How different is a real piano to an electric one? Struggling
Discussion
I brought a Roland FP10 electric piano a year ago as according to reviews the key action was the most realistic at the price point compared to a real piano. A friend has a different electric, might be a Yamaha, that was similar money (£300) which I actually prefer playing, the keyboards is more squishy and the sound is better.
As I say, I got the Roland as I thought it would be more helpful, but in fact whenever I noodle on a real one neither the Roland or Yamaha electric seems remotely close to the feeling of acoustic keys. Even the shape of the keys - real pianos seem to have physically higher, thinner black notes.
I'm doubting whether I'm going to be able to transfer my skills to a real or more advanced electric piano when I get one. Do I need to throw money at the problem? Or am I worrying about nothing, I will get used to different pianos quickly?
As I say, I got the Roland as I thought it would be more helpful, but in fact whenever I noodle on a real one neither the Roland or Yamaha electric seems remotely close to the feeling of acoustic keys. Even the shape of the keys - real pianos seem to have physically higher, thinner black notes.
I'm doubting whether I'm going to be able to transfer my skills to a real or more advanced electric piano when I get one. Do I need to throw money at the problem? Or am I worrying about nothing, I will get used to different pianos quickly?
I’ve never played an electric piano that you could mistake for a real one.
All pianos (electric and proper) vary considerably with their action. With real pianos, bluthners for instance tend to have much softer actions than Steinways. It of course also depends on the age of the piano vs the maintenance it’s had.
In my opinion, pianos with harder actions are initially a little harder to play if you’re coming from a softer one, but when you’re used to the harder action actually easier and better for good technique.
My background is as a professional string player, not a professional pianist, so am happy to be told I’m wrong!
All pianos (electric and proper) vary considerably with their action. With real pianos, bluthners for instance tend to have much softer actions than Steinways. It of course also depends on the age of the piano vs the maintenance it’s had.
In my opinion, pianos with harder actions are initially a little harder to play if you’re coming from a softer one, but when you’re used to the harder action actually easier and better for good technique.
My background is as a professional string player, not a professional pianist, so am happy to be told I’m wrong!
nuyorican said:
First off. What you’re talking about is usually described as a digital piano rather than an electric piano. When one thinks of electric pianos, it’s usually something like a Rhodes piano, which has a distinctive bluesy sound thanks to the ‘electric’ components. Valves, I think?
Digital pianos are just that. A piano emulation with digital benefits like volume control and headphones support etc, and fewer of the drawbacks of a real piano, like weight, having to tune it etc.
Some are better than others. I’m not sure about your model, I’m not familiar with it. Though of course Roland are a quality brand. I have a Yamaha Clavinova, which has weighted, graded keys which is what you want if you’re looking to transfer easily to an acoustic.
One thing everyone notices about digital pianos is that the keys make a loud ‘clunk’ when they return to their tracks unplayed position. Some are better than others, and older pianos are worse for it as the felt gets worn. Acoustic pianos will likely have this issue too, but as they’re so damned loud you’d probably not notice it.
Yep noted, digital piano, cheers. Digital pianos are just that. A piano emulation with digital benefits like volume control and headphones support etc, and fewer of the drawbacks of a real piano, like weight, having to tune it etc.
Some are better than others. I’m not sure about your model, I’m not familiar with it. Though of course Roland are a quality brand. I have a Yamaha Clavinova, which has weighted, graded keys which is what you want if you’re looking to transfer easily to an acoustic.
One thing everyone notices about digital pianos is that the keys make a loud ‘clunk’ when they return to their tracks unplayed position. Some are better than others, and older pianos are worse for it as the felt gets worn. Acoustic pianos will likely have this issue too, but as they’re so damned loud you’d probably not notice it.
I was aware of the Clarinovas but even with them some of the reviews make them sound, er, out dated in terms of tech for the money they are.
Typically the keybed of a digital piano will be a different design to an acoustic. There may be others BUT the only digital piano that I’m aware of with real wooden keys with an extended key pivot length of an acoustic grand piano is the Kawai MP11SE.
As said above, there is much difference between the key feel of different acoustic pianos so it’s not quite as simple as digital v acoustic.
I started learning some years ago on a Nord piano and then a Roland RD2000 and now use a Nord Grand. The NG has one of Kawai’s best keybeds which I really like but I would assume it’s not to everyone’s taste. It’s very light.
On the other hand, I regularly play 2 acoustic grand pianos; a really old Chappell and a 1980s Yamaha. When I originally started on the Chappell I did not like the lightness of the keys but as I got better (currently doing my AMRSM Grade 8) I began to love it for its lightness because it allows for so much more expressive playing. I originally loved playing the Yamaha for its weighty keys but that’s no longer the case.
So, a digital will never really feel exactly like an acoustic but then one acoustic does not feel like another. Even then, the feel of one may really suit your playing style, or just feel right whereas another will not.
After saying all that, if it’s just piano at home you’re interested in then I would personally prefer an acoustic grand (I could possibly fit a baby grand in my house as it is but probably a step too far - but who knows). I don’t get on with uprights as I just don’t like the upper front being right in front of me. But if you don’t have the space, or want something more portable, then a digital is the only way to go.
So no one right answer, unfortunately.
Edit for spelling and using electric where I mean digital
As said above, there is much difference between the key feel of different acoustic pianos so it’s not quite as simple as digital v acoustic.
I started learning some years ago on a Nord piano and then a Roland RD2000 and now use a Nord Grand. The NG has one of Kawai’s best keybeds which I really like but I would assume it’s not to everyone’s taste. It’s very light.
On the other hand, I regularly play 2 acoustic grand pianos; a really old Chappell and a 1980s Yamaha. When I originally started on the Chappell I did not like the lightness of the keys but as I got better (currently doing my AMRSM Grade 8) I began to love it for its lightness because it allows for so much more expressive playing. I originally loved playing the Yamaha for its weighty keys but that’s no longer the case.
So, a digital will never really feel exactly like an acoustic but then one acoustic does not feel like another. Even then, the feel of one may really suit your playing style, or just feel right whereas another will not.
After saying all that, if it’s just piano at home you’re interested in then I would personally prefer an acoustic grand (I could possibly fit a baby grand in my house as it is but probably a step too far - but who knows). I don’t get on with uprights as I just don’t like the upper front being right in front of me. But if you don’t have the space, or want something more portable, then a digital is the only way to go.
So no one right answer, unfortunately.
Edit for spelling and using electric where I mean digital
Edited by Arrivalist on Monday 12th August 09:34
I have a Roland stage piano, also a Yamaha work station.... they can't really compare to the real thing that weighs in over 600 pounds and have a more complex action.
I tend to think of them as different instruments offering different benefits. I would struggle to find a keyboard that came really close to the actual instrument.
I tend to think of them as different instruments offering different benefits. I would struggle to find a keyboard that came really close to the actual instrument.
Just realised your last point has not been answered.
Yes, you will be able to transfer your skills from one to another BUT that highlights a very important fact - you really should develop good technique/technical ability in the first place.
There is absolutely no substitute for technical skills IF you want to play accurately, fluidly, musically.
Yes, you will be able to transfer your skills from one to another BUT that highlights a very important fact - you really should develop good technique/technical ability in the first place.
There is absolutely no substitute for technical skills IF you want to play accurately, fluidly, musically.
We have a Kawai CS10. Bought it second had to ease the financial pain.
It has the same physical case, keys and soundboard as an acoustic piano and honestly it sounds and plays better than most real pianos.
My brother has a Clavinova and the second you touch a key and play a note it feels completely artificial compared to the Kawai.
It has the same physical case, keys and soundboard as an acoustic piano and honestly it sounds and plays better than most real pianos.
My brother has a Clavinova and the second you touch a key and play a note it feels completely artificial compared to the Kawai.
They are always going to be vastly different, but you can still learn and develop technique on a digital piano. I didn't have access to an acoustic piano for about a decade from my late teens to my late 20's, relying on a stage piano for practise, and didn't lose the ability. You'll just appreciate a good acoustic piano all the more when you get your hands on one.
I would rather have a cheap digital than a cheap acoustic in any case, because poorly maintained low value acoustic pianos are abysmal (to me), so unless you have the space, can make the noise and are happy to put several thousand pounds into buying and then maintaining and tuning a half-decent acoustic I'd just stick with what you've got, or trade it for something you prefer.
You will not get near the feel and resonance of an acoustic piano without spending many thousands of pounds on the best digital/hybrid and if that were the case I'd say an acoustic would do a much better job of holding its value. I bought a mid 90's Yamaha U3 in 2007 and sold in 2022 for twice what I paid nominally.
I would rather have a cheap digital than a cheap acoustic in any case, because poorly maintained low value acoustic pianos are abysmal (to me), so unless you have the space, can make the noise and are happy to put several thousand pounds into buying and then maintaining and tuning a half-decent acoustic I'd just stick with what you've got, or trade it for something you prefer.
You will not get near the feel and resonance of an acoustic piano without spending many thousands of pounds on the best digital/hybrid and if that were the case I'd say an acoustic would do a much better job of holding its value. I bought a mid 90's Yamaha U3 in 2007 and sold in 2022 for twice what I paid nominally.
Edited by theboss on Monday 19th August 16:27
nuyorican said:
Ronstein said:
I was listening to an interview with Tony Banks (Genesis) last week and he was saying that there were songs recorded on acoustic piano that had almost never played live because it was impossible to replicate the range of sound on an electric piano.
Lazy.He just couldn't be arsed to bring the piano. You never saw Freddie Mercury saying "sorry LiveAid, can't play 'We Are The Champions' today because we couldn't be arsed to bring the piano".
Joke by the way. I love Tony Banks.
theboss said:
Ultimately look at how classical repertoire is performed, when did you ever walk into a 2000-seat hall for one of the big concertos to see a digital instrument and PA system. Instead there’s a concert grand with the lid up and no mics in sight.
Often wondered about that, in a non amplified concert hall setting a soloist isn't drowned out by the 60 piece orchestra behind them. theboss said:
Ultimately look at how classical repertoire is performed, when did you ever walk into a 2000-seat hall for one of the big concertos to see a digital instrument and PA system. Instead there’s a concert grand with the lid up and no mics in sight.
I think your confusing/conflating what to learn on with what to perform on.Even a dirt cheap (or free) old piano will give 1000x more 'feel' and 'vibe' than an electric keyboard, unless you spend many thousands on one which has fully weighted keys, an excellent sound system etc.etc.
If this is more of a fun hobby and you have the space to spare, I'd be looking for a local piano tuner who could help you source a half decent upright then come and tune it up for you - it'll be a much more involving experience and IME keep you interested in learning in the longer term.
If this is more of a fun hobby and you have the space to spare, I'd be looking for a local piano tuner who could help you source a half decent upright then come and tune it up for you - it'll be a much more involving experience and IME keep you interested in learning in the longer term.
Arrivalist said:
theboss said:
Ultimately look at how classical repertoire is performed, when did you ever walk into a 2000-seat hall for one of the big concertos to see a digital instrument and PA system. Instead there’s a concert grand with the lid up and no mics in sight.
I think your confusing/conflating what to learn on with what to perform on.theboss said:
Arrivalist said:
theboss said:
Ultimately look at how classical repertoire is performed, when did you ever walk into a 2000-seat hall for one of the big concertos to see a digital instrument and PA system. Instead there’s a concert grand with the lid up and no mics in sight.
I think your confusing/conflating what to learn on with what to perform on.Arrivalist said:
theboss said:
Arrivalist said:
theboss said:
Ultimately look at how classical repertoire is performed, when did you ever walk into a 2000-seat hall for one of the big concertos to see a digital instrument and PA system. Instead there’s a concert grand with the lid up and no mics in sight.
I think your confusing/conflating what to learn on with what to perform on.nuyorican said:
Not sure about that first paragraph. There's a lot of junk pianos that seem to go round the city from house to house. 'FREE PIANO' gets everyone all excited, but really, the last owners just wanted it shifted for free.The new owners will get some friends and hire a van, only to get it in place to find it's untunable. I bet piano tuners see hear the same pianos over and over in different houses 
I have an old digital. A Yamaha Clavinova. The action I think is close enough for me. I don't rate the sound though. I have it hooked up via MIDI to an old Roland JV1080 sound module which has some lovely piano sounds, amongst others. The audio then goes to a power amp and out to a big pair of speakers in front of me. I love this setup but it's nothing like an acoustic upright. For a start, the sound is in front of you rather than kind of underneath. Maybe it's similar to how a grand sounds? But I've never played a grand.
To clarify, I didn't say any old piano will be a 'better' solution for the OP than an electric piano, but it will certainly have nice chunky keys and a proper feel! I have an old digital. A Yamaha Clavinova. The action I think is close enough for me. I don't rate the sound though. I have it hooked up via MIDI to an old Roland JV1080 sound module which has some lovely piano sounds, amongst others. The audio then goes to a power amp and out to a big pair of speakers in front of me. I love this setup but it's nothing like an acoustic upright. For a start, the sound is in front of you rather than kind of underneath. Maybe it's similar to how a grand sounds? But I've never played a grand.
If he wanted to go down that route though a local tuner will probably have some good ideas where to find one which is in good shape rather than taking a flyer and discovering later that it needs surgery. Alternatively there are plenty of dealers around, but obviously there's a premium to pay.
The baby-grand Challen here was incredibly cheap, simply because people struggle to find enough space for them these days.
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