Vince Cable - discuss
Discussion
Eddie Strohacker said:
You do have a problem staying on the point don't you?
So in summary, Cable's observations are factually accurate, thanks for the clarification. Brexit was foisted on the young by the old. Also, the less educated, which we also know, but that inconvenient truth is catnip round here, so let's not dwell on that.
In passing, I note you can't resist ascribing a negative characteristic to me - to wit: Hate. I hate no one, not even someone who continually attempts to casually & erroneously denigrate my character, like you. Hug?
Especially by those youngsters that voted for it...So in summary, Cable's observations are factually accurate, thanks for the clarification. Brexit was foisted on the young by the old. Also, the less educated, which we also know, but that inconvenient truth is catnip round here, so let's not dwell on that.
In passing, I note you can't resist ascribing a negative characteristic to me - to wit: Hate. I hate no one, not even someone who continually attempts to casually & erroneously denigrate my character, like you. Hug?
alfie2244 said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
alfie2244 said:
princealbert23 said:
alfie2244 said:
Stupid old man..........is that how you do it jj?
He is using his Strohacker login for this subject. 
Murph7355 said:
You've just taken the "2+2=5" prize from ///ajd. Congratulations
Over 90% of the vote went to parties committing to exiting the EU. Believing that people didn't think one of those major parties really meant it is an interesting viewpoint on our voting system and the electorate's intent It may explain why polls have been so shonky though.
The LibDems took more seats but less of the vote (a major issue in our system, irrespective of who benefits/loses out). They were the only half credible party that had staying in the EU as a mainstay of their manifesto. If there had been any major will to move on that, they would have gained more.
Right. So you're pointing out that in a gun shop, people bought guns, the 90% (80 actually) is just that.Over 90% of the vote went to parties committing to exiting the EU. Believing that people didn't think one of those major parties really meant it is an interesting viewpoint on our voting system and the electorate's intent
It may explain why polls have been so shonky though.The LibDems took more seats but less of the vote (a major issue in our system, irrespective of who benefits/loses out). They were the only half credible party that had staying in the EU as a mainstay of their manifesto. If there had been any major will to move on that, they would have gained more.
Anyway, I don't care about the Lib Dems, didn't vote for them, can't see I will in the future but since you've tried to move on to their electoral weakness, I guess that's a tacit admission that you agree Vince is speaking truth unto power. Amazing how you Brexit martyrs are all lining up behind me this morning. Well done you.
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
The vitriol was all yours Eddie!
Oh but I beg to differ.don'tbesilly said:
Cable is as much as an irrelevance as Farron was (arguably more so), the hysterics won't get him anywhere, apart from ridicule, water off a ducks back to 'Dr Doom' who has always been a nobody, so well used to it.
Overlooking your entirely predictable slur on my character, I ask again, what did Cable say that isn't borne out by what we know? Please answer the question my Brexit martyr.As for Cable, I covered most of it without the vitriol displayed so magnificently by you.
The pensioners Cable condemns had as much right to vote as you and I did, the fact that they didn't vote along with the way he and you would prefer is an irrelevance, as is the poll used by Cable to make a disrespectful point.
Many of the pensioners he slates don't enjoy the comforts he bangs on about, and if they voted Leave so be it, with the experience of living in the EU that clearly they wanted to end, it was their democratic right for them to vote in the way they did.
Writing them off in the way he has has when many have years left ahead of them is disgraceful.
Many of those he condemns are younger than he is,his pontification is aimed at the younger sections of society, the same section of society who the Lib-Dems shafted not so long ago.
If he carries on, the policies he employs (attacking the same demographic he sits in) will cover a cradle to grave shafting, perhaps the Lib - Dems would do better if they just published the book 'How to win friends & influence people' as their manifesto, it would put them in a better position than they are now.
It doesn't come as a great surprise that you're a fan of Cable, he's just carried on where Farron and Clegg left off.
When the choice of potential leaders is in single numbers, pulling the short straw is always a far greater risk, as Cable found out
So in summary, Cable's observations are factually accurate, thanks for the clarification. Brexit was foisted on the young by the old. Also, the less educated, which we also know, but that inconvenient truth is catnip round here, so let's not dwell on that.
In passing, I note you can't resist ascribing a negative characteristic to me - to wit: Hate. I hate no one, not even someone who continually attempts to casually & erroneously denigrate my character, like you. Hug?
You make Cable look saintly!
Perhaps you're blind or blinkered, most people I know would find what you've written highly offensive, the fact you don't sums you up!
Eddie Strohacker said:
The most selfish element of the most selfish generation, a bunch of I'm alright Jacks who ate their own young.
The least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a f
king con.
You reap what you sow Eddie, spewing bile does your cause no good what so ever, one would hope your ramblings would be condemned by your own kith and kinThe least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a f
king con.don'tbesilly said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
The vitriol was all yours Eddie!
Oh but I beg to differ.don'tbesilly said:
Cable is as much as an irrelevance as Farron was (arguably more so), the hysterics won't get him anywhere, apart from ridicule, water off a ducks back to 'Dr Doom' who has always been a nobody, so well used to it.
Overlooking your entirely predictable slur on my character, I ask again, what did Cable say that isn't borne out by what we know? Please answer the question my Brexit martyr.As for Cable, I covered most of it without the vitriol displayed so magnificently by you.
The pensioners Cable condemns had as much right to vote as you and I did, the fact that they didn't vote along with the way he and you would prefer is an irrelevance, as is the poll used by Cable to make a disrespectful point.
Many of the pensioners he slates don't enjoy the comforts he bangs on about, and if they voted Leave so be it, with the experience of living in the EU that clearly they wanted to end, it was their democratic right for them to vote in the way they did.
Writing them off in the way he has has when many have years left ahead of them is disgraceful.
Many of those he condemns are younger than he is,his pontification is aimed at the younger sections of society, the same section of society who the Lib-Dems shafted not so long ago.
If he carries on, the policies he employs (attacking the same demographic he sits in) will cover a cradle to grave shafting, perhaps the Lib - Dems would do better if they just published the book 'How to win friends & influence people' as their manifesto, it would put them in a better position than they are now.
It doesn't come as a great surprise that you're a fan of Cable, he's just carried on where Farron and Clegg left off.
When the choice of potential leaders is in single numbers, pulling the short straw is always a far greater risk, as Cable found out
So in summary, Cable's observations are factually accurate, thanks for the clarification. Brexit was foisted on the young by the old. Also, the less educated, which we also know, but that inconvenient truth is catnip round here, so let's not dwell on that.
In passing, I note you can't resist ascribing a negative characteristic to me - to wit: Hate. I hate no one, not even someone who continually attempts to casually & erroneously denigrate my character, like you. Hug?
You make Cable look saintly!
Perhaps you're blind or blinkered, most people I know would find what you've written highly offensive, the fact you don't sums you up!
Eddie Strohacker said:
The most selfish element of the most selfish generation, a bunch of I'm alright Jacks who ate their own young.
The least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a fking con.
You reap what you sow Eddie, spewing bile does your cause no good what so ever, one would hope your ramblings would be condemned by your own kith and kinThe least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a f
king con.Eddie Strohacker said:
Right. So you're pointing out that in a gun shop, people bought guns, the 90% (80 actually) is just that.
Anyway, I don't care about the Lib Dems, didn't vote for them, can't see I will in the future but since you've tried to move on to their electoral weakness, I guess that's a tacit admission that you agree Vince is speaking truth unto power. Amazing how you Brexit martyrs are all lining up behind me this morning. Well done you.
Do you think the major parties only set up a gun shop for a laugh?Anyway, I don't care about the Lib Dems, didn't vote for them, can't see I will in the future but since you've tried to move on to their electoral weakness, I guess that's a tacit admission that you agree Vince is speaking truth unto power. Amazing how you Brexit martyrs are all lining up behind me this morning. Well done you.
It doesn't alter the fact that there was a "not a gun shop" option, but nobody went in it. Despite many of their other policies arguably appealing to the young and debonair.
(Is your 80% only Labour and Conservatives btw? I thin over 85% of the votes went to those noting we were exiting...and over 90% of seats).
The more I look at what Vince Cable said the less I really understand where he is coming from. He talks like there are only two demographics - "young" and "old" - and the very policies he is a massive supporter of are ones which cause the chasm between the two. All whilst sitting on top of a very gold plated pension arrangement and rather a large pile of cash (which in itself I have zero problem with whatsoever, as long as the hypocrisy meter is kept below 5).
I actually hope he makes some inroads on this. Corbyn was the biggest beneficiary of the young vote in 2017. If the LibDems could get large chunks of them back in the fold with some of Vince's nonsense, it is likely to ensure Corbyn has peaked and will never see power.
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
don'tbesilly said:
The vitriol was all yours Eddie!
Oh but I beg to differ.don'tbesilly said:
Cable is as much as an irrelevance as Farron was (arguably more so), the hysterics won't get him anywhere, apart from ridicule, water off a ducks back to 'Dr Doom' who has always been a nobody, so well used to it.
Overlooking your entirely predictable slur on my character, I ask again, what did Cable say that isn't borne out by what we know? Please answer the question my Brexit martyr.As for Cable, I covered most of it without the vitriol displayed so magnificently by you.
The pensioners Cable condemns had as much right to vote as you and I did, the fact that they didn't vote along with the way he and you would prefer is an irrelevance, as is the poll used by Cable to make a disrespectful point.
Many of the pensioners he slates don't enjoy the comforts he bangs on about, and if they voted Leave so be it, with the experience of living in the EU that clearly they wanted to end, it was their democratic right for them to vote in the way they did.
Writing them off in the way he has has when many have years left ahead of them is disgraceful.
Many of those he condemns are younger than he is,his pontification is aimed at the younger sections of society, the same section of society who the Lib-Dems shafted not so long ago.
If he carries on, the policies he employs (attacking the same demographic he sits in) will cover a cradle to grave shafting, perhaps the Lib - Dems would do better if they just published the book 'How to win friends & influence people' as their manifesto, it would put them in a better position than they are now.
It doesn't come as a great surprise that you're a fan of Cable, he's just carried on where Farron and Clegg left off.
When the choice of potential leaders is in single numbers, pulling the short straw is always a far greater risk, as Cable found out
So in summary, Cable's observations are factually accurate, thanks for the clarification. Brexit was foisted on the young by the old. Also, the less educated, which we also know, but that inconvenient truth is catnip round here, so let's not dwell on that.
In passing, I note you can't resist ascribing a negative characteristic to me - to wit: Hate. I hate no one, not even someone who continually attempts to casually & erroneously denigrate my character, like you. Hug?
You make Cable look saintly!
Perhaps you're blind or blinkered, most people I know would find what you've written highly offensive, the fact you don't sums you up!
Eddie Strohacker said:
The most selfish element of the most selfish generation, a bunch of I'm alright Jacks who ate their own young.
The least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a fking con.
You reap what you sow Eddie, spewing bile does your cause no good what so ever, one would hope your ramblings would be condemned by your own kith and kinThe least affected. The retired, the home owners, the triple locked pensioners who threw the following generations on the fire for their own folly, whospent twenty years swallowing the bile of Mail & the Telegraph hook line & sinker. What a f
king con.Even if correct, the elderly, pensioners or not, have the same rights you and I have, they have no duty to others, as you with your vote to Remain had no duty to others.
Did you consider those with opposing views to you when you visited the polling booths?
Your post and Cable's thoughts are not borne out by my own experience/knowledge of the demographic in question, the broadbrush attack based on a poll is far from the truth, and like many Remainers who claim their opinions are facts, we know that is not the case.
Eddie Strohacker said:
Fastchas said:
Especially by those youngsters that voted for it...
I'll take your evidence when you're ready. While I'm waiting, here's something for you....https://fullfact.org/europe/young-voters-and-eu-re...
Choose your poll from in there. But pushing 30% of the young voted to Leave.
I'm sure you're not advocating ignoring them....
Murph7355 said:
Do you think the major parties only set up a gun shop for a laugh?
It doesn't alter the fact that there was a "not a gun shop" option, but nobody went in it. Despite many of their other policies arguably appealing to the young and debonair.
Labour did! Who knows what they were doing on Brexit in the GE? Not me that's for sure.It doesn't alter the fact that there was a "not a gun shop" option, but nobody went in it. Despite many of their other policies arguably appealing to the young and debonair.
However, your argument is fallacious. The Lib Dems were not a non Brexit option & I can only surmise why the Brexiteers keep pushing this. They campaigned on a referendum on the outcome of negotiations as you well know, not a referendum on Brexit itself. Moreover, it's patently absurd binary reductionism to equate their election outcome with support for Brexit. Electorates behave complexly, they vote the way they do for myriad reasons. The notion that a+b=c is nonsense.
However, I'm not here to defend the Lib Dems. I'm here to point out Cable's article is spot on & the evidence clearly supports his conclusions. The old gimmers shafted the kids.
don'tbesilly said:
Suggest away Eddie, Polls have been proven to be wrong as we have witnessed before.
Your post and Cable's thoughts are not borne out by my own experience/knowledge of the demographic in question, the broadbrush attack based on a poll is far from the truth, and like many Remainers who claim their opinions are facts, we know that is not the case.
Two interesting points there: One - cast aspersions on multiple polls that don't support your position & two - I offer a sample of one. Put those two together & it's actually quite funny. Allow me: The polls are rubbish! But my personal poll of people I know is infallible. Nope, not having a bar of it.Your post and Cable's thoughts are not borne out by my own experience/knowledge of the demographic in question, the broadbrush attack based on a poll is far from the truth, and like many Remainers who claim their opinions are facts, we know that is not the case.
Just another example of the selective democracy, as used by those who did not get what they wanted in the 2016 referendum want to apply now..
They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
Pan Pan Pan said:
Just another example of the selective democracy, as used by those who did not get what they wanted in the 2016 referendum want to apply now..
They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
Who is saying it wasn't ok? They had a vote & used it. Once again & now I'm sounding like you, I'm simply pointing out that a generation who largely won't have to suffer the consequences of this folly have forced onto one that will.They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
Eddie Strohacker said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Just another example of the selective democracy, as used by those who did not get what they wanted in the 2016 referendum want to apply now..
They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
Who is saying it wasn't ok? They had a vote & used it. Once again & now I'm sounding like you, I'm simply pointing out that a generation who largely won't have to suffer the consequences of this folly have forced onto one that will.They seem to forget that it was in fact that the very same people who Cable is having a go at now, who voted for the UK to remain in the EEC in 1975.
Why was it OK for the very same people to vote remain in 1975, but not for them to vote leave in 2016, and with far greater information (not least about the existence of the EU and how it operates) than was available to them in 1975. Of the two votes the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU would be by far the most reliable.
No ordinary man in the street in 1975 knew what remaining in the EEC would actually mean for them, any more than people know now what leaving the EU will mean, it is all supposition, and in the case of the sh*t scared cowardly remoaners, all doom and gloom.
The `Old' that utter tw*ts like Cable is now referring to, and denigrating were the ones that fought for the real freedoms the UK enjoys now, None of them knew in 1939 - 40 what fighting the Germans would mean for them, and the UK.
It seems the young now are paralyzed with fear, unless someone, somewhere, tells them `exactly' what is going to happen . Strangely, in the real world that is not how it works, nor has it ever..
wevster said:
oyster said:
No chance.
There's no way you go from being 20-odd points ahead to virtually neck and neck because of a couple of 'titbits' as you put it. It was much more fundamental than that. Have a look at the British Election Survey info recently revealed - huge swathes of remainers moving to Labour from other parties.
Labour may have promised to carry out the election result, but it appears lots of people didn't believe them.
I think it's wrong to go back on the referendum result, but I think the odds of Brexit not happening are shortening by the day.
The Tories didn't win outright due to 2 bad policies in their manifesto, the scrapping of the triple lock and pensioners paying more for their cars in old age.There's no way you go from being 20-odd points ahead to virtually neck and neck because of a couple of 'titbits' as you put it. It was much more fundamental than that. Have a look at the British Election Survey info recently revealed - huge swathes of remainers moving to Labour from other parties.
Labour may have promised to carry out the election result, but it appears lots of people didn't believe them.
I think it's wrong to go back on the referendum result, but I think the odds of Brexit not happening are shortening by the day.
Pan Pan Pan said:
What about the generations who had the EU foisted on them without their consent?, What about the billions paid by them in taxes into the bottomless one way (for the UK) pit of the EU`s coffers? What about the indigenous population who now have to compete with an extra 3.3 million (and rapidly rising) people for the same school, and University places, the same housing, healthcare, jobs, transport etc that they want, paid for by all the UK`s taxpayers (you know, the `old') who worked and paid `their' taxes, whilst the `young' were still filling their nappies
No ordinary man in the street in 1975 knew what remaining in the EEC would actually mean for them, any more than people know now what leaving the EU will mean, it is all supposition, and in the case of the sh*t scared cowardly remoaners, all doom and gloom.
The `Old' that utter tw*ts like Cable is now referring to, and denigrating were the ones that fought for the real freedoms the UK enjoys now, None of them knew in 1939 - 40 what fighting the Germans would mean for them, and the UK.
It seems the young now are paralyzed with fear, unless someone, somewhere, tells them `exactly' what is going to happen . Strangely, in the real world that is not how it works, nor has it ever..
I read your post & decided I'm liking Vince more & more. Thanks for doing that. No ordinary man in the street in 1975 knew what remaining in the EEC would actually mean for them, any more than people know now what leaving the EU will mean, it is all supposition, and in the case of the sh*t scared cowardly remoaners, all doom and gloom.
The `Old' that utter tw*ts like Cable is now referring to, and denigrating were the ones that fought for the real freedoms the UK enjoys now, None of them knew in 1939 - 40 what fighting the Germans would mean for them, and the UK.
It seems the young now are paralyzed with fear, unless someone, somewhere, tells them `exactly' what is going to happen . Strangely, in the real world that is not how it works, nor has it ever..
Vince Cable said:
To describe such masochism as 'martyrdom' is dangerous. We haven't yet heard about 'Brexit jihadis' but there is an undercurrent of violence in the language which is troubling. We have already had the most fervent of Brexiteers, such as Nigel Farage, warning of civil unrest if the 'will of the people' is frustrated.
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