Rear Ended - Liability now being contested!
Discussion
Bit of advice with the following scenario if you please;
Two lanes of traffic flowing in the same direction towards a set of traffic lights. On approach I changed lanes to put myself at the front for an easy 'off' from the lights. The guy who is now behind me obviously didn't like this (despite my leaving masses of room and not cutting in aggressively) and proceeds to flash lights, give it the coffee beans and generally rant away at the wheel.
This continues as the lights go green so I pull away gently whilst Mr Shouty continues flashing and hanging two inches off my rear bumper. I continue to accelerate but we're still only going 10 mph tops at this stage. Now given this is a gyratory with traffic all flowing in the same direction I now have a pavement on my right and a lane of traffic on my left also moving away from the lights, so whilst I might normally just move over and let the prat go about his business I don't have that option here.
This is where it gets weird. Mr Shouty moves as if to go round me on the drivers side between me and the pavement. I instinctively brake as had he completed the move things would have got rather cramped to say the least. Mr Shouty hits me in the rear at no more than 5-10 Mph leaving very minor scuffs on both cars.
So, he gets out all apologetic and explains he's had a bad day at work blah blah blah... we swap details etc. Now as I'm about to return to my vehicle a cyclist comes over and says "I saw what happened there..." so I'm thinking great a witness to the aggressive driving but he turns to the bloke who's just driven in to me and says "I'm happy to back up the fact that he stopped for no reason" - my jaw was on the floor at this point and I could easily of lost my temper so chose to take a deep breath and leave it to the insurers. Shouty Man is grinning and can't believe his luck.
Now my insurers have written to me saying liability is being contested and asking me to do a written description of events and diagram. I've not been involved in anything but a simple non fault in the past so am unsure how to respond. Do I lay out all the above in detail or do I keep it really simple and just state "I felt intimidated and stopped to allow him to pass". Am I going to be totally screwed due to the witness wrongly calling the situation?
For the benefit of the inevitible question: no I didn't brake test him & no I am not claiming for imaginary whiplash, he had ample time to stop but was pumped up and not paying attention. I have a photo of his passenger side front in contact with my drivers side rear which supports the fact that he was about to drive around the wrong side of me.
How best to proceed?
Thanks in advance.
Two lanes of traffic flowing in the same direction towards a set of traffic lights. On approach I changed lanes to put myself at the front for an easy 'off' from the lights. The guy who is now behind me obviously didn't like this (despite my leaving masses of room and not cutting in aggressively) and proceeds to flash lights, give it the coffee beans and generally rant away at the wheel.
This continues as the lights go green so I pull away gently whilst Mr Shouty continues flashing and hanging two inches off my rear bumper. I continue to accelerate but we're still only going 10 mph tops at this stage. Now given this is a gyratory with traffic all flowing in the same direction I now have a pavement on my right and a lane of traffic on my left also moving away from the lights, so whilst I might normally just move over and let the prat go about his business I don't have that option here.
This is where it gets weird. Mr Shouty moves as if to go round me on the drivers side between me and the pavement. I instinctively brake as had he completed the move things would have got rather cramped to say the least. Mr Shouty hits me in the rear at no more than 5-10 Mph leaving very minor scuffs on both cars.
So, he gets out all apologetic and explains he's had a bad day at work blah blah blah... we swap details etc. Now as I'm about to return to my vehicle a cyclist comes over and says "I saw what happened there..." so I'm thinking great a witness to the aggressive driving but he turns to the bloke who's just driven in to me and says "I'm happy to back up the fact that he stopped for no reason" - my jaw was on the floor at this point and I could easily of lost my temper so chose to take a deep breath and leave it to the insurers. Shouty Man is grinning and can't believe his luck.
Now my insurers have written to me saying liability is being contested and asking me to do a written description of events and diagram. I've not been involved in anything but a simple non fault in the past so am unsure how to respond. Do I lay out all the above in detail or do I keep it really simple and just state "I felt intimidated and stopped to allow him to pass". Am I going to be totally screwed due to the witness wrongly calling the situation?
For the benefit of the inevitible question: no I didn't brake test him & no I am not claiming for imaginary whiplash, he had ample time to stop but was pumped up and not paying attention. I have a photo of his passenger side front in contact with my drivers side rear which supports the fact that he was about to drive around the wrong side of me.
How best to proceed?
Thanks in advance.
Edited by DoubleSix on Thursday 5th December 08:59
speedking31 said:
Is there a solid line to your right which he has crossed? Might help your case.
He should still be able to stop even if you did brake test him (not implying you did). What if a pedestrian had run across the road and you had to brake heavily. I wouldn't give any more detail than absolutely necessary. "Moved off from lights up to 10mph, unsure which way to go so accelerating slower than usual, car behind ran into me."
There's no solid line, just parking bays and then pavement. In theory he could of raced up through the parking bays but that would have been nuts in rush hour traffic. Thanks for the advice.He should still be able to stop even if you did brake test him (not implying you did). What if a pedestrian had run across the road and you had to brake heavily. I wouldn't give any more detail than absolutely necessary. "Moved off from lights up to 10mph, unsure which way to go so accelerating slower than usual, car behind ran into me."
Steve Benson said:
Why would you instinctively brake when someone was trying to overtake you?
I can't imagine a scenario where you would other than letting someone in who had mistimed an overtake and was heading for a head on collision.
It's difficult to explain but in two lanes of traffic he would of left me no where to go if he had got along side me. It's could have got very uncomfortable. I can't imagine a scenario where you would other than letting someone in who had mistimed an overtake and was heading for a head on collision.
oldnewbie said:
I imagine what you really did was to take your foot of the accelerator, that is when the collision occurred, naturally you then stopped "after" the impact. This would make the cyclists statement less relevant.
Even so as others have said following driver should have been able to stop regardless.
Indeed. But how important is the witness in this, I mean, can he just say what he thinks he saw and will that carry weight?Even so as others have said following driver should have been able to stop regardless.
t1grm said:
I wouldn't mention all the business about changing lane, flashing of lights, tail gating in the lead up to the incident. Just focus on the actual incident itself. You were driving along, saw someone try an dangerous overtaking move, decided there wasn't space for both cars so you stopped to give him space and avoid an accident. He then hit you from behind. Those are the only salient facts.
Cheers, this is the approach I will most likely take.thetrash said:
It sounds to me like it's your fault(maybe not legally) for brake testing him. I don't believe you instinctively braked because it looked like he was was going to overtake In such a tight spot as part of his car was still behind yours.
On another forum somewhere is another driver moaning about some idiot who cut him up coming to a set of traffic lights, so he flashes them, who then precedes to pull away slowly, brake tests him and a collision happens.
Cheers.. On another forum somewhere is another driver moaning about some idiot who cut him up coming to a set of traffic lights, so he flashes them, who then precedes to pull away slowly, brake tests him and a collision happens.
Monkeylegend said:
In this instance it sounds like it was a duel carriageway.
.
I don't think so because a duel carriage way has a barrier with another carriage way on the other side doesn't it? This is just two lanes of traffic moving in the same direction with buildings on either side..
Monkeylegend said:
DoubleSix said:
Monkeylegend said:
In this instance it sounds like it was a duel carriageway.
.
I don't think so because a duel carriage way has a barrier with another carriage way on the other side doesn't it? This is just two lanes of traffic moving in the same direction with buildings on either side..
oh I see... sorry 'Dual'I certainly pulled away slower than i usually might, I had less attention on the road ahead than i would of liked as I was monitoring the chap behind. I had feeling he was going to do something stupid.
But no slower than someone might if they were looking for a gap to change lanes or something... my car would have stopped quicker than usual as this is a reasonable upwards incline.
I could do with more advice on what to incude and not incude and also the type of road so I can describe it correctly, anybody?
But no slower than someone might if they were looking for a gap to change lanes or something... my car would have stopped quicker than usual as this is a reasonable upwards incline.
I could do with more advice on what to incude and not incude and also the type of road so I can describe it correctly, anybody?
I thought this 'Speed, Plod & the Law' not 'Opinions, Conjecture & Accusation'.
I just wanted some straight forward advice on how best to approach my written description. Whether you believe my version of events is really by the by and unlikely to proven here.
Anyway, cheers to those that offered some useful snippets.
I just wanted some straight forward advice on how best to approach my written description. Whether you believe my version of events is really by the by and unlikely to proven here.
Anyway, cheers to those that offered some useful snippets.
http://goo.gl/maps/Jfiv7
Does that work? I was positioned roughly where the Silver BMW is, the guy tried to pass me on the right, where there is no lane to do so.
Does that work? I was positioned roughly where the Silver BMW is, the guy tried to pass me on the right, where there is no lane to do so.
Yes, that's what I was thinking but didn't want to over complicate the situation. If going into that sort of detail is what I should be doing then I appreciate the advice and will do so...
I'm just concerned that a complete prat of a cyclist (a few of those in Bristol) is acting as a myopic independent witness and what effect this has on the whole thing.
I'm just concerned that a complete prat of a cyclist (a few of those in Bristol) is acting as a myopic independent witness and what effect this has on the whole thing.
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