What’s your big gamble? (Volume 2)

[GliderRider]

ferrisbueller said:

petemurphy said:

500 Miles said:

So did DeepCludge - very weird..

its had a good week! nice little rise for sng too going into the new year. lets hope for a happy new year all

I read DeepClunge. My mind is clearly elsewhere.

FerrisBueller, I can assure you you weren't the only one.

[EFH189]

I’ve no affiliation with this blog, the article was shared with me for 4D Pharma where I am invested and I noted a few companies I think you guys trade in: https://lemminginvestors.blogspot.com/2021/01/my-2...

[22s]

Trading 212 questions... Quite specific...

Does T212 allow the trading of SPAC units and warrants? I know they offer some commons.

If they offer units, what is the fee to split them?

Does anyone have a T212 referral link please as I don't have an account and seen a few people bandy them about on here I think?

If they don't offer units, does anyone know of a broker that offers ISA accounts and full SPAC units and warrants? Interactive Brokers seems to be the best option, but they don't support ISA wrappers.

[Milkbuttons]

22s said:

Trading 212 questions... Quite specific...

Does T212 allow the trading of SPAC units and warrants? I know they offer some commons.

If they offer units, what is the fee to split them?

Does anyone have a T212 referral link please as I don't have an account and seen a few people bandy them about on here I think?

If they don't offer units, does anyone know of a broker that offers ISA accounts and full SPAC units and warrants? Interactive Brokers seems to be the best option, but they don't support ISA wrappers.

Sent you pm

[vulture1]

Anyone able to find info on what sort of dates Siemens will sell down its holdings in siemens energy? I'm keen to buy more of this but want to buy when they are selling off their stakes in it

[Adam B]

EFH189 said:

I’ve no affiliation with this blog, the article was shared with me for 4D Pharma where I am invested and I noted a few companies I think you guys trade in: https://lemminginvestors.blogspot.com/2021/01/my-2...

Very interesting thanks

Seems to have done some decent research (though all these things should be taken with a pinch of salt it’s a hell of a lot better than LSE).

Will keep my 4D, avoid PHE now, and may add some SYN back

[911pleb]

Feels like an age since I last read/posted on here.
Still in GGP for the long term and EUA for the sale... still very happy with both. Can't wait for Scallywag results. Game changer if good (they will be).

Looking to the future, would anybody be kind enough to give me the lowdown on syme? I've read up on the business model and the directors and all the boring stuff, but what I'm struggling with is understanding the potential growth and what the catalysts are.

The most recent rns seems to have killed the sp a bit and I have to admit I didn't really understand it.

Is it a short term rocketship or a long term hold proposition?

I expect 100% out of GGP this year at the very least, is syme on par with that?

Thanks in advance to anybody willing to humor me in my laziness.

[Adam B]

911pleb said:

Looking to the future, would anybody be kind enough to give me the lowdown on syme? I've read up on the business model and the directors and all the boring stuff, but what I'm struggling with is understanding the potential growth and what the catalysts are.

The most recent rns seems to have killed the sp a bit and I have to admit I didn't really understand it.

I get the concept, and the recent RNS confirmed from an accounting perspective it takes asset and liability off the balance sheet, but I achieved house so quickly on the bullst biz speak bingo I am deeply suspicious. Also not sure how SYME can be an expert in stock appraisal across industries but it is a clever idea. Essentially like debt factoring but with stock not debtors.

[alistair1234]

ferrisbueller said:

TCX said:

ferrisbueller said:

TCX said:

China looking to guarantee ore supply chain
https://www.mining.com/web/china-to-build-overseas...

I saw something about that in a feed the other day - probably linked to me following Rio Tinto which I own a few of.

Googled: The major iron ore producers in Western Australia include BHP Billiton, Rio Tinto and Fortescue Metals Group (FMG). The sector also includes a number of smaller, mid-tier producers, such as Cliffs Natural Resources, Citic Pacific Mining and Hancock Prospecting.

Wonder if the Aus government be happy china trying to buy into WA,plus Chinese weren't happy with Rio,blaming them for ore price rises ?
Would've thought china try it on in Africa,s America,easier for them to manipulate government/ mining firms

Far beyond my geo-political knowledge but I suspect China are making numerous moves, both public and behind the scenes, on many fronts at present. Land grabs, muscle flexing, cyber intrusions, some might say Covid.......there is an awful lot going on.

Have a look at ZIOC https://www.zanagairon.com/about-us/

They’ve got a 50% stake along with Glencore of one of the biggest resources. Rumours for a long time that China are going to fund the means to get the product to the port in RoC so they can export it back home

[anonymous-user]

Adam B said:

911pleb said:

Looking to the future, would anybody be kind enough to give me the lowdown on syme? I've read up on the business model and the directors and all the boring stuff, but what I'm struggling with is understanding the potential growth and what the catalysts are.

The most recent rns seems to have killed the sp a bit and I have to admit I didn't really understand it.

I get the concept, and the recent RNS confirmed from an accounting perspective it takes asset and liability off the balance sheet, but I achieved house so quickly on the bullst biz speak bingo I am deeply suspicious. Also not sure how SYME can be an expert in stock appraisal across industries but it is a clever idea. Essentially like debt factoring but with stock not debtors.

I’d agree with that. It could be an amazing new accounting tool or a mechanism for fraudsters and failing companies to extract cash.

It’s my second biggest holding and could be massive or sink. For me it’s a lth and could yield significant returns. It’s not a safe share like eua or GGP. I don’t recommend Syme to people but am happy to take the risk myself.

[Adam B]

MikeStroud said:

I’d agree with that. It could be an amazing new accounting tool or a mechanism for fraudsters and failing companies to extract cash.

I guess it can’t be too hard to examine the sales figures and figure out whether the stock is selling quickly or not, but other than a short term cash crunch i don’t see why a successful company would give 10-20% of their margin away (do you know what % they charge?)


Also do you know once factored out, how does SYME ensure the company sells the stock? I assume they take legal title of the stock but assume the original company keep physical ownership and are still required to sell it to their customers?

[JustinF]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55504881

Just a heads up that China stocks might all take a kicking over regulatory fears even though not mentioned in this article, BABA, XPEV NIO etc

[anonymous-user]

Adam B said:

MikeStroud said:

I’d agree with that. It could be an amazing new accounting tool or a mechanism for fraudsters and failing companies to extract cash.

I guess it can’t be too hard to examine the sales figures and figure out whether the stock is selling quickly or not, but other than a short term cash crunch i don’t see why a successful company would give 10-20% of their margin away (do you know what % they charge?)


Also do you know once factored out, how does SYME ensure the company sells the stock? I assume they take legal title of the stock but assume the original company keep physical ownership and are still required to sell it to their customers?

You’re right, Syme do due diligence on all companies before they can join the platform. I assume they repeat that periodically but don’t know how often. They charge to do that dd. Any inventory they monitise they get 1% of and the stock owner then pays whoever monitised it some fee. Syme is just the platform in the middle raking off 1%. A bit like say eBay.

Yes the original owner still holds the stock and is expected to sell it.

An example from my own experience: I used to be under huge pressure years ago to deliver £50m of revenue by year end. It had to be £50m as bonuses and share prices etc would drop if not as forecast. If I’d got to £45m and the last £5m deal wasn’t going to happen until after the deadline then using Syme I can make the product, monetise it and £50m hit. Everyone is happy.

Another example. You make Yule logs for Tesco. You start making them in august but Tesco don’t want delivery til November and won’t pay you til January. Then use Syme to help your cash flow. In this case of course bank loans etc are already available for cash flow but Syme is another tool that helps with revenue as well as cash flow.

At least that is how I understand it works and why last weeks RNS about accounting firms accepting what Syme are doing was a good thing imo.

Syme have said their dd is aimed at also checking inventory is actually saleable on an open market and not junk. Part of their bulls**t is that they then use blockchain to uniquely track that inventory. God knows how that works.

Two of the big four accounting firms accepting what Syme do was a big deal for me and makes the proposition much more attractive to companies needing to hit revenue targets at year end. That said I’ve only syme’s RNS for that... I wonder what those two accounting companies have actually said ???

[JustinF]

So SYME is basically a corporate pawn shop where the loanee gets to keep his goods, their enforcement dept better be st hot.

[CaptainSlow]

MikeStroud said:

You’re right, Syme do due diligence on all companies before they can join the platform. I assume they repeat that periodically but don’t know how often. They charge to do that dd. Any inventory they monitise they get 1% of and the stock owner then pays whoever monitised it some fee. Syme is just the platform in the middle raking off 1%. A bit like say eBay.

Yes the original owner still holds the stock and is expected to sell it.

An example from my own experience: I used to be under huge pressure years ago to deliver £50m of revenue by year end. It had to be £50m as bonuses and share prices etc would drop if not as forecast. If I’d got to £45m and the last £5m deal wasn’t going to happen until after the deadline then using Syme I can make the product, monetise it and £50m hit. Everyone is happy.

Another example. You make Yule logs for Tesco. You start making them in august but Tesco don’t want delivery til November and won’t pay you til January. Then use Syme to help your cash flow. In this case of course bank loans etc are already available for cash flow but Syme is another tool that helps with revenue as well as cash flow.

At least that is how I understand it works and why last weeks RNS about accounting firms accepting what Syme are doing was a good thing imo.

Syme have said their dd is aimed at also checking inventory is actually saleable on an open market and not junk. Part of their bulls**t is that they then use blockchain to uniquely track that inventory. God knows how that works.

Two of the big four accounting firms accepting what Syme do was a big deal for me and makes the proposition much more attractive to companies needing to hit revenue targets at year end. That said I’ve only syme’s RNS for that... I wonder what those two accounting companies have actually said ???

Can you please share a link to the RNS that details monetised stock is counted as revenue?

[Adam B]

CaptainSlow said:

Can you please share a link to the RNS that details monetised stock is counted as revenue?

“The eligible Client Companies are ready to implement the inventory monetisation process and their financial advisory teams (including external auditors numbering among them two of the Big4[1] audit firms) have approved the structure and derecognition accounting treatment of the inventory monetisation transaction.”

https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/SYME/inventory-funding-y...

[Adam B]

MikeStroud said:

Syme have said their dd is aimed at also checking inventory is actually saleable on an open market and not junk. Part of their bulls**t is that they then use blockchain to uniquely track that inventory. God knows how that works.

Not an expert on blockchain but know it’s main advantage is independent verification of transactions so that makes sense.

What I am not sure about is what if the company takes the money and doesn’t make any effort to sell that stock, eg instead tries to shift stock that SYME refused to monetise. And the stock just sits there becoming obsolete.

Not SYME risk as they have their 1% but is for their partners. Imagine they would want more like then 10-20% I mentioned!

[CaptainSlow]

Adam B said:

CaptainSlow said:

Can you please share a link to the RNS that details monetised stock is counted as revenue?

“The eligible Client Companies are ready to implement the inventory monetisation process and their financial advisory teams (including external auditors numbering among them two of the Big4[1] audit firms) have approved the structure and derecognition accounting treatment of the inventory monetisation transaction.”

https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/SYME/inventory-funding-y...

Thanks, I dont see anything about the client accounting in there.

I would imagine it would be credit stock debit cash in a similar manner to monetising an accounts receivable would be credit AR debit cash. There's no way you would book a stock monetising transaction as revenue.

[Adam B]

I assume it is booked like any other sale, you sell to 3rd party for say 80% of normal price.

I think the above confirms you can remove the value of the stock and add cash/ reduce AP on agreement of the factoring contract. Just a guess though as RNS speaks in riddles

[CaptainSlow]

Adam B said:

I assume it is booked like any other sale, you sell to 3rd party for say 80% of normal price.

I think the above confirms you can remove the value of the stock and add cash/ reduce AP on agreement of the factoring contract. Just a guess though as RNS speaks in riddles

It isnt a sale so cant be booked as such.