I think I'm done with road...
Discussion
Haven’t yet felt the need to give up on road riding, but suspect if I was still in Surrey then I’d consider it.
Certainly agree in not escalating things, even when you’re certain you’re not in the wrong. I’ve been brushed past a few times (bus and car physically hit me with their overtakes) and I had to really resist the natural urge to ‘fight back’ and I’m a very patient and placid individual.
‘Lesson’ learnt on one occasion of tapping the side glass of the car passing when they were too close (10cm
away). They then rammed me into the kerb. I ended up in a+e. Police said with no CCTV it was 50/50. The car driver left grinning like a Cheshire Cat as he’d ‘won’.
There are some really unhinged individuals, and you will meet them everywhere. Sadly they are allowed on the road (in cars and on bikes).
Certainly agree in not escalating things, even when you’re certain you’re not in the wrong. I’ve been brushed past a few times (bus and car physically hit me with their overtakes) and I had to really resist the natural urge to ‘fight back’ and I’m a very patient and placid individual.
‘Lesson’ learnt on one occasion of tapping the side glass of the car passing when they were too close (10cm
away). They then rammed me into the kerb. I ended up in a+e. Police said with no CCTV it was 50/50. The car driver left grinning like a Cheshire Cat as he’d ‘won’.
There are some really unhinged individuals, and you will meet them everywhere. Sadly they are allowed on the road (in cars and on bikes).
TGCOTF-dewey said:
FFS and again. Forced into diving between two parked cars this time.
Two rows of parked cars, I'm halfway down these rows and car appears. Instead of stopping before they enter, they just carry on forcing me to dive between two parked cars.
s!
I had this today. I thought she wasn't going to stop. I certainly wasn't. The male passenger did a wTwo rows of parked cars, I'm halfway down these rows and car appears. Instead of stopping before they enter, they just carry on forcing me to dive between two parked cars.
s! ker sign and she looked utterly gormless. I was firmly there first (cars on their side) amd i glanced when entering - no car approaching first parked car, glanced up again to see her barellimg down towards me but it appears no one explained about vulnerable road users to her...
Again I wouldn't have stopped. She did when she realised this.
I did a 30mile road route yesterday. It was a really good ride too. I had one close pass at speed on a totally empty wide road. One car pass me with a red light and queue directly in front, only to cut in and immediately brake to a complete stop. One old guy coming the other way wait for me to get on top of his position and then turn right across my path whilst looking right at me and making me brake to a complete stop. He even slowed his turn to force me to stop as a F you. Also got told off by two horse riders as I went to pass them who insisted I stay behind them and not pass at all, they were letting cars pass them though, very odd.
Sounds crazy typing it but it’s a typical Saturday, the ride was fab and the majority of drivers passed safely and gave good distance.
Sounds crazy typing it but it’s a typical Saturday, the ride was fab and the majority of drivers passed safely and gave good distance.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
I had this today. I thought she wasn't going to stop. I certainly wasn't. The male passenger did a wker sign and she looked utterly gormless.
I was firmly there first (cars on their side) amd i glanced when entering - no car approaching first parked car, glanced up again to see her barellimg down towards me but it appears no one explained about vulnerable road users to her...
Again I wouldn't have stopped. She did when she realised this.
Sometimes the trick is to stop ker sign and she looked utterly gormless. I was firmly there first (cars on their side) amd i glanced when entering - no car approaching first parked car, glanced up again to see her barellimg down towards me but it appears no one explained about vulnerable road users to her...
Again I wouldn't have stopped. She did when she realised this.
stargazer30 said:
Also got told off by two horse riders as I went to pass them who insisted I stay behind them and not pass at all, they were letting cars pass them though, very odd..
Most cyclists pass horse riders fat too quickly ... my own group have done this and I've gone ape with them. The best way is to slow down way before (no hasrh stopping/squeeking brakes!) and talk to the riders ... the horses need to know its a human behind them. I usually just say 'morning' or 'hello' and then the horse rider will probably explain (if required) if their horse is nervous and needs more time or space. I come across quite a few where we ride and never had a problem ... the talking bit was explained to me years ago by a horse rider.
But then again, you always get 'one'.
JEA1K said:
stargazer30 said:
Also got told off by two horse riders as I went to pass them who insisted I stay behind them and not pass at all, they were letting cars pass them though, very odd..
Most cyclists pass horse riders fat too quickly ... my own group have done this and I've gone ape with them. The best way is to slow down way before (no hasrh stopping/squeeking brakes!) and talk to the riders ... the horses need to know its a human behind them. I usually just say 'morning' or 'hello' and then the horse rider will probably explain (if required) if their horse is nervous and needs more time or space. I come across quite a few where we ride and never had a problem ... the talking bit was explained to me years ago by a horse rider.
But then again, you always get 'one'.
What is deeply disturbing about UK society is that if someone boasts about a close pass or almost forcing a cyclist off the roads because " they shouldn't be there should they" or "They make everyone late " (ive heard people in real life say both) no one bats an eyelid. If you turned up at someones house and proudly boasted that you almost put a pedestrian over your bonnet or ran them into the hedge as you passed them people would have something to say about it to you .
For some reason cyclists don't count as people to a very concerning large number of people who use the road with us. Just see the post from that lunatic very early in this thread to prove my point.
The old argument of "look at how cyclists behave" is utter tosh. Many people behave likes when they use the road. THose people will also behave like s in other areas of life too.
It worries me that so many people don't see people on bikes as 'other people' but as parasites to be injured/killed for laughs. Plenty of media publications push this dangerous thinking as well.
There ares everywhere, some use bikes, some drive cars or lorries, some work in libraries. (probably less in libraries I'm guessing though)
As for me in the south east, its usually not too bad where iI am, but in the last 18mnths there has been (on certain roads anyway) a huge increase in close passing and people overtaking to turn left immediately in front of me, something that round here almost never happened before.
As for escalating things, I can't see the point, you never know who will get out and try and attack you. Just keep moving and turn off onto another road for a bit if needs be. I never understand why people stop to either confront or be confronted in these situations, Just keep moving. Once they get out, they are on foot, you're on a bike, I think I see a way out of this....
I have also been lucky (certainly compared to what I read here) in that ive had only a very tiny handful of abuse/targeted dangerous driving in the almost 22 years ive been riding regularly (ie several times a week). Good luck out there !
For some reason cyclists don't count as people to a very concerning large number of people who use the road with us. Just see the post from that lunatic very early in this thread to prove my point.
The old argument of "look at how cyclists behave" is utter tosh. Many people behave like
s when they use the road. THose people will also behave like s in other areas of life too.It worries me that so many people don't see people on bikes as 'other people' but as parasites to be injured/killed for laughs. Plenty of media publications push this dangerous thinking as well.
There are
s everywhere, some use bikes, some drive cars or lorries, some work in libraries. (probably less in libraries I'm guessing though)As for me in the south east, its usually not too bad where iI am, but in the last 18mnths there has been (on certain roads anyway) a huge increase in close passing and people overtaking to turn left immediately in front of me, something that round here almost never happened before.
As for escalating things, I can't see the point, you never know who will get out and try and attack you. Just keep moving and turn off onto another road for a bit if needs be. I never understand why people stop to either confront or be confronted in these situations, Just keep moving. Once they get out, they are on foot, you're on a bike, I think I see a way out of this....
I have also been lucky (certainly compared to what I read here) in that ive had only a very tiny handful of abuse/targeted dangerous driving in the almost 22 years ive been riding regularly (ie several times a week). Good luck out there !
neilr said:
What is deeply disturbing about UK society is that if someone boasts about a close pass or almost forcing a cyclist off the roads because " they shouldn't be there should they" or "They make everyone late " (ive heard people in real life say both) no one bats an eyelid. If you turned up at someones house and proudly boasted that you almost put a pedestrian over your bonnet or ran them into the hedge as you passed them people would have something to say about it to you .
For some reason cyclists don't count as people to a very concerning large number of people who use the road with us. Just see the post from that lunatic very early in this thread to prove my point.
The old argument of "look at how cyclists behave" is utter tosh. Many people behave likes when they use the road. THose people will also behave like s in other areas of life too.
Absolutely. Unforturnately, when we have 'mouthpieces' like Jeremy Clarkson who spouting vitirol in their newspaper columns about their hatred of cyclists, then some sections of society are motovated and inspired to mirror this with aggression towards cyclists. For some reason cyclists don't count as people to a very concerning large number of people who use the road with us. Just see the post from that lunatic very early in this thread to prove my point.
The old argument of "look at how cyclists behave" is utter tosh. Many people behave like
s when they use the road. THose people will also behave like s in other areas of life too.I mean, all you need to do is take a look on Facebook and find an article about cyclists to see the hatred towards them, often, as you say, people taking pleasure in making the life of a cyclist misery by almost ending their lives.
When these posts come up, and they're based on road safety an how dangerous cyclists are to pedestrians, I always like to chime in with these valuable statistical graphs.
I agree with what the last two posters have said completely. This is also a useful graphic, although it pisses me off they refer to "car" and not driver for obvious reasons.
Where I don't agree with a lot of you is I cannot let it go. I always shout and wave at close passes and other un-necessary bad driving. If nothing else it alerts other road users to the situation, and it might just make the perp think again next time.
Where I don't agree with a lot of you is I cannot let it go. I always shout and wave at close passes and other un-necessary bad driving. If nothing else it alerts other road users to the situation, and it might just make the perp think again next time.
I agree the anti-cycling sentiment is awful. I also agree that de-humanising someone because they happen to be on a push bike ("bloody cyclist") is utterly absurd.
Cyclists are no better or worse as human beings, just a little fitter.
And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.
Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.
There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
Cyclists are no better or worse as human beings, just a little fitter.
And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.
Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.
There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
nickfrog said:
Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.
There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
Agreed. There are poor bahaviors and attitudes on both sides ... as always, sadly its the extremist elements amongst us. There are those that make a genuine mistake or a slight error in judgement which, although it may result in a moment of panic, if there is no harm caused, we can only hope that the responsible party 'learns a lesson'. These are still the majority of confrontations on the road rather than deliberate moves. There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
I mean, if the awful, vindictive drivers were in the majority, then we'd all be dead, right?!
nickfrog said:
And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.
There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
I don’t find it controversial at all. 100% agree. Sadly we’re all lumped in as a ‘group’ to the lowest common denominator. As the general public increasingly get told how bad cyclists are, they’ll of course only see bad behaviour. There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".
When an angry driver shouts that we should all take a cycling test to get a license, I can’t argue, I tend to agree.
You could take a cycle test, be advanced, pay £300 cycle tax a year, use cycle numberplate and you'd still get the same risk.
That's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.
My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.
This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.
They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.
That's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.
My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.
This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.
They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
You could take a cycle test, be advanced, pay £300 cycle tax a year, use cycle numberplate and you'd still get the same risk.
That's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.
My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.
This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.
They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.
Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one pieceThat's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.
My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.
This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.
They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.
Ironically I shouted at a driver last week, crossing on foot he took the corner fast to avoid waiting for us to cross. I shouted at him. He slammed on, called me a few names then jumped out.
As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.
Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!
As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.
Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Ironically I shouted at a driver last week, crossing on foot he took the corner fast to avoid waiting for us to cross. I shouted at him. He slammed on, called me a few names then jumped out.
As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.
Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!
It doesn't surprise me that another person called him out! It would be so funny, if it wasn't so sad. These people can't even see what they are doing wrong. They can't be arsed sometimes and accelerate to avoid stopping for pedestrians, it happened to me with a bus recently. A freaking bus!As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.
Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!
Brighton is fine, you get the occasional idiot, the annoying cyclists as well, the red light jumpers and the full-face masked Deliveroo maniacs with their illegal electric bikes, but it is generally ok. I feel generally safe to cycle here, stupid Beemer driver or not.
Siao said:
Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece
The answer to this is front and rear cameras and the Op Crackdown website. It's a pain, but the more cyclists use it, the more prosecutions there will be. This will lead to greater public awareness and hopefully bad drivers will think twice before putting cyclists at risk. Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff