What training are you doing/have you done today? Vol.2
Discussion
1/10 gym rat type bodybuilders does any meaningful leg work.
Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
(That said, it's hard to compare lifts because none of them are done with full ROM. There are 3 or 4 people I have ever, in 5 years, seen touch, let alone pause, a bench press.)
Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
(That said, it's hard to compare lifts because none of them are done with full ROM. There are 3 or 4 people I have ever, in 5 years, seen touch, let alone pause, a bench press.)
ORD said:
1/10 gym rat type bodybuilders does any meaningful leg work.
Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
(That said, it's hard to compare lifts because none of them are done with full ROM. There are 3 or 4 people I have ever, in 5 years, seen touch, let alone pause, a bench press.)
Mu step daughter goes to a gym twice a week (and once here at home) in Cheltenham. She told me that most of the guys there are on steroids, have huge upper bodies and stick-thin legs, the funniest thing she ever seen, as they look so odd.Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
(That said, it's hard to compare lifts because none of them are done with full ROM. There are 3 or 4 people I have ever, in 5 years, seen touch, let alone pause, a bench press.)
Because she horse rides a lot, her abductors are very strong, and she can use more weight than some of the steroid-ridden guys. She told me yesterday that her and her PT (who is also on steroids but freely admits it on his FB page, but does legs too) were laughing when these upper body/no lower body guys tried to do some.
I do not understand the mentality of not working the lower body, more so if I was on steroids, 20-30 years younger so it would be so easy too muscle!
Would these people not be able to Deadlift too much?
There's a bloke in my gym who's times sometimes crossover mine, he is s big bloke in the upper body, much bigger than me, and has that 'classic' BB bulky swollen look. Nice definition, but too much for my tastes. I have never seen him doing any lower body, save for last week when he did some squats, I didn't pay too much attention, but I was interested. I don't think he went above 110, maybe 120 kg, for not long in the power rack. I think I've seen him shoulder press more seated in the smith machine. He's not the worst example, and he wears baggy shorts so you can't see, so no idea. He does use a lot of light weights/DBs for upper body work too, delts and the like, so it might have been a light day.
ORD said:
1/10 gym rat type bodybuilders does any meaningful leg work.
Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
Most of the very buff guys in my local gym can bench press more than they can squat.
Any squat without weights is already bodyweight I would think. Benching features no bodyweight at all, obviously, So if someone benches and squats 110, they're lifting more on the squat. It's only trad weightlifting vernacular that doesn't allow for this. I only make this point because I think it's a bit unfair and negative motivationally for beginners who may struggle to do 4x10 perfect squats with no weight, yet can do 4x10 @30kg on their first ever day in the gym. Try telling them they need their bodyweight plus that twice again on the bar to achieve parity with their benching.Lift your own weight on a pullup and it's called 'bodyweight'... .
chris watton said:
Because she horse rides a lot, her abductors are very strong,
You may mean adductors here Chris.Sure, but these guys aren't beginners. They're 90 + kgs of juiced up buffness.
My understanding is that people don't do lower body work for two reasons: (1) hips, glutes and hamstrings aren't vanity / beach muscles and (2) squats are vastly more difficult and unpleasant than upper body exercises.
For me, 5 x 5 @ 75% of 1RM on the bench is easy. I could do it without much body tension or effort. Squats at that % require effort and focus. I think that's true for most people.
As for hypertrophy rep ranges (which the BB types tend to work in), after doing 9 reps to failure on squats the other day, I had to sit down and compose myself for a minute; my 9RM on bench press is easy for the first 7 reps and then requires a little bit of grit for the last 2, but not remotely comparable to the squats.
I think a lot of guys make no progress with squats because they try no harder than they do with upper body exercises. If I equalised the effort, I would be squatting 60-80kg for 6 reps. I think the average person has no idea how much more potential strength they have in their legs and hips. I remember looking at strength standards and thinking 'Double bodyweight squat?! WTF?!'
One point I don't understand, and maybe the strong guys could explain it to me, is that there are some exercises on which I can keep going when it's uncomfortable and very tough (squats, isolation work, deadlifts) and others where it goes from fairly easy to impossible very quickly (bench press, pull ups). On the latter kind, I only get 1 hard rep before I hit failure. On the former, I can do several reps more after it feels marginal whether or not I can make the lift. Is it just mental? Is it because on some exercises you can cheat more / shift emphasis onto other muscles so work around l the weak link?
My understanding is that people don't do lower body work for two reasons: (1) hips, glutes and hamstrings aren't vanity / beach muscles and (2) squats are vastly more difficult and unpleasant than upper body exercises.
For me, 5 x 5 @ 75% of 1RM on the bench is easy. I could do it without much body tension or effort. Squats at that % require effort and focus. I think that's true for most people.
As for hypertrophy rep ranges (which the BB types tend to work in), after doing 9 reps to failure on squats the other day, I had to sit down and compose myself for a minute; my 9RM on bench press is easy for the first 7 reps and then requires a little bit of grit for the last 2, but not remotely comparable to the squats.
I think a lot of guys make no progress with squats because they try no harder than they do with upper body exercises. If I equalised the effort, I would be squatting 60-80kg for 6 reps. I think the average person has no idea how much more potential strength they have in their legs and hips. I remember looking at strength standards and thinking 'Double bodyweight squat?! WTF?!'
One point I don't understand, and maybe the strong guys could explain it to me, is that there are some exercises on which I can keep going when it's uncomfortable and very tough (squats, isolation work, deadlifts) and others where it goes from fairly easy to impossible very quickly (bench press, pull ups). On the latter kind, I only get 1 hard rep before I hit failure. On the former, I can do several reps more after it feels marginal whether or not I can make the lift. Is it just mental? Is it because on some exercises you can cheat more / shift emphasis onto other muscles so work around l the weak link?
ORD said:
One point I don't understand, and maybe the strong guys could explain it to me, is that there are some exercises on which I can keep going when it's uncomfortable and very tough (squats, isolation work, deadlifts) and others where it goes from fairly easy to impossible very quickly (bench press, pull ups). On the latter kind, I only get 1 hard rep before I hit failure. On the former, I can do several reps more after it feels marginal whether or not I can make the lift. Is it just mental? Is it because on some exercises you can cheat more / shift emphasis onto other muscles so work around l the weak link?
I guess its as you said- with big compounds like squats/deads, load can be transferred to other muscles when the main ones fatigue, so you can 'cheat' to a degree. With bench, this isn't really an option, and you can't really reset mid set either. Probably a mental aspect to it also- the bar's above your chest on bench, failure can be more painful!For me today>
Bench: 135kg x14 (got to be a PB)
Dips: +60kg x 12
standing strict BB: 80kg x 11
18" deads: 240kg x 10
Chins: +20kg x 10
Decent Monday morning session. Bit tentative on the 18" deads, as that's what got my glute 2 weeks ago, but didn't got too heavy, and the were ok. Bench was great, and I used to hate it!
Best thing I've ever done for bench was to do it like a bodybuilder, to the mid/upper chest, with elbows out and emphasis on the pecs. Initially I was weaker, but it's going great now, pecs have definitely grown too.
Fantastic work on the bench!
I personally go for a middle ground between powerlifting and bb technique because I think it offers the best balance between risk and reward. A pure bb style is a bit harsh on the shoulders, and a pure powerlifting style is not good if you want a balanced stimulus (rather than getting massive anterior delts and triceps). I start with elbows fairly close in but let them come up towards my head once the bar is away from my chest.
A lot depends on individual physique, though - I have long arms and a thin torso so the bottom end shoulder stress is extreme if I let my elbows flare. I have to tuck at least for the first couple of inches, but a guy with a big chest and back and short arms is probably not getting anything like such a problematic shoulder position if he lets the elbows come up a bit.
I personally go for a middle ground between powerlifting and bb technique because I think it offers the best balance between risk and reward. A pure bb style is a bit harsh on the shoulders, and a pure powerlifting style is not good if you want a balanced stimulus (rather than getting massive anterior delts and triceps). I start with elbows fairly close in but let them come up towards my head once the bar is away from my chest.
A lot depends on individual physique, though - I have long arms and a thin torso so the bottom end shoulder stress is extreme if I let my elbows flare. I have to tuck at least for the first couple of inches, but a guy with a big chest and back and short arms is probably not getting anything like such a problematic shoulder position if he lets the elbows come up a bit.
Today, a little less variety than usual, but more..
Squats:
5x12-8 reps
7x5-1 rep (up to 165 and a half squat at 170)
Bench Press:
4x12-8 reps
7x1 rep up to 135kg
6x3-8 rep drop sets with 125-100kg
Clean and Press:
6x5 up to 70kg
3x3-1 reps up to 85kg
BB BOR - 4x12-8 reps
Wide grip Pull Ups - 4x12-8 reps
Seated Pulley Row-4x16-12 reps
And that's it..
Squats:
5x12-8 reps
7x5-1 rep (up to 165 and a half squat at 170)
Bench Press:
4x12-8 reps
7x1 rep up to 135kg
6x3-8 rep drop sets with 125-100kg
Clean and Press:
6x5 up to 70kg
3x3-1 reps up to 85kg
BB BOR - 4x12-8 reps
Wide grip Pull Ups - 4x12-8 reps
Seated Pulley Row-4x16-12 reps
And that's it..
Great stuff, Chris. Impressive on the bench and clean and press.
What's the consensus around here on push presses? I am thinking about replacing the strict OHP with push presses for a month or two to see what happens. I like the idea of a bit more explosive work and getting the upper and lower body in sync.
What's the consensus around here on push presses? I am thinking about replacing the strict OHP with push presses for a month or two to see what happens. I like the idea of a bit more explosive work and getting the upper and lower body in sync.
ORD said:
Great stuff, Chris. Impressive on the bench and clean and press.
What's the consensus around here on push presses? I am thinking about replacing the strict OHP with push presses for a month or two to see what happens. I like the idea of a bit more explosive work and getting the upper and lower body in sync.
It's great I think, overloads the shoulders and tris nicely. I've actually just swapped back to strict for a change, but push is my preference to get stronger. What's the consensus around here on push presses? I am thinking about replacing the strict OHP with push presses for a month or two to see what happens. I like the idea of a bit more explosive work and getting the upper and lower body in sync.
also- great work Chris.
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