Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 10

[rider73]

Greens are England's libdems now

[633Squadron]

rider73 said:

Greens are England's libdems now

Just what I was thinking.

Let’s see those policies get implemented

[rider73]

First day for them is hypocrisy

Cuts to rail, greens want more investment in public transport.
Says it all about this coalition

There will be lots of well in the future green promises to keep them in line while snp plough on with their own agenda

[the-sharpener]

633Squadron said:

Just what I was thinking.

Let’s see those policies get implemented

Who will the SNP blame for a total lack of road building

the english or the greens

[APontus]

Always eat your greens!

[s2kjock]

the-sharpener said:

Who will the SNP blame for a total lack of road building

Don't be silly. Road building is surging ahead - just look at this announced the day before the Greens joined the SG.

A9 dualling procurement

I assume Patrick and Lorna got an invite to the online event but were too busy negotiating to attend.

[irc]

The Times quotes one of the agreed joint policies as setting up a citizen's assembly to consider replacing the council tax. An assembly? You could even call it a parliament.

Oh wait. We have a parliament already with 129 elected MSPs paid to govern the country. Is this just a way of Sturgeon being able to deflect any blame for changes to the citizens assembly? For as sure as night follows day any changes to council tax will have losers as well as winners.

And another policy. Set up govt offices in Copenhagen and Warsaw. Unless I am mistake both those cities will already have UK embassies. Just more jobs for the girls then. It's only a few million quid to run them. Loose change really in SNP terms. Just increase the deficit.

Edited by irc on Saturday 21st August 11:02

[rider73]

That's why i have no faith in snp seriously considering indy in the next 5 to 6 years, or even 10.
They know the rules for eu membership, yet they are going in the opposite direction fiscally

The only option they might go for if by some miracle they can have the vote, is to delay as long at possible actuality with the ref, or simply say they won't join the eu after all, but will be a future goal....

[the-sharpener]

rider73 said:

That's why i have no faith in snp seriously considering indy in the next 5 to 6 years, or even 10.
They know the rules for eu membership, yet they are going in the opposite direction fiscally

The only option they might go for if by some miracle they can have the vote, is to delay as long at possible actuality with the ref, or simply say they won't join the eu after all, but will be a future goal....

Two explanations

1 They couldn’t give a crap about the EU it is merely noise to get the gullible and the London based media onside

2 They couldn’t give a crap about Indy. They just want money and power

The first one is a running certainty

The 2nd i am not so sure

[Evercross]

rider73 said:

That's why i have no faith in snp seriously considering indy in the next 5 to 6 years, or even 10.
They know the rules for eu membership, yet they are going in the opposite direction fiscally

The only option they might go for if by some miracle they can have the vote, is to delay as long at possible actuality with the ref, or simply say they won't join the eu after all, but will be a future goal....

Been said before in here (many times) and I will say it again. The SNP were traditionally a Euro-sceptic party, and Nicola Sturgeon only hitched the Nationalists to the EU bandwagon because she thought (wrongly) she could translate a (slim) majority in favour of remaining in the EU in Scotland into a majority for Scottish independence bundled with EU membership.

It was a knee-jerk policy decided the day after the Brexit referendum that cost the SNP a whole pile of seats at the subsequent General Election, and ever since Sturgeon has had to slowly reverse back down that wrong turning, not helped by the fact that remoaners in the media, dismayed by the Janus approach to Brexit by the Labour Party, looked to the SNP as the bulwark against 'Tory Brexitism'.

Edited by Evercross on Saturday 21st August 11:50

[aparna]

One of SNP’s advantages is they can jump on passing bandwagons. They are not defined by political compass, so if they want to wear labours shoes, they can morph into that party without too much trouble. Their historical position isn’t that relevant to younger voters, an increasing proportion of which were not even alive when thatcher was in power for instance, and care more about what is being offered now.

[sherman]

aparna said:

Their historical position isn’t that relevant to younger voters, an increasing proportion of which were not even alive when thatcher was in power for instance, and care more about what is being offered now.

Only because the snp keep the voters in their core areas life expectancy low enough that the ones who would be able to remember Maggie are dying off.

[Pastor Of Muppets]

Well said Gerald. Proving that not all Glaswegians are head in the sand Indynialists.

[alangla]

Evercross said:

Been said before in here (many times) and I will say it again. The SNP were traditionally a Euro-sceptic party, and Nicola Sturgeon only hitched the Nationalists to the EU bandwagon because she thought (wrongly) she could translate a (slim) majority in favour of remaining in the EU in Scotland into a majority for Scottish independence bundled with EU membership.

It was a knee-jerk policy decided the day after the Brexit referendum that cost the SNP a whole pile of seats at the subsequent General Election…

Going a bit further back, was “Scotland in Europe” not a Salmond mantra years ago (I.e. 1990s or early 2000s, probably before he became First Minister)

[hidetheelephants]

biggles330d said:

Also - anyone noticed how there seems to be zero interest from the Scottish Government or Scotrail in sorting out the never-ending Sunday strikes?

link - https://www.scotrail.co.uk/about-scotrail/fit-futu...

That would mean facing down the unions though. I can't think of a single example of where Scottish Government has been keen to tackle this. Much easier to roll over and crow about the jobs being created - any focus on efficiency is of secondary importance. In fairness, it's now not Abellio Scotrail's problem. They are out of the door soon so I wouldn't expect them to bother lifting a finger now. Once Scotrail is back under direct Ministerial control the strikes might evaporate as ScotGov will quietly cough up to whatever demands there are. I fully expect that despite running a lot less trains there will be not a lot of change in staffing levels. The unions are already putting marks in the sand for that, so any expectation of ScotRail costing a lot less to operate will evaporate and I wouldn't be surprised it it ended up costing a lot more as those nice Civil Servants in Transport Scotland play at managing complex rail services with their little or no expertise or experience in doing so.
Fun times ahead.

I wonder what will become of routine overtime working; whether they'll have redundancies and keep it or bin it off and retain the same headcount.

[irc]

I enjoyed the scotrail Sunday once an hour Helensburgh to Edinburgh a couple of weeks ago. 90m journe from westerton. Standing room only. Where's your social distancing now?

Edited by irc on Saturday 21st August 18:30

[the-sharpener]

Now that the trains are under SNP control and we know that the McGammons will never question any government figures

Can we expect to see people dutifully getting up and walking straight off the platforms as the time table says there is a train there

[Pastor Of Muppets]

Topic on WOS yesterday and today is showing some incredible reading, and considering the discussion here is almost non existent these days it's well worth a look. This one caught my eye...

WoS said...

"Of course we wouldn’t f*****g win! (indy ref2)

What will it take before reality sinks in? Every political party active in Scotland, possibly excepting Alba, is in the lie-peddling business. Labour aren’t interested in working people. The Tories don’t protect traditional values. The Lib Dems won’t protect rights and freedoms. The Greens have already sold out on the environment.

And yes, the SNP want to run a devolved government, subbed from WM, in perpetuity. Collectively, they have no more idea on how to organise the affairs of a sovereign nation than I have.

What the SNP are doing is managing the transition from being a party with a defined destination, to being one with an ongoing journey. The key thing to understand is that the journey is now the raison d’etre, and the destination has been abandoned. By doing this, the SNP expects to remain in power indefinitely. I think it highly likely that they have already gamed how to hold IndyRef2 (eventually), how to lose it again (just), and how to therefore retain power afterwards. Where else would the Indy supporters put their crosses?"

Hundreds more here.... https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-last-ten-seconds...

[Evercross]

Pastor Of Muppets said:

Topic on WOS yesterday and today is showing some incredible reading, and considering the discussion here is almost non existent these days it's well worth a look.

That's because the independence cause is now fractured and our pro-indy representatives have dropped into different camps, either pro or anti-SNP. It is no longer a united front so is difficult to defend, so they have departed.

Our arch Sturgeonite Lim made no secret of the fact that he wasn't really interested in independence, just about Nicola securing 5 more years.....

[is-uk]

Marc Dolan will now be an enemy of the faithful.

https://twitter.com/AgentP22/status/14293838394624...