Can a school confiscate a mobile phone for more than a day?

[jazzyjeff]

R0G said:

For the school to assume parental responsibility after school has ended is wrong - end of

Spot on.

Time the parents stepped up to their responsibilities...

[Deva Link]

I'm surprised no-one has so far suggested the usual PH response to everything - a strongly worded email to the school.

[carmonk]

doogz said:

carmonk said:

I understand what the thread is about. If schools didn't allow phones then this issue would never have arisen, which is why I commented. Something I'd be happy to discuss with anyone who doesn't have a history of single-sentence trolling.

My history of single sentence trolling? Stop making stuff up.

If you actually want to discuss it, go ahead and explain why an adult can possess a phone at work, and a child can't possess one in school.

I'm listening.

Because an adult will use a phone for work. They may also use a phone to organise things that need organising, rather than bantering with a mate. If they do use it for talking to a mate that's fine, because as adults we're expected to be responsible and not let it interfere with our work. If it does, we run the risk of losing our jobs. Responsibilty: That's why we are allowed to drive cars and kids aren't. It's clear that the kids in question at this school are not responsible because the OP has told us phones are not allowed, yet everyone has them and the OP uses his in lessons. There was not a single moment when I was at school when I thought, "Hmm, I really need to make an urgent phonecall yet dang, I just don't have a phone available!" Kids don't need phones in school.

And therein lies the difference.

[R0G]

carmonk said:

Kids don't need phones in school.

I agree but as it is a good idea for them to have then when out of school then the school should have a system of storing them for the school period

[timbob]

One of the big problems with discipline in many schools is (I found from experience) is that schools can't follow through with any punishments because of all the red tape, and the fact that the kids know their rights. You can't just put a kid into after school detention anymore - you have to go through the rigmarole of 2 or 3 smaller detentions (which are usually truanted) before you can send a letter home to get parental permission to give an after school detention. If the letter is mysteriously "lost" by the child before it reaches the parents, the slip doesn't come back and the potential detainee usually gets off. As a fortnight has now passed since the original offence - the punishment, if it even occurs will have no impact.

It should be easy - keep the child behind, phone the parents to inform them that they will have to make arrangements to collect their offspring. Hopefully the extra hassle caused to the parents will mean a little extra punishment at home.

As for mobile phones in lessons (one of my biggest bugbears when I was teaching) - I'd confiscate them straight away. I'm not stealing the phone, it was disrupting the learning going on in my lesson, and needed to be dealt with. If it causes inconvenience to the student because they spend the day not being able to text their friends, then so much the better.

As far as I know, the schools I've worked in would usually return confiscated property at the end of the day, but if the student was a repeat offender, constantly disrupting other students' learning and always getting their phone confiscated, perhaps holding it for a week would actually cause them enough annoyance to stop playing with their phone in class!

Edited by timbob on Wednesday 16th November 18:20

[Silent1]

carmonk said:

Silent1 said:

I reckon it's theft, I'd be pretty pissed off if it was my child that had it taken off them.

As for the people decrying children having phones, why do you have a car? People did perfectly fine without them, houses seem mightily excessive when we can have a cave for free.

Are you suggesting we give children cars? After all, why not? If they need everything an adult needs then we should give them cars. We should also allow them to have a couple of pints at lunchtime, seeing as us adults often do.

No as that would be dangerous, whereas a phone carries no danger and could be used in a situation whereby they need help.

jazzyjeff said:

Not 'for free', just 'free'...

You're not one of those parents that thinks the sun shines out of their behind irrespective of their behaviour, are you? Surely your first thought if your child's phone has been taken is to consider [b] why [/b} that might have happened in the first place..?

First of all, I'm 24 and sans children it was merely hypothetical.
As for confiscating the phone, fine whilst they're in school, once they leave they should get it back, I couldn't care if they all have to be handed in first thing and handed back at the end of the day, I just don't agree that a school feels it has the right to retiring property that they don't own outside of the time they are the guardian of the owner/keeper.

As for trying to deride me by suggesting that I would need to consider my child's behaviour as well as just generally being facetious, why don't you try and engage in debate without having to resort to petty behaviour.

[kamilb1998]

timbob said:

but if the student was a repeat offender, constantly disrupting other students' learning and always getting their phone confiscated, perhaps holding it for a week would actually cause them enough annoyance to stop playing with their phone in class!

It is the first time my phone has been confiscated and I've been at the school for over 2 years - currently in Year 9.

[R0G]

timbob said:

As far as I know, the schools I've worked in would usually return confiscated property at the end of the day, but if the student was a repeat offender, constantly disrupting other students' learning and always getting their phone confiscated, perhaps holding it for a week would actually cause them enough annoyance to stop playing with their phone in class!

Did you have permission from the parent to with hold the family property out of school hours?

[ExChrispy Porker]

I really don't know how I managed 14 years schooling without having a mobile phone. Perhaps I was just lucky.

[voyds9]

So you want to be able to flout the rules but expect the teacher to respect the rules.

I think a better idea would be to sit you in the office until a parent comes to take the phone off you, and if I were your teacher I would check you for it every day.

[carmonk]

doogz said:

Unless they need to contact their parents at some point, either before, during, or after school hours. Which is the justification for most kids having phones, is it not?

But why would they? You say that adults managed fine before mobile phones so that's no argument, but what I'm saying is I can't remember a time when I needed to contact my parents or anybody else from school. And if I did, and there was any sort of urgency, I could have asked to use a phone in the office.

doogz said:

The fact that the school says they're not allowed, and people do it anyway doesn't really show they're irresponsible, any more than you or i speeding on the way to work is irresponsible.

No, because kids should not be treated as small adults. They need to learn responsibility and adherence to rules in order to mature into a well adjusted adult. When they become an adult they can then choose with more leeway which rules to observe and which not to, but before that time they shouldn't be given the choice.

doogz said:

There wouldn't have been a single moment when you were at school and thought "damn, i need a mobile phone" any more or less than the exact same sentence repeated, about your parents at the time. Adults managed just fine before mobile phones were invented, so the justification for Adults having them now, and kids not, is a fairly poor one.

As I said, it's not me saying "I need a mobile phone" but me saying "I really need to contact someone but can't." It just never happened and if it did - phone in office, teacher, another adult, phone box..?

[pip t]

timbob said:

One of the big problems with discipline in many schools is (I found from experience) is that schools can't follow through with any punishments because of all the red tape, and the fact that the kids know their rights. You can't just put a kid into after school detention anymore - you have to go through the rigmarole of 2 or 3 smaller detentions (which are usually truanted) before you can send a letter home to get parental permission to give an after school detention. If the letter is mysteriously "lost" by the child before it reaches the parents, the slip doesn't come back and the potential detainee usually gets off, as a fortnight has now passed since the original offence - the punishment, if it even occurs will have no impact.

It should be easy - keep the child behind, phone the parents to inform them that they will have to make arrangements to collect their offspring. Hopefully the extra hassle caused to the parents will mean a little extra punishment at home.

This (The current situation you describe) is exactly how it should be. If I as a parent have commitments for myself or my child after school, the school should not disrupt this. Absolutely give detentions, punishment is necessary, but it should be at a mutually convenient time, not at the schools whim. In this day and age a quick email to the parent to check/inform them of a potential detention bypasses all possibility of a child 'losing' a permission slip.

timbob said:

As for mobile phones in lessons (one of my biggest bugbears when I was teaching) - I'd confiscate them straight away. I'm not stealing the phone, it was disrupting the learning going on in my lesson, and needed to be dealt with. If it causes inconvenience to the student because they spend the day not being able to text their friends, then so much the better.

No problem with confiscation of phones when the child is on school premises, no problem at all - you are absolutely right, phones should not disrupt lessons and if they do they should be removed from the owners!

timbob said:

As far as I know, the schools I've worked in would usually return confiscated property at the end of the day, but if the student was a repeat offender, constantly disrupting other students' learning and always getting their phone confiscated, perhaps holding it for a week would actually cause them enough annoyance to stop playing with their phone in class!

This is where I have an issue. Confiscation of property beyond the end of the school day is a big no no for me, unless the item is dangerous or illegal - but that is a whole different ball game.

Edited by pip t on Wednesday 16th November 18:29

[carmonk]

Silent1 said:

carmonk said:

Silent1 said:

I reckon it's theft, I'd be pretty pissed off if it was my child that had it taken off them.

As for the people decrying children having phones, why do you have a car? People did perfectly fine without them, houses seem mightily excessive when we can have a cave for free.

Are you suggesting we give children cars? After all, why not? If they need everything an adult needs then we should give them cars. We should also allow them to have a couple of pints at lunchtime, seeing as us adults often do.

No as that would be dangerous, whereas a phone carries no danger and could be used in a situation whereby they need help.

Have you any idea how many fights and muggings and bullyings occur because of mobile phones? Neither do I, but I bet it's a lot. The idea that kids are safer than 20 years ago because they all carry mobile phones sounds a bit mad to me.

[ExChrispy Porker]

Tens of thousands of crimes involving school age kids and mobile phones occur every year.
Most reported robberies involve under 17s and mobile phones.
To suggest that taking a mobile to school means kids are safer is ridiculous.

[Y282]

Right, youre in my back yard with this one...

No, they cant legally keep it, unless they inform your parents they will be sending it to them directly and even then its to be frowned upon. Theyre for your safety, OUTSIDE of lesson times.



Now ive got that out of the way, TURN YOUR BLOODY PHONE OFF IN LESSONS FOR CHRISTS SAKE.

We've just expelled a student for this as a warning to the others. It's unbelievably rude and is not to be done in lessons.


All about rights and not responsibilities, isnt it?

[herewego]

Y282 said:

Right, youre in my back yard with this one...

No, they cant legally keep it, unless they inform your parents they will be sending it to them directly and even then its to be frowned upon. Theyre for your safety, OUTSIDE of lesson times.



Now ive got that out of the way, TURN YOUR BLOODY PHONE OFF IN LESSONS FOR CHRISTS SAKE.

We've just expelled a student for this as a warning to the others. It's unbelievably rude and is not to be done in lessons.


All about rights and not responsibilities, isnt it?

Expelling a student is OK but keeping her phone overnight isn't. Maybe if you'd kept the phone overnight she'd have learned her lesson and passed the course.

[Y282]

herewego said:

Y282 said:

Right, youre in my back yard with this one...

No, they cant legally keep it, unless they inform your parents they will be sending it to them directly and even then its to be frowned upon. Theyre for your safety, OUTSIDE of lesson times.



Now ive got that out of the way, TURN YOUR BLOODY PHONE OFF IN LESSONS FOR CHRISTS SAKE.

We've just expelled a student for this as a warning to the others. It's unbelievably rude and is not to be done in lessons.


All about rights and not responsibilities, isnt it?

Expelling a student is OK but keeping her phone overnight isn't. Maybe if you'd kept the phone overnight she'd have learned her lesson and passed the course.

It was the final straw for a very weak student that has been given far more help and opportunity than was required and took kindness for weakness. There comes a point when the corrosive effect of one student far outweighs the statistic of keeping them on.

[Silent1]

ExChrispy Porker said:

Tens of thousands of crimes involving school age kids and mobile phones occur every year.
Most reported robberies involve under 17s and mobile phones.
To suggest that taking a mobile to school means kids are safer is ridiculous.

So because there's a risk of being mugged (of less than 1% I bet) then no child should take a phone to school?
That is ridiculous

[Engineer1]

R0G said:

On the way home you find that you need the phone to make an emergency call

Your parents state that you have a phone for this puprose as well as other uses

The school has kept your phone

To my mind the school has now put you in danger

Or the OP's failure to abide by the rules and almost certainly blatant phone use has meant it has been confiscated, if the OP has obeyed the rules and kept the phone in his bag/ pocket then the OP would still have the phone.

OP if other kids are messing with their phones then being the one who is seen will result in your phone being confiscated. Bad luck, obey the rules and ask the teacher tomorrow if you can have your phone back.

[kamilb1998]

Engineer1 said:

Or the OP's failure to abide by the rules and almost certainly blatant phone use has meant it has been confiscated, if the OP has obeyed the rules and kept the phone in his bag/ pocket then the OP would still have the phone.

OP if other kids are messing with their phones then being the one who is seen will result in your phone being confiscated. Bad luck, obey the rules and ask the teacher tomorrow if you can have your phone back.

I understand why I got it confiscated. I was just curious as to whether or not a school can legally decide not to return your phone to you at the end of the school day.