Taking the knee
Discussion
irc said:
ATG said:
"Taking the knee" means whatever the individual taking the knee says it means.
If you say it means something different after they've explained to you what they mean by doing it, that is entirely your problem.
So if I do a Hitler salute but say that to me it means brotherly love and equality that's OK? Because that is what I mean by it. The fact most others regard it as a fascist symbol does not matter?If you say it means something different after they've explained to you what they mean by doing it, that is entirely your problem.
"Taking the knee" has no generally excepted meaning. As someone posted above, before BLM it already had different meanings in different contexts. The footballers have come out and quite clearly explained what they mean by it and it clearly is not taking a political stance on anything. Is that not adequate? How could any reasonable person object further?
105.4 said:
chrispmartha said:
I am saying BLM means different things to different people, you might think that everyone thinks its a marxist political organisation, but they don't.
And there is the root of the problem.BLM is a Marxist organisation, (by their very own admission), and large parts of society are too ignorant or too dumb to realise that, or to realise that Marxism in its various guises is never, ever, a good think, (see my post a few pages back for my Wife’s own personal experiences of growing up under the kosh of the Maoist variant of Marxism and try imagining yourself in her shoes).
https://blacklivesmatter.uk
So now you're calling people dumb and ignorant for having a different opinion than you.
I read your post on your wife's experience it its dreadful and I have every bit of empathy for what she went through and I can understand why it would form your view on this issue.
Can you understand how people who have been subjected to racism might have a different view on what BLM means to them?
ATG said:
GroundZero said:
The whole function of group identity politics is to actively look for differences/inequalities/oppression in any form, which can then be inflated in to a social/political problem narrative.
All the time ignoring the obvious; that people are different, individual and don't wish to be treated as a basic 'number' within a group.
Any way, my opinion on "taking the knee"; no matter how many times the lefties say its nothing to do with the BLM, it is very much to do with the BLM.
"Taking the knee" has become synonymous with the BLM, whereby the media lapped it up during the BLM's violent and criminal performances during the riots. Although the narrative for the BLM is advertised as "anti-racist", they are in fact a political movement whether people like it or not. Along with that, given that the leaders of the BLM advertised themselves as "trained marxists", and the same groups of people are involved with antifa, it is an extremist political movement that many do not wish to be part of.
I'm all for sport stamping out racism, but "taking the knee" is political and is associated with an extremist group of people, which should be very much avoided.
Instead of "taking the knee" an alternative sporting demonstration should be voiced or visualised to target racism.
"Taking the knee" means whatever the individual taking the knee says it means.All the time ignoring the obvious; that people are different, individual and don't wish to be treated as a basic 'number' within a group.
Any way, my opinion on "taking the knee"; no matter how many times the lefties say its nothing to do with the BLM, it is very much to do with the BLM.
"Taking the knee" has become synonymous with the BLM, whereby the media lapped it up during the BLM's violent and criminal performances during the riots. Although the narrative for the BLM is advertised as "anti-racist", they are in fact a political movement whether people like it or not. Along with that, given that the leaders of the BLM advertised themselves as "trained marxists", and the same groups of people are involved with antifa, it is an extremist political movement that many do not wish to be part of.
I'm all for sport stamping out racism, but "taking the knee" is political and is associated with an extremist group of people, which should be very much avoided.
Instead of "taking the knee" an alternative sporting demonstration should be voiced or visualised to target racism.
If you say it means something different after they've explained to you what they mean by doing it, that is entirely your problem.
Randy Winkman said:
If someone thinks that taking the knee means someone supports a marxist organisation is it OK for me to think that someone booing them doing it is a racist?
People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
Not forgetting that kneeling is divisive, but booing isn't.People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
Vanden Saab said:
ATG said:
GroundZero said:
The whole function of group identity politics is to actively look for differences/inequalities/oppression in any form, which can then be inflated in to a social/political problem narrative.
All the time ignoring the obvious; that people are different, individual and don't wish to be treated as a basic 'number' within a group.
Any way, my opinion on "taking the knee"; no matter how many times the lefties say its nothing to do with the BLM, it is very much to do with the BLM.
"Taking the knee" has become synonymous with the BLM, whereby the media lapped it up during the BLM's violent and criminal performances during the riots. Although the narrative for the BLM is advertised as "anti-racist", they are in fact a political movement whether people like it or not. Along with that, given that the leaders of the BLM advertised themselves as "trained marxists", and the same groups of people are involved with antifa, it is an extremist political movement that many do not wish to be part of.
I'm all for sport stamping out racism, but "taking the knee" is political and is associated with an extremist group of people, which should be very much avoided.
Instead of "taking the knee" an alternative sporting demonstration should be voiced or visualised to target racism.
"Taking the knee" means whatever the individual taking the knee says it means.All the time ignoring the obvious; that people are different, individual and don't wish to be treated as a basic 'number' within a group.
Any way, my opinion on "taking the knee"; no matter how many times the lefties say its nothing to do with the BLM, it is very much to do with the BLM.
"Taking the knee" has become synonymous with the BLM, whereby the media lapped it up during the BLM's violent and criminal performances during the riots. Although the narrative for the BLM is advertised as "anti-racist", they are in fact a political movement whether people like it or not. Along with that, given that the leaders of the BLM advertised themselves as "trained marxists", and the same groups of people are involved with antifa, it is an extremist political movement that many do not wish to be part of.
I'm all for sport stamping out racism, but "taking the knee" is political and is associated with an extremist group of people, which should be very much avoided.
Instead of "taking the knee" an alternative sporting demonstration should be voiced or visualised to target racism.
If you say it means something different after they've explained to you what they mean by doing it, that is entirely your problem.
Randy Winkman said:
If someone thinks that taking the knee means someone supports a marxist organisation is it OK for me to think that someone booing them doing it is a racist?
People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
It's one of the lovely ironies isn't it?People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
"It's up to me how I interpret taking the knee regardless of what the person doing it says".
"how dare you suggest i'm racist for booing I've repeatedly said I'm not racist why won't you listen to me".
Remarkable
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said:Randy Winkman said:
If someone thinks that taking the knee means someone supports a marxist organisation is it OK for me to think that someone booing them doing it is a racist?
People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
It's one of the lovely ironies isn't it?People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
"It's up to me how I interpret taking the knee regardless of what the person doing it says".
"how dare you suggest i'm racist for booing I've repeatedly said I'm not racist why won't you listen to me".
Remarkable
- Standard NP&E hypocrisy
105.4 said:
chrispmartha said:
I am saying BLM means different things to different people, you might think that everyone thinks its a marxist political organisation, but they don't.
And there is the root of the problem.BLM is a Marxist organisation, (by their very own admission), and large parts of society are too ignorant or too dumb to realise that, or to realise that Marxism in its various guises is never, ever, a good think, (see my post a few pages back for my Wife’s own personal experiences of growing up under the kosh of the Maoist variant of Marxism and try imagining yourself in her shoes).
Both "XR" and "BLM" are primarily labels or brands that people associate themselves with and organise their own little groups around. For example, quite a few people in our neighbouring village who had already got together to establish a community garden, volunteered to look after some communal spaces also decided to paint themselves some "XR" placards and have a march to express concern about central government inaction on environmental issues. That is what XR is. It is not a Marxist conspiracy. It's "members" are not trying to overthrow the state. BLM is exactly the same.
There may well be some people who like to think these things are organisations and they're in charge of them and they can be converted into pinko political movements, but they are fantasists,
Pugaris said:
They aren't equatable. Colin Kapernick popularised taking a knee, he is not BLM's equivalent of Hitler, taking the knee is not a pledge of allegiance to the Black Lives Matter organisation, no matter how much you try to paint it as such. The Nazi salute is a pledge of allegiance to Nazism.
I doubt he did in the U.K., I would surprised if the average person on the street knew who he was mrporsche said:
I doubt he did in the U.K., I would surprised if the average person on the street knew who he was
You doubt that the taking of a knee at UK sports events is directly linked to Kapernick doing it in the NFL? Are you for real? The average person on the street not knowing who he is isn't relevant, really. The protests in football are a direct copy of Kapernick's.
Vanden Saab said:
chrispmartha said:
Do you think a Nazi salute and Taking the Knee have comparable meanings to people?
So you agree that peoples understanding of what something means is important then?So, you think they have comparable meanings?
Vanden Saab said:
chrispmartha said:
Do you think a Nazi salute and Taking the Knee have comparable meanings to people?
So you agree that peoples understanding of what something means is important then?Do you think the intent of a multimillionaire taking the knee at a football match is to show their support for Marxism?
Do you think the intent of a person doing a Nazi salute is to show their support for Nazism?
If you answer those questions truthfully, you'll see why your desire to equate them is nonsense.
chrispmartha said:
Black Lives Matter UK is not a marxist organisation.
https://blacklivesmatter.uk
Can you understand how people who have been subjected to racism might have a different view on what BLM means to them?
BLM UK, do they have a local branch in Henley upon Thames, give me strength!https://blacklivesmatter.uk
Can you understand how people who have been subjected to racism might have a different view on what BLM means to them?
Black Lives Matter said:
Black Lives Matter Global Network Foundation, Inc. is a global organization in the US, UK, and Canada, whose mission is to eradicate white supremacy
BLM. The BLM as formed from the US, and is still peddling the same old crap. Black Lives Matter said:
Join the Movement to fight for Freedom, Liberation and Justice by signing up for updates, supporting our work, checking out our resources, following us on social media, or wearing our dope, official gear.
Spend your money on our 'dope' merch.....that's awesome I'll have some of that, oh hang on.....Black Lives Matter said:
We appreciate your support of the movement and our ongoing fight to end State-sanctioned violence, liberate Black people, and end white supremacy forever.
erm...Black Lives Matter said:
We affirm the lives of Black queer and trans folks, disabled folks, undocumented folks, folks with records, women, and all Black lives along the gender spectrum. Our network centers those who have been marginalized within Black liberation movements.
but...Black Lives Matter said:
The call for Black lives to matter is a rallying cry for ALL Black lives striving for liberation.
What is marxism?the internet said:
Marxism is a social, political, and economic philosophy named after Karl Marx. It examines the effect of capitalism on labor, productivity, and economic development and argues for a worker revolution to overturn capitalism in favor of communism.
Black Lives Matter said:
We are a collective of liberators who believe in an inclusive and spacious movement. We also believe that in order to win and bring as many people with us along the way, we must move beyond the narrow nationalism that is all too prevalent in Black communities. We must ensure we are building a movement that brings all of us to the front.
If it walks like a duck, and quacks....it's likely a duck.Countdown said:
bhstewie said:
hstewie said:Randy Winkman said:
If someone thinks that taking the knee means someone supports a marxist organisation is it OK for me to think that someone booing them doing it is a racist?
People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
It's one of the lovely ironies isn't it?People taking the knee might be thinking anything and people booing might also be thinking anything.
"It's up to me how I interpret taking the knee regardless of what the person doing it says".
"how dare you suggest i'm racist for booing I've repeatedly said I'm not racist why won't you listen to me".
Remarkable
- Standard NP&E hypocrisy
The people taking the knee have explained what they mean by it.
What they have said is not contentious.
"Booing" has an unambiguous meaning. You are complaining about what someone else is saying or doing.
So, either the booers are:
- opposed to people making a simple anti-racist gesture, which actually seems pretty unlikely
- or they're confused about what the gesture means in spite of what the footballers have said, which seems fairly likely because boneheaded thickos
- or they just like feeling offended about stuff and don't much care if they're being irrational and look a bit silly to the rest of us, which also seems fairly likely
ddom said:
mrporsche said:
I doubt he did in the U.K., I would surprised if the average person on the street knew who he was
It was international news.I would still be surprised if the average person knew who he was .
mrporsche said:
I am not sure what that means in this context. There are loads of international news stories that people have no recollection of.
I would still be surprised if the average person knew who he was .
Selective knowledge these people seem to have.I would still be surprised if the average person knew who he was .
Pretty handy for your argument.
mrporsche said:
ddom said:
mrporsche said:
I doubt he did in the U.K., I would surprised if the average person on the street knew who he was
It was international news.I would still be surprised if the average person knew who he was .
I don't understand what clever point you think you're making.
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