Car sold privately - broken down, where do I stand?

[Seb.F]

Not sure if this is the right section, as I've not been here long... so here we go.

New owner bought my car last wednesday night (a 206), to have a (brand new only done 3k miles might I add) clutch fail on him. The symptoms are he can feel a bite as he lifts the pedal up but only for a second as if the clutch isn't even gripping. It apparently happened just as he pulled up to a garage to fill the tyres up with air.

No sounds or smells, just went. I'm taking a guess at clutch cable or auto adjuster, as the gearbox & linkage is fine and still goes straight into gear.

Now, where do I stand on this? The phrase Caveat Emptor springs to mind, am I correct in saying it's not my problem at all, and I shouldn't have to deal with it out my own pocket?

The lad's mother called and said that she has '7 days to find the fault or return the car to get a full refund'.

Is that true?

Can't seem to find much info on it...

Any advice, mechanical or legal appreciated.

Thanks
Seb

[Neil_H]

By the side of the road?

sorry

Who fitted the clutch? If it was only a short time ago, it should be the responsibility of the garage shouldn't it?

If not, it's his problem, caveat emptor indeed. His Mum is talking bks, you have no comeback from a private sale for mechanical issues.

Edited by Neil_H on Saturday 5th September 11:05

[P-J]

If you're not a dealer then there's no guarantee with it.

However, how would you feel if it happened to you?

[Tyre Smoke]

Have you a receipt signed by the purchaser 'sold as seen tried and tested, no warranty implied or given' ?

If so, you can sit back and tell them to take a running jump. Whether you would fell happy morally to do that is up to you.

If you haven't then you still have no obligation to do anything, but I'd feel happier with the receipt.

Tell them to do their worst. You've done nothing illegal, so any action they take will be civil and therefore cost them money, which they are unlikely to do given that the car they've bought was hardly expensive (tens of £000's)and they are on dodgy ground.

[Seb.F]

P-J said:

If you're not a dealer then there's no guarantee with it.

However, how would you feel if it happened to you?

Pretty crap indeed! But I just forked out £170odd for tracking work on my new VX220, as the thing was all over the place when I bought it.

Was pretty annoyed at that, but, crap happens.

[Seb.F]

Tyre Smoke said:

Tell them to do their worst. You've done nothing illegal, so any action they take will be civil and therefore cost them money, which they are unlikely to do given that the car they've bought was hardly expensive (tens of £000's)and they are on dodgy ground.

Cheers, I'd thought as much. The car only cost them £2600.

I'd spent about half of that just having a spanking new engine/clutch/servicing cost done about 3000 miles ago.

[bigdods]

Private sale is always sold as seen you dont need to state that on a recipt. 7 days to return , she must think she's dealing with a shop.

Just point out to the buyer, st happens. I sold a car on ebay a while back, it got literally 5 miles before the engine expired. Buyer rang me from the hard shoulder to ask if I could bring a torch for him to take a look which I happily did. He rightly accepted that once he'd handed over the cash it was his problem.

[interloper]

Strictly speaking its not your problem but if you are feeling kind, you could always hand the new owner the receipt for the clutch job and point him in the direction of the garage that did it. The part at least should have its own warranty.

It may well go some way to solving the new owners problem and not cost you anything at the same time.

[GreigM]

Private buyers are paying a lower price because they are taking the risk - if they want a guarantee thats what dealers are there for.

I would simply have no further contact with the buyer - there is no reason for you to. By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest. Any further communication cannot improve the situation for you - simply don't respond and they will go away.

[Marcellus]

As said legally they're stuffed.

Morally if there was a warranty on the work you had done then you might want to let them take it back to the garage concerned... but clutch going after 3000miles.... doubt you'd have much back on them even if youhadn't sold the car.

[madala]

Seb.F said:

P-J said:

If you're not a dealer then there's no guarantee with it.

However, how would you feel if it happened to you?

Pretty crap indeed! But I just forked out £170odd for tracking work on my new VX220, as the thing was all over the place when I bought it.

Was pretty annoyed at that, but, crap happens.

HMMMMmmmmm but you still bought knowing that the tracking was all over the place.....surely you had a test drive?....if not....more fool you.

To the OP....isn't the original warranty still valid on the car if it has only 3000K?

[pokethepope]

madala said:

Seb.F said:

P-J said:

If you're not a dealer then there's no guarantee with it.

However, how would you feel if it happened to you?

Pretty crap indeed! But I just forked out £170odd for tracking work on my new VX220, as the thing was all over the place when I bought it.

Was pretty annoyed at that, but, crap happens.

HMMMMmmmmm but you still bought knowing that the tracking was all over the place.....surely you had a test drive?....if not....more fool you.

To the OP....isn't the original warranty still valid on the car if it has only 3000K?

The new clutch has dont 3k, not the car itself.

[Seb.F]

madala said:

HMMMMmmmmm but you still bought knowing that the tracking was all over the place.....surely you had a test drive?....if not....more fool you.

To the OP....isn't the original warranty still valid on the car if it has only 3000K?

I wasn't insured to drive it on roads, so the only drive I had was in an empty open car park.

The car wasn't brand new, just the engine. It's about 8 or 9 years old, so no warranty on it.

[IforB]

You have no idea how the car has been treated since you handed it over. He may have been screwing around royally.

As already mentioned, you have no legal responsibility for this car now. You aren;t the owner and as it was a private sale, that's it.

I would point them in the direction of the garage that did the work, but that's it.

[Tuscanless Ali]

GreigM said:

By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest.

I think the laws do exist, went through the same when we bought a car from a private individual, engine blew up when we got it home, phoned trading standards and was told I could reject the vehicle and give back to the seller for a full refund, or the seller could repair it.

We agreed between us after having the engine evaluated that the seller would pay for what it would cost to repair the engine, which was about 1500 quid, we then paid the extra for a full engine rebuild.

[H_Kan]

Tuscanless Ali said:

GreigM said:

By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest.

I think the laws do exist, went through the same when we bought a car from a private individual, engine blew up when we got it home, phoned trading standards and was told I could reject the vehicle and give back to the seller for a full refund, or the seller could repair it.

We agreed between us after having the engine evaluated that the seller would pay for what it would cost to repair the engine, which was about 1500 quid, we then paid the extra for a full engine rebuild.

That's absolute rubbish, if this did happen then it was because the seller was uninformed about the law.

Long as the OP hasn't misstated facts then he would be fine. If he's written something like 'guaranteed to run perfectly for many more miles' etc then that's a little shakier. If however he has merely stated that the car had a new clutch 3000miles ago then there is nothing wrong with that.

Similarly, there are no comebacks from auction sales either.

In any case OP, the buyer sounds like a young lad, so thinking back, I'm almost certain it would ragged big time.

[Tuscanless Ali]

H_Kan said:

Tuscanless Ali said:

GreigM said:

By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest.

I think the laws do exist, went through the same when we bought a car from a private individual, engine blew up when we got it home, phoned trading standards and was told I could reject the vehicle and give back to the seller for a full refund, or the seller could repair it.

We agreed between us after having the engine evaluated that the seller would pay for what it would cost to repair the engine, which was about 1500 quid, we then paid the extra for a full engine rebuild.

That's absolute rubbish, if this did happen then it was because the seller was uninformed about the law.

Do you think the our seller didn't phone trading standards himself It was a few years ago so maybe the law has changed.

[Alex97]

Tuscanless Ali said:

H_Kan said:

Tuscanless Ali said:

GreigM said:

By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest.

I think the laws do exist, went through the same when we bought a car from a private individual, engine blew up when we got it home, phoned trading standards and was told I could reject the vehicle and give back to the seller for a full refund, or the seller could repair it.

We agreed between us after having the engine evaluated that the seller would pay for what it would cost to repair the engine, which was about 1500 quid, we then paid the extra for a full engine rebuild.

That's absolute rubbish, if this did happen then it was because the seller was uninformed about the law.

Do you think the our seller didn't phone trading standards himself It was a few years ago so maybe the law has changed.

The law hasn't changed, but if the situation was like you described it, the seller did not have to pay for anything at all.

[hunt_the_fox]

It is always sold as seen, buyer has no recourse, as previously stated you have no idea how the car was used/abused. Tell the mother to do one.

[NiceCupOfTea]

Tuscanless Ali said:

H_Kan said:

Tuscanless Ali said:

GreigM said:

By making up laws which don't exist they are trying to bully you into something which is not your responsibility and have shown themselves to be somewhat dishonest.

I think the laws do exist, went through the same when we bought a car from a private individual, engine blew up when we got it home, phoned trading standards and was told I could reject the vehicle and give back to the seller for a full refund, or the seller could repair it.

We agreed between us after having the engine evaluated that the seller would pay for what it would cost to repair the engine, which was about 1500 quid, we then paid the extra for a full engine rebuild.

That's absolute rubbish, if this did happen then it was because the seller was uninformed about the law.

Do you think the our seller didn't phone trading standards himself It was a few years ago so maybe the law has changed.

More than likely Trading Standards got confused and thought the seller was a trader. You have no recourse whatsoever with the seller as long as the car is yours to sell and is as described. You were very lucky with that and the seller got utterly shafted as there was no reason for him to pay a penny towards the repair.

People want the cheapness of private / auction sales, but the protection and warranty of a main dealer You can't have it both ways!

Sleep easy in your bed. Tell the buyer it's unfortunate that it's happened but not your problem, and they should take it up with the people who fitted the new engine/clutch.

7 days to find fault return for a full refund what planet are they on? Do they think you're a branch of Currys!? Lad could have been driving around riding the clutch on the rev limiter since he bought it... Remember that Britain's Worst Driver when the woman doing a parallel park on a hill killed the clutch in 2 separate cars!? 6k RPM plus slipping clutch is not a good recipe for clutch longevity.

Finally, to make you forget all about it, have a read of the 18 page thread in Speed, Plod & the Law where TonyHetherington has had a very similar problem. Upshot is that if the car is yours to sell and as described and you are not a trader the buyer has NO comeback.

Thread here:

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/xforums/topic.asp?h=0...

Edited by NiceCupOfTea on Saturday 5th September 13:24