Looking to buy a Fiat Coupé 20VT what should I look out for?
Discussion
Hand written service history, Cam' belt and tensioner change, front ABS sensors (hub condition in general), noisy back brakes, buckled wheels, blue smoke (turbo oil seal failure), white smoke (head warped or gasket common with Audi five pots not too sure about Fiat ones), clutch, inside front tyre wall for wear (tracking). Most important make sure all the keys are there. I've been told about cars sold with only two keys, then attempted to be stollen about a month later with the missing key.
You need to get across to the fiat coupe forum - fccuk.org/forum and look on there. Its by far the best resource on the net for Fiat Coupes, and you will find all your answer on there from a newbie buyers guide, to how to get over 500 bhp!!
They are great cars, but you need to buy with caution, so come on over and have a read
They are great cars, but you need to buy with caution, so come on over and have a read
Edited by JimO on Sunday 14th June 09:56
The 20V Turbo is a great car, but get some insurance quotes first. It's a group 20 car, the 16V Turbo and 20V non-Turbo are 16-18 depending on the company and the 16V non-Turbo group 14. I know a lad (21) who bought a bargain 20V non-turbo for £800 at auction only to find it would cost him £2000 to insure.
I've had two, viewed lots. Go on condition, full service history and owner's enthusiasm. If the previous owner lavished it, then that is a good sign. There are lots of dogs out there, hang on until you find a nice example, after you compare a few, you'll know the right one. Amazing cars, there is nothing for the money with this much pace and style. Bargain of the decade.
Robert060379 said:
Hand written service history, Cam' belt and tensioner change, front ABS sensors (hub condition in general), noisy back brakes, buckled wheels, blue smoke (turbo oil seal failure), white smoke (head warped or gasket common with Audi five pots not too sure about Fiat ones), clutch, inside front tyre wall for wear (tracking). Most important make sure all the keys are there. I've been told about cars sold with only two keys, then attempted to be stollen about a month later with the missing key.
Head gasket failure is extremely rare on the 20VT engine, even when running rather more boost then it left the factory with. The main issues relating to keys is the presence of the red master key. This key is required to program standard keys into the immobiliser. Contrary to popular belief they are rarely needed, and it's not a deal breaker if it's missing, but a good haggling point. A complete ECU/code module/lock set with 3 keys can be bought for quite reasonable money s/h if you feel you must have a red key.Off the top of my head common faults are:
- Manifold cracking. They ALL do this at some stage, even the later modified design cracks eventualy. New manifolds are very pricey, but they can be welded up successfully. Someone on FCCUK is selling reasonably priced tubular manifolds now, but no long term experience yet.
- Front wishbone bushes (cause wandering and bad torque steer when worn, aftermarket parts don't last long but are cheap.)
- Rear radius arm bearings (just like the old mini's setup)
- Engine mounts (very expensive and not always available from Fiat dealers)
- Sticking front Brembo calipers. Note these brakes are very prone to squealing, so this isn't a bad sign.
- Worn disks, the combination of a very quick and nose heavy car means front disks tend to wear fairly quickly.
- Ask about oil consumption, some of these engines have a prodigious appetite.
- Rotting radiators. Not really a coupe specific fault, but one to watch for.
- Corrosion on oil cooler fittings. These have been known to fail and dump all the oil out with predictable consequences.
- Rusting exhausts, especially rear tailpipe. The tailpipes can actually fall off the silencer if they get rotten enough, and the exhaust then melts a hole in the rear bumper.
- Turbo wear, same as any turbocharged car.
- Rear wheel bearings, getting common now most cars have higher mileage on them (both of mine went before 90k).
- The "coolant hose of death". Ask if this has been changed, it connects the thermostat housing to the rear left hand side of the block and is a ball ache to change and a common failure. The actual hose is reasonably cheap, around £20.
- Thermostat. Quite expensive (£40-£50) as it's a fairly complex casting rather than just a simple thermostat insert. Commonly jam open leading to cool running engine. Engine should be between 85-90 on the gauge if it's working, it may go over 90 if stopped in traffic on a hot day.
- Oil pressure. Gauge should read 0 bar with engine off and ignition on. If it reads 3bar then sender is knackered or disconnected (possibly for good reason!). Pressure should be 3 bar at idle with a cold engine, and may drop as the engine warms up. It should be no lower than ~1.5 bar at idle. A really good engine will hardly drop from 3 bar, but check the oil being used! Some use 10W50 instead of the recommended 10W40, which results in an increase in oil pressure. Handy if your engine is a bit tired and you are trying to sell it...
I've probably missed a few, but the common ones are there.
I just bought a yellow 20v Turbo (1998) from ebay a few months ago - £550! It had been parked up for over 2 years and the clutch was slipping and the cambelt overdue. Have subsequently pulled the engine out, put in a new clutch and changed all of the belts/tensioners. Engine is very healthy - good compression across all cylinders and no smoke, oil pressure 3 bar with little to no consumption and power wise, yes they are pokey, it spins the wheels in first and thats with new Falken FK452s on.
I only bought it as a track day toy and am looking forward to getting it out on track next month. Agree that for the money, there is little that can touch them.
I only bought it as a track day toy and am looking forward to getting it out on track next month. Agree that for the money, there is little that can touch them.
Chipped ECU worth the extra insurance? On it's own no, but with other modifications to even it out probably. Ask to see the before and after dynographs and recipt if there are not available then the car probably isn't chipped at all and he's pull the wool over your eyes. Your insurance will probably want proof as well. The increase will probabbly be canceled out if you get a good alarm and immobiliser or join the IAM (I get 25% off mine for being a member).
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