45th President of the United States, Donald Trump. (Vol 4)

[Europa1]

Vanden Saab said:

Taking that statement literally I can understand your point, yes I know it probably dates from the 15th century or something, but in reality he is not far wrong. With the exception of a few scientists and mathematicians no one had ever heard of a trillion it certainly wasn't in everyday use as it seems to be now.

I disagree. Strenuously.

[Halb]

Anyone watch the Putin interviews on SA? Talk about being in charge, from his big desk.

Makes me wonder what Trump looks like doing th same thing.

[Tony33]

maddog993 said:

Vanden Saab said:

Taking that statement literally I can understand your point, yes I know it probably dates from the 15th century or something, but in reality he is not far wrong. With the exception of a few scientists and mathematicians no one had ever heard of a trillion it certainly wasn't in everyday use as it seems to be now.

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/01/06/us/reagan-sends-1-trillion-budget-to-congress-and-battle-is-joined.html
(edited for poor link, sorry)

Indeed.

“We don't have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven't taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much.” Ronald Reagan

1981 I believe...

[Vanden Saab]

Oh my you actually googled it ...

[Tallow]

Vanden Saab said:

Oh my you actually googled it ...

Oh my, you actually thought no one had heard of a trillion before 10 years ago...

[Byker28i]

Byker28i said:

coyft said:

Eric Mc said:

coyft said:

It’s pointless trying to debate with the vast majority on this thread. Let’s take you for example, you’ve stated that Trump is a fool, ignorant, narcissist and everything in between. In your eyes he can’t do ANY good.

So I’m just here to point out the facts every now and again. If you challenge me on the facts I’ll happily enter into a debate.

I’m not a Trump supporter, I think all politicians are self serving.

No point in ALLEGING that you are pointing out facts without backing those facts up.

I AM challenging you on the facts behind the headlines you select. Off you go.

Eric you’re such a bore. If you want to enter into an intellectual debate you at least need to challenge me on something specific.

Crack on.

OK, lets start with the trade negotiations that you posted a headline about. I responded with why I thought they didn't actually amount to too much other than a nice headline for the donald and went into details of the deal and why. What's your thoughts into the specifics of the deal?

As I thought - Coyft has nothing to add other than dropping in with the occasional headline.

[Byker28i]

Seventy said:

Byker28i said:

SO we now know why Mannafort was playing hard ball, Trumps lawyer Dowd was dangling a presidential pardon in front of him and Flynn. We know Trump also kept in contact with them.
Thats witness tampering - surely. Obstruction of Justice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trumps-law...

So Dowd dangles the carrot.
I should imagine it goes something like: 'we're in deep st here boys. Say nothing, take your punishment and don't worry - the President himself has said he'll pardon you for saving his ass'

Where's the obstruction?

So going back to this.

Mannafort and Flynns lawyers were operating under a joint defence agreement with trumps lawyers (Dowd was leading) that allowed them to work together and share information, that means that anything was then protected by client attorney privilege. This shields anything from Muellers investigation, whilst allowing trumps lawyers to plan a joint defence, know everything thats going on etc.

It's no surprise that Dowd was telling them they would have a pardon, neither is it any surprise that the white house has denied this. The white house has denied many things that later turn out to be true.

Flynn has flipped and is giving evidence and has kept very quiet, along with his lawyer.

We now know from the latest charges that Gates, Mannafort maintained contacts with Mannaforts previous employee who is alleged to be a member of the GRU, especially during the last few weeks of the election. The GRU who are implicated in the hacking of Clintons emails and who Skripal shared secrets about with British intelligence.

Gates is giving evidence and has had 20 charges against him dropped as part of his plea bargain.

So we've firing of key people investigation russian collusion, we've trump constantly keeping in touch with people who could be witnesses against him, we've pardons being dangled, trump asking Comey to drop the investigation, trump pressuring sessions to fire Mueller etc etc etc.

It seems they have something to hide and certainly looks like obstruction.

Edited by Byker28i on Friday 30th March 07:59

[Byker28i]

Muellers also investigating the Mayflower hotel conference
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russi...

We've discussed this before, how the location was changed last minute, how team trump met with Kislyak to discuss sanctions (former russian ambassador) in side meetings, despite many denials, how Kislyak was guest of honour in the front row. Where the speech was made praising Putin and russia and the start of the russian messages being sent, including the 'russia if you're listening' plea o hack Clintons emails, when it appears via Stones contacts with Guccifer 2.0 that they knew they already had these.

J.D. Gordon says Trump ordered the platform change on March 31, 2016, right after learning Papadopoulos was aiding the Kremlin and just after Manafort and Gates, who had criminal connections to pro-Putin Ukrainians, joined his campaign.

This was one of the meetings that sessions denied, then remembered when shown evidence that he had a “brief interaction” with Kislyak instead

"No collusion, no collusion..."

[anonymous-user]

When is Muellers end date ? Be good to know when all these issues are going to be concluded as the daily ins and outs are frankly ridiculous keeping up with if most of the idiots have charges dropped.

[DeejRC]

Most of the charges against most folks involved will eventually be dropped. Mann and Papa will probably do some cell time because they are dodgy fkers - or someone will off them.

The only person Big Rob really cares about is Donald. He will say, do, promise anything to land something on him Watergate style. That in the end is the only game in town. This whole shebang isn’t about the truth or anything so prosaic, it’s just about the big haymaker that takes down the boss.

[Byker28i]

The mayflower hotel where Robert "Bud" McFarlane and four ambassadors from nations involved in the largest-ever Russian oil sale (the Rosneft deal - Russia, Italy, Singapore, and the Philippines) were invited to trumps first foreign policy speech. McFarlane is an advocate for Saudi Arabian nuclear-reactor deals.

The steele report says says the Rosneft deal, the biggest oil deal in Russian history,is the basis for Trump-Russia collusion.

These attended a VIP cocktail hour before the speech with 24 people, including Sessions, Kushner, Lewandowski, Trump Jr., Manafort, Lewandowski, and Trump.

Kushner etc have been negotiating for some time to give US nuclear technology to the Saudi's. Russian want to build reactors there but can't because of the sanctions. McFarlane just happens to be at an event at which he'll have access to Trump and the Kremlin's top agent in America at a time when he wants these two parties to get together on sanctions so his Saudi Arabia deal can go through. Then Trump gives a speech offering exactly that policy. McFarlane seemed to be gifted a ceremonial scimitar at this event.

Here he is returning to his seat wit it with Kisylyak


Then of course there's Erik Prince's meetings with the UAE and Kushners attempts to get funding for his real estate business, which Qatar have claimed that after Kushner was turned down, a group of Middle Eastern countries, led by Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates with Kushner’s backing, led a diplomatic assault that culminated in a blockade of Qatar. They are said to have turned over evidence to Mueller about this.


Wierd Carter page interview on MSNBC last night, where he confirmed he told investigators about campaign contacts with the Russian ambassador at the GOP convention.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m77IHhEV6aY


And people wonder why this investigation is taking so long. It's a long complex tangled web

[smn159]

Vanden Saab said:

Oh my you actually googled it ...

I know, it's bizarre that someone should try using facts to counter a gut feel argument, isn't it!

[Vanden Saab]

smn159 said:

I know, it's bizarre that someone should try using facts to counter a gut feel argument, isn't it!

Yes utterly bizarre 4 Volumes of facts and yet Don is still POTUS....My fascination is the absolute black and white view of some posters here and in other similar threads see Brexit, Corbyn et all. As someone who tries to see both sides of a discussion and realises that there are almost always plus and minus points to everything in life I struggle to understand the mindset.

[Blackpuddin]

Byker28i said:

Wierd Carter page interview on MSNBC last night, where he confirmed he told investigators about campaign contacts with the Russian ambassador at the GOP convention.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m77IHhEV6aY

Squirmtastic. Not very good at stonewalling is he.

[Mr E]

Vanden Saab said:

Taking that statement literally I can understand your point, yes I know it probably dates from the 15th century or something, but in reality he is not far wrong. With the exception of a few scientists and mathematicians no one had ever heard of a trillion it certainly wasn't in everyday use as it seems to be now.

Children’s book published in 1971. I’m pretty sure I was about 9 when I read it.

I do take trumps point that the word wasn’t in day to day usage regarding money at that point though. I wonder if he knows there’s a difference in usage (short scale or long scale)?

[JuniorD]

I remember well in the mid 1980s, when I was about 8, reading in a magazine that America had a national debt that was over a trillion dollars. I didn't have a clue about national debt but thought it was cool that a number with 12 zeros at the end was a Trillion.

Before that, this is what I understood to be a Trillian




You'd need to be a right tard (or Trump supporter) to reach the 21st century without hearing of a Trillion $.

Edited by JuniorD on Friday 30th March 10:06

[pinchmeimdreamin]

Vanden Saab said:

As someone who tries to see both sides of a discussion and realises that there are almost always plus and minus points to everything in life I struggle to understand the mindset.

Would you care to point out some of the plus points of Trumps Administration ?

[Byker28i]

Vanden Saab said:

Yes utterly bizarre 4 Volumes of facts and yet Don is still POTUS....My fascination is the absolute black and white view of some posters here and in other similar threads see Brexit, Corbyn et all. As someone who tries to see both sides of a discussion and realises that there are almost always plus and minus points to everything in life I struggle to understand the mindset.

History is being made right now and we're living through it and I find that fascinating.

The scale of this is just incredible so it's not surprising that it's taking a considerable time. Not only team Trump, but the tentacles seem to reach into the republican party, so desperate were they for for power they apply a blind eye, or in the case of Nunes and other, actively try to assist the obstruction.

There's a lot to investigate. There's 20+ people implicated on team trump, before we even get to the russian money into the NRA which went into assisting trumps campaign, trumps addiction to Fox and the regular communication with Hannity, his sex scandels coming back again, illegal campaign payments, the money laundering to finance his campaign and all the lies.

I think "no collusion, FAKE NEWS, biggest witch hunt.. " will go down in history along with "I am not a crook" and "I did not have sexual relations..."

[Halb]

pinchmeimdreamin said:

Would you care to point out some of the plus points of Trumps Administration ?

Rapprochement in North Korea?

---

As for the trillion thing, I actually thought it was Bush II that took it over a trillion, but it was Reagan and Reaganomics!
I checked after reading the above and what I recall is that Bush was the first to add a full trillion in a single year.

[Byker28i]

minimoog said:

President Genius addressing a crowd of construction workers in Richfield, Oh., on America spending $7 trillion

Trump the other day claimed his wall was being started in California, but it's work planned for a few years as a replacement, nothing to do with him but he's tried to claim it.

He claimed he was going to spend $1.5trillion on infrastructure, but signed off on congress spending bill giving him $21billion, or just over 1%
Not sure that's going to fund what he said was "the biggest and boldest infrastructure investment in American history”.

Where the money is allocated
https://appropriations.house.gov/uploadedfiles/03....

he's given away so much money in tax cuts that they can't afford it.

His speech was the same old format: trade, immigration, tax cuts, the media and a new one, the revival of TV show “Roseanne.”
trumps continued promises on 'infrastructure week' are a running joke as he loses focus as another controversy strikes (Squirrel!)

Rather than cutting the nation debt as he promised, he's already added $1.3trillion to it