What engine can I lob in my Lupo?

[ThePurpleWind]

Right,

I own a 2000 VW Lupo 1.0 E. It's currently SORN and going into storage because project car. I'm intending to do an engine swap and a few interior mods as well as getting it resprayed. Engine swap is inevitable because I presume turbocharging the 1.0 MPI will a) not do a whole amount and b) blow it up after a few thousand miles. Please spare me from the "sell it and get a GTi/16v 1.4/better car entirely" comments. Looking for no more than about 150bhp either.

The default answer seems to be the AVY 1.6 from the Lupo and Polo GTi, or the 1.8T conversion, but every man and his dog with a VAG will do the 1.8T. I don't even know how much the 1.8 produces powerwise.

So, as per the topic title, any ideas?

[aka_kerrly]

It's true that it's often easier to start with the car with the biggest engine to start with so in the Lupo case a GTI, but , where is the fun in that.

FYI i have a mk2 Polo with a 1.6 16v polo gti engine, with upgrades it runs over 150hp, there are examples of 1.6 16v with 200hp so I wouldn't completely rule out the 1.6 GTI engine it can be a cracking motor in a sub 1tonne car!!

Ideally you'd need a donor car in order to get the whole wiring loom in less of course you opt for standalone management in which case you can build a loom from scratch and buy just an engine * i paid £150 for a Polo GTI 1.6 16v engine a while back but don't know if that's the current going rate**. With that in mind it can be cheaper to buy an entire Polo GTI as these are the cheapest source of the 1.6 as Lupo GTIs have much more of a following. Then you can take the engine and wiring and sell the remains to recoup some money .. this is how i did my original 1.4 16v AFH conversion by buyin a Polo16v 100hp for £600 an selling everything other than the engine & wiring loom + ECU.

Alternatively, you could buy a mk4 Golf Gti ,a Seat Leon Cupra or Skoda Vrs , Audi A3/tt to get a 20VT conversion. These engines range from 150hp to 225hp. The benefit of these is that there are existing Lupo 20vt conversions so there is lots of information and specialist conversion parts available. see Club LUPO

More advanced than a 20vt but by no means impossible is a VR6 based conversion, again there are already examples built with the 2.8 12v mk3 Golf all the way through to the mk5 3.2 VR6 and even a Lupo with TWIN vr6s engines installed - search TAZ twin vr ;-)

[AJB88]

1.8T, 1.9TDI are common.

others like 3.2 V6, 2.0TDI, 2.0TFSI will probably fit.

2.0TSI found in the new cars would probably fit but nobody has managed to hack the ECU system yet to work apparently, few MK1 and MK2 Golfs sat around waiting for it.

[Dr G]

aka_kerrly said:

buy a mk4 Golf Gti

I've paid as little as £500 for running, driving, legal MK4 GTIs and they'll give you well over 80% of the parts you need.

You'll also have the best support community around conversion parts and bug fixing. Even a base, early 150BHP engine can be turned up to 200 very easily.

If you did want to stay NA the 1.6 mentioned already is a nice revvy little thing; ABF 2.0 16v out of a MK3 GTI is also a good unit and will go just over your 150BHP goal also.

I'd go 1.8T personally. Done well the end product should even remain a quite saleable car.

[Ahbefive]

1.8T is surely a no brainer. Cheap to find, reliable enough and easy to extract more power from later on.

[Swampy1982]

are you planning on doing the brakes etc? hope so, a 225 1.8 BAM with rear drums would be a scary thing...

[Dr G]

Rear drums are probably fine on a Lupo; I imagine they're at least 70% front heavy.

Beauty of doing the conversion with a donor car is that you can often use a lot of the bigger car's brake components.

[Swampy1982]

Dr G said:

Beauty of doing the conversion with a donor car is that you can often use a lot of the bigger car's brake components.

That was the observation I was going make, to nick as much off the donor car as pos, including brakes (and wheels if needed to fit the brakes)

[ThePurpleWind]

Plenty of feedback

Brakes wise, of course they are getting upgraded. Even if I was sticking with the stock engine, I'd be upgrading the brakes.

To go down the donor car route, I presume the best thing is to look on sites like Copart to get writeoffs that still run fine, never a fan of the idea of ripping apart a perfectly good car.

Not considering TDi engines, especially with the way diesel prices are going.

I don't mind going turbocharged route with a 1.8T if that's definitely the best way to go, especially seen as the most hands on thing I've ever done with car is either topping up coolant or fitting a rev counter to my Aygo Doing something completely left field probably isn't the best way to go then. To be honest, I've seen companies that offer 1.8T conversions, so it might be a case of saving the pennies for a few months.

TSR Performance, Style Dynamics and JBS Auto Designs are 3 I've seen, with JBS being preferable being fairly local (Derbyshire instead of Middlesex or Somerset.

Not in a huge rush as this is a long term thing, because insurance premiums are a thing.

[rufmeister]

Why not something like this:

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/is-this-twin-engi...

[ajprice]

Quoting myself from an engine swap thread, go big or go home...

ajprice said:

Small car, big engine. Something ridiculous like an Audi 4.2 V8 engined Lupo

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[ThePurpleWind]

Next it'll be LS swap it

[SuperchargedVR6]

AJB88 said:

2.0TSI found in the new cars would probably fit but nobody has managed to hack the ECU system yet to work apparently, few MK1 and MK2 Golfs sat around waiting for it.

Easily the best choice of engine mentioned so far, especially in Edition 30/Edition 35/Scirocco R/8P S3 KO4 flavour.

Good for 350hp with standard hardware. People who limit themselves to a specific hp number are just kidding themselves, especially with turbo conversions. That is plenty of power in a Lupo. Even the standard 230-260hp levels of tune is plenty.

People have put that engine into MK1 Golfs, so it's not an insurmountable problem. Just depends how far you want to go with it. The more ancillaries you transfer over, the easier the conversion is. Bare bones engine only is where things can get difficult.

[aka_kerrly]

AJB88 said:

2.0TSI found in the new cars would probably fit but nobody has managed to hack the ECU system yet to work apparently, few MK1 and MK2 Golfs sat around waiting for it.

QPENG offer a TFSI harness and ECU conversion. There are also high pressure fuel pump solutions an Stealth racing offer some kind of tfsi hack as well.

The chap who built the twin VR6 Lupo has a 2.0 TFSI as well


there are a few build threads online for it
http://www.edition38.com/forums/index.php?/topic/4...

[AJB88]

aka_kerrly said:

QPENG offer a TFSI harness and ECU conversion. There are also high pressure fuel pump solutions an Stealth racing offer some kind of tfsi hack as well.

The chap who built the twin VR6 Lupo has a 2.0 TFSI as well


there are a few build threads online for it
http://www.edition38.com/forums/index.php?/topic/4...

TSI not TFSI

[AJB88]

SuperchargedVR6 said:

Easily the best choice of engine mentioned so far, especially in Edition 30/Edition 35/Scirocco R/8P S3 KO4 flavour.

Good for 350hp with standard hardware. People who limit themselves to a specific hp number are just kidding themselves, especially with turbo conversions. That is plenty of power in a Lupo. Even the standard 230-260hp levels of tune is plenty.

People have put that engine into MK1 Golfs, so it's not an insurmountable problem. Just depends how far you want to go with it. The more ancillaries you transfer over, the easier the conversion is. Bare bones engine only is where things can get difficult.

I was talking about the Gen 8 EA888 Golf R, Cupra 280/190/300 engine

[Dr G]

AJB88 said:

TSI not TFSI

That's just different branding for Audi/VW. They're interchangeable.

[aka_kerrly]

Dr G said:

AJB88 said:

TSI not TFSI

That's just different branding for Audi/VW. They're interchangeable.

[AJB88]

Dr G said:

That's just different branding for Audi/VW. They're interchangeable.

Yes and No.

VW,SEAT and Skoda called the old MK5 platform engine found in the R and Cupra a TFSI, Audi called it TSI.

now the MQB platform cars MK7 etc VW,SEAT,Skoda call it TSI, Audi call it TFSI

The best engine to lob in would be the 2.0 TSI EA888 Gen 3 CJX engine as found in MK7 R, Cupra 280/290/300 but nobody has managed to crack the loom/ecu for that to be converted yet.