Will the 370z become a future classic?

[NJH]

I have no dog in this fight I wonder if all the naysayers would have said the same thing about the Z3M breadvan several years back? After all it was a car not remotely universally liked, ugly, old fashioned suspension design, less good than a car with the same engine made by the same manufacturer which was starting to be found for shed money etc. etc. However look at them now, who could have predicted that?

[tali1]

Always see the 370Z as something of a cut-price GTR

[swisstoni]

I could see a case for it.
When the stoners grow up and look back on their youth, they may start to seek them out again. Just have to twiddle thumbs for about 20 years.

If the next version of this car is uglier, more remote and some 4 pot turbo hybrid or something equally horrendous, then the originals will be even more attractive. That's sort of happening with 911s after all.

[Andy S15]

You'll be waiting a long, long time before 370Z values start to increase. There's just not enough to make them stand out amongst the other Japanese performance cars of that era. Rarity, popularity and uniqueness are the biggest factors in something becoming a classic, none of which the 370Z has going for it in great amounts.

In my opinion the S2000 is going to see the biggest value increase over the coming years in this segment. Popularity is on the rise (although slowly), they are becoming increasingly rare and have a very unique engine which we'll never see the likes of again.

But then again, might just be saying that because I own one.

[CYMR0]

Never understood why, after 25 years, 300ZXs aren't more expensive than they currently are:

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C678451

[fivepointnine]

Andy S15 said:

You'll be waiting a long, long time before 370Z values start to increase. There's just not enough to make them stand out amongst the other Japanese performance cars of that era. Rarity, popularity and uniqueness are the biggest factors in something becoming a classic, none of which the 370Z has going for it in great amounts.

In my opinion the S2000 is going to see the biggest value increase over the coming years in this segment. Popularity is on the rise (although slowly), they are becoming increasingly rare and have a very unique engine which we'll never see the likes of again.

But then again, might just be saying that because I own one.

What Japanese performance cars from the 2005-current are a GT car, 300+bhp and RWD? The S2000 is a roadster, and the various Honda R's are hot hatches, the RX8 is not even remotely in the same league. There are not any others that I can think of. The closest competitors are the BRZ (not near the power output) and the Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8 (not available here).

I also cannot understand why the 300ZX TT is not worth more. Contemporary reviews compared it very favourably to the FD RX8 and the MKIV Supra, yet those cars prices have rocketed up and the 300ZX TT prices have stayed stagnant.

[Andy S15]

fivepointnine said:

What Japanese performance cars from the 2005-current are a GT car, 300+bhp and RWD?

Admittedly, not much. Very little especially 300+ unless you look much more modern due to the gentleman's agreement. But that's precisely the point - Japan doesn't really do GT's (look at the SC430!), it isn't their forte and they aren't exactly desirable. While that gives them the rarity status, there's got to be a demand there to make something valuable, Japanese GT is a very specific, and not very popular niche. This is also why Z32 300ZX's aren't really worth anything, as there are better GT cars around from that era and dynamically the Z32 isn't anything special. You could say exactly the same statement about the 370z. I do see the point you're making though.

Oh, and Hyundai? Japanese?

Edited by Andy S15 on Tuesday 19th January 09:28

[Leins]

NJH said:

I have no dog in this fight I wonder if all the naysayers would have said the same thing about the Z3M breadvan several years back? After all it was a car not remotely universally liked, ugly, old fashioned suspension design, less good than a car with the same engine made by the same manufacturer which was starting to be found for shed money etc. etc. However look at them now, who could have predicted that?

Lots of people TBF. As soon as E30 M3s really started picking up in value (c. 2010-11), people started eyeing up Z3MCs & CSLs

[daemon]

Andy S15 said:

You'll be waiting a long, long time before 370Z values start to increase.

Clearly, apart from anything, they still make it.

It could take a good 10 years after production ends for values to even think about rising.

[Andy S15]

Another point to think about, the 240z? Probably the most famous Z car ever. They are much much rarer, way more desirable, have a cult (although fairly small) following and went out of production 40 odd years ago. They also seem to have only really become more popular over the last 10 years. From a quick search on Car and Classic they appear to be going from between 15-30k for a UK one - much less than what a 370z costs new which are more abundant and less desirable.

[C70R]

xRIEx said:

C70R said:

A cult car is one that inspires a fanatical following, recognised beyond owners/fans.

That's the very opposite of a cult following; cult cars would only be lauded by owners/fans, anyone beyond wouldn't care about them. Hence 'cult'.

It seems that "cult car" doesn't follow the accepted dictionary definition of "cult", so I can see why the confusion is happening. Some examples of general use of the "cult car" nomenclature:
https://www.adrianflux.co.uk/cult-classics/
http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/03/cars-cult-collect...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/g833/10-cool-...
http://www.auto123.com/en/news/top-10-modern-cult-...

I accept that there's a chance I'm wrong on this, but none of the links above contain niche cars with small followings, generally unrecognised outside of their owners' groups.

[fivepointnine]

Andy S15 said:

Admittedly, not much. Very little especially 300+ unless you look much more modern due to the gentleman's agreement. But that's precisely the point - Japan doesn't really do GT's (look at the SC430!), it isn't their forte and they aren't exactly desirable. While that gives them the rarity status, there's got to be a demand there to make something valuable, Japanese GT is a very specific, and not very popular niche. This is also why Z32 300ZX's aren't really worth anything, as there are better GT cars around from that era and dynamically the Z32 isn't anything special. You could say exactly the same statement about the 370z. I do see the point you're making though.

Oh, and Hyundai? Japanese?

Edited by Andy S15 on Tuesday 19th January 09:28

True, not Japanese, but it is the closest car to the 370Z that Asia produces (just a touch bigger with a barely usable back seat, but about 15bhp more)
Good point about the SC430, that car was dismal.

[TooMany2cvs]

C70R said:

xRIEx said:

C70R said:

A cult car is one that inspires a fanatical following, recognised beyond owners/fans.

That's the very opposite of a cult following; cult cars would only be lauded by owners/fans, anyone beyond wouldn't care about them. Hence 'cult'.

It seems that "cult car" doesn't follow the accepted dictionary definition of "cult", so I can see why the confusion is happening. Some examples of general use of the "cult car" nomenclature:
https://www.adrianflux.co.uk/cult-classics/
http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/03/cars-cult-collect...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/g833/10-cool-...
http://www.auto123.com/en/news/top-10-modern-cult-...

I accept that there's a chance I'm wrong on this, but none of the links above contain niche cars with small followings, generally unrecognised outside of their owners' groups.

"Term with specific meaning gets widely misunderstood and misused". Hold the front page.

[C70R]

TooMany2cvs said:

C70R said:

xRIEx said:

C70R said:

A cult car is one that inspires a fanatical following, recognised beyond owners/fans.

That's the very opposite of a cult following; cult cars would only be lauded by owners/fans, anyone beyond wouldn't care about them. Hence 'cult'.

It seems that "cult car" doesn't follow the accepted dictionary definition of "cult", so I can see why the confusion is happening. Some examples of general use of the "cult car" nomenclature:
https://www.adrianflux.co.uk/cult-classics/
http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/03/cars-cult-collect...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/g833/10-cool-...
http://www.auto123.com/en/news/top-10-modern-cult-...

I accept that there's a chance I'm wrong on this, but none of the links above contain niche cars with small followings, generally unrecognised outside of their owners' groups.

"Term with specific meaning gets widely misunderstood and misused". Hold the front page.

Jeez, you're a ray of sunshine. Those one-liner, sarcastic posts (your MO) are not tremendously helpful.

[TooMany2cvs]

C70R said:

Jeez, you're a ray of sunshine. Those one-liner, sarcastic posts (your MO) are not tremendously helpful.

<shrug> They only come out when and where they're truly warranted.

[Dynamic Turtle]

CYMR0 said:

Never understood why, after 25 years, 300ZXs aren't more expensive than they currently are:

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C678451

It is strange because it's ostensibly quite a pleasingly design by the standards of 90s jap coupes.

I think it might be down to the complexity of the vehicle; a tightly packed twin turbo engine bay and four wheel steering is nasty to work on, according to the Nissan mechanics I've spoken to and a few VQ/RB specialist shops won't even look at a 300ZX. The 350Z returned to a much simpler high displacement / double wishbone design.

Another thing this thread seems to neglect is that while Z cars in general are pretty rare in the UK they're ten-a-penny Stateside, not forgetting the even more numerous G35/G37 Infiniti variants too.

[forzaminardi]

Ultimately, any old car in good nick (especially a performance car) will become 'classic' simply by being old and rare - but it will take decades. Original Z-Cars have only relatively recently become covetable by people outside fan clubs, and we're talking about potentially almost 40-year old cars there.

Aside from the obvious candidates, what could make a car potentially a classic (especially from a mainstream / mundane manufacturer which Nissan patently is) is an element of character or x-factor. The car doesn't have to be essentially good, really, simply it has to have something tangible or intangible about it that maybe only a few people get, but in time serve to define its qualities. The S2000, as someone mentioned, has that - it's not necessarily the best car ever, or flawless, or everyone's cup of tea, but its engine and ethos give it an aura beyond its fundamental qualities even if many of us think that's all bullsh*t. I think the 370Z, by nature of being the last of the mainstream brand big-engined NA RWD coupes has it to a certain extent, but I'm not sure it's enough. Good cars, I'm sure the owners love them and I'd like to have a go in one but I don't think they have the necessary x-factor to avoid over the next decade or so simply being thought of as "old cheap Japanses sports car" by the wider market. Also I tend to think bringing the NISMO version out damages the potential for the 'normal' ones to be sought after - by and large, the S2000 (again for example) was just as it was beyond facelifts and technical updates, and thus they are all equally appreciated. The NISMO one immediately makes the 'normal' 370Zs seem 'second best'.

All simply my opinion obviously.

[C70R]

TooMany2cvs said:

C70R said:

Jeez, you're a ray of sunshine. Those one-liner, sarcastic posts (your MO) are not tremendously helpful.

<shrug> They only come out when and where they're truly warranted.

You've added a great deal to this discussion, for which we are truly grateful.

[Ecosseven]

forzaminardi said:

Also I tend to think bringing the NISMO version out damages the potential for the 'normal' ones to be sought after - by and large, the S2000 (again for example) was just as it was beyond facelifts and technical updates, and thus they are all equally appreciated. The NISMO one immediately makes the 'normal' 370Zs seem 'second best'.

All simply my opinion obviously.

Not sure about this. The NISMO may be faster but I'm not convinced it's a better car for UK roads. Plus the standard 370z looks good but the NISMO has too many additional skirts and spoilers. All IMHO of course.













[url]|http://thumbsnap.com/kmMRhs7h[/url

Edited by Ecosseven on Tuesday 19th January 16:38

[Ved]

Great car, 350z too, but no. It'll be like the GT-Four; a magnificent car but one that never really took and certainly won't appreciate like its peers have will.