Sailing boats!!

Author
Discussion

zadumbreion

Original Poster:

1,049 posts

235 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
My dad used to drag us out on sailing boats when we were young, and we hated it.

I've just noticed how cheap small yachts are, and the crazy idea of subjecting my own kids to the same thing in case they enjoyed it seems to have entered my brain.

1. What qualifications would you need to be able to sail something like a 24 foot sailing boat? I did do various RYA things when I was younger - are these essential?

2. How long does it take to get the relevant qualifications, assuming you've done a bit of sailing before, including charts, bearings etc etc?

3. Once you have the qualifications, what else would you need to be able to sail to, say, France? Would the problem be that once there you wouldn't be able to afford a mooring or something? Is there a catch?

thinfourth2

32,414 posts

219 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
No qualifications needed what so ever in the UK

Feel free to kill yourself without the nanny state butting in

Simpo Two

89,012 posts

280 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
thinfourth2 said:
No qualifications needed what so ever in the UK

Feel free to kill yourself without the nanny state butting in
Don't you need some kind of navigation qualification to cross the Channel? It's bloody busy.

Muntu

7,662 posts

214 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
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I have yet to get to the bottom of the concept of "tacking". It just doesn't add up
for me.

Mrs Grumpy

863 posts

204 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
There is nothing stopping you buying a yacht and sailing across to France tomorrow. You might well die trying though.... A fair few yachts have disappeared without trace in the channel. IMHO apart from needing to know how to sail the boat, you need to know about charts, navigation and tides, etc. The channel is the busiest shipping lane in the world and can be quite confusing around Portsmouth / Southampton / IOW.

Moorings aren't too expensive (well, wasn't when I was last there, which, thinking about it, was a few years back now!). Quite nice to sail along the Normandy coast.

thinfourth2

32,414 posts

219 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
thinfourth2 said:
No qualifications needed what so ever in the UK

Feel free to kill yourself without the nanny state butting in
Don't you need some kind of navigation qualification to cross the Channel? It's bloody busy.
Nope no licence needed to get run over by a container ship doing 30mph

Damn good idea to learn the rules though

Engineer1

10,486 posts

224 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
Borrowing/renting a boat they may want RYA or similar qualifications but for your own boat, buy it then sail to france / get stuck in the harbor, blown off course and end up god knows where.

BigLepton

5,042 posts

216 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
thinfourth2 said:
No qualifications needed what so ever in the UK

Feel free to kill yourself without the nanny state butting in
Don't you need some kind of navigation qualification to cross the Channel? It's bloody busy.
Nope, completely free of interferance from govt and do-gooders. Go and buy yourself a 4000hp 70 foot motoryacht and go wherever you like at 40knots with no tests, no licences and no insurance if you don't fancy it! smile

alfaman

6,416 posts

249 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
I did my Yachtmaster nav. course via evening classes at the local college - took about 8 months IIRC.

I used to be one of the skippers in the Sailing club where I used to work at (company which spnsored RTW race )

Legally you can sail in the UK without either theory or practical Day skipper or Coastal skipper / yachtmaster exams - however I would *really* not recommend sailing X-channel without a LOT of experience and appropriate quals.

Bear in mind as skipper you are legally responsible for the others on board - and its unlikely you could charter a boat without RYA quals.

In France - mooring charges along the Brittany coast are generally less than round the solent area ( maybe not now thought wiht 1 euro = 1 pound , anyway the charges arent exortionate )

I have sailed across the channel several times - and really enjoyed it , just be aware that quite a bit can go badly wrong on a yacht...and if you are 40 miles from shore it's good to know how to deal with every eventuality.


EDIT: I would NOT take a 24 foot yacht across the channel unless it was completely millpond-like. 35 to 45 footers are far more appropriate IMHO


Edited by alfaman on Saturday 10th January 21:31

zadumbreion

Original Poster:

1,049 posts

235 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
No nanny state involvement at all??

jeez, it's almost worth doing just for that.

I did do the RYA yachtsman's certificate thing with my Dad, and did everything including day and night navigation etc - only to be told by the guy that he couldn't give me a certificate because I was too young. I was, not surprisingly, somewhat upset....

zadumbreion

Original Poster:

1,049 posts

235 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
What are the pros / cons of a single hull versus a trimaran?

Al W

591 posts

242 months

Saturday 10th January 2009
quotequote all
zadumbreion said:
What are the pros / cons of a single hull versus a trimaran?
A modern trimaran will generally offer less accommodation than an equivalent monohull, but sail faster and heel less. An analogy might be sportscar v saloon?

For more detailed answer you'd have to be more specific. As with anything else, there are good and bad examples of each.

XJSJohn

16,085 posts

234 months

Sunday 11th January 2009
quotequote all
alfaman said:
EDIT: I would NOT take a 24 foot yacht across the channel unless it was completely millpond-like. 35 to 45 footers are far more appropriate IMHO


Edited by alfaman on Saturday 10th January 21:31
I think i know what you are getting at but perhaps a better way to say it is that 24ft is still a small boat, and you need to be aware of the boats (and your) limitations before setting off. But then this applies to any size of boat.

FWIW i have done channel crossings in the past in boats smaller than 24 ft too ... (although i would not want to do, say a poole - cherbourg crossing in such.)

to the OP, no quals needed, but may be worth booking yourself onto a weekend sailing course just to remind you what everything does before you start inflicting your Captain Ahab on your nippers hehe


donutsina911

1,049 posts

199 months

Sunday 11th January 2009
quotequote all
zadumbreion said:
My dad used to drag us out on sailing boats when we were young, and we hated it.

I've just noticed how cheap small yachts are, and the crazy idea of subjecting my own kids to the same thing in case they enjoyed it seems to have entered my brain.

1. What qualifications would you need to be able to sail something like a 24 foot sailing boat? I did do various RYA things when I was younger - are these essential?

2. How long does it take to get the relevant qualifications, assuming you've done a bit of sailing before, including charts, bearings etc etc?

3. Once you have the qualifications, what else would you need to be able to sail to, say, France? Would the problem be that once there you wouldn't be able to afford a mooring or something? Is there a catch?
1. None required by law,although you must have a VHF ticket to operate a marine VHF legally. I'd recommend at least doing RYA Competent Crew before considering investing in a yacht (to see if you still enjoy it and to build miles for next level of course) and then at least Day Skipper before/when buying. Not sure how easy you'd find it to get insurance without a ticket, especially for crossing the channel.

If you can do the training on your own boat then its a big plus in my eyes, rather than doing it on a school's 34ft Bavaria that wont have the string and rags in the same place as your pride and joy and will no doubt handle completely differently.

2. If you've got Competent Crew, you can do a combined Day Skipper practical and theory in about 9/10 days in one hit - cost about £800 IIRC. If you're anywhere near the South Coast, I'd highly recommend having a chat with Doug, the principle/owner at Stormforce Coaching (www.stormforce.biz).

3. Crossing the channel is a big deal in a yacht - wind,tide, the busiest shipping lanes (combined with limited maneuverability) and generally speaking a small aux engine mean that it's a different ball game to jumping on a 24ft powerboat, pointing south and driving.

That said, a yacht of 24ft would easily be capable of the crossing all things being equal - plenty of smaller craft to it all the time. But (trying not to be a patronising tt here), I'd aim for getting to the Isle of Wight a few time first before trying France, just to get a feel for the yacht, you, your crew and a smaller but similar environment.

Here's a basic list of kit that'd I'd want to carry on any yacht heading for France, in addition to all the essentials like echo sounder, charts etc..I've probably missed loads, but here's a few..


- Radar Reflector (even better if you can get active like SeaMe)
- Lifejackets with harnesses
- Fire extinguishers (at least two)
- Fire blankets
- Throwing line and lifebouys
- High powered search light
- Emergency tiller or secondary steering device
- Foghorn
- Nautical almanac
- Charts and pilots for the route taken by the Rally
- Auto and manual bilge pumps and buckets
- Sea sickness tablets
- Drinking water
- Offshore flare pack
- EPIRB
- First Aid Kit
- Handheld VHF
- Fixed VHF
- Sea Anchor
- Tool kit
- Torch and Search light
- Thermal Protection Aids
- Liferaft


Marinas in Northern France arent too expensive - for a 24 ft yacht I reckon on allowing for e25 per night.

zadumbreion

Original Poster:

1,049 posts

235 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
Great info, thanks guys...

XJSJohn

16,085 posts

234 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
And remember one thing (a lesson learnt by us just last weekend)

Regularly practice a man overboard drill and make some fun of it.

We lost a hat over the side so decided to do a MOB drill by way of recovery and boy did we make a complete pigs ear of it, whats more worrying is the experiance onboard including 2 offshore DSV operators and many thousands of combined ocean cruising, round the cans sailing, dinghy and speedboat miles / hours!!!

Lets just say that next weekend we may be doing a few MOB practices as our poor hat was killed several times over hehe

donutsina911

1,049 posts

199 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
zadumbreion, cant see where you're based, but if you want a second opinion on any yachts on the south coast, feel free to PM me - more than happy to kick tyres and beat up brokers on price for an afternoon or two..

tank slapper

7,949 posts

298 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
XJSJohn said:
And remember one thing (a lesson learnt by us just last weekend)

Regularly practice a man overboard drill and make some fun of it.

We lost a hat over the side so decided to do a MOB drill by way of recovery and boy did we make a complete pigs ear of it, whats more worrying is the experiance onboard including 2 offshore DSV operators and many thousands of combined ocean cruising, round the cans sailing, dinghy and speedboat miles / hours!!!

Lets just say that next weekend we may be doing a few MOB practices as our poor hat was killed several times over hehe
And that is before you have to actually get a potentially unconcious person back on board. Lifting the dead weight of a man and sodden clothing up the freeboard of a yacht is incredibly difficult and will often be impossible for a single person to do without rigging up some sort of tackle to help.

Very worthwhile spending the time to sort out how you would do this if you had to.

XJSJohn

16,085 posts

234 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
indeed, fortunately for us most MOB's are wearing just shorts and T-shirts and with water temps of 20c little risk of cold, and its still a lot more difficult than you might think!!

We have MOB recovery systems on board most boats (because offshore for us tends to be a minimum 20 hours with no coastguard or RNLI to hand) but it gets you thinking "how does this work" followed by "how does this work when i am rolling about in a 70mph Sumatra ... "




Snoggledog

8,636 posts

232 months

Monday 12th January 2009
quotequote all
XJSJohn said:
And remember one thing (a lesson learnt by us just last weekend)

Regularly practice a man overboard drill and make some fun of it.

We lost a hat over the side so decided to do a MOB drill by way of recovery and boy did we make a complete pigs ear of it, whats more worrying is the experiance onboard including 2 offshore DSV operators and many thousands of combined ocean cruising, round the cans sailing, dinghy and speedboat miles / hours!!!

Lets just say that next weekend we may be doing a few MOB practices as our poor hat was killed several times over hehe
That's why I like dinghies. Drag 'em in over the transom. Hell of a lot easier than having to haul someone up the side of a yacht.