Forza Horizon 4 !

[Kewy]

Mastodon2 said:

I'm stuck with a mountain of cars I just don't give a fk about. My garage value can't be easily converted into credits to spend on something that I'd actually be interested in driving and I can only assume that this is a deliberate design choice by the developers to stretch out the length of this rather empty game.

Are you joking?! I've never had a game chuck so much st at me left right and centre. Wouldn't call it empty. Not sure how many hours you've invested but I guess all games have to come to an end. Maybe it's time to open the curtains and open the pile of mail on your welcome mat

[TommoAE86]

Kewy said:

Mastodon2 said:

I'm stuck with a mountain of cars I just don't give a fk about. My garage value can't be easily converted into credits to spend on something that I'd actually be interested in driving and I can only assume that this is a deliberate design choice by the developers to stretch out the length of this rather empty game.

Are you joking?! I've never had a game chuck so much st at me left right and centre. Wouldn't call it empty. Not sure how many hours you've invested but I guess all games have to come to an end. Maybe it's time to open the curtains and open the pile of mail on your welcome mat

The game only does that while you'd doing the races though, Mastodon is describing exactly the same problem as the last game though, my FH3 garage is full of useless tat I have no interest in driving because unless it's either super-rare or an FH edition you've got no chance of selling it. He mentioned a 10mil value car, even if he could sell it for a quarter of it's value you could then buy something he wanted to drive.

There needs to be a well thought out balance between time and ease of grinding out for your next car, Test Drive Unlimited 2 is the worst I remember for lack of money making opportunities once you'd finished the main races, and the original Gran Turismo's were easy because you just redid the cup with the highest value prize car over and over. FH3 and 4 struggle with this as you have to luck into your wheelspins after doing big races, such as that tour one on FH3, you could end up with a bunch of worthless cars/clothes/accessories instead of money if you are unlucky with your spins.

[RB Will]

ajprice said:

Winter time. Blasted through 3 of the 4 weekly forzathon parts, didn't get the 10 trading paints done because there weren't any cars around to hit . Spent some forzathon points on the 911 and Skyline LM

Same lol. I tried doing a 4th SUV race for trading paint but I guess you can only do it with the AI real world traffic rather than racers. and I didn't come across any so gave up.

Annoyingly the other night I was going round doing all the speed traps and there was plenty of bloody traffic then

[tsp]

TommoAE86 said:

The game only does that while you'd doing the races though, Mastodon is describing exactly the same problem as the last game though, my FH3 garage is full of useless tat I have no interest in driving because unless it's either super-rare or an FH edition you've got no chance of selling it. He mentioned a 10mil value car, even if he could sell it for a quarter of it's value you could then buy something he wanted to drive.

There needs to be a well thought out balance between time and ease of grinding out for your next car, Test Drive Unlimited 2 is the worst I remember for lack of money making opportunities once you'd finished the main races, and the original Gran Turismo's were easy because you just redid the cup with the highest value prize car over and over. FH3 and 4 struggle with this as you have to luck into your wheelspins after doing big races, such as that tour one on FH3, you could end up with a bunch of worthless cars/clothes/accessories instead of money if you are unlucky with your spins.

I think its a lot to do with how you play these games. And where you get the enjoyment from.

If you are the sort of person who just redoes the race with the highest value prize over and over again to progress super quickly then yes the game will feel empty quick because of your accelerated progression.

On the other hand if you set the difficulty to unbeatable and have all the assist off it might take you all day just to win one race. Which might not be very rewarding in terms of in game credits. But is more rewarding in terms of satisfaction when you do win. And the rate of progression is much slower so the game last longer.

[TommoAE86]

That sounds like the game will last longer for you, but some people might not want to do that and therefore I think there should be a freedom to choose to do whatever you want regardless of where you are in the game. The game shouldn't stop for people who don't want to beat everything on max difficulty once you've completed everything first time around because the developers are too lazy to think about the endgame.
For me I'd like to own alot of cars and take pics/race them/tune them but to fund this my only serious money making method forces me into a FH car and 1 particular (& long) race then I'm going to get bored very quickly and stop playing.

The same could be said for GTA for example, could waste hours in GTA San Andreas with the wealth of fun/pointless things to do, but in GTA IV & V there is nothing to keep you coming back. (Online doesn't count thanks to the playerbases ability to stop you trying to achieve what you want to do).

[Drew106]

TommoAE86 said:

That sounds like the game will last longer for you, but some people might not want to do that and therefore I think there should be a freedom to choose to do whatever you want regardless of where you are in the game. The game shouldn't stop for people who don't want to beat everything on max difficulty once you've completed everything first time around because the developers are too lazy to think about the endgame.
For me I'd like to own alot of cars and take pics/race them/tune them but to fund this my only serious money making method forces me into a FH car and 1 particular (& long) race then I'm going to get bored very quickly and stop playing.

I thought the races paid out the same, regardless of how many times you run them?

I like creating long road or rally circuit races, 10+ laps, something like that. They pay out quite a bit.

I've got quite a bit to go before I can afford the castle! Think I'm on around 4m at the min. I'm not actively grinding though, just enjoying the game and building credits.

[Mastodon2]

Turning the difficulty right up isn't some cure for the lack of content in this game, not in the least because the AI in Horizon has always been comically unfair, it is rubber banding in the extreme. The game rewards smooth driving, not fast driving and if you drive quickly and smoothly the AI will eventually roll over and let you through. Drive fast but messy, banging into walls and things and the AI will mysteriously gain a huge amount of power to keep you behind them. This was most obviously demonstrated in Horizon 1 in the final race against the festival champ, he used to drive a Ferrari 599XX iirc, but he could outrun a Veyron Supersport on the highway section of that race. I've had it in Horizon 4 though, accelerating flat out in an Agera S on the really long straight across the moors in the colossus race, only to find the McLaren Senna leading the race was pulling away from me, then on the final straight before the finish line I was in first place and I pulled away from him like...well, like you'd expect an Agera to pull away from a Senna, I guess.

I do play with all of the assists off too, not that I look down on people who use them, it's all personal preference and everyone should be free to get their enjoyment from this game however they see fit.

However, my point still stands. You've got the four "Horizon stories", 10 chapters in each taking a maximum of 5 minutes a piece. Many of them can be completed with three stars on the first go without too much trouble. They offer very little reward after you've completed them so replaying them isn't really worthwhile. You've got a few different race series, but again after reaching maybe level 13 in each of those there is little left to get from them, arguably level 10 is where you should finish unless you want the series-specific t shirt for each (yawn). Then you can go and do the drift zones, danger signs, speed traps and speed zones - but you don't need to 3 star all of them to hit level 10 in each field and again the rewards drop off so there is little incentive to 3 star all of those tasks outside of sheer completionism.

I still think there are fun things in the game, such as car collecting all of the stuff I want, but other than gambling Forzathong points on super wheelspins there doesn't seem to be an easy way to generate cash. I wonder what that is? Oh right, it's a deliberate design choice to keep players coming on to keep the servers busy and the game alive. I understand that if you give everything away too quickly you'll kill the game, but the devs have got the balance wrong here. I've been given way too many free cars I don't give a st about and not enough money to get the cars I actually want. If I could turn my free car rewards back into cash at even half of the full value of the car that would be a start.

To put into perspective how long it takes to save up cash in this game, lets look at the colossus race, which I think is the most efficient race for cash grinding. It takes about 7 minutes to complete depending on the class of car you use, it can be done faster if you use the very top tier of performance cars but I'd say 7 minutes is a reasonable average. For that level, with highly skilled drivatars and no assists you'll get about 70,000 credits for a first place finish. If you want to get the 10,000,000 credits for a Porsche Pink Pig, you'll need to complete that race 143 times, which will take about 16.5 hours. Ok you can probably get one from the auction house for half the price, but that still means 8 hours of racing, using the most efficient race. And that doesn't include loading times or sitting through the reward screens. To be fair, you will get a few wheelspins along the way which might offer you some money, but it's no guarantee and the loot boxes do seem to be designed to give you st like horns, clothes and 5000 credit rewards more often than not so I wouldn't factor these in as being a big saving on the voerall time it would take to grind that cash out.

The game is designed to push you towards buying the loot boxes. Call it a wheelspin if you must, but it's a loot box. The game wants to get you hooked into seeing the wheels spin around, hoping that your dream car will come out, but it probably won't, so you'll keep playing. This is the reason that the cash earnings in this game are so pitiful.

[TommoAE86]

Drew106 said:

I thought the races paid out the same, regardless of how many times you run them?

I like creating long road or rally circuit races, 10+ laps, something like that. They pay out quite a bit.

Yeah this is what I did on FH3, that round the map race, 10 laps / various perks / XP bonus FH car to max the number of wheelspins I get, but that's it if you want a meaningful hit of cash to buy lots of fun cars and tune them etc. But going back and doing a championship which pays out between 20 & 70k leads to an off-balance grind, which leads to this:

Mastodon2 said:

To put into perspective how long it takes to save up cash in this game, lets look at the colossus race, which I think is the most efficient race for cash grinding. It takes about 7 minutes to complete depending on the class of car you use, it can be done faster if you use the very top tier of performance cars but I'd say 7 minutes is a reasonable average. For that level, with highly skilled drivatars and no assists you'll get about 70,000 credits for a first place finish. If you want to get the 10,000,000 credits for a Porsche Pink Pig, you'll need to complete that race 143 times, which will take about 16.5 hours. Ok you can probably get one from the auction house for half the price, but that still means 8 hours of racing, using the most efficient race.

Bold and last paragraph are exactly the issue with alot of games, not just Forza, not just racing games but lots of games just don't have the endgame fun the old ones used to.

Mastodon2 said:

I still think there are fun things in the game, such as car collecting all of the stuff I want, but other than gambling Forzathong points on super wheelspins there doesn't seem to be an easy way to generate cash. I wonder what that is? Oh right, it's a deliberate design choice to keep players coming on to keep the servers busy and the game alive. I understand that if you give everything away too quickly you'll kill the game, but the devs have got the balance wrong here. I've been given way too many free cars I don't give a st about and not enough money to get the cars I actually want. If I could turn my free car rewards back into cash at even half of the full value of the car that would be a start.

The game is designed to push you towards buying the loot boxes. Call it a wheelspin if you must, but it's a loot box. The game wants to get you hooked into seeing the wheels spin around, hoping that your dream car will come out, but it probably won't, so you'll keep playing. This is the reason that the cash earnings in this game are so pitiful.

[tsp]

The smooth driving rubber banding is very noticable. I hadn't noticed a lot of the other issues you mentioned Mastodon2 but now you have I completely agree with them.

But still I am nowhere near bored or close to completing the game.

[xjay1337]

Mastodon2 said:

To put into perspective how long it takes to save up cash in this game, lets look at the colossus race, which I think is the most efficient race for cash grinding. It takes about 7 minutes to complete depending on the class of car you use, it can be done faster if you use the very top tier of performance cars but I'd say 7 minutes is a reasonable average. For that level, with highly skilled drivatars and no assists you'll get about 70,000 credits for a first place finish. If you want to get the 10,000,000 credits for a Porsche Pink Pig, you'll need to complete that race 143 times, which will take about 16.5 hours. Ok you can probably get one from the auction house for half the price, but that still means 8 hours of racing, using the most efficient race. And that doesn't include loading times or sitting through the reward screens. To be fair, you will get a few wheelspins along the way which might offer you some money, but it's no guarantee and the loot boxes do seem to be designed to give you st like horns, clothes and 5000 credit rewards more often than not so I wouldn't factor these in as being a big saving on the voerall time it would take to grind that cash out.

I think you are (perhaps purposefully?) ignoring the fact there are loads of other ways to earn money.
Buy the Ford Focus Hoonigan thing
Max out your skill points in the car for all the combo, x7 thing etc
Buy Porsche 964 Turbo...use skill points to unlock 200,000cr or something

Easy

I've put maybe 15-20 hours into the game and I have well over 6million without any sort of grinding at all.

Also not forgetting the drift pack cars (I think everyone gets them?) also give you free money and there are like 8 of them which is well over 1m.

[Mastodon2]

xjay1337 said:

I think you are (perhaps purposefully?) ignoring the fact there are loads of other ways to earn money.
Buy the Ford Focus Hoonigan thing
Max out your skill points in the car for all the combo, x7 thing etc
Buy Porsche 964 Turbo...use skill points to unlock 200,000cr or something

Easy

I've put maybe 15-20 hours into the game and I have well over 6million without any sort of grinding at all.

Also not forgetting the drift pack cars (I think everyone gets them?) also give you free money and there are like 8 of them which is well over 1m.

I'm not ignoring it, there is about 4,000,000 credits tied up in various cars in the game. Once you've raided that piggy bank there's nothing left in it. That's not a huge amount of money when you consider that by the time you own 250 cars, your total garage value will probably exceed 70,000,000 in value. And that value is all tied up and can't be converted back into useful currency easily.

[Pommy]

Mastodon2 said:

xjay1337 said:

I think you are (perhaps purposefully?) ignoring the fact there are loads of other ways to earn money.
Buy the Ford Focus Hoonigan thing
Max out your skill points in the car for all the combo, x7 thing etc
Buy Porsche 964 Turbo...use skill points to unlock 200,000cr or something

Easy

I've put maybe 15-20 hours into the game and I have well over 6million without any sort of grinding at all.

Also not forgetting the drift pack cars (I think everyone gets them?) also give you free money and there are like 8 of them which is well over 1m.

I'm not ignoring it, there is about 4,000,000 credits tied up in various cars in the game. Once you've raided that piggy bank there's nothing left in it. That's not a huge amount of money when you consider that by the time you own 250 cars, your total garage value will probably exceed 70,000,000 in value. And that value is all tied up and can't be converted back into useful currency easily.

Mine is 550 cars with a value of about 200million. You can only sell modern day HyperCars for anything like their market sale value - no one wants the old stuff.

[Mr E]

ajprice said:

Winter time. Blasted through 3 of the 4 weekly forzathon parts, didn't get the 10 trading paints done because there weren't any cars around to hit . Spent some forzathon points on the 911 and Skyline LM

I have a tune for a 1000bhp jag suv that is “amusing”. Stupid, stupid thing

[Cledus Snow]

Pommy said:

Mastodon2 said:

xjay1337 said:

I think you are (perhaps purposefully?) ignoring the fact there are loads of other ways to earn money.
Buy the Ford Focus Hoonigan thing
Max out your skill points in the car for all the combo, x7 thing etc
Buy Porsche 964 Turbo...use skill points to unlock 200,000cr or something

Easy

I've put maybe 15-20 hours into the game and I have well over 6million without any sort of grinding at all.

Also not forgetting the drift pack cars (I think everyone gets them?) also give you free money and there are like 8 of them which is well over 1m.

I'm not ignoring it, there is about 4,000,000 credits tied up in various cars in the game. Once you've raided that piggy bank there's nothing left in it. That's not a huge amount of money when you consider that by the time you own 250 cars, your total garage value will probably exceed 70,000,000 in value. And that value is all tied up and can't be converted back into useful currency easily.

Mine is 550 cars with a value of about 200million. You can only sell modern day HyperCars for anything like their market sale value - no one wants the old stuff.

I do. I’d much rather have old stuff. I keep being outbid on the auction house too so i’m Not the only one.

[Jader1973]

Cledus Snow said:

I do. I’d much rather have old stuff. I keep being outbid on the auction house too so i’m Not the only one.

Same here. I’m building a collection of nice older cars (auction house is very useful). I’d rather have a highly tuned classic than a Lamborghini or McLaren.

[Pommy]

Jader1973 said:

Cledus Snow said:

I do. I’d much rather have old stuff. I keep being outbid on the auction house too so i’m Not the only one.

Same here. I’m building a collection of nice older cars (auction house is very useful). I’d rather have a highly tuned classic than a Lamborghini or McLaren.

I'm not saying they're not subjectively wanted by people but on the Auction House the old stuff rarely sells for near list price but things like the McLaren F1 GT, F40, F50 etc pretty much sell for list

[goforbroke]

In FH3 I used to hate it when you ended up with 2 or more of the same car, but couldn't sell them. The only thing you could do other than keep them was to delete them.

What I'm finding in 4 though is that if I like a car, I'll have 2 or 3 of them, but spec them up for different seasons. Currently running around in a great winter/rally spec Lotus Carlton.

I think if they offered you 10% of the cars value when you remove it from your garage would be better. At least you don't feel like you're throwing it away.

[Shappers24]

New expansion announced... fortune island. Apparently their biggest forza horizon expansion to date.

[smithyithy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&amp...

[RB Will]

Well my Speed 12 won’t be much use there