RE: Caparo Lays Claim To Top Gear Power Lap
Discussion
GTRene said:
Fort Jefferson said:
AJM6 said:
Oh yes, and the owner must be happy to leave it unattended in a public place.
Not sure about this one, I'm very particular where I leave my Elise. There are far too many morons out there, you only have to read PH to see how often deliberate damage occurs.
Packman said:
I have built and owned Tigers since 1997. None have cost me over £11K to build and none of them have given me anything but pure driving pleasure. SVA now ensures that they are built safer than ever. They are the man in the streets way of getting performance that they otherwise could not afford. So come on TG whats wrong with them?
Packman
It's an image that the industry is stuck with I'm afraid, old perceptions die hard. Not just Top Gear but the public in general. OK, the SVA has made a difference to the way they are screwed together but there are some truly awful kit cars out there.Packman
Just walk down the rows of Tigers at Stonleigh, all SVA'd but the standard runs from first rate cars to cars you'd be embarrassed to be seen in, all down to the builder, craftsman or bodger?
For every one well built Dax, GD, Ultama etc. out there, there are hundreds of other cars that are just crap and no matter how much money they have spent on them will always be crap.
Oh, and by the way I've built two Tigers myself, so I'm not anti kit car.
flemke said:
WombatinSwansea said:
But you didn't mention the sensible attitude, correct politics, good taste in cars (most of the time), sense of humour, or cute cheekiness. Plus he can drift and has driven a Veyron. What else matters?
Let's see..."Sensible attitude" - sometimes, but then he'll go off on one of his ludicrous, obnoxious tangents, such as when he advocated mowing down cyclists with his car, and he does great damage to the cause of motorists', as well as making an ass of himself,
"Correct politics" - you would think so, but he appeared on Question Time a couple of years ago. I was looking forward to his demolishing the lefties with trenchant arguments, but in the event they left him looking a one-dimensional, babbling fool,
"Good taste in cars" - This is a guy with an admitted aversion to Porsches, which is fair enough, but with a slavish devotion to the filth of Maranello, who have perfected the pursuit of style over substance whilst polluting motorsport to an unforgivable extent. Good taste? I think not.
"Sense of humour" - Perhaps a bit, although have we not had enough repetitions of his, "We needed to see what it would really do, so we gave it to...(queue deep voice)...the Stig."?
"Cute cheekiness" - If that means tongue-tied drooling over a boring, egomaniacal ice queen such as Kristin Scott Thomas, then I'll grant you cute cheekiness.
"He can drift" - Perhaps, but, if so, that would be a new skill for him. It wasn't that long ago that I tried to follow him around the Nordschliefe. I say "tried", because soon I was forced to overtake him - it was not possible to drive as slowly as he was doing.
"He's driven a Veyron" - I've driven three, but it didn't turn me into anything special.
Anyhow, this is all in good fun. I was just surprised that that sort of guy attracts women.
Way off topic now but anyway, I'm really only a fan for, umm, 4 reasons:
He stands up for us (petrolheads)
He's amusing at times
He's anti Porsche (me too)
He rates my car top 10 (me too)!
Must admit though the image has all become a bit Mr Bean now.
Frik said:
WombatinSwansea said:
He's anti Porsche (me too)
How not to get on flemke's good side...They make capable, solid cars, and have an admirable record in racing.
What Wiedeking has done to the company has been financially brilliant, but utterly devoid of artistry and passion. The company has become comprehensively cynical. It's no longer about anything except maximising return. If I were a shareholder, that would make me happy. As a car owner and motorsports fan, however, it is deeply disappointing.
Their current flagship "driver's car", the 997 GT3, is hugely competent but is, at the same time, the least involving Porsche road car that I have ever driven.
A few living vestiges of Porsche greatness remain in Weissach. Once the likes of Rohrl and Kussmaul retire in the next few years, it truly will be all over.
Back to the Caparo - at least that's got artistry and passion in it!
WombatinSwansea said:
He rates my car top 10 (me too)!
And that car would be...?WombatinSwansea said:
Must admit though the image has all become a bit Mr Bean now.
Funny you should mention Mr Bean.Wrt most of your criteria:
WombatinSwansea said:
But you didn't mention the sensible attitude, correct politics, good taste in cars (most of the time), sense of humour, or cute cheekiness. Plus he can drift and has driven a Veyron.
I can assure you that RA is a lot better qualified than Lumpy is.
flemke said:
Back to the Caparo - at least that's got artistry and passion in it!
And maybe a little too much arrogance?I'm still rather surprised by the decision to bring the car to the masses (or the hacks at least) before it really should have been.
I wonder where the pressure came from to set a date that was simply too early.
Frik said:
flemke said:
Back to the Caparo - at least that's got artistry and passion in it!
And maybe a little too much arrogance?I'm still rather surprised by the decision to bring the car to the masses (or the hacks at least) before it really should have been.
I wonder where the pressure came from to set a date that was simply too early.
Let's keep in mind that premature publicity may have been the reason that Freestream attracted Caparo in the first place, and that that funding may have been crucial to the project.
In the two(?) years since then, however, it might well have been wiser to stay under the radar.
flemke said:
Frik said:
WombatinSwansea said:
He's anti Porsche (me too)
How not to get on flemke's good side...Back to the Caparo - at least that's got artistry and passion in it!
My car? A humble V6 Clio does it for me. I haven't even seen a Veyron in the flesh, let alone drive one. You are privileged!
WombatinSwansea said:
flemke said:
Frik said:
WombatinSwansea said:
He's anti Porsche (me too)
How not to get on flemke's good side...Back to the Caparo - at least that's got artistry and passion in it!
My car? A humble V6 Clio does it for me. I haven't even seen a Veyron in the flesh, let alone drive one. You are privileged!
As for the Bug, it's beautifully made and has an extraordinary gearbox. Otherwise, it is inspired, but not inspiring.
Frik said:
Agreed, and BSG and GH are very much Engineers, not marketing men - the car is testament to that.
But they'd be well aware it wasn't ready. Were Caparo keen to see a return on their investment and the T1 out the door and money making projects on the drawing boards I wonder.
Maybe, but it was a mistake.But they'd be well aware it wasn't ready. Were Caparo keen to see a return on their investment and the T1 out the door and money making projects on the drawing boards I wonder.
flemke said:
"Good taste in cars" - devotion to the filth of Maranello, who have perfected the pursuit of style over substance whilst polluting motorsport to an unforgivable extent.
jeremy clarkson said:
This company can give you a good px deal for one of Maranellos finest
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/245264.htm
they do add must have one careful owner and must not be tracked !!
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/245264.htm
they do add must have one careful owner and must not be tracked !!
DBSV8 said:
flemke said:
"Good taste in cars" - devotion to the filth of Maranello, who have perfected the pursuit of style over substance whilst polluting motorsport to an unforgivable extent.
jeremy clarkson said:
This company can give you a good px deal for one of Maranellos finest
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/245264.htm
they do add must have one careful owner and must not be tracked !!
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/245264.htm
they do add must have one careful owner and must not be tracked !!
[/quote]
If you love your car, that makes it a good one.
As for the Bug, it's beautifully made and has an extraordinary gearbox. Otherwise, it is inspired, but not inspiring.
[/quote]
Interesting. I also have a burning desire to drive an Audi R8 but I figure it might be a bit like that too.
(Which helps me live with the fact that I will never get to drive one!)
WombatinSwansea said:
flemke said:
If you love your car, that makes it a good one.
As for the Bug, it's beautifully made and has an extraordinary gearbox. Otherwise, it is inspired, but not inspiring.
Interesting. I also have a burning desire to drive an Audi R8 but I figure it might be a bit like that too.As for the Bug, it's beautifully made and has an extraordinary gearbox. Otherwise, it is inspired, but not inspiring.
(Which helps me live with the fact that I will never get to drive one!)
R8 - you're not missing that much. The brakes spoil everything. NSX is a nicer drive.
tinman0 said:
said:
It's very simple; as others have eluded to, Top Gear is about making 'entertainment' telly for the masses, it is by no means scientific in its approach to 'testing'.
The Top Gear 'Lap' fills 5-10 mins an episode and that's about it. The mere fact that the 'tests' take place throughout the year, in all weathers, renders the results all but worthless.
Caparo laying claim to the TG 'record' is about as pointless as the car they produce.
I'm a fan of it from a 'build it cos we could' perspective - but £235k for privelege? Not to mention the fact that it's broken down in some way or other every time it's been tested!? No thanks. Just go and buy yourself a pukka race car - it will be faster on the one place you can get to enjoy it - the track.
Other than maybe parking outside the Casino in Monaco, or posing down the Kings Road (briefly), there's no point in using it on the road.
Ultima beating everything by a country mile would be far too embarrassing to the mainstream manufacturers and let's face it, they need to keep them on-side to lend cars for the regular 'supercar vs. some inane form of trasnport psuedo race' where they miraculously finish within microns of each other.
Enjoy it for what it is - telly. If you want to prove a point, just go an buy a suitable car and thrash everyone else at an appropriate trackday/race/test session.
who said that?? The Top Gear 'Lap' fills 5-10 mins an episode and that's about it. The mere fact that the 'tests' take place throughout the year, in all weathers, renders the results all but worthless.
Caparo laying claim to the TG 'record' is about as pointless as the car they produce.
I'm a fan of it from a 'build it cos we could' perspective - but £235k for privelege? Not to mention the fact that it's broken down in some way or other every time it's been tested!? No thanks. Just go and buy yourself a pukka race car - it will be faster on the one place you can get to enjoy it - the track.
Other than maybe parking outside the Casino in Monaco, or posing down the Kings Road (briefly), there's no point in using it on the road.
Ultima beating everything by a country mile would be far too embarrassing to the mainstream manufacturers and let's face it, they need to keep them on-side to lend cars for the regular 'supercar vs. some inane form of trasnport psuedo race' where they miraculously finish within microns of each other.
Enjoy it for what it is - telly. If you want to prove a point, just go an buy a suitable car and thrash everyone else at an appropriate trackday/race/test session.
NB. can I just say, for the record (given that this is a TG thread), that my nickname existed long before TG's 'The Stig' did. About the only element of infamy about it, is that PetrolTed was instrumental in me 'earning' it
Edited by Stig on Friday 23 November 11:02
errek72 said:
cpufreak said:
Frequently I drove in the wet, on semi slicks, in some case with only a couple of mm of tyre depth left.
Now that's hardly fair, how can anybody have an argument with a guy that is obviously going to end up as a flaming ball of fire sooner rather than later? Seriously though, not very smart what you're doing there (if you are).
This has been one of the wettest summers in history, yet I had semi slicks on from April until November. Never once did I feel unsafe, or unsettled due to my choice of tyres (or for any other reason as matter of fact).
In this time, I completed 20,000 miles, of which about 6500 were on track (mostly the nurburgring, but also some drift days). The 'ring was driven come rain or shine, similarly the surrounding roads, autobahns, and roads back to holland were driven on whatever the weather.
Firstly Cups, Corsas, R888s, A048s etc are not bad in damp conditions, certainly on track its possible to get temperature in them, and then they're better than normal road tyres, due to the softer compound.
On the road, driving sensibly you wont get temperature into them, but in damp to mildly wet conditions again they're fine...
The area you need to be careful of is when standing water however, but generally judging by the level of recent or present precipitation it is possible to judge whether there was likely to be standing water ahead.
I didn't try and set any records in the wet, but nor was I ever significantly delayed on a journey due to having Cups on.
I'm not trying to make any claim like a Pilot sport cup offers better grip than a PS2 in the wet, just that provided you're not an idiot, semi-slicks are not dangerous in the wet.
Infact, sadly a chap died last week in a 4WD Audi R8, on PS2s, when he lost control on an autobahn doing inappropriate speeds for the (wet) conditions... so there is a danger that too much perceived safety gives the impression of invulnerability....
Perhaps we should all drive around on cross plies!
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