Miami school shooting

[Robertj21a]

Europa1 said:

I was slightly sceptical of the posters who are of the view that gun control isn't the answer, there is a deeper underlying problem to be addressed.

Then I heard an interview on the Today programme, where a 17 year old pupil from the school where this latest massacre occurred state his view that the answer was to arm the teachers. If you have children thinking more guns is the answer, it seems to me you have a massive, deep seated cultural problem.

Here's an idea, why not arm all the pupils too. That way, just about everybody in the school will have a gun (or 2, 3, 4) and they can all shoot each other.

It might even deter the 'expelled nutter' from doing anything if he knows everyone else can shoot back.........

[Jockman]

p1stonhead said:

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/11/07/world/americ...

Quite an interesting article.

Indeed.

"If mental health made the difference, then data would show that Americans have more mental health problems than do people in other countries with fewer mass shootings. But the mental health care spending rate in the United States, the number of mental health professionals per capita and the rate of severe mental disorders are all in line with those of other wealthy countries."

[NerveAgent]

If they made it a legal requirement to carry and built the wall. And then another one.

The problem maybe be solved quicker than we thought possible.

[louiechevy]

The problem is simply the American gun culture, to give you an idea in the UK there are over seven hundred thousand firearms and shotgun licence holders with between them just over 1.9 million firearms. For the year ending March 2016 there was 26 firearms murders in the UK 18 with unlicensed firearms 7 that it wasn't known and 1 with a licenced firearm. For the same period in America over 30 thousand. I will admit yes I have a firearms licence I go target shooting, my guns are under lock and key when not in use and I certainly would never load one at home! And I personally think they are mad in America.

[Blue62]

The hypocrisy is sickening, was there ever a clearer example of state corruption? A terror attack provokes a completely different response from Mr President to anything a home grown malcontent could drum up. I know the world's gone mad, but this stuff really makes me want to get off.

[Justayellowbadge]

Blue62 said:

this stuff really makes me want to get off.

You could have phrased that better.

[Budflicker]

Having listened to the TV and radio for the last couple of days since this awful tragedy and also after similar shootings in the USA of recent years i do wonder why we in the UK get in such a tizzle over USA laws.

I totally understand that the events are dreadful however this is the UK and the only time we ever get vexed over laws in another country is after a mass shooting in the USA?

Awful as events are, does anyone remember debating gun laws in Norway after Anders Breivik butchered 69 people?

Why do we get so excited over gun laws in the US.

[Dr Jekyll]

TTmonkey said:

The big difference, surely, is that when someone becomes unhinged, you can't just pop down to Asda (Walmart) and just buy a semi automatic weapon?

If we had no ban, if Dunbalne hadn't occurred, Asda would probably sell guns by now.

The only difference Dunblane made was that handguns for target shooting were banned. You could by guns in shops in the UK before Dunblane, you can now.

[AreOut]

Blue62 said:

The hypocrisy is sickening, was there ever a clearer example of state corruption? A terror attack provokes a completely different response from Mr President to anything a home grown malcontent could drum up. I know the world's gone mad, but this stuff really makes me want to get off.

Well it's obvious they have enough idiots and they don't need more. Having potential ISIS terrorists in Europe is a big problem but it's much bigger problem in USA where weapons are widely available.

[Vipers]

Matt Harper said:

Vipers said:

In Florida if your over 18 you can buy a weapon without permit, and no limit either. (According to the papers).

Trump said he doesn't want to tighten up gun laws, buts wants to look at mental health issues.

Maybe he should his name at top of the list.

My understanding is that you must be 21y/o or older - most certainly the case with concealable weapons, though members/ex-memgers of US military are usually granted exception.
However - this only applies to licensed dealers. Gun shows allow pretty much anyone to buy pretty much anything. Pretty ridiculous really.

Just quoting the article, maybe it's different in different states. Even 21 seems daft if you can just walk in and buy a firearm.

[Robertj21a]

Budflicker said:

Why do we get so excited over gun laws in the US.

Probably because to the sane people outside the USA it's the most ridiculous situation that any 1st world country could possibly get into, all by itself. The fact that it looks utterly ridiculous to, probably, most of the rest of the world - and makes the USA a laughing stock - is why it's so interesting to watch. People go to watch car-crash movies, they film disasters, pay to see horror films etc etc. The USA is full of residents who do all that entertainment, quite naturally, and for free.

[AreOut]

Robertj21a said:

Probably because to the sane people outside the USA it's the most ridiculous situation that any 1st world country could possibly get into, all by itself. The fact that it looks utterly ridiculous to, probably, most of the rest of the world - and makes the USA a laughing stock - is why it's so interesting to watch. People go to watch car-crash movies, they film disasters, pay to see horror films etc etc. The USA is full of residents who do all that entertainment, quite naturally, and for free.

it's similar in Russia, only they don't need guns just dashcams

[red_slr]

Matt Harper said:

Gun shows allow pretty much anyone to buy pretty much anything. Pretty ridiculous really.

They closed that loop hole now, you have to do fed check and 3 day wait. Some counties 5 days.

Its only F2F sales that are not regulated.

[Budflicker]

Robertj21a said:

Probably because to the sane people outside the USA it's the most ridiculous situation that any 1st world country could possibly get into, all by itself. The fact that it looks utterly ridiculous to, probably, most of the rest of the world - and makes the USA a laughing stock - is why it's so interesting to watch. People go to watch car-crash movies, they film disasters, pay to see horror films etc etc. The USA is full of residents who do all that entertainment, quite naturally, and for free.

Thats interesting, however it doesn't really answer the question which i asked.

What you say could apply to many things in many countries, i asked a very specific question in relation to the hysteria in ths UK over US gun laws.

I personally couldn't care less in the same way that i dont really care about gun laws in the democratic republic of Congo.

[Kinkell]

Hollywood gun culture pervades the society of the USA. From John Wayne to the Coen brothers it's portrayed as cool and glamorous to shoot from the hip and maim as many of your fellow countrymen as you can.
It's small wonder that an individual with a few issues takes out his adolescent moment of madness on his classmates. Easy to obtain lethal weapon, mixed emotions so let's do it.
The aftermath is horrendous. Just imagine losing your child in this awful situation.

[Pacman1978]

Does your average American town or community/neighborhood seem to have their overall majority of heads buried in the sand? Is multiple mass murders by gunshot so ingrained into daily life that they are just blindly wandering around unaware of the way their country is heading?

Without wanting to go all walking dead, how do they honestly think about how mainstream society will be like in ten years time? I know that these incidents are not unique to the USA but what is the reason for so many ordinary normally non blood thirsty average people to easily go beyond having a bad day week or whatever and decide to be overwhelmingly selfish s and murder strangers and children?

I wonder if any research has been made into the acts of lonewolf terrorist attacks and the similar incidents of mass shootings.

For a society that is well known for being so patriotic and proud it seems to be at odds with the way it is slowly but surely tearing itself apart.

[RobDickinson]

The perception is guns are American 'fk yeah' and they have to be ready at any moment to over throw the government if called for, or defend either their country, way of life or just their yard.


Still stuck in the wild west.

[kainedog]

You’de think that sandy hook ( shocking to say the least ) would have been the turning point but it was not . All the other massacres since won’t make any difference

[kainedog]

And you can buy an assault rifle if you’re 18 but can’t buy alcohol till you’re 21. How messed up is that , not to mention massively powerful v8 cars and the straightest roads anywhere but 55mph limit 😂

[kainedog]

Pacman1978 said:

Does your average American town or community/neighborhood seem to have their overall majority of heads buried in the sand? Is multiple mass murders by gunshot so ingrained into daily life that they are just blindly wandering around unaware of the way their country is heading?

Without wanting to go all walking dead, how do they honestly think about how mainstream society will be like in ten years time? I know that these incidents are not unique to the USA but what is the reason for so many ordinary normally non blood thirsty average people to easily go beyond having a bad day week or whatever and decide to be overwhelmingly selfish s and murder strangers and children?

I wonder if any research has been made into the acts of lonewolf terrorist attacks and the similar incidents of mass shootings.

For a society that is well known for being so patriotic and proud it seems to be at odds with the way it is slowly but surely tearing itself apart.

i read somewhere that more people were killed in the USA in 2017 than the combined allied losses in Iraq and Afghanistan