Rural drink-driving
Discussion
coppice said:
biggbn said:
Why do people NEED a drink with dinner? What is this hard wired need to consume alcohol? If you are driving don't do it, that seems like a really simple and easy to follow set of rules, no?
They (ie me ) don't need a drink , in the same way as none of us actually NEED a nice car . But they make the journey or the meal more enjoyable . I can't imagine having an expensive meal out, or an opulent one at home without wine. And no - I don't drink and drive . At least not any more - it was compulsory to do so in the 70s and 80s . Cue panic attacks by millenials ... biggbn said:
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
Why do people NEED a drink with dinner? What is this hard wired need to consume alcohol? If you are driving don't do it, that seems like a really simple and easy to follow set of rules, no?
If there’s a negligible difference between none and one then what is the issue?Only my opinions man, others will disagree, and that's cool!
Edited by biggbn on Thursday 11th August 22:56
Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
With respect, 'each to their own' is not your policy on this, is it?
What else is on your list of things that are 'not for you' that you want to take from other people?
SpeckledJim said:
You could make the same argument about radios and telephones in cars. You really need to be concentrating. You can't handle John Humphreys or Massive Attack, or an argument with the missus when you need the reactions of a cat.
Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
Why two when you can have cheeky three?Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
Why do people NEED a drink with dinner? What is this hard wired need to consume alcohol? If you are driving don't do it, that seems like a really simple and easy to follow set of rules, no?
If there’s a negligible difference between none and one then what is the issue?Only my opinions man, others will disagree, and that's cool!
Edited by biggbn on Thursday 11th August 22:56
Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
With respect, 'each to their own' is not your policy on this, is it?
What else is on your list of things that are 'not for you' that you want to take from other people?
Have a great day, peace, gbn xEdited by biggbn on Friday 12th August 09:57
Exoticlover said:
SpeckledJim said:
You could make the same argument about radios and telephones in cars. You really need to be concentrating. You can't handle John Humphreys or Massive Attack, or an argument with the missus when you need the reactions of a cat.
Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
Why two when you can have cheeky three?Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
The issue is with people who have had a lot. Not people who have had a little.
Why make the good the enemy of the perfect?
We can have the same argument around speed limits. Lets make the urban limit everywhere 20mph. That'll make criminals of the people who do 30mph, and it'll have no impact on the knobheads who do 90 and cause the actual problems.
I think the DD limit should be zero. No exceptions, no bar room calculations. Nothing.
If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
I think the DD limit should be zero. No exceptions, no bar room calculations. Nothing.
If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
You're banning orange juice then?If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
Exoticlover said:
SpeckledJim said:
You could make the same argument about radios and telephones in cars. You really need to be concentrating. You can't handle John Humphreys or Massive Attack, or an argument with the missus when you need the reactions of a cat.
Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
Why two when you can have cheeky three?Why. Take. The. Chance.
(If a glass of wine has a noticeable effect on you sometimes, then by all means refrain. But leave the rest of us to just have a nice time supporting rural pubs and enjoying a proper pint or two. By all means put a bobby at the end of the road to catch the dick who has had six.)
SpeckledJim said:
biggbn said:
Why do people NEED a drink with dinner? What is this hard wired need to consume alcohol? If you are driving don't do it, that seems like a really simple and easy to follow set of rules, no?
If there’s a negligible difference between none and one then what is the issue?I obviously don't drive after a whole bottle but I have driven after one glass at lunchtime.
SpeckledJim said:
and it'll have no impact on the knobheads who do 90 and cause the actual problems.
Just because you personally don't see that person caught at that moment doesn't mean that they haven't before and will be again. People who act like that tend to be caught and if not in person they've got poor awareness skills and trigger traffic cameras.
Like a bad experience with a bmw model on the Internet, people see someone acting badly on the street and think that's it, it's lawless. It's all bad now.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
SpeckledJim said:
and it'll have no impact on the knobheads who do 90 and cause the actual problems.
Just because you personally don't see that person caught at that moment doesn't mean that they haven't before and will be again. People who act like that tend to be caught and if not in person they've got poor awareness skills and trigger traffic cameras.
Just as the knobhead driving after 6 pints isn't going to 'see the light' if you make the limit 50 instead of 80.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
I think the DD limit should be zero. No exceptions, no bar room calculations. Nothing.
If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
Cocaine hasn't been a middle class drug since the last century. If you aren't adult enough to get yourself in one direction safely you deserve your licence removing and insurance rocketing for years.
Just as prevalent now is drug driving. Middle class people thinking cocaine is alright. They would be incest if someone stole their car yet happy to do business with said criminals buying their drugs from them.
It's not worth it. Full stop. You might never get away with it or on the 10th occasion your caught.
Why risk everything?
People say a few pints is fine, they are safe but you aren't. Especially if it's been a long day. Concentration slips at the most unexpected places.
Plus as noted a few times, people have lost loved ones to drink drivers.
I knew someone who when growing up in rural Cumbria was caught DD twice.
He had a drink problem 30yrs on. I don't know him now but I bet he still does it. He had that sort of 'ill be alright mate ' arrogance.
And I'm not sure many are claiming a 'few pints' is OK!!
This is a thread about rural drink driving as in people who live in the countryside and drive while over the legal limit. Very few on this thread have come close to condoning that behaviour. There have probably been more insane posts about how it's middle class people to blame or that one pint of beer leads to incest than posts saying deliberately drinking over the legal limit should be allowed.
A few years ago, I was out late with a friend driving some of the nicer country roads that are usually extremely quiet during the night.
We ended up behind a chap that was blatantly drunk - so drunk in fact that he pulled over by himself and thought we were police.
We rung it in anyway - easy to turn a blind eye, but the safety of others was the biggest concern.
We ended up behind a chap that was blatantly drunk - so drunk in fact that he pulled over by himself and thought we were police.
We rung it in anyway - easy to turn a blind eye, but the safety of others was the biggest concern.
Exoticlover said:
thats what i am saying. let people enjoy life a bit. 2 or 3 pints, and one for the road. whats not to like on a summer evening?
What you seemed to be implying from earlier posts was that people have no self control so once they have a pint they're off on a session. The law makes it pretty clear where the dividing line is and most people opt to remain on a specific side. Is anyone condoning those who opt to be on the wrong line?The current English system gives leeway not just for a pint at lunch or dinner but for residual alcohol the morning after. It's set at a pretty benign level that seems a fair compromise between vet little potential impairment and not criminalising the bulk of the country.
The actual issue is that it simply isn't cost effective to enforce the law robustly on those who make the overt decision to break it. Changing the legal limit won't change that.
There will never be the levels of police manpower or budget to clamp down on rural drunk drivers. There is no electronic policing fix. What you have is fellow drinkers and landlords who could be incentivised to grass them up but we've just had two years of lockdowns and people building pubs in their back gardens and hosting clandestine piss ups so we actually know that all that would happen is that these people would congregate where there were no witnesses etc.
DonkeyApple said:
What you seemed to be implying from earlier posts was that people have no self control so once they have a pint they're off on a session. The law makes it pretty clear where the dividing line is and most people opt to remain on a specific side. Is anyone condoning those who opt to be on the wrong line?
The current English system gives leeway not just for a pint at lunch or dinner but for residual alcohol the morning after. It's set at a pretty benign level that seems a fair compromise between vet little potential impairment and not criminalising the bulk of the country.
The actual issue is that it simply isn't cost effective to enforce the law robustly on those who make the overt decision to break it. Changing the legal limit won't change that.
There will never be the levels of police manpower or budget to clamp down on rural drunk drivers. There is no electronic policing fix. What you have is fellow drinkers and landlords who could be incentivised to grass them up but we've just had two years of lockdowns and people building pubs in their back gardens and hosting clandestine piss ups so we actually know that all that would happen is that these people would congregate where there were no witnesses etc.
But 9hours later a residual amount means you've had some fair drinking on a school night. The current English system gives leeway not just for a pint at lunch or dinner but for residual alcohol the morning after. It's set at a pretty benign level that seems a fair compromise between vet little potential impairment and not criminalising the bulk of the country.
The actual issue is that it simply isn't cost effective to enforce the law robustly on those who make the overt decision to break it. Changing the legal limit won't change that.
There will never be the levels of police manpower or budget to clamp down on rural drunk drivers. There is no electronic policing fix. What you have is fellow drinkers and landlords who could be incentivised to grass them up but we've just had two years of lockdowns and people building pubs in their back gardens and hosting clandestine piss ups so we actually know that all that would happen is that these people would congregate where there were no witnesses etc.
Again, as mentioned further up why do people need to drink.
It should be a weekend treat.
If I'm riding my motorbike I wouldn't even look at a shandy.
Same with driving. You need your concentration, all of it.
Exoticlover said:
thats what i am saying. let people enjoy life a bit. 2 or 3 pints, and one for the road. whats not to like on a summer evening?
Probably near the top of what's not to like is the (actual event) person killed because someone had 4 pints and drove a car whilst, according to a graph i saw, the average person will have reduced perception and reaction in the region of 40%.That's quite a big disadvantage in my book. It could be my daughter run over not the lad in Birmingham in the instance above. I'd say 2 or 3 and 1 for the road is pretty irresponsible to be perfectly frank. What's great about driving a lethal weapon with 40% of your ability gone?
Habits have changed to some extent where I live. The two rural pubs I use are busy @ 6-8pm where people have a couple of drinks, or more if their partner is driving. After that, go home have something to eat and drink as much as they want. I was taken out for a meal to one recently and we were the last to leave @ 9.20pm. Not everyone, obviously, but a lot more, and use of cabs (which can be hard to get).
It's a pity ordinary strength beers have got stronger over the years. When I was 18 a 3.5% beer wasn't uncommon, now 4% min.
One issue you might not expect is mothers having a couple of large glasses of wine over/as lunch before going to collect their children from (predominantly public) school.
It's a pity ordinary strength beers have got stronger over the years. When I was 18 a 3.5% beer wasn't uncommon, now 4% min.
One issue you might not expect is mothers having a couple of large glasses of wine over/as lunch before going to collect their children from (predominantly public) school.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
DonkeyApple said:
What you seemed to be implying from earlier posts was that people have no self control so once they have a pint they're off on a session. The law makes it pretty clear where the dividing line is and most people opt to remain on a specific side. Is anyone condoning those who opt to be on the wrong line?
The current English system gives leeway not just for a pint at lunch or dinner but for residual alcohol the morning after. It's set at a pretty benign level that seems a fair compromise between vet little potential impairment and not criminalising the bulk of the country.
The actual issue is that it simply isn't cost effective to enforce the law robustly on those who make the overt decision to break it. Changing the legal limit won't change that.
There will never be the levels of police manpower or budget to clamp down on rural drunk drivers. There is no electronic policing fix. What you have is fellow drinkers and landlords who could be incentivised to grass them up but we've just had two years of lockdowns and people building pubs in their back gardens and hosting clandestine piss ups so we actually know that all that would happen is that these people would congregate where there were no witnesses etc.
But 9hours later a residual amount means you've had some fair drinking on a school night. The current English system gives leeway not just for a pint at lunch or dinner but for residual alcohol the morning after. It's set at a pretty benign level that seems a fair compromise between vet little potential impairment and not criminalising the bulk of the country.
The actual issue is that it simply isn't cost effective to enforce the law robustly on those who make the overt decision to break it. Changing the legal limit won't change that.
There will never be the levels of police manpower or budget to clamp down on rural drunk drivers. There is no electronic policing fix. What you have is fellow drinkers and landlords who could be incentivised to grass them up but we've just had two years of lockdowns and people building pubs in their back gardens and hosting clandestine piss ups so we actually know that all that would happen is that these people would congregate where there were no witnesses etc.
Again, as mentioned further up why do people need to drink.
It should be a weekend treat.
If I'm riding my motorbike I wouldn't even look at a shandy.
Same with driving. You need your concentration, all of it.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
But 9hours later a residual amount means you've had some fair drinking on a school night.
Again, as mentioned further up why do people need to drink.
It should be a weekend treat.
If I'm riding my motorbike I wouldn't even look at a shandy.
Same with driving. You need your concentration, all of it.
So as suggested earlier, you will be banning orange juice, because it has alcohol in it. And rum-raisin ice cream (sorry kids, daddy can't be too careful).Again, as mentioned further up why do people need to drink.
It should be a weekend treat.
If I'm riding my motorbike I wouldn't even look at a shandy.
Same with driving. You need your concentration, all of it.
And car radios. And phones. And passengers.
When you set an absolutist policy like you have, you have to be serious, don't you. Even if it makes you look a nutter.
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