Employment Law on Company Relocation
Discussion
Hi.
Looking for so.e advice.
My employer is relocating from London to Nr Birmingham.
Staff are going through consultation.
HR have said that anyone not moving or commuting may not be eligible for redundancy as they will be deemed to have resigned.
Also that requests for flexible working would be viewed more favourably if the requester has children.
What are people's thoughts?
No-one has a mobility clause in their contract.
Looking for so.e advice.
My employer is relocating from London to Nr Birmingham.
Staff are going through consultation.
HR have said that anyone not moving or commuting may not be eligible for redundancy as they will be deemed to have resigned.
Also that requests for flexible working would be viewed more favourably if the requester has children.
What are people's thoughts?
No-one has a mobility clause in their contract.
Jazzy Jag said:
Hi.
Looking for so.e advice.
My employer is relocating from London to Nr Birmingham.
Staff are going through consultation.
HR have said that anyone not moving or commuting may not be eligible for redundancy as they will be deemed to have resigned.
Also that requests for flexible working would be viewed more favourably if the requester has children.
What are people's thoughts?
No-one has a mobility clause in their contract.
IANAL but was a TUPE rep onceLooking for so.e advice.
My employer is relocating from London to Nr Birmingham.
Staff are going through consultation.
HR have said that anyone not moving or commuting may not be eligible for redundancy as they will be deemed to have resigned.
Also that requests for flexible working would be viewed more favourably if the requester has children.
What are people's thoughts?
No-one has a mobility clause in their contract.
The advice I was given is "reasonable" varies but my simplistic viewpoint;
Emp A lives in London with a 15-20 minute commute - move will incur them 4 hours a day travel plus costs which itself is unreasonable and would likely be made redundant if a reasonable agreement cannot be reached (flexible/remote working, reimbursement of costs for a time period etc)
Emp B Lives in Redditch and current commutes to london and back every day - moving the office to birmingham actually reduces the time and cost of their commute so refusing would be unreasonable and deemed resignation
Kids that need to be dropped off or collected is absolutely something that has to be looked at by the employer.
Is there relocation assistance for such as removal costs etc? If so what are detailed rules?
For example one of my moves one limit on assistance was that the new home had to be within a certain distance of the new work location. Think it was 15 miles as the crow flies. As this was right on the western side of Birmingham close to open country that opened up lots of nice places to the south and west in such as Worcestershire and even into Shropshire, though the actual area surrounding the office etc was a bit grim in the other directions eg north and east at least in our price range.
Old story of devil is in the detail. Lots of variation in locations all loosely described as Birmingham.
For example one of my moves one limit on assistance was that the new home had to be within a certain distance of the new work location. Think it was 15 miles as the crow flies. As this was right on the western side of Birmingham close to open country that opened up lots of nice places to the south and west in such as Worcestershire and even into Shropshire, though the actual area surrounding the office etc was a bit grim in the other directions eg north and east at least in our price range.
Old story of devil is in the detail. Lots of variation in locations all loosely described as Birmingham.
On the one hand I'd guess the employer is sailing close to the wind with constructive dismissal.
OTOH, some employees will be looking to cash in and then take a job equally far from home.
These things quickly get messy and expensive with lawyers.
The word 'may' in 'may not be eligible' is perhaps key.
The other thing is, statutory minimum redundancy money isn't always very much.
OTOH, some employees will be looking to cash in and then take a job equally far from home.
These things quickly get messy and expensive with lawyers.
The word 'may' in 'may not be eligible' is perhaps key.
The other thing is, statutory minimum redundancy money isn't always very much.
When we went through a restructure quite a few local offices were closed and regional offices opened. What we were told was
If there was a suitable office within 20 miles that was considered a reasonable amount to travel. If you didn't want to move then you were resigning. If it was over 20 miles and we weren't willing to move then it would be considered redundancy for "Some other substantive reason".
To be honest I assumed that this was a legal thing and applied to all such relocations.
Just to add from memory i think our Contracts said that we could be redeployed to "any local office" if it was required for operational reasons. In hindsight I guess 20 miles was considered local.
If there was a suitable office within 20 miles that was considered a reasonable amount to travel. If you didn't want to move then you were resigning. If it was over 20 miles and we weren't willing to move then it would be considered redundancy for "Some other substantive reason".
To be honest I assumed that this was a legal thing and applied to all such relocations.
Just to add from memory i think our Contracts said that we could be redeployed to "any local office" if it was required for operational reasons. In hindsight I guess 20 miles was considered local.
AI says:-
Relocation & Redundancy Rights
No mobility clause in your contract is crucial. That means your employer cannot require you to move, and if your current place of work is closing, this could be a genuine redundancy situation.
You may be entitled to redundancy pay if:
Your role is no longer available in your current location.
You re not offered a suitable alternative (and a move to Birmingham may not be suitable if it s too far to commute).
You should not be deemed to have resigned :
If your employer says that not agreeing to relocate = resignation, that is legally very questionable and could potentially amount to constructive dismissal if handled poorly.
Case law supports the view that if your contract doesn t require you to move and your current job is ending, it s a redundancy not a resignation.
2. Flexible Working and Discrimination Risk
Your HR team stating that flexible working requests are more favourable if you have children is problematic.
Under the Equality Act 2010:
All employees have the right to request flexible working (as long as they ve worked there 26 weeks or more).
Prioritising parents could amount to indirect discrimination against those without children especially carers, older workers, or those with disabilities.
3. Best Practice for You
Here s what you might consider doing:
Request all communications in writing especially around redundancy eligibility.
Clarify their position on relocation formally. Ask: If I do not wish to relocate or commute, and there s no mobility clause, will I receive redundancy?
Consult ACAS or an employment solicitor they can help you challenge unfair redundancy decisions.
If you re in a union, engage them early.
Relocation & Redundancy Rights
No mobility clause in your contract is crucial. That means your employer cannot require you to move, and if your current place of work is closing, this could be a genuine redundancy situation.
You may be entitled to redundancy pay if:
Your role is no longer available in your current location.
You re not offered a suitable alternative (and a move to Birmingham may not be suitable if it s too far to commute).
You should not be deemed to have resigned :
If your employer says that not agreeing to relocate = resignation, that is legally very questionable and could potentially amount to constructive dismissal if handled poorly.
Case law supports the view that if your contract doesn t require you to move and your current job is ending, it s a redundancy not a resignation.
2. Flexible Working and Discrimination Risk
Your HR team stating that flexible working requests are more favourable if you have children is problematic.
Under the Equality Act 2010:
All employees have the right to request flexible working (as long as they ve worked there 26 weeks or more).
Prioritising parents could amount to indirect discrimination against those without children especially carers, older workers, or those with disabilities.
3. Best Practice for You
Here s what you might consider doing:
Request all communications in writing especially around redundancy eligibility.
Clarify their position on relocation formally. Ask: If I do not wish to relocate or commute, and there s no mobility clause, will I receive redundancy?
Consult ACAS or an employment solicitor they can help you challenge unfair redundancy decisions.
If you re in a union, engage them early.
Jazzy Jag said:
My employer is relocating from London to Nr Birmingham.
andburg said:
mp B Lives in Redditch and current commutes to london and back every day - moving the office to birmingham actually reduces the time and cost of their commute so refusing would be unreasonable and deemed resignation
OP - can you clarify where you currently live? Your profile says you are in the Midlands so the relocation could be reducing your commute which may explain why your employer isn't considering it as a redundancy.ralphrj said:
OP - can you clarify where you currently live? Your profile says you are in the Midlands so the relocation could be reducing your commute which may explain why your employer isn't considering it as a redundancy.
HiMost staff currently live in central/ NE London and Essex and don't own cars or in some cases drive.
My Location is actually out of date :getmycoat:
No idea why they are saying redundancy is not offered.
hidetheelephants said:
Jazzy Jag said:
No idea why they are saying redundancy is not offered.
Maybe your HR are hoping no one knows their rights or worse still HR have no clue about their legal obligations, given the distance of the move it's hard to see how it's not redundancy for most people.Jazzy Jag said:
HR have said that anyone not moving or commuting may not be eligible for redundancy as they will be deemed to have resigned.
AFAIK the situation described is pretty much akin to the employee just deciding that the job is "not for them" any more, which is pretty much resignation.Jazzy Jag said:
Also that requests for flexible working would be viewed more favourably if the requester has children.
Pretty standard I would have thought.Jazzy Jag said:
Hi
Most staff currently live in central/ NE London and Essex and don't own cars or in some cases drive.
My Location is actually out of date :getmycoat:
No idea why they are saying redundancy is not offered.
sounds like they're making a statement of reality, not moving with the role MAY mean not meeting redundancy criteria. They have not (unless you've failed to mention) said redundancies will not be made or offerred. Most staff currently live in central/ NE London and Essex and don't own cars or in some cases drive.
My Location is actually out of date :getmycoat:
No idea why they are saying redundancy is not offered.
If i were you OP I'd be inclined to say i don't think it works for me long term and to start looking. What they then offer you in terms of an acceptable package to them might be beneficial to you and if you flat out refuse you limit your options. Either way get out there now and get looking for another job as even if you are offered redundancy it's better to take it and carry on working than spend 6 months not working and find work has dried up.
I have both first and second hand experience of companies relocating;
First hand was when my company moved from Lancaster to Warrington, which is about 50 miles. It was only a small company (about 10 people). It was 25 years ago now, but as I recall, they paid certain relocation expenses. I didn't have anywhere to sell, as I was actually living at my future in-laws house so it worked out well for us as we bought our first house at that time in the new location.
They paid (from memory): Travelling expenses for looking for a house. Removal costs (in my case, van hire and petrol). Stamp Duty and the mortgage arrangement fee.
3 people in the company decided not to move, so they just left. I'm sure they did not get any redundancy payments.
Second hand experience is that I've worked for a company (joined, left, returned etc, both staff and contract) and they moved from Preston to Manchester (not whilst I was there however). They didn't pay any relocation costs, but they did cover your increased travel costs for 12 months. They also allowed more working from home (this was around 15 years ago now). I don't know anyone that did relocate, they either stayed put and continued working for the company, or within those 12 months, they left. I suppose they used that 12 months to find another job. Again, no one get any redundancy payments.
First hand was when my company moved from Lancaster to Warrington, which is about 50 miles. It was only a small company (about 10 people). It was 25 years ago now, but as I recall, they paid certain relocation expenses. I didn't have anywhere to sell, as I was actually living at my future in-laws house so it worked out well for us as we bought our first house at that time in the new location.
They paid (from memory): Travelling expenses for looking for a house. Removal costs (in my case, van hire and petrol). Stamp Duty and the mortgage arrangement fee.
3 people in the company decided not to move, so they just left. I'm sure they did not get any redundancy payments.
Second hand experience is that I've worked for a company (joined, left, returned etc, both staff and contract) and they moved from Preston to Manchester (not whilst I was there however). They didn't pay any relocation costs, but they did cover your increased travel costs for 12 months. They also allowed more working from home (this was around 15 years ago now). I don't know anyone that did relocate, they either stayed put and continued working for the company, or within those 12 months, they left. I suppose they used that 12 months to find another job. Again, no one get any redundancy payments.
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