Hawker Typhoon rebuild

[ettore]

aeropilot said:

Yesterday, Air Leasing at Sywell, have taken the wraps of their Tempest II rebuild, so it must be getting close to first flight.

Looks terrific

That really does look thoroughly splendid!

[ettore]

aeropilot said:

Yesterday, Air Leasing at Sywell, have taken the wraps of their Tempest II rebuild, so it must be getting close to first flight.

Looks terrific

That really does look thoroughly splendid!

[aeropilot]

Dr Jekyll said:

aeropilot said:

Yes, Centaurus VI engine.
And no, Shell haven't made any 100U oil since the 1980's, and I've heard in recent months (after the Navy Wings Sea Fury crash) that its believed that the very last stock of it was destroyed when Buncefield depot blew up back in 2005.

Just what is involved in producing 100U oil? I read there was a proposal to produce a batch some years ago but there wasn't enough demand for the stuff to justify it.

Handing over the money to Shell to produce it........but I gather they naturally have a minimum quantity to do so, and that's where it falls down, because all the worldwide Centaurus operators couldn't get their act together so as for one order to be processed, plus you then have where do you store such a quantity for x years while you batch it up in drums over x years and distribute to each user etc.
It was different in the days when there was a large commercial, and military user (MOD with RAF and RNHF plus ze Germans) for Shell to handle and store it under a big contract.

[Simpo Two]

aeropilot said:

Handing over the money to Shell to produce it........but I gather they naturally have a minimum quantity to do so, and that's where it falls down...

If I was the boss of Shell I'd just make a batch just for the publicity. The cost wouldn't scratch the sides of the piggy bank.

[Dr Jekyll]

aeropilot said:

Handing over the money to Shell to produce it........but I gather they naturally have a minimum quantity to do so, and that's where it falls down, because all the worldwide Centaurus operators couldn't get their act together so as for one order to be processed, plus you then have where do you store such a quantity for x years while you batch it up in drums over x years and distribute to each user etc.
It was different in the days when there was a large commercial, and military user (MOD with RAF and RNHF plus ze Germans) for Shell to handle and store it under a big contract.

Sure, but what I'm curious about it why it costs so much to set up to produce it that you need a large order. Considering the vast variety of oil based fluids it doesn't normally need vast capital investment to produce a new one. Or is it just the size of the plant and the need to make a tankful at a time?

[Burrow01]

Dr Jekyll said:

Sure, but what I'm curious about it why it costs so much to set up to produce it that you need a large order. Considering the vast variety of oil based fluids it doesn't normally need vast capital investment to produce a new one. Or is it just the size of the plant and the need to make a tankful at a time?

They probably need to develop all the QA controls and sign offs and paperwork - typically for aviation this is more overhead than producing the product

[Yertis]

aeropilot said:

Yes, Centaurus VI engine.
And no, Shell haven't made any 100U oil since the 1980's, and I've heard in recent months (after the Navy Wings Sea Fury crash) that its believed that the very last stock of it was destroyed when Buncefield depot blew up back in 2005.

How will they fly it? Presumably insurance etc stipulate that the engine must be operated within spec, ie using the approved type of lubricant.

[Dr Jekyll]

I've been reading up on the history of this project through it's various owners.

In brief:

2004. Airframe ready to go, just needs engine.
2007. Engine being renovated in the US, Once it's finished and delivered it's just s case of airframe final assembly and airworthiness checks.
2008. Work has started on renovating engine.
2009. Will be ready to fly in 2010, just needs the engine.
2013. Almost complete, just needs the engine.
2014. Airframe being assessed for rebuild to flying condition. Engine has arrived from the US and work will start on renovating it.
2016. Rear fuselage complete, next jobs are the tail and the cockpit. Engine now ready for rebuild.
2018. Wings now being restored.

Anyone know when a Tempest last flew?

[aeropilot]

Dr Jekyll said:

Anyone know when a Tempest last flew?

Probably 1955 when the Indian Air Force retired their fleet of Tempest II's (of which this was one)

[Eric Mc]

The Tempest on display at the RAF Museum Hendon was painted up in target towing colours. I think the RAF used them well into the 1950s too for non front-line duties.##

[Ayahuasca]

aeropilot said:

Dr Jekyll said:

Anyone know when a Tempest last flew?

Probably 1955 when the Indian Air Force retired their fleet of Tempest II's (of which this was one)

Hawker Sea Furies are substantially similar and are still flying.

[Dr Jekyll]

Eric Mc said:

The Tempest on display at the RAF Museum Hendon was painted up in target towing colours. I think the RAF used them well into the 1950s too for non front-line duties.##

Wasn't there also a Tempest II in the RAF museum?

[dr_gn]

Dr Jekyll said:

Eric Mc said:

The Tempest on display at the RAF Museum Hendon was painted up in target towing colours. I think the RAF used them well into the 1950s too for non front-line duties.##

Wasn't there also a Tempest II in the RAF museum?

At Cosford? Yes it was moved from the London museum last year. I was looking at it on Monday when I had a trip over there.

[saaby93]

The Tempest has the huge air intake below the engine - the tempest II looks more like a radial?

[CanAm]

They were fitted with the Bristol Centaurus air-cooled radial engine, like the Sea Fury. Some Tempests also had the radiators in the wing roots rather under the engine.

[dr_gn]

saaby93 said:

The Tempest has the huge air intake below the engine - the tempest II looks more like a radial?

The Tempest V with the chin intake had a Napier Sabre H-24 engine, the Tempest II has a Centaurus radial.

[Eric Mc]

During World War 2, it was common practice to design new aircraft with a number of different engine options. This was looked on as an insurance policy if there were development problems with an engine or if production was interrupted due to enemy action.

The Tempest was tested with the Rolls Royce Griffon, the Bristol Centaurus and the Napier Sabre. Production went ahead with the Centaurus and Sabre variants but the Centaurus version entered service just after the war had ended.

Here's the Tempest III fitted with the Griffon.

[Piginapoke]

ettore said:

aeropilot said:

Yesterday, Air Leasing at Sywell, have taken the wraps of their Tempest II rebuild, so it must be getting close to first flight.

Looks terrific

That really does look thoroughly splendid!

Oh My days

[aeropilot]

Ayahuasca said:

aeropilot said:

Dr Jekyll said:

Anyone know when a Tempest last flew?

Probably 1955 when the Indian Air Force retired their fleet of Tempest II's (of which this was one)

Hawker Sea Furies are substantially similar and are still flying.

Define substantially?

It's made by Hawker, and it's powered by a Centaurus. Other than that, there's not a lot of similar about the two.
Its like saying a Hurricane is substantially similar to a Spitfire.

[Dr Jekyll]

aeropilot said:

Define substantially?

It's made by Hawker, and it's powered by a Centaurus. Other than that, there's not a lot of similar about the two.
Its like saying a Hurricane is substantially similar to a Spitfire.

No, there's more to it than that. The wings of the Sea Fury are based on the outer section of the Tempest wings and the fuselage is evolved from the Tempest design albeit different in construction.

More like saying the Tempest is substantially similar to a Typhoon. Hawkers hardly ever designed anything from scratch.