highest number of LGO complaints overall for 2016/17 (beaten only by Lambeth) and was fifth re Highways and Transport.
Red Devil said:
nickfrog said:
Is there an authority to report them to and who can step in ? Surely their incompetence and inability to allow basic judiciary due process needs to be reviewed.
Yes and yes.You have to follow the correct process. Ealing's 3 stages are designed to delay responses as much as possible.
They have form for not responding to e-mails and have been criticised for it in several LGO Annual Reviews.
In the private sector a complaint to the top gets passed swiftly down to the person charged with departmental responsibility.
Often with an accompanying memo "sort it".
You may find these links useful.
The Chief Executive - http://directory.londoncouncils.gov.uk/directory/e...
The Leader of the Council - http://ealing.cmis.uk.com/ealing/Councillors/tabid...
If you don't get satisfactory responses take it to the LGO - http://www.lgo.org.uk/make-a-complaint/how-to-comp...
Ealing had the second highest number of LGO complaints overall for 2016/17 (beaten only by Lambeth) and was fifth re Highways and Transport.
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