RE: Gran Turismo 6 launch: PH liveblog
Wednesday 4th December 2013
With a thread now stretching back to May and currently at 36 pages, it's probably fair to assume there's some excitement in the PH community about GT6. It officially goes on sale at the end of the week, but we've been invited out to Ascari Race Resort for the launch and will use this liveblog to keep you updated on what we discover.
Wednesday, 0900h, Ascari Race Resort secret garages
So our final treat on the GT6 launch is a browse of the Ascari car collection. Which has lots of, well, Ascaris in it actually.
Gran Turismo 6 launch: PH liveblog
What's in the basement garage at Ascari Race Resort? A bunch of Ascaris of course!
Can it deliver after the disappointment of GT5? On a personal level, I actually switched allegiance having owned every GT from GT2 and bought a 360 with Forza 4 about a year ago. It's still with me, though sparingly used, but I still want the sixth version of the first Playstation game I owned to be fantastic.
I had an early teaser drive (sorry, play) at PHHQ last week; it was a couple of laps of Brands Hatch GP in a GT-R so, although there's nothing to say about the intricacies of the game, I can say that it felt even closer to the ultimate driving simulator than ever. But then that's never really been GT's problem, has it? It will be investigated to the full, along with some road driving and hopefully a few quick laps of Ascari too, over the next couple of days.
Matt
So our final treat on the GT6 launch is a browse of the Ascari car collection. Which has lots of, well, Ascaris in it actually.
But it's been a while, so poring over KZ1s, A10s and a lone Ecosse certainly wasn't a chore. Moreover, with all the cars open, it gave us chance to recall the 'unique' ergonomics of an Ascari, with offset pedals, tiny dials and some rather bold upholstery colours. What did happen to Ascari?
But there was far more waiting downstairs. It was the Ascari Club garage, where members' cars are stored. We never got official sanction to wander round so it was a frustratingly brief nose about. The pictures really speak for themselves here though; to see a pair of GT40s, a 512 TR (on slicks!) an LFA and a Ferrari Daytona really was something.
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Previous updates:
Monday, 2300h, Ronda
Tuesday, 1115h, Ascari Race Resort, battling 'hands on' instructors
Tuesday, 1300h, Ascari Race Resort, chatting with Kazunori
Tuesday, 1445h, Ascari Race Resort and back behind the wheel
Tuesday, 1700h, Ascari Race Resort and in the Aventador
Tuesday, 1730h, Ascari Race Resort and some virtual driving
Discussion
I've not touched this game in eons - has it gone beyond
"Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
"Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
Cool!
Few questions from a long-time series fan:
1) Does the frame rate hold up ok? I'm hoping it's at least no worse than GT5
2) Is the menu any quicker to navigate? E.g. fully tuning a car from stock?
3) Is there any sign of the prices of top cars being inflated to encourage people to pay real money for credits?
Few questions from a long-time series fan:
1) Does the frame rate hold up ok? I'm hoping it's at least no worse than GT5
2) Is the menu any quicker to navigate? E.g. fully tuning a car from stock?
3) Is there any sign of the prices of top cars being inflated to encourage people to pay real money for credits?
Quote: I can say that it felt even closer to the ultimate driving simulator than ever. But then that's never really been GT's problem, has it?
Gran Turismo: The ultimate marketing simulator.
It had no real competition until Forza and that's when it all started to go wrong for the series. Anyone who has played Forza 3 onwards will know that it is much better than Gran Turismo 5.
The big list of problems:
Problems with controller mapping I think they optimised the game for a steering wheel as it's rubbish with a controller. Forza has a simulation steering option for wheels otherwise it's assisted I don't know why GT doesn't do this. Also the brake and especially throttle mapping is like a light switch (I used the triggers, the thumbsticks I didn't like using).
There's a feeling of disconnection to the car like it's skating along the track and there's no sense of feedback or weight shifting around.
The understeer is atrocious and very had to tune out. Especially as there's no telemetry like there is in Forza.
Worse car selection with 50 variations of the same car to up the car count.
Very bad sounds the engines are like milkfloats or spaceships.
The graphics are ok for their time but very dated especially compared to Forza 3/4.
It's no fun there are no fun challenges.
No online marketplace, leaderboards, decent racing except in clans, etc.
The menu system is slow and clunky, it's slow to load, slow to move around.
The black car interiors. t
The ps2 ported cars with ps2 like graphics, and tracks.
The boringly smooth billiard table race tracks.
The stupid AI that doesn't adapt to your driving or skill level.
The pointlessness of racing when it's so dull and you get credits for cars you can't use.
Some cars are stupidly expensive it's laborious to do twenty races for one rare car.
The ease with which you can beat races once you have some money for tuning cars is annoying.
I think that's everything. Oh GT, how the mighty have fallen. I REALLY hope that GT6 addresses most of these problems or Forza 4 will still be far better. Only reason I wish I could afford another 360 or an Xbox one.
Edited to add:Forgot that it also has the worst screen tearing and flicker issues of any console game I've played. Polyphony please care and give people fans what they want not what you think they want.
Gran Turismo: The ultimate marketing simulator.
It had no real competition until Forza and that's when it all started to go wrong for the series. Anyone who has played Forza 3 onwards will know that it is much better than Gran Turismo 5.
The big list of problems:
Problems with controller mapping I think they optimised the game for a steering wheel as it's rubbish with a controller. Forza has a simulation steering option for wheels otherwise it's assisted I don't know why GT doesn't do this. Also the brake and especially throttle mapping is like a light switch (I used the triggers, the thumbsticks I didn't like using).
There's a feeling of disconnection to the car like it's skating along the track and there's no sense of feedback or weight shifting around.
The understeer is atrocious and very had to tune out. Especially as there's no telemetry like there is in Forza.
Worse car selection with 50 variations of the same car to up the car count.
Very bad sounds the engines are like milkfloats or spaceships.
The graphics are ok for their time but very dated especially compared to Forza 3/4.
It's no fun there are no fun challenges.
No online marketplace, leaderboards, decent racing except in clans, etc.
The menu system is slow and clunky, it's slow to load, slow to move around.
The black car interiors. t
The ps2 ported cars with ps2 like graphics, and tracks.
The boringly smooth billiard table race tracks.
The stupid AI that doesn't adapt to your driving or skill level.
The pointlessness of racing when it's so dull and you get credits for cars you can't use.
Some cars are stupidly expensive it's laborious to do twenty races for one rare car.
The ease with which you can beat races once you have some money for tuning cars is annoying.
I think that's everything. Oh GT, how the mighty have fallen. I REALLY hope that GT6 addresses most of these problems or Forza 4 will still be far better. Only reason I wish I could afford another 360 or an Xbox one.
Edited to add:Forgot that it also has the worst screen tearing and flicker issues of any console game I've played. Polyphony please care and give people fans what they want not what you think they want.
Edited by iloveboost on Monday 2nd December 23:43
The biggest diappointment for me when giong from GT3 to GT5 was the graphics. Sure, there were some very nice premium cars - but for every one of those, these wer at least 2 normal cars that were horrifically bodged re-renders from GT3 and Gt4, complete with octagonal wheelarches and pixellated graphics. This simply just is not acceptable, and if they havent fixed it for GT6 then I'll never buy another GT.
The other big disappointment was (again) the lack of properly exotic cars. One can only buy some many versions of the same Skyline or Evo with different (J)(MKIII)(Eu) bits tagged onto the end. I mean, in GT5 I can buy an 05 Swift sport... or an 07 car that looks identical, has the same power, torque and performance point figures, and costs the same. WHY? Where are all the classic cars we were promised? And why do all the cars of each engine type (especially V8 muscle or V12 supercars) STILL sound exactly the same as each other?
The other big disappointment was (again) the lack of properly exotic cars. One can only buy some many versions of the same Skyline or Evo with different (J)(MKIII)(Eu) bits tagged onto the end. I mean, in GT5 I can buy an 05 Swift sport... or an 07 car that looks identical, has the same power, torque and performance point figures, and costs the same. WHY? Where are all the classic cars we were promised? And why do all the cars of each engine type (especially V8 muscle or V12 supercars) STILL sound exactly the same as each other?
is that in the game?There are MUCH better simulators than GT5 and Forza (on PC), although these games are nice as a complete package.
Havent found Forza that interesting (haven't tried the latest though), physics seems a bit odd, and you get to the fastest kind of cars to quickly. I really liked the early GT games where you really had to struggle for a long time with used cheap cars, buying one mod at a time, slowly catching up with the opponents.
I have all the GT games, and as soon as the races get longer, cars expensive and ultra fast it really dies out for me
I haven't noticed the understeery tendencies in gt5, I would almost say the opposite. I´m only playing with steering wheel nowdays (not so often thoug). It really transformed the driving experience, from ok to really impressive (including all the bumps you suddenly feel at the ring, nice feeling of grip etc). As a regular track driver it feels much more at home, even though I have been playing with the hand control for years.
Looking forward to GT6, will at least try and see if its improved on menus and other stuff that needed a look over.
Havent found Forza that interesting (haven't tried the latest though), physics seems a bit odd, and you get to the fastest kind of cars to quickly. I really liked the early GT games where you really had to struggle for a long time with used cheap cars, buying one mod at a time, slowly catching up with the opponents.
I have all the GT games, and as soon as the races get longer, cars expensive and ultra fast it really dies out for me
I haven't noticed the understeery tendencies in gt5, I would almost say the opposite. I´m only playing with steering wheel nowdays (not so often thoug). It really transformed the driving experience, from ok to really impressive (including all the bumps you suddenly feel at the ring, nice feeling of grip etc). As a regular track driver it feels much more at home, even though I have been playing with the hand control for years.
Looking forward to GT6, will at least try and see if its improved on menus and other stuff that needed a look over.
They need to do something special to beat Forza.
Having not played Forza 5 yet, I'm assuming it's an improvement on Forza 4 as they've all been better than the previous one. Some people say it's not realistic, but there's normal and simulation which have a lot of difference. There's four difficulty levels, but 10 if you do the career and it gets gradually harder. The noise of the cars is a lot better too, popping and banging etc as you improve the car. The online is crap I think due to getting smashed out the road too easy, but Horizon was a big improvement.
I actually bought a PS3 with GT5 2 or 3 years back then swapped it for an Xbox due to Forza being better. It's one of the few games I play and I'm guessing there's other people that will choose a console based on these two offerings.
Having not played Forza 5 yet, I'm assuming it's an improvement on Forza 4 as they've all been better than the previous one. Some people say it's not realistic, but there's normal and simulation which have a lot of difference. There's four difficulty levels, but 10 if you do the career and it gets gradually harder. The noise of the cars is a lot better too, popping and banging etc as you improve the car. The online is crap I think due to getting smashed out the road too easy, but Horizon was a big improvement.
I actually bought a PS3 with GT5 2 or 3 years back then swapped it for an Xbox due to Forza being better. It's one of the few games I play and I'm guessing there's other people that will choose a console based on these two offerings.
daveinaravecave said:
They need to do something special to beat Forza.
Having not played Forza 5 yet, I'm assuming it's an improvement on Forza 4 as they've all been better than the previous one. Some people say it's not realistic, but there's normal and simulation which have a lot of difference. There's four difficulty levels, but 10 if you do the career and it gets gradually harder. The noise of the cars is a lot better too, popping and banging etc as you improve the car. The online is crap I think due to getting smashed out the road too easy, but Horizon was a big improvement.
I actually bought a PS3 with GT5 2 or 3 years back then swapped it for an Xbox due to Forza being better. It's one of the few games I play and I'm guessing there's other people that will choose a console based on these two offerings.
I got an XBox 1 on launch and personally I think Forza 5 has taken a step back. There has been a massive reduction in cars and tracks.Having not played Forza 5 yet, I'm assuming it's an improvement on Forza 4 as they've all been better than the previous one. Some people say it's not realistic, but there's normal and simulation which have a lot of difference. There's four difficulty levels, but 10 if you do the career and it gets gradually harder. The noise of the cars is a lot better too, popping and banging etc as you improve the car. The online is crap I think due to getting smashed out the road too easy, but Horizon was a big improvement.
I actually bought a PS3 with GT5 2 or 3 years back then swapped it for an Xbox due to Forza being better. It's one of the few games I play and I'm guessing there's other people that will choose a console based on these two offerings.
Where as before you had individual makers garages to flick through to buy your cars, there's actually so little cars now that its just a side scrolling list.
This is the biggest disappointment for me along with the reduction from loads of tracks to about 5 (with different layouts)
I miss the original tracks from 4 (Maple Valley) and the Ring has now gone.
The handling though has come on and I drive without any aids. The difficulty has increased without any aids buts the cars are a lot more adjustable now and list off oversteer in the Fiesta ST or Mini is a giggle.
The accuracy goes as far now that the cars have different braking points on the brake trigger which makes mastering the cars without ABS extremely difficult. Which to me definitely adds to the game.
To me its not as much of a flop as GT5 but I think Forza 5 has taken a backwards step. Im tempted to get GT6 but as stated by others, it may have a 1000+ car count but when 200 of them are different trim specs of Civic it takes away from the game somewhat. I really don't want a copy of GT5 + an extra 50 cars. Its needs to be a complete overhaul but I doubt it somehow.
I have compared the La Ferrari and P1 though on Forza lol. P1 is quicker but the Ferrari sounds better.
Edited by dukebox9reg on Tuesday 3rd December 08:26
I never really had much of a problem with GT5's driving model. As long as you resisted the temptation to put cartoon grip 'Racing Softs' on everything it was fine. The console driving games are always going to have a fairly forgiving model - for a real simulator you need one of the PC games.
405dogvan said:
I've not touched this game in eons - has it gone beyond
"Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
"I've not touched this game in eons - has it gone beyond""Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
That says it all, GT5 was on another level to the early GT games so go get GT6 and enjoy.
I know GT5 had it's issue however these imho were put right over time (should have been from the beginning I know ie more premium cars, updating physics, standard cars graphics etc)
GT5 gets too much of a hard time, it ended up being a great game more so if people actually play it online, that's where the real fun is for me.
If GT6 is a step forward from what GT5 became at the end we're in for a real treat.
GT5 gets too much of a hard time, it ended up being a great game more so if people actually play it online, that's where the real fun is for me.
If GT6 is a step forward from what GT5 became at the end we're in for a real treat.
Evo said:
405dogvan said:
I've not touched this game in eons - has it gone beyond
"Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
"I've not touched this game in eons - has it gone beyond""Buy a car"
"Tune it up"
"Race and win easily"
"Almost certainly never use it again"
"Repeat for weeks until you're done"
"At no point actually encounter any challenge"
At least from a single-player point-of-view?
Also - did they ever replace the 'understeer and more understeer' handling with something which actually feels like a car?
Don't get me wrong - the first 2 games were amazing in their day, but I think things moved-on and the impression I get is that GT rides on it's laurels and licence just a bit too much?
That says it all, GT5 was on another level to the early GT games so go get GT6 and enjoy.
I found it deathly dull, and compared to GT4 was incredibly light on actual racing content. The lack of races in comparison was shocking.
It pains me to say this but I think GT6 is going to be sh*te again. How they still think they can get away with black interiors is beyond me.
The last couple of games haven't been fun or challenging at all, just an endurance test to see how long you can be bothered to stick it out. I remember back in the days of GT2 when you had very limited funds and cars it was much harder to win a race so you felt like you had to earn it. In GT5 its too easy to just get a car, tune it to the max and then win by miles.
Definitely the first GT game since 2 I wont be buying at launch if at all.
The last couple of games haven't been fun or challenging at all, just an endurance test to see how long you can be bothered to stick it out. I remember back in the days of GT2 when you had very limited funds and cars it was much harder to win a race so you felt like you had to earn it. In GT5 its too easy to just get a car, tune it to the max and then win by miles.
Definitely the first GT game since 2 I wont be buying at launch if at all.
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