Breaking Bad (including spoilers)
Discussion
I think that is quite telling of players in the drug business though. Driven people with acute business acumen usually pursue other legal fields. Illegal drugs tend to attract those looking for a quick and easy payday, not really the sort with much forward planning and sensible decision making. The reason why they are successful at all is more to do with profit margins and demand, not really because they know how to operate a business professionally.
I knew (this was a few years back) a few people who were in that industry and did very well out of it, but they could barely string together a proper sentence, never mind read one. They were also so careless with their money (spending it openly on items that scream "drug dealer") that it was a wonder they ever lasted as long as they did.
I knew (this was a few years back) a few people who were in that industry and did very well out of it, but they could barely string together a proper sentence, never mind read one. They were also so careless with their money (spending it openly on items that scream "drug dealer") that it was a wonder they ever lasted as long as they did.
redtwin said:
I think that is quite telling of players in the drug business though. Driven people with acute business acumen usually pursue other legal fields. Illegal drugs tend to attract those looking for a quick and easy payday, not really the sort with much forward planning and sensible decision making. The reason why they are successful at all is more to do with profit margins and demand, not really because they know how to operate a business professionally.
I knew (this was a few years back) a few people who were in that industry and did very well out of it, but they could barely string together a proper sentence, never mind read one. They were also so careless with their money (spending it openly on items that scream "drug dealer") that it was a wonder they ever lasted as long as they did.
Very astute point, I too know some shady characters and their opinion of their business acumen is a long way away from where their actual skill levels lie! It's like shooting fish in a barrel when selling illegal drugs! I knew (this was a few years back) a few people who were in that industry and did very well out of it, but they could barely string together a proper sentence, never mind read one. They were also so careless with their money (spending it openly on items that scream "drug dealer") that it was a wonder they ever lasted as long as they did.
Back on topic, How did Victor get to the apartment to fetch Jessie and where is his transport now? Remember he was in a rush to fetch Jessie as they knew he was going to kill Gale, Now he is home (having taken Jessie in his own car) and dead what happened to his car? Are the police now pawing over it?
freecar said:
Back on topic, How did Victor get to the apartment to fetch Jessie and where is his transport now? Remember he was in a rush to fetch Jessie as they knew he was going to kill Gale, Now he is home (having taken Jessie in his own car) and dead what happened to his car? Are the police now pawing over it?
Exactly. Thats why he had to die. Gus sees things things like that. Details matter. Even the possibly of that means the guy has to go.Its like Goodfellas, after Stax (Samuel L Jackson, playing the guy who was supposed to get rid of the truck) didn't do his job. The cops get the truck, full of fingerprints etc. After that one leak, everyone had to die. Bodies turning up for weeks, anyone who had any connection.
papercup said:
freecar said:
Back on topic, How did Victor get to the apartment to fetch Jessie and where is his transport now? Remember he was in a rush to fetch Jessie as they knew he was going to kill Gale, Now he is home (having taken Jessie in his own car) and dead what happened to his car? Are the police now pawing over it?
Exactly. Thats why he had to die. Gus sees things things like that. Details matter. Even the possibly of that means the guy has to go.Its like Goodfellas, after Stax (Samuel L Jackson, playing the guy who was supposed to get rid of the truck) didn't do his job. The cops get the truck, full of fingerprints etc. After that one leak, everyone had to die. Bodies turning up for weeks, anyone who had any connection.
I don't buy that he was killed for what happened at Gale's apartment, he wouldn't be idenifiable to anybody there as they don't know him, he barely set foot inside so wouldn't have left much in the way of trace evidence.
Remember it was Mike who told Gus of what went on, were he expecting Victor to be killed he wouldn't have freaked out and pulled a gun on Gus, he pretty much jumped out of his skin when Gus opened Victor's neck! This is what makes me think that Gus cared more for Gale than just business, I think they were family or very close friends, maybe they went to college together and it was conversations between the two of them that inspired Gus to persue a life of alternative employment! Either way, Gus is taking this very personally, when he didn't take child murder as seriously.
Well Gale was an investment for GUS he doesn't care about him at all on a personal level. It took him years to find Gale. It was very difficult for him to find someone that was both highly skilled, professional, reliable and would keep quiet. They say so much the hard part is not necessarily finding someone who has skill but someone who will remain quite and has skill. Gus has a very elaborate and expensive multi million dollar set up and he needs someone to run the supply aspect of the business for him.
PaulFontaine said:
Well Gale was an investment for GUS he doesn't care about him at all on a personal level. It took him years to find Gale. It was very difficult for him to find someone that was both highly skilled, professional, reliable and would keep quiet. They say so much the hard part is not necessarily finding someone who has skill but someone who will remain quite and has skill. Gus has a very elaborate and expensive multi million dollar set up and he needs someone to run the supply aspect of the business for him.
And if you remember he had someone already who persuaded him to get Walt to help.This doesn't fit with the whole "business" aspect of Gus, he said himself that 96% would be fine, it was Gale who talked him into going into business with Walt.
If Gus is the consumate professional that we all think he is, why would he risk bringing a new man in for the sake of 3% purity? If it is all business between Gus and Gale how did Gale talk him into going into business with an unknown stranger?
Remember the lab was built for Gale, not Walt. Gus didn't need Walt in any way shape or form, he had a good cook, meth heads don't care whether it's 99% pure or 96% as long as they get their fix.
Why would Gus accept a user and a stranger into his world when he had everything he needed? Why would Gus kill a trusted individual after losing another? If finding these people is as hard as people say then he surely wouldn't volunteer to lose another over the death of a commodity?
freecar said:
And if you remember he had someone already who persuaded him to get Walt to help.
This doesn't fit with the whole "business" aspect of Gus, he said himself that 96% would be fine, it was Gale who talked him into going into business with Walt.
If Gus is the consumate professional that we all think he is, why would he risk bringing a new man in for the sake of 3% purity? If it is all business between Gus and Gale how did Gale talk him into going into business with an unknown stranger?
Remember the lab was built for Gale, not Walt. Gus didn't need Walt in any way shape or form, he had a good cook, meth heads don't care whether it's 99% pure or 96% as long as they get their fix.
Why would Gus accept a user and a stranger into his world when he had everything he needed? Why would Gus kill a trusted individual after losing another? If finding these people is as hard as people say then he surely wouldn't volunteer to lose another over the death of a commodity?
Yes the Gus did not want Walt and Jessie but since he could not replicate Walt's formula and Gale explained that while it sounded like only a little difference in terms of chemical engineering it was a massive gulf and it would be very worth it to have Walt there for a few months so he could learn and master the secret. Gale's reasoning was that since you've already spent all this money time and trouble why would you want the best product on the market possible and theri product would always be second place to walt'sThis doesn't fit with the whole "business" aspect of Gus, he said himself that 96% would be fine, it was Gale who talked him into going into business with Walt.
If Gus is the consumate professional that we all think he is, why would he risk bringing a new man in for the sake of 3% purity? If it is all business between Gus and Gale how did Gale talk him into going into business with an unknown stranger?
Remember the lab was built for Gale, not Walt. Gus didn't need Walt in any way shape or form, he had a good cook, meth heads don't care whether it's 99% pure or 96% as long as they get their fix.
Why would Gus accept a user and a stranger into his world when he had everything he needed? Why would Gus kill a trusted individual after losing another? If finding these people is as hard as people say then he surely wouldn't volunteer to lose another over the death of a commodity?
I must have missed the bit where Gale introduced Walt to Gus and persuaded him to hire him as has been mentioned?.
The conversation surrounded Gale telling Gus that he could not replicate the purity of the sample. There was nothing there to suggest that Gale knew who made it never mind that he suggested Gus hire Walt. If something happened in previous seasons please mention it as I guess I need to watch them again.
My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that Walt/Heisenberg sought out Gus after he lost Tuco as a distributor. The lab may have been built for Gale, but Gale lacking self confidence, bowed out as he knew he couldn't produce the quality product that Gus wanted to compete with. I am guessing Gale knew better than to disappoint a man like Gus.
The conversation surrounded Gale telling Gus that he could not replicate the purity of the sample. There was nothing there to suggest that Gale knew who made it never mind that he suggested Gus hire Walt. If something happened in previous seasons please mention it as I guess I need to watch them again.
My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that Walt/Heisenberg sought out Gus after he lost Tuco as a distributor. The lab may have been built for Gale, but Gale lacking self confidence, bowed out as he knew he couldn't produce the quality product that Gus wanted to compete with. I am guessing Gale knew better than to disappoint a man like Gus.
PaulFontaine said:
Yes the Gus did not want Walt and Jessie but since he could not replicate Walt's formula and Gale explained that while it sounded like only a little difference in terms of chemical engineering it was a massive gulf and it would be very worth it to have Walt there for a few months so he could learn and master the secret. Gale's reasoning was that since you've already spent all this money time and trouble why would you want the best product on the market possible and theri product would always be second place to walt's
Which would sound plausible if Gus didn't know full well that 96% was fine, it came across as more of a personal favour. Gus didn't seem keen to get into business with Walt, in fact I think he would have had him killed had Gus not insisted he wanted to get the final few points, then the plan changed to allow Gale to learn Walt's secrets then he would be killed. It's a hell of a lot of trouble to go to for no extra profit.redtwin said:
I must have missed the bit where Gale introduced Walt to Gus and persuaded him to hire him as has been mentioned?.
The conversation surrounded Gale telling Gus that he could not replicate the purity of the sample. There was nothing there to suggest that Gale knew who made it never mind that he suggested Gus hire Walt. If something happened in previous seasons please mention it as I guess I need to watch them again.
My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that Walt/Heisenberg sought out Gus after he lost Tuco as a distributor. The lab may have been built for Gale, but Gale lacking self confidence, bowed out as he knew he couldn't produce the quality product that Gus wanted to compete with. I am guessing Gale knew better than to disappoint a man like Gus.
The scene in the Lab where Gus said that the meth that Gale made was fine, showed he didn't need Walt's meth. He only worked with Walt so that Gus could learn his formula.The conversation surrounded Gale telling Gus that he could not replicate the purity of the sample. There was nothing there to suggest that Gale knew who made it never mind that he suggested Gus hire Walt. If something happened in previous seasons please mention it as I guess I need to watch them again.
My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that Walt/Heisenberg sought out Gus after he lost Tuco as a distributor. The lab may have been built for Gale, but Gale lacking self confidence, bowed out as he knew he couldn't produce the quality product that Gus wanted to compete with. I am guessing Gale knew better than to disappoint a man like Gus.
You're right that Walt sought out Gus but if you didn't pick up the part where Gus didn't want to work with Walt you should go back and rewatch them, it was clear in the previous episodes and it was clear from the new one that Gus only worked with Walt to allow Gale to learn how to get the last 3-4%.
Gus didn't need to compete with product quality, he had a lock down on the supply in that state and neighbouring ones. Meth heads don't care for quality as long as it gets them smashed, he was happy to use Gale's 96% product to usurp the cartel, Gale changed his mind, which showed he had quite some influence.
freecar said:
I don't buy that he was killed for what happened at Gale's apartment, he wouldn't be idenifiable to anybody there as they don't know him, he barely set foot inside so wouldn't have left much in the way of trace evidence.
Err what? So people only get caught for things if they know someone? People identify other people all the time when they don't know them. In a town near the border where there are loads of hispanics, and people are used to seeing them, and they don't all 'look the same', expecting no-one to be able to identify him was ridiculous, hence why Mike stared at him like he was stupid when he said it. He turned up at Gail's flat and barged in and stood there and looked around, and then left, all the while being stared at by several witnesses. It was a daft thing to do. It was very obvious he could be identified, and his car being nearby only adds to that possibility.
(Whereas you heard the witness say that they did not see Jessie, they only heard the shot.)
Mike told Gus. Gus tidied the loose end and at the same time sent a message.
freecar said:
The scene in the Lab where Gus said that the meth that Gale made was fine, showed he didn't need Walt's meth. He only worked with Walt so that Gus could learn his formula.
You're right that Walt sought out Gus but if you didn't pick up the part where Gus didn't want to work with Walt you should go back and rewatch them, it was clear in the previous episodes and it was clear from the new one that Gus only worked with Walt to allow Gale to learn how to get the last 3-4%.
Gus didn't need to compete with product quality, he had a lock down on the supply in that state and neighbouring ones. Meth heads don't care for quality as long as it gets them smashed, he was happy to use Gale's 96% product to usurp the cartel, Gale changed his mind, which showed he had quite some influence.
It's been over a year since I watched the last season so I guess my memory is shaky. It was only from this last episode that it became apparent (to me) that Gale was the first choice to run the lab. In the previous season Gus brought Walt to the lab and asked him to cook for him, Gale was nowhere to be seen until Jessie flaked out and Walt said he needed an assistant. Walt asked for help and Gus provided Gale. I guess that could be a wily con that Gus had planned all along, but I am not seeing the same back story you are.You're right that Walt sought out Gus but if you didn't pick up the part where Gus didn't want to work with Walt you should go back and rewatch them, it was clear in the previous episodes and it was clear from the new one that Gus only worked with Walt to allow Gale to learn how to get the last 3-4%.
Gus didn't need to compete with product quality, he had a lock down on the supply in that state and neighbouring ones. Meth heads don't care for quality as long as it gets them smashed, he was happy to use Gale's 96% product to usurp the cartel, Gale changed his mind, which showed he had quite some influence.
I will re-watch this last episode and DL the last season again.
papercup said:
Err what? So people only get caught for things if they know someone? People identify other people all the time when they don't know them. In a town near the border where there are loads of hispanics, and people are used to seeing them, and they don't all 'look the same', expecting no-one to be able to identify him was ridiculous, hence why Mike stared at him like he was stupid when he said it.
He turned up at Gail's flat and barged in and stood there and looked around, and then left, all the while being stared at by several witnesses. It was a daft thing to do. It was very obvious he could be identified, and his car being nearby only adds to that possibility.
(Whereas you heard the witness say that they did not see Jessie, they only heard the shot.)
Mike told Gus. Gus tidied the loose end and at the same time sent a message.
Don't get confused by the car, it was just me thinking, we didn't see a car at all, for all we know the writers could have intended him to run there, I was just spitballing.He turned up at Gail's flat and barged in and stood there and looked around, and then left, all the while being stared at by several witnesses. It was a daft thing to do. It was very obvious he could be identified, and his car being nearby only adds to that possibility.
(Whereas you heard the witness say that they did not see Jessie, they only heard the shot.)
Mike told Gus. Gus tidied the loose end and at the same time sent a message.
I don't think the look was about being there, the look was because a cook with direct links to Gus was lying dead and he wasn't able to clean evidence of Gus from the apartment, hence the close up on the lab notes book. Mike was shocked by Gus' reaction, watch it again he nearly shoots him!
I'm sure we'll see in upcoming episodes.
Started watching the last "boxcutter" episode again and in the first few minutes it is still clear to me that Gus built the lab for Gale. Gale on seeing Walt's product loses confidence in his own ability to produce a quality product (his 96% was good enough until he tested Walt's 99%) and as such pretty much talks himself out of the job due to his own insecurities and maybe prior knowledge of Gus' high expectations.
Gale had no clue who Walt was, Gus tells him and then goes on to say that he isn't professional enough to work with (which is true). In the end Gus realizing that Gale is not up to the job (mentally anyway) decides that Walt and his baggage is worth it to get the best product possible.
Just not seeing the angle where Walt was brought in as an assistant for/to teach Gale, but then I haven't re-watched the last season yet. There could have been a bit I missed where Gale talked Gus into getting Walt on-board.
I guess only writers will know for sure.
Gale had no clue who Walt was, Gus tells him and then goes on to say that he isn't professional enough to work with (which is true). In the end Gus realizing that Gale is not up to the job (mentally anyway) decides that Walt and his baggage is worth it to get the best product possible.
Just not seeing the angle where Walt was brought in as an assistant for/to teach Gale, but then I haven't re-watched the last season yet. There could have been a bit I missed where Gale talked Gus into getting Walt on-board.
I guess only writers will know for sure.
Gus didn't want Gale to pursue to last few percent, he was happy with what Gale could already make.
He wouldn't have invested all that money into the lab if he was going to leave it up to Gale whether he was going to cook or not.
Watch season three, Gus conspires to bring Walt to Gale, he goes through a lot of checks before he exposes the lab or Gale to Walt. It is only when Walt can concoct a mistake that he gets rid of Gale and brings Jessie in.
It's not really fair because I've watched them all through at least three times! The most recent were only a few weeks ago in preperation for the upcoming season.
He wouldn't have invested all that money into the lab if he was going to leave it up to Gale whether he was going to cook or not.
Watch season three, Gus conspires to bring Walt to Gale, he goes through a lot of checks before he exposes the lab or Gale to Walt. It is only when Walt can concoct a mistake that he gets rid of Gale and brings Jessie in.
It's not really fair because I've watched them all through at least three times! The most recent were only a few weeks ago in preperation for the upcoming season.
Pretty minor episode didn't really push the story too much further. After the last couple of really good ones I look forward to watching this show every week and am almost getting into the danger of reading too much into the little subtle thing the director throws in there.
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http://www.bettercallsaul.com/
PaulFontaine said:
Awesome, thanks for that!I hoped the episode was going to be a little informative but it wasn't.
I was glad to see hank walking as that helps me figure out how long the writers will keep him in recovery!
I can't believe Walt and that gun, what is he thinking? Also going to Mike after the new guy started, what is he on? If there is a new guy that means that even if he kills Gus he is not safe, so hardly the time to be talking to Mike.
Disappointed in Jessie not being able to hack the solitude, I thought he had made peace with his decisions and role in this life but it seems no he's just as screwed up as ever.
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