Test Drive Unlimited (PC)... DO NOT BUY!

[ThePassenger]

I realise that many people here have brought the game and are playing it happily. Apparently, as far as PC users are concerned you are in the minority.

So far the game has the following issues:
- Crash to Desktop (CtD) after intro videos (95% chance of this happening each time you run the game).
- Random CtD during game.
- Poor graphics performance on random cards / drivers (ATi or Nvidia doesn't matter).
- Zero support for wheel input.
- Game crashes or drops to 1fps when using a force feedback wheel.
- Game crashes when using mouse input.
- Game crashes when using joystick input... actually the game crashes when you use ANYTHING USB.
- Some SMP (athlon X2, Core 2 Duo) configurations are utterly incompatible.
- Game has issues with 2GB RAM or more.
- Game has issues with sub 2GB RAM or less.
- Money will be deducted from your virtual account but you will NOT recive the car/item you purchased.
- Your profile will randomly change sex.
- You profile (online and offline) will randomly corrupt at somepoint between 10min - 20min of play resulting in loosing all progress.

Due to the game having zero anti-cheat programs in it racing on-line is pointless; 1000+mph cars and bikes are common place and all on-line results tables are currently 'p0wn3d'. This is of course for the whole 10 - 20 min you are able to play on-line before the game 'forgets' everything returning you to square one.

Currently there is no patch available, one has been announced but there is no ETA.

Save your money and get something not made by Infogrames... they were renound as being st before and since trading as Atari they've got worse
Basically, if you're tossing up between rFactor and TDU.... buy rFactor.

[ThePassenger]

xiphias said:

Sorry, I don't quite get the point of this post, seems a bit random...

Exactly like TDU on the PC then.

The point of the post is quite simple: Avoid the game like the god damn plague. It's horribly horribly broken on so many different configurations (single & dual core, AMD, Intel, ATi, Nvidia, WinXP, Vista, etc.) that if you buy it and the thing runs; pat yourself on the back for being a lucky sod.

The reason for posting: This is PH, people like racing games (logical), people hate wasting money (logical again).

[ThePassenger]

CivPilot said:

- Crash to Desktop (CtD) after intro videos (95% chance of this happening each time you run the game). - NEVER happened to me. Not once.

Then you are judging by the official forums, very lucky.

CivPilot said:

- Random CtD during game. - Again, never happened.

Your luck has increased.

CivPilot said:

- Poor graphics performance on random cards / drivers (ATi or Nvidia doesn't matter). - Have a card listed in the games "supported cards" list and runs fine.

Magic combination of drivers and hardware for this one. People all over the shop are having issues with the games performance even though their card is on the official supported list.

CivPilot said:

- Zero support for wheel input. - Don't have a wheel, but have heard that MS wheels have problems, G25 is fully supported (Including H pattern) and works according to the official forums. Besides there is a huge list of supported wheel sets on the main site and in the readme file?

Which unfortunatley (from the posts in the official forums) is lies. If YOURS is working then you've been exceptionally lucky.... actually too lucky, are you sure you're PC isn't an XBox?

CivPilot said:

- Game crashes or drops to 1fps when using a force feedback wheel. - Well your previous problem said there was no wheel support? which is it? Does it not support your wheel?.
- Game crashes when using mouse input. - I use the mouse in the menus not for driving, its fine.
- Game crashes when using joystick input... actually the game crashes when you use ANYTHING USB. - Total and utter Codswallop. I use a USB joystick and have zero control issues.

Unfortunately not. Official forum posts indicate the game has issues with any USB inputs (from wired XBox controllers to wheels).

CivPilot said:

- Some SMP (athlon X2, Core 2 Duo) configurations are utterly incompatible. - there is a duo core bug for some users, others seem fine (again, this is from the official forums).

I agree it is SOME users, the utterly randomness of it suggests the quality of the code.

CivPilot said:

- Game has issues with 2GB RAM or more. - No. I know of people with over 2gb having no issues.
- Game has issues with sub 2GB RAM or less. - No. I have 1.5gb and I have no issues.

You do indeed have a magic computer. The game has issues with RAM fullstop.

CivPilot said:

I fully understand your point in posting this, but at the same time you have worded your post as absolute "fact" and told people they must not buy it yet I've been playing the game since release without these issues you claim. So I can only in the politest possible way say "bollox". It seems that you bought the game, couldnt get it to work on your system and are now pissed off. Well it's your perogative, but trying to get nobody else to buy it is just silly. I have the following basic system configuration.

They are extrapolations from the official forums. I left out the bit about Atari not really giving a rats ass about the game being broken. Did I buy it? Yes. Did it work for me? No. Crash to Desktop... 100% of the time, so I've been spared the other annoyances, glitches and "happy fun quirks" this game has. The game has had victory declared and been ebayed, so I'm hardly bitter or pissed off about it.

CivPilot said:

Pentium P4 3.4ghz
1.5MB ram
Nvidia 6800GT 256mb
USB Joystick control (Must buy a wheel)
and the game works fine in high res with x4 AA. I'm not the exception as you seem to claim.

Personally I'd like to see the full workup of your machine, even down to the mobo revision; as you've got a lucky system there which is neatly bypassing all of the issues. It is, however, an exception to the norm.

CivPilot said:

The game does have issues for some people, there is a patch being created, it is slated for release in may, and the online cheating, profile corruption, performance issues are all key patch criteria.

This is where I will use my past experience of Infogrammes to respond. If you think that patch is going to fix anything you are deluding yourself. I'm expecting it to break more things than it fixes, it's traditional, when you're Atari.

[ThePassenger]

marfgtxx said:

Oh, and by the way, Atari didn't make this game, Eden did. Atari are merely the publisher and marketing vehicle.

Heard that one before. Eden are Atari's in house development team, they're website was a swine to track down but the games list & logo match. So yeah... just the publisher... and the developer.

marfgtxx said:

ThePassenger said:

CivPilot said:

- Game crashes or drops to 1fps when using a force feedback wheel. - Well your previous problem said there was no wheel support? which is it? Does it not support your wheel?.
- Game crashes when using mouse input. - I use the mouse in the menus not for driving, its fine.
- Game crashes when using joystick input... actually the game crashes when you use ANYTHING USB. - Total and utter Codswallop. I use a USB joystick and have zero control issues.

Unfortunately not. Official forum posts indicate the game has issues with any USB inputs (from wired XBox controllers to wheels).

Works just fine with my PS2 controller via USB adapter, can map all 12 buttons and all 4 axes.

You know reading your posts again it sounds very much like you havent had half these issues being reported on the forum, most of which are driver related or can be fixed easily through tweaks of some sort or another.

[/quote]

You would be correct. I haven't yet been able to enjoy all of these wondrous bugs, glitches... nor have I managed to fall off the world which sounds like a laugh. Currently my legit copy of TDU has a cup of coffee on it and I'm considering turning it in to an ashtray. Because that really is all the CD is useful for. Other than inserting it in to the drive and watching Windows fall over (GPF in the Test Drive executable) repeatedly, the bink video's work so that's £20 for what 1min's entertainment? I can get cheaper drugs than that! Yes, it's a wonderful game and well worth £20... assuming the point of the game is to be devoid of any entertainment and full of annoyances.

I'd love it to be drivers. But it just isn't so. I'd hoped that CnC3 would keep me occupied whilst Atari. No, lets not soil that name... I loved my ST. Lets call these morons who they really are: Infogrames, renound for being crap, delivered on a patch. Well, they haven't. Sorry but the number of serious faults this game is showing would have me pushing the first patch out 1st May and follow it up in quick sucsession. And to be perfectly frank the rumour of a PC patch is currently just that, the same as the rumours of TDU2 being in development. I honestly do not expect a patch to appear this month or any other.

By the way, 20fps on a Go 7500GS is pathetic. Especially considering the draw distance on the game looks to be similar to borrowing Mr. Magoo's eyes. I have a 7500GS and am expecting 30fps+ will all the goodies, if SupCom can do 'everything on' (as can CnC3 and everything else) so can TDU... unless you are also saying the game has serious technical issues as well?

Right I'm off to make an ashtray.

[ThePassenger]

marfgtxx said:

Eitherway, it runs fine and I'm playing happily, I'm sorry your not, perhaps you should get a refund rather than defiling your game? however satisfying that may be.

I can exchange it for... another copy of the game. But I can't get a refund as... I might have copied it. Seems to be the standard polict of stores these days unfortunately. I can ebay it for a loss... or turn it in to an ashtray and Tortuga a version to patch up... if they ever release one.

marfgtxx said:

Have you thought about talking to the support team about getting a key for the download version in exchange for your DVD copy? I understand that people have had less issues with the patched DL version.

Infogrames support is legendarily bad; it's worth a shot I suppose however... if I download it and doesn't work I'm back to square one and lumbered with Infogrames 'DirectDrive' system which is.... known to go bang regularly.

To be honest looking around the forums, people with 6000 series cards are running rings around yours. I'd suggest drivers but well; the game seems exceptionally twitchy to that sort of thing.

And yes, I still stand by my original statement that this game isn't worth the money asked for it. I'll add that it would be best to wait until it's been patched a few times and THEN test it out.

Edited by ThePassenger on Wednesday 9th May 23:33

[ThePassenger]

ThePassenger said:

Must admit too I'm not entirely sure if mine is a 128mb with 128 available if needed from the system RAM, or if its a true 256 card. Different sites give different specs

Normally the 7000 series have their own RAM. But really easy way to tell. Right click on My Computer and select Properties.

The first tab should have some gumf about your system... including the amount of physical RAM. If it's missing 12MB... you know it's stealing RAM

I think I might just do the Trading Standards thing; store credit would be good... if it's active until the CnC3 mission pack appears

[ThePassenger]

marfgtxx said:

Yeah it reports 1gb of system ram so the card isnt theiving any.

Good good. So it's just a drivers tweaking game... assuming you think tweaking with drivers is fun

[ThePassenger]

marfgtxx said:

Nah buggrit, if I wanna higher frame rate I'll play on my little bro's PC, that manages 35fps with the ATI card it has installed.

What else are little bro's for other than stealing their stuff?

[ThePassenger]

R1 GTR said:

So do i buy the PS2 version (heard its not a good) or risk it and buy the pc version?

Edit: im going off to buy it right now so which one?

Edited by R1 GTR on Saturday 12th May 12:57

To be blunt. The PS2 version. It bypasses the whole god damn palava. I wouldn't get the PC one unless the patch is out (ETA 4th week May).

[ThePassenger]

Civpilot said:

This simply must be a driver/PC compatibility issue.

Possibly. But which driver? Their are issues on the official Atari forums where it can't possibly be a single driver version for a specific peice of hardware. You see issues with Intels and AMD's, Nvidia and ATi... it's wildly differing hardware and drivers. But. If, CnC3 runs sweet as a nut, along with SupCom, NWN2... as well as NWN2 can run it's another Atari game :S... which one is the odd man out?
If I was trying to do something daft like run it in WINE (which doesn't work due to the games very strange usage of a D3D function) then yeah fair enough... but i'm not. This is XP-SP2 at the current patch level.

Civpilot said:

So from the initial post:-

"- Zero support for wheel input" - Wrong

Actually, I'll give you that one but I will amend it.
VERY LITTLE OFFICIAL support for wheel input.

Civpilot said:

"- Game crashes or drops to 1fps when using a force feedback wheel." - Wrong again

Actually the force feed back system causing massive drops in frame rates is a known bug in the game. Especially as the bug is not related to just the old Microsoft wheel, several people with Saitek units have reported the same issue.

Civpilot said:

In fact in the official forums there was a poll on what gave the better control, Steering wheel or game pad. The wheel won with 79+% of the vote. So saying the game has zero wheel support was also incorrect, hence I think the problems being had are even more so individual PC/driver related.
As for the first statement that there is zero support for wheel input. Well this is the Atari/eden statement:-
So maybe not officially supported, but loads of wheels tested and work.

Having spent a lot of time lurking on the 'Official Atari Forums' I would take any poll results with a healthy dose of scepticism. I've seen at least one moderator acting in a very unprofessional manner towards people (in essence calls them a n00b and bans them for kicks), it is not such a major leap of faith to think that the polls are often rigged. The only official Atari/Eden statement I've seen on those forums is that a patch is being worked on, the only control method stickyed is how to use a 360 pad. Those in itself are quite suggestive. Actually saying there is "zero support" is correct, with the number of DirectInput wheels on the market those officially supported (not just happen to work) is in effect such a low percentage as to be zero.

Civpilot said:

I initially bought the Ps2 version on release day but took it back the following day to upgrade to the PC version. PS2 version is nothing but a pale shadow arcade racer missing loads of cars and having crap graphics in comparison.

But it a) works flawlessly b) misses out on the twisted minefield that is getting the product home only to find it not working.

Right. To settle this matter give me 5 min to reboot.

Sorry about the delay needed to be in Windows. This is what happens when you double click the icon to run the game. This is repeatable, this is the only action the game takes after the videos have played:



And just to prove this isn't Test Drive: Unlimited 'Tortuga Edition':



So, buy the PS2 version or the PC version? Well there's your 'worst case' with the PC version running the latest stable drivers for everything.

Edited by ThePassenger on Saturday 12th May 16:55

Edited by ThePassenger on Saturday 12th May 17:15

[ThePassenger]

marfgtxx said:

I must say tho that the Atari TDU forums are plagued by a huge number of incredibly whiney, rude and small minded yankee teenagers.

I went on there last night for the first time in a long while and was quickly reminded why I stopped going on there. A young girl had posted a question about the game in relation to her Dell PC and was then abused and shouted down till she left, deleting all her posts in the process.

If one of the people joining in had the name "tenebra" then that's a moderator...
But yes, I'm rather glad I only visit infrequently and stay long enough to confirm suspicions.

[ThePassenger]

Mr Whippy said:

ThePassenger said:

Well there's your 'worst case' with the PC version running the latest stable drivers for everything.

Think thats your problem. I always stay about 6-12 months back on drivers and hardware because it's always crap when it's new/un-tested etc.

All the issues seem to be on super new systems with people who worry more about 3D Mark scores and will install beta drivers for 0.5fps more on some test or another...

Ahh sorry, I should clarify. These aren't bleeding edge just released. They're what Intel, Nvidia, Rioch (card reader) and Co. say are their most current stable release... so not like the 1xx.xx series of Nvidia drivers

The only older drivers I've got are the ones that come with the XPS... and to be honest their Nvidia drivers are an old unstable release... it texture flashes all over the shop :-/

Edited by ThePassenger on Saturday 12th May 17:48

[ThePassenger]

Civpilot said:

ThePassenger said:

.....
Right. To settle this matter give me 5 min to reboot.

Sorry about the delay needed to be in Windows....

erm... are you running a dual boot system, the highlighted statement above appears to imply that you are?

If so then maybe that might be a major something to do with it. I'm running XP sp2 and no other operating system and experience none of the problems you speak of. I know the game has online issues with corrupting save games etc, but off line mine runs very well indeed with no frame rate drops for force feedback etc.

If your PC is within the operating requirements (which I have no doubt it is) then there is no reason why you cant run the game. However, if you running dual boot maybe (just maybe) there is something there. Can you think of any other reason why I can run the game with no problem but you cannot even get it to start? I can't. Adn the only real difference between our machince is that you appear to be running dual boot.

Problem is when booted in to Windows, none of the Linux code is running in the background nor is it in memory. I've tried, just on the remote off chance this was the problem powering down the laptop, removing the mains AND battery then going in to windows, that way total clean slate. True GRUB runs but exits cleanly after selecting the OS run run. Now, having several games that are using the same version of SecuROM the multiple partitions on the disk aren't causing an issue, nor is the Windows EXT2 driver (I've tried with and without it).

The fascinating thing is that for me, the game doesn't even run in WINE (despite being set to any version of Windows from 98 - Vista), it bombs instantly after the videos have played... that's freaky as we're talking two utterly different sets of drivers and an emulation layer that's trying to smooth out the bugs. Needless to say this is two separate installations but both failing at the exact same point, in different OS's.

So, it's not drivers as everything else works. It's not XP-SP2 as WINE gets the same treatment. The disc is fine and checks out, besides which you'd expect the installer to be CRCing as it goes. The drive optics check out both for reading/writing CD's and DVD's. It's not 3rd party software (AVG-Free, DeamonTools, et al) as I've tried it each way. It's not heat as I've tried it from a cold (sat on top of the AC cold) boot. And the hdd is fine too.

Before I tell someone not to buy something, I am nothing if not bloody thorough in checking everything out first.


ETA: 'Tortuga Edition' has been tried and does the same.

Edited by ThePassenger on Saturday 12th May 20:35

[ThePassenger]

I'm afraid I have to agree. A little erm... rambunctious there Sadako.

But, anyway, ignoring that. I'm out of ideas. I'm always in the mood to tinker but I'm not about to scratch build the system when it's working fine. To be honest, if Atari/Eden have deployed code that's fiddling/checking with the bootsector of the primary drive (which is the only difference between your system and mine when in Windows) that is a big klaxon going off right there. The only thing that should be in that area is the OS loader(s) not a chunk of game code.

Besides which I'm not convinced just installing XP-SP2 would do it. If installing 'Tortuga Edition' (which fails to run the same way, but has all it's copy protection removed), then scrubbing every last trace of it off (inc. registry) and putting on legit edition results in the same fault... it's got the be the game.

BTW Civ.... it's she not he

[ThePassenger]

Civpilot said:

oops

It is very strange and to be honest the fact that I (and to be fair, many other people) can run the game without issue I wouln't put it past eden to code something so stupid as the game is pretty much a direct port of the 360version. Ignoring the dual boot situation, say the difference in our system is only that I run service pack 2, maybe its worth a shot? Stranger things have happened?

Service pack 2 of what? I'm already running XP-SP2 at the current MS patch level. I admit it is XP-SP2 Pro however (and again, legit OEM version that I specc'd for the laptop, not 'Tortuga Edition'). You see what I mean? As far as oddities go my laptop's as generic as they come, it doesn't even have a wheel attached (i've tired with/without USB mouse)... by rights it should work and work flawlessly. And if they've managed to write a game that doesn't work in XP Pro... there would be even more people screaming blue murder on the forums (when Tenebra and co aren't culling the voices of dissent) than there already is.

It not working on two different OS's (remember, I did attempt in Linux+WINE) and failing at the exact same point when you using two different versions of the game (fresh installing + reg wipe each attempt) points to hardware, which... as we've gone over passes every diagnostic I've got AND doesn't act up in any other working game (CnC3 is a royal resource hog if something was wrong that'd show it up).

Which leaves the only source of the problems being? Test Drive: Unlimited. Which is nearly pointed to by the error message in Windows; the fault is in the testdriveunlimited.exe.

To be quite honest I actually doubt the large numbers of people having zero issue thing. We've both been on the official EU forums and we've both seen how fast the mods ban pretty much anyone who gripes about an issue. I believe that most of the people who have issues are currently banned from the forums for being "novice PC game users" (quote from moderator tenebra).

[ThePassenger]

LukeBird said:

To clear up the XP Pro thing, I'm playing (well, I will be when I re-install TDU) it on XP Pro SP2 with the full updates as well. It does seem very odd that it randomly runs on some systems and not on others...
Very bizarre....

Didn't think it'd be XP Pro (I tried it in WINE set to everything from 98 up ) but ta muchly for closing that hole.

This is the point I was trying to make in my first post. Ok, anyway, skipping that... take the bit about wheels needing to be "DirectInput Compatible"... that's pretty much any PC game interface built since the days of Windows 98. So why are Saitek users having issues, with brand new kit? Same with the MS Wheel, which whilst being old should bloody well be DirectInput compliant after all MS wrote it And yes, I've spotted one each of people using 360 pads, PS2 pads and Logitech G25 wheels having issues on the forums.... which is freaky again as its working for others.

Whilst everything about TDU smells rushed, my personal opinion is that on the PC version Eden screwed up their compiler settings, it's either too loose (or more likley too tightly bound to the dev boxes) so anyone who's close 'enough' gets away with it, anyone who's too far either way... splat. It also explains why the game was pushed out with no release day patch to cover this problem, Atari/Eden hadn't got a clue this was coming.

Side: Atari's share price being what it is, the actions of the moderators seems explainable beyond simple 'net-nazi' antics... this game has to be perfect and anyone who says it is not has to be silenced. The utterly unforgivable thing is that people are buying the game AND a wheel, heading to the forums because the games gone bang big time and being insulted before being banned.

[ThePassenger]

I figured I'd just dump this here (thus bumping my own thread ).

That TDU patch that was due to hit May? 100% for sure, May?

It's now scheduled for mid-June at the earliest.

[ThePassenger]

LukeBird said:

ThePassenger said:

I figured I'd just dump this here (thus bumping my own thread ).

That TDU patch that was due to hit May? 100% for sure, May?

It's now scheduled for mid-June at the earliest.

is it literally just to fix the game...?
I'm having no problems so I'm slightly apprehensive now!

TDU is erm... well, just look at all the diagnostic hoops on the previous pages I went though to prove it's the game... it's twitchy about configurations (or just plain st, your choice). If it's working for you then a sigh of relief.

The patch is pure bug fixes and anti-cheat for on-line (BUT primarily bug fixes), to sweeten the deal (because some people have been unable to play this thing for two solid months) they're going to throw in two free cars... which the XB360 players got as part of their DLC bundles (a Audi R4 and a Skyline I believe).

Mr Whippy said:

It will arrive and fix no issues, cause more bugs than it fixes, and generally mean no one will want another product from these arses again.

I said that about NWN2 (another fine Atari release, rushed out the door) and I brought TDU, principally because I figured half of PH would be playing it and thus wanted to race. Personally, that's to me Atari falling down on two projects and showing no signs of learning from their mistakes.

Edited by ThePassenger on Thursday 31st May 00:24

[ThePassenger]

Thudd said:

These problems can all be solved by running TDU on an xBox360, if you can find one that works.

Maybe. I said to a guy "Go buy the PS2 version" only to discover it's broken. I'm sure there are people having issues with the 360 version.

[ThePassenger]

CombeMarshal said:

Nope! only problem originally was that you could get stupid speed boosts, but they fixed that on the second update!
Apart from that it is totally trouble free!
another plus for console over PC!

Not really. The PS2 version has issues. I'd say it shows which system the game has been primarily aimed at, in this case the 360.