Is driving difficult?

[morgrp]

kambites said:

Driving is easy.

Driving well is hard.

I've never been in a car with anyone who drives perfectly.

This - driving well is difficult - sure, anyOne can learn good road manners and behaviour but it's the abuse people afflict on cars that really highlights a bad driver (these are also often the people who see themselves as gods gift to driving). I strongly believe the reason so many dual mass flywheels die prematurely is that people are so harsh on them when going through the gears - sure, they're a stty invention but the number of people I have been in the car with laying claim to being amazing drivers that abuse their cars by doing quick but violent gear changes thinking they are just like michael schumacher makes me laugh.
The other thing that really gets me is people and brakes - people who don't read the road properly use the brakes a lot. The number of cooked brake discs I replace on customer's cars is incredible. The other old favourite is sitting behind people in traffic with their foot on the brake - for fks sake, take it out of gear and stick the hand brake on.

People often accuse cars of being unreliable when parts wear out or break but it is nearly always because the driver has abused them in some way.

[bicycleshorts]

Benbay001 said:

For those who have answered "no" as opposed to "yes sometimes" Then that would mean you have never made a mistake, surely? Yeh right..

Having sex is easy but people manage to break their nobs.

[jmsgld]

This happened to me a few months ago, was changing the throttle cable in the chim parked at the roadside in London.
Upside down in the footwell, thought I felt the car move... just managed to get into the right position to access the cable so ignored it, carried on with job in hand, 20s later felt it again, managed to extract myself from the car just in time to see a BMW estate reverse into my car for the third time!!?

Stoopid woman seemed to think it was my fault!!? Even told the insurance company so too, despite the fact she had admitted that my car was parked!!?

So for some people I think driving is definitely hard...

[Benbay001]

bicycleshorts said:

Having sex is easy but people manage to break their nobs.

Never heard of that happening before..
I would imagine people who have suffered that cruel fate would probably answer that they found it rather difficult on that occasion.

[sparkyhx]

JonnyFive said:

We had a woman this morning on the A3 (A busy road!) stop in the right hand lane because she was near her junction and hadn't moved across lanes yet.

I've also been in the car with people some times when they brake all of the time, they brake for empty roundabouts, they brake for every single corner, they brake when they see another car.. Again, driving seems difficult for these people.

jeez whats my wife doing on the A3 she should be in Halifax.

Honestly your description sounds exactly like my wife. She stopped on the inside lane of a motorway to let someone out once.

The slowing stuff is as a rule just annoying not necessarily dangerous - her most dangerous manoeuvre is the multi lane roundabout where she just takes the shortest route completely oblivious to anyone on the inside or outside of her. (not over the middle though).

Edited by sparkyhx on Thursday 1st December 11:44

[JonnyFive]

Benbay001 said:

For those who have answered "no" as opposed to "yes sometimes" Then that would mean you have never made a mistake, surely? Yeh right..

But making a mistake doesn't mean you find driving difficult.. Making constant mistakes is finding driving difficult.

[Marf]

Benbay001 said:

For those who have answered "no" as opposed to "yes sometimes" Then that would mean you have never made a mistake, surely? Yeh right..

Ever tripped over? Ever dropped a mug?

Walking is easy. Carrying a mug is easy.

Just because you make a mistake doesnt mean something is hard.

[RenesisEvo]

Couldn't agree more with kambites post.

A lot of people here are saying 'these people go far too slowly round xyz corner'. Please, ask yourself, is your assessement of the bend correct? If you can't stop in the distance you can see to be clear, then on a public road you are going too fast to be safe. Feel free to complain if visibility is great and they still anchor up, but please remember that our judgement of conditions may well differ. Our circumstances will definitely differ. Maybe, for example, the driver in front knows they have budget ditchfinder tyres on, and they are driving accordingly, as the limit for them is a lot closer than the following PHer in his TVR with Michelin-Mega-Pilot-Sport-Nero-Snow-Monsters.

[eltax91]

I went for "sometimes". Most of the time, it's very easy. However, I think to just drive is easy. To drive properly, efficiently, safely and to a high standard ALL the time takes effort. Most of those who just think it's easy are properly doing things every day that I would consider to not be driving to a high standard. Me included.

I cover so many miles, I often have to give myself a mental slap, usually when tired or on familiar motorways, to concentrate and drive "well" rather than "just drive" IYSWIM

[Classic Grad 98]

If everyone thinks it's easy all the time, then you aren't paying close enough attention IMO. I will happily admit that often it requires a lot of my concentration.
Making a car move is easy. Roadcraft is not.

[sparkyhx]

Benbay001 said:

For those who have answered "no" as opposed to "yes sometimes" Then that would mean you have never made a mistake, surely? Yeh right..

making a mistake doesn't make things difficult.

I poked myself in the eye once while sleeping - that doesn't make sleeping difficult.

[Dr G]

kambites said:

Driving is easy.

Driving well is hard.

I've never been in a car with anyone who drives perfectly.

Have another

Simply 'operating a motor car' is not driving.

[jagnet]

RenesisEvo said:

Couldn't agree more with kambites post.

A lot of people here are saying 'these people go far too slowly round xyz corner'. Please, ask yourself, is your assessement of the bend correct? If you can't stop in the distance you can see to be clear, then on a public road you are going too fast to be safe. Feel free to complain if visibility is great and they still anchor up, but please remember that our judgement of conditions may well differ. Our circumstances will definitely differ. Maybe, for example, the driver in front knows they have budget ditchfinder tyres on, and they are driving accordingly, as the limit for them is a lot closer than the following PHer in his TVR with Michelin-Mega-Pilot-Sport-Nero-Snow-Monsters.

+1
Discovering limit point theory was probably one of the most significant moments in my driving career.

[BriC175]

Classic Grad 98 said:

If everyone thinks it's easy all the time, then you aren't paying close enough attention IMO. I will happily admit that often it requires a lot of my concentration.
Making a car move is easy. Roadcraft is not.

There is a difference in something being difficult, and something requiring concentration. To me, difficult would be juggling whilst riding a unicycle. No amount of attention I give it would make it particularly easier, as I don't know how to do either. Driving on the other hand - I've had my training, I know how to operate my car, I know what signs, road markings, etc mean and I know how to be aware of those around me. I just need to apply concentration, and I complete my journey safely. I certainly wouldn't describe it as difficult.

[Twincam16]

Dr G said:

kambites said:

Driving is easy.

Driving well is hard.

I've never been in a car with anyone who drives perfectly.

Have another

Simply 'operating a motor car' is not driving.

Many people can make a car move perfectly well. It's doing it in relation to everything else that's the difficult bit.

I notice it manifested most noticeably with my big bugbear - timid drivers. The sort of people who are terrified of everything around them and as a result hold everyone up with their slow, irrational, paranoid driving style. Good driving should result in smooth-flowing traffic. You should be able to do 60 in a 60, 70 in a 70 and so on. If you can't because you're being held up by someone who isn't confident enough to go with that flow, they shouldn't be subject to sympathetic New Labour empathy and hand-holding, they should be forced to keep learning until they're competant.

However, part of that competance involves being able to deal with problems in extremis. I think it's a travesty that dealing with a skid using opposite lock is on our theory, rather than practical tests. We live in a country where it rains a lot so this is rooted in reality - how hard can it be to incorporate into the lessons and test a section on a skidpan where you have to demonstrate rescuing a car from a slide around a soaking wet corner, and also straight-line braking in the wet?

If you don't equip people with skills to deal with this sort of thing, they just end up permanently terrified and timid, constantly looking for people to bail them out.

[bicycleshorts]

Benbay001 said:

Never heard of that happening before..
I would imagine people who have suffered that cruel fate would probably answer that they found it rather difficult on that occasion.

Penile fracture.

[snorkel sucker]

The act of driving itself is not particularly difficult; the fact that millions of people drive proves this point. But, as Kambites alluded to, driving well is a different matter.

I think though, that what we on here need to remember is that driving, for the vast majority of people, is just that - getting from A to B. Driving to an enthusiast is very much different. A few examples:

The 30mph bend with "slow down" signs peppered on its approach. We know it is safe to take it at double that. We look well ahead, deep to the apex, and pick our turn in point. No oncoming cars, so we widen our approach. Steady throttle - don't want to upset the car's balance - smooth turn in and clip that drain cover just so as you sweep out the other side.

To the majority of people, its just another bend. To some people its a dangerous bend. To us, its an opportunity.

The big roundabout with no left hand entry, and a well sighted right hand one. We see it as an oppotunity to scythe through with a spot of trail braking and a smooth, fast line, picking up the clipping point marked out as that drop kerb in the distance.

To the majority of people, its just another roundabout. To some people, it means stopping and giving way. To use, its a chicane.

We are very different to most people out there. we see things others dont, and are more aware because we like to be.

Worth bearing in mind really, as we also need to be the ones to be aware of those who don't take driving as seriously as we do...

[OllieC]

PoleDriver said:

Where's the options for:-
"Driving well is easy if you have a brain"
"Driving is easy if you can concentrate on the job in hand"

?

My father is a good driver by and large, some bad habits but I feel perfectly safe with him driving.

however when he is nattering to me about something or not giving it 100% concentration for whatever reason he goes from perfectly competent to a menace !

[RemainAllHoof]

JonnyFive said:

I've also been in the car with people some times when they brake all of the time, they brake for empty roundabouts, they brake for every single corner, they brake when they see another car.. Again, driving seems difficult for these people.

Women?

[gtdc]

RemainAllHoof said:

JonnyFive said:

I've also been in the car with people some times when they brake all of the time, they brake for empty roundabouts, they brake for every single corner, they brake when they see another car.. Again, driving seems difficult for these people.

Women?

Seems to be a higher proportion of women from what I have observed but generally I think driving standards are getting worse very quickly. Could it be because people have so much more stuff in their cars? Phones, satnav, children watching movies. Couple that with the aftermath of NuLabour's "nothing is your fault/you have the right to whatever you want/you don't have to take any reposnisbility" and you get people driving like mouth breathers.

It's a real shame because driving can be one of life's great pleasures. You don't need to drive fast to enjoy it but you do need to give it your full attention.