Tenant broken boiler, refusing me access to check it
Discussion
Sir Bagalot said:
OP, you may have missed my original question so I'll repeat it.
You said rent was paid direct to you but the tenant changed this (as they are legally allows to do). When two months arrears were built up why did you not request from the council that the rent be paid directly to you? (As you're legally entitled to do).
I'm also surprised to read that in 8 months you've made £4.5K in mortgage payments on the property (or does that figure also include your own mortgage)?
The council no longer deal with rent, it's all handled by Universal Credit now. You said rent was paid direct to you but the tenant changed this (as they are legally allows to do). When two months arrears were built up why did you not request from the council that the rent be paid directly to you? (As you're legally entitled to do).
I'm also surprised to read that in 8 months you've made £4.5K in mortgage payments on the property (or does that figure also include your own mortgage)?
The tenant always paid rent in arrears, so they were always 1 month in arrears due to the way Universal Credits is paid.
All we know is that we're not receiving rent, and we are assuming the tenant has changed it to pay themselves. It may well be that they've not done something they were supposed to do and their housing benefits has been stopped by Universal Credits. We've chased the tenant up a few times and they keep saying they'll sort it, then we here nothing.
At this point, I'm not concerned about the rent arrears, I want them out, so it works in my favour.
As for our rent payments. We pay an interest only payment to the mortgage company each month, and on top of that we make at least a £300 per month overpayment which we use to bring the mortgage balance down. We've only been doing this for the last couple of years though. The mortgage on this property is due to be paid in October, and our plan has been to pay as much as we can off the mortgage so that we can release equity from our main home to pay the mortgage off completely in October, then keep the property as a rental to recoup the money we've taken off our main home. Sadly, we've already decided that it's just not worth the hassle anymore, and we're going to take the hit and get rid.
Paft Dunk said:
What does your landlord insurance cover as most have legal expenses included? Is that a route here ?
Sorry about your situation, not sure how I’d keep level headed in the same situation.
yes we have legal cover and have used it in the past, and will use it should we need it.Sorry about your situation, not sure how I’d keep level headed in the same situation.
CharlesElliott said:
I can understand how stressful this is OP but you are moving in the right direction, keep going and best wishes.
I just have to keep reminding myself that's it's about winning the battle and not the war. The aim is to get them out, so I need to do what I can to facilitate that.Sir Bagalot said:
I understand that, but once two months is owed you can apply to have the rent directly to you and the tenant can do f
k all about it. Please do this as it stops the tenant getting it. You're evicting them anyway.
I actually sought advice on the lack of a CP12 as I was in a situation where I didn't have one. I was told that as long as you have taken reasonable actions to get one then you'd be ok.
I don't think you understand how long eviction will take. You're at the back of a very very very long queue (hence why you should apply to have the rent paid directly to you). Perhaps give someone like Landlord Action a call for a chat and they should give you an indication of long it will take to get the bailiffs in.
You also have another problim looming. As of 1st April you need to have a EICR in place.
I don't want any rent payments as that means they'll not be over 6 month in arrears and I'll have to give them six months notice to vacate.k all about it. Please do this as it stops the tenant getting it. You're evicting them anyway.I actually sought advice on the lack of a CP12 as I was in a situation where I didn't have one. I was told that as long as you have taken reasonable actions to get one then you'd be ok.
I don't think you understand how long eviction will take. You're at the back of a very very very long queue (hence why you should apply to have the rent paid directly to you). Perhaps give someone like Landlord Action a call for a chat and they should give you an indication of long it will take to get the bailiffs in.
You also have another problim looming. As of 1st April you need to have a EICR in place.
Once they are in 6 month arrears, I'll raise a section 8/21 and then contact Universal Credits for future payments while we wait for things to go through.
The EICR, i think that only applies to new tenancies after a certain date, not existing ones.
nails1979 said:
From the description of boarded up houses and a right hole then I'm changing my guess to one of the numbered streets in blackhall or horden.
I've posted before on this subject over cheap houses and landlords has created a race to bottom and ruined entire estates round here.
It would seem that tenants have far too many rights and it should be remembered that they are merely renting and it's not their property. Should be able to turf them after the 2nd missed payment without courts.
Well done, sadly I can't afford to give you a winners prize I've posted before on this subject over cheap houses and landlords has created a race to bottom and ruined entire estates round here.
It would seem that tenants have far too many rights and it should be remembered that they are merely renting and it's not their property. Should be able to turf them after the 2nd missed payment without courts.
The area never used to be fantastic, but most homes were owned by real people and it wasn't too bad. At some point a local letting agent managed to snap up over 100 houses and eventually got to the point where they couldn't afford to maintain them. In the end, I think the council forced them to put the houses up for auction and they've ended up being bought for cheap by landlords from outside the area who don't really care who they're renting to and have no physical attachment to the property.
There have been council talks over the last few years to pull some of the houses down, but god knows when that might happen, and last year a train station was built on the coastline near these houses to give better access to the likes of Sunderland, Hartlepool and anywhere else on that line. This hasn't done anything to attract better people into these properties and I'm not sure it will.
I'm sure there's similar areas in the country, but around here there's a sense of entitlement which means people blame everyone else for there own problems rather than taking responsibility, putting in the hard graft and doing something about it.
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 07:25
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 07:25
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 07:26
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 07:29
Meeten-5dulx said:
Have you established if you need an electrical certificate?
I would be making sure all my ducks were lined up. Don't trip up over this!
Forget your inspection, and if you persist on joining the engineer on Thursday it will not end well as she will refuse access to you and the engineer. You need the gas certificate, don't jepordise getting that.
Just assume the place is a s hithole and refrain for actually seeing it. Your only going to increase your own stress levels. Appreciate it was the original intention whilst trying to sort out the boiler, and bit that opportunity has sailed.
Like others have said, the bigger picture is to get her out and in order to do that (legally) you need to ensure your paperwork is fully compliant. Does that include the electrical cert? that is what I'd be concerned about at the moment. Don't trip up now!
Best of luck in this horrid situation!
From someone that had to evict a tennant, then pay a fortune to get house to a standard and then was trying to sell during lock down....
Yes it does look like existing tenancies need an electrical cert from the 1st April onwards, so that's something else we need to sort. Thankfully we should have already served a section 21 before then so it won't stop off starting the process. We will still need to get the tenant to allow an electrician access to perform this test as well at some point soon.I would be making sure all my ducks were lined up. Don't trip up over this!
Forget your inspection, and if you persist on joining the engineer on Thursday it will not end well as she will refuse access to you and the engineer. You need the gas certificate, don't jepordise getting that.
Just assume the place is a s hithole and refrain for actually seeing it. Your only going to increase your own stress levels. Appreciate it was the original intention whilst trying to sort out the boiler, and bit that opportunity has sailed.
Like others have said, the bigger picture is to get her out and in order to do that (legally) you need to ensure your paperwork is fully compliant. Does that include the electrical cert? that is what I'd be concerned about at the moment. Don't trip up now!
Best of luck in this horrid situation!
From someone that had to evict a tennant, then pay a fortune to get house to a standard and then was trying to sell during lock down....
I did some quick math last night. We've always aimed to pay our own mortgage off before I'm 55 (15 year). It looks like to get rid of the rental we will need to cover maybe a £15k shortfall which will means that we should be able to cover that on our mortgage without increasing our existing monthly payments (we over pay our mortgage). Or we can take it out of savings and pay it back separately.
It's not ideal, but we've decided getting rid is the best way forward for us.
It's not ideal, but we've decided getting rid is the best way forward for us.
bennno said:
Stick it in to an auction as soon as you have got rid of tennant.
How did you end up with this in the first place?
It was our first home, lived in it for a few year, but then one day we saw a repossession for sale, we couldn't waste time so we bought that, move into it and just continued to rent the old house out. No way did we think that in the space of 10 years the value of these properties would drop from £65k to £20k.How did you end up with this in the first place?
We've had a few good tenants. First one was in 6 month, no bother at all. The second was a couple who both worked, always paid their rent on time and stayed about three year, but they were heavy smokers and when they left it cost us loads to get the whole house redecorated. Then we had a guy in on benefits who lived there for three or so years, and everything was fine until he stopped doing whatever he needed to do and his benefits were stopped. We ended up going to court to get rid. We had a lass there for almost a year, she left us owing £250 which wasn't too bad. Then we got another lass who lasted a few month, left us with unpaid rent and a load of furniture/rubbish we had to get rid of, and then we have these tenants we've got now.
Fckitdriveon said:
reading that I think you've highlighted how this countries gone downhill in the last 5-10 years.
It's always difficult. I can never understand the mentality of people that don't want to have some pride in themselves, or can't be bothered to pull their fingers out. I was brought up on a council estate by my mother, we didn't have much. Since I was old enough I had multiple paper rounds, up early every morning before school delivery papers in all weathers. I've always worked even if it mean doing some crappy jobs. My wife is the same, she's a grafter and we both do the best we can with what we've got available to us. We're both self employed and while working we've both been to college/university and both gained Masters Degrees while working and bringing up two kids. We always want to better ourselves and it really annoys us when friends and family members moan and complain that they can't do this and they can't do that, always blaming someone else. We're of the mindset that if you want to do something, then you've got to do something about it, you can't sit back and expect something to fall on your lap while in the meantime just sitting there blaming everyone that is hasn't happened yet.otolith said:
Jesus that's grim. Was just looking at Google Street View and then at the stats for the primary school there. That seems a long way from the "levelling up agenda", not sure a kid growing up there has much opportunity.
it also doesn't help that around 2001 the local area was brimming with call centres. We had Npower, HMRC, Orange, EDS(HP), a Clothing Factory and another new call centre estate being built. Since then, Npower is gone, EDS is gone, Orange is gone and the clothing factory has gone. The new call centres that were built have stood empty since they were built 15-20 year ago.The town centre itself is full of charity shops, it's an absolute dive. Town centre rents are so high no-one can afford to be there, and there's a big chunk of the population who can't/won't take any responsibility for their own lives/actions.
It's depressing.
As for kids, they don't stand a chance because a good chunk of parents don't take any responsibility. They've had kids too young and it's not their job to educate them. Many parents can't control their kids, even those in Primary School. Kids go without school uniforms but parents have new iPhones and can afford to taxi their kids to school and back every day even though the school is only a 10 minute walk away.
I'm starting to rant now.
It's not a terrible area, there's some nice housing estates and most people are just normal folk trying to get about their daily lives.
As for Horden itself, it needs bombing.
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 10:16
otolith said:
It looks, socioeconomic factors aside, like a lovely place. On the coast, lovely countryside. It's just what happens when an area gets thrown on the economic scrapheap. But those numbered streets - I appreciate that dates back to before the decline of the mining and doesn't reflect the current decline, but what do you have to think of your workers that you don't even think their street needs a name?
These places need serious investment to create modern, prosperous jobs. That could be a brilliant place to live.
The location is fantastic. My clients down in MK always complain that where I live, we have easy access to proper fish and chips. They hate it in the summer when I tell them I'm nipping to the coast at lunch time for some lunch. We've got Durham only a few mile away, and loads of countryside to walk around. There's a lot of positives, they're just sometimes difficult to see.These places need serious investment to create modern, prosperous jobs. That could be a brilliant place to live.
Fckitdriveon said:
actually you lacking the ability to understand Is also an issue, aside from the main case in point of course.
It's a hard one and it's very easy to not understand something that you've not had close contact with. Before I met my wife and move to this area I was completely blind to what really went on, alcohol, drugs, depression, I was never really exposed to it growing up.We have family who have struggled with alcohol and have seen first hand how it impacts the family. Parents have tunnel vision and find it extremely difficult to think of anything but themselves. Once you're in that situation, how do you get out, it's a downward spiral and there needs to be support in place to help these people.
Edited by TheBinarySheep on Monday 11th January 10:40
Kent Border Kenny said:
For God’s sake, what are you doing? Don’t justify, don’t explain, just repeat “if you let me know when I can attend then I will make myself available.”
Why are you making your life harder?
We're all sorted now.Why are you making your life harder?
Tenant got the boiler fixed themselves and I've arranged for an engineer to do a gas safety check on Thursday.
Fckitdriveon said:
it would be good advice if it was full of not so subtle digs. unfortunately the good advice gets lost in the B.S of someone telling someone else how c*ap they are. Its not how things are done.
The Op has half a brain cell and is well aware of how perhaps things could've been handled better but doesn't need telling in such a way as to just make someone feel sh*t about themselves.
They say the truth hurts, but it doesn't. There may be digs, but they're 100% accurate. Renting isn't for us, it's just more hassle than it's worth, but not because renting itself is bad, but just because as individuals we are too nice. Combine that with the fact there's little money in now by the time you cover the mortgage, landlords insurance, repairs, agent fees (if you have one) and then the fact you can no longer offset mortgage costs against incomeThe Op has half a brain cell and is well aware of how perhaps things could've been handled better but doesn't need telling in such a way as to just make someone feel sh*t about themselves.
We used a letting agent initially, but the experience completely put us off.
Some quick costs as an example for a 12 month period on the assumption we have a tenant for the full 12 month and rent paid every month;
Rental income: £4,750
Mortgage interest payment: £1,680
Insurance: £500
Gross Profit: £2,570
Tax: £700 (est)
Net Profit: £1,870 per year excluding repairs, redecorating, cost of getting tenants in etc
Then if we factor in that we've got an asset that's depreciated by an average of £2,250 per year and the fact that we're still having the pay the capital on the mortgage of £2,250 per year, there's just no profit.
Even if we wanted to keep it we just can't see how we'd be able to pull this one back. We're losing money hand over fist.
Our plan had been to keep it and rent it out until we'd brought the mortgage down to around the same amount as the value of the property, and then get rid as it would minimise our loses.
Keeping it and renting it out was a bad idea right from the start, and we should have just sold it. If we'd known what we know now things may have been different. We're renting out a property that we paid £47,000 for that's worth £20k. Many other landlords are renting out similar properties that they've paid £15k for. I can see how it's totally worthwhile for them.
Note: My calculations above might be off, I've rushed them whilst trying to work.
Sir Bagalot said:
I have pointed this out to OP. They seem intent on allowing the tenant to go six months into arrears so they can apply for eviction under a different section and therefore notice is just 4 weeks. What they don't realise is
1/ There is a big long queue at the courts. They will be at the back on it.
2/ So tenant gets 6 months in arrears. LL applies for UC to be paid direct. LL applies for eviction. Day before court tenant pays enough rent so they are now 5 months and 3 weeks in arrears. Tenant no longer six months in arrears so eviction applied for under incorrect section.
LL hasn't stated if they will go through the court process themselves, or leave it to professionals like LA. If it's the former then they still haven't grasped that they're dealing with someone who knows how to play the game.
If what you're saying it true, then it looks like it's almost impossible to get rid of the tenants? We want them gone, but it seems there's every obstacle possible in the way of us doing that.1/ There is a big long queue at the courts. They will be at the back on it.
2/ So tenant gets 6 months in arrears. LL applies for UC to be paid direct. LL applies for eviction. Day before court tenant pays enough rent so they are now 5 months and 3 weeks in arrears. Tenant no longer six months in arrears so eviction applied for under incorrect section.
LL hasn't stated if they will go through the court process themselves, or leave it to professionals like LA. If it's the former then they still haven't grasped that they're dealing with someone who knows how to play the game.
Sir Bagalot said:
Just be prepared for a long drawn out eviction. She knows how to play. I'd be surprised if it takes less than a year. Seriously, give LA a call. Initial call is free and they can give you an indication of costs and time taken.
A close friend of ours is a solicitor, we'll speak to her and see if there's someone at her company that can help.We have to pay the mortgage off on this property in October, so it looks likely we'll have to raise the funds to cover the mortgage while we wait to get these buggers out.
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