F430 (Manual) - a celebration
Discussion
Pork said:
Thanks for the reply.
My, possibly ignorant, view would be the world is changing. People like the interaction and involvement of manual cars, hence the rise in prices of older manuals. While I'd agree the race is on for Ferrari and their peers to get the speed crown, that's surely for their halo cars. On lesser models, where bragging rights of 0.01s of a second are largely irrelevant, if customer demand is for involvement, the customer will get what they want. I may be wrong.
Developing two gearboxes may be expensive but I suspect Ferrari have the volumes and certainly have clients willing to pay for what they want, if that's what's needed.
You are most likely right that another n/a V8 won't be made but I didn't expect the FF replacement to still have an n/a engine.
Interesting times, thanks again for your view.
I think that ultinately Ferrari would only buold another manual if they believed there was a strong business case based on demand. The demand for new supercars with manual shift just isn't there.... whenever manual v dct is offered, dct sales rocket and no-one wants the manual... especially so given how modern electronics put the transmission at the heart of the dynamics and ecu control strategyMy, possibly ignorant, view would be the world is changing. People like the interaction and involvement of manual cars, hence the rise in prices of older manuals. While I'd agree the race is on for Ferrari and their peers to get the speed crown, that's surely for their halo cars. On lesser models, where bragging rights of 0.01s of a second are largely irrelevant, if customer demand is for involvement, the customer will get what they want. I may be wrong.
Developing two gearboxes may be expensive but I suspect Ferrari have the volumes and certainly have clients willing to pay for what they want, if that's what's needed.
You are most likely right that another n/a V8 won't be made but I didn't expect the FF replacement to still have an n/a engine.
Interesting times, thanks again for your view.
Only if Ferrari offered a entry level manual only option would I see take up.... and even then presumably it would have a turbocharged engine.... I can't see it happening.... what would it be up against - Porsche Cayman gt4?
Entry level manuals would not be a high margin car and thus require volume... unless Ferrari want to massively ramp up production targets it makes no sense.
willfinch36 said:
Nice one - post up some more pics when you get a chance!
I can related to the 6th gear as well... I also came from a 996 turbo.
Funny thing is, when driving it, I just didn't care that it didnt feel super fast.... I mean its still a 9.0s car to 100mph so clearly its not slow, but the sensations and thrill of driving roof down with the orchestra at your left hands disposal is so overwhelmingly blissful that it makes outright acceletation or speed issues feel quite irrelevant !I can related to the 6th gear as well... I also came from a 996 turbo.
Nano2nd said:
Great number plate... any better interior pics?
j3gme said:
http://preowned.ferrari.com/en/gb/search/2006/ferr...
Well its getting silly now ....£159,990!!!!!
Would be 8-10% more if it was red Well its getting silly now ....£159,990!!!!!
Obviously one for collectors but they are out there... the 3k mile rosso/crema coupe at bols sold in 4 days for 150k£.
mon the fish said:
Looks so much cleaner without the shields IMO. What price would it be if it had ceramics...?
On a 10yr old car, no difference imo. Many buyers, incl myself prefer steels... much chepaer replacement costs and no concerns about chipping/scoring, both of which Ive seen recently. I don't think any options really add value other than colour combination of exterior/interior... there are nice to haves such as carbon seats, carbon zone... some buyers may pay a small premium but these cars are so thin on the ground what really matters is the colour combo, bodyshape (spider premium), the miles, and the condition/svc history.
Nano2nd said:
does the spider premium apply to manuals? theoretically if your buying a manual your looking for a more raw/best driving experience, then the coupe is the choice? however theres so few available a doubt that or even the colour combo makes much difference
Market transactions appear to support the premium yes. Bear in mind that the spider was circa £9k more expensive new than the coupe so the premium isn't really a premium so much as maintenance of the status quo... But it does mean a modest price uptick allister said:
Yes £159,990 does sound a lot, but let's not forget, this is virtually a brand new car with little more than delivery miles on the clock! - This car should literally be in showroom condition!
Before anyone raises the point..... Yes I do agree that a few more miles, would probably have been healthier for the car over the duration of it's life
It's not a particularly desirable spec frankly.... But as prices rise its expected that these kind of collectors pieces that probably would never otherwise see the light of day will come to market. Before anyone raises the point..... Yes I do agree that a few more miles, would probably have been healthier for the car over the duration of it's life
You only have to look at what's in storage with Ferrari dealers (let alone Indy storage) to know that there is a LOT of very special cars that literally never see the light of day until one day the owners feel the market is right to sell
Nano2nd said:
that was a great offer, mines done 24k miles and a local main dealer offered me no-where near that figure
Last time I checked, the trade bid (cash not px) from a ferrari main dealer vs the retail price they would put the same car up was £35-40k !They are a business and will make money out of owners that are prepared to forgo realising the true market value of their car in exchange for an easy and straightforward cash deal.
The last Porsche I sold privately yielded me 38% more than my local Porsche main dealer offered me as a cash buy... says it all.
markst said:
mine - I did btw nearly buy a 2008 manual in red .
Indeed there are a few 2008's out there.... this months Auto Italia magazine has an F430 buying guide and uses a 2008 spider manual (in light blue) as the feature car. Obviously with the manual, I don't believe theres difference between a 2005 or 2008 bar the carbon ceramics and the mk2 manifolds... most of the yearly upgrades were focused on the F1 hardware and software.
dang2407 said:
12 months is stated to ensure work and hence momey for the Service Centres - pure and simple. There is no way that oil degrades from just sitting there (unless you do really short journeys where it does not get to operating temp).
Yes but what makes sense from a practical maintenance perspective, and what the market demands if you want to ask top dollar for the car are very different things. allister said:
Sorry, maybe I misunderstood - Did the new owner (purchaser) who it was said 'paid in full' for the car take it back to the dealer due to dis-satisfaction? Or was this a case of the owner (selling through the dealer) reclaiming the car?
The latter I understood.Edited by allister on Monday 14th March 19:00
Drclarke said:
Apart from the eye catching interior, it appeared to be a nice car.
It shows where the true values of the market is at the moment rather than the talked up, inflated ones of the owners.
My neighbour has just part exchanged his Red with Cream Leather Manual hardtop with a dealer against a 458 and they gave him £66,000 and the car was immaculate.
So you think that the "True values of the market" is best reflected from a dodgy coloured car at a clearly off-market price, that was pulled from sale ? Rather than the numerous 6fig actual transacted deals done in recent times ! Interesting perspective you have....It shows where the true values of the market is at the moment rather than the talked up, inflated ones of the owners.
My neighbour has just part exchanged his Red with Cream Leather Manual hardtop with a dealer against a 458 and they gave him £66,000 and the car was immaculate.
And unfortunately, IF your neighbours story is true, then he's got more money than sense and was robbed, because he's given his RHD manual car away for many many thousands less that other main dealers are paying for LHD F1 cars with mid- 20's miles as PX - Fact !
cgt2 said:
We now have individual threads obsessed with value of nearly every supercar complete with explosive indignation from owners every time someone dares question values. 
Whilst all quite amusing, lets hope the market tanks soon so we can get back to driving and talking about cars again like the good old days..
Yes its a shame that the thread has gone from being focused on celebrating one of the most iconic symbols in the automotive world (the open gated shifter) to discussing values.... my intention in creating the thread was to avoid such diversions.... alas I'm as guilty as the next man for responding to comments/links etc put up where pricing/values are the focus of the post.Whilst all quite amusing, lets hope the market tanks soon so we can get back to driving and talking about cars again like the good old days..
Ultimately, try as we might, we cant escape the fact that in the world of expensive sports cars today, the dominant theme really is their store of value and source of alternate investment.... more so than the thrill of driving or the pleasure of ownership.... you only have to look at how new GT Porsches are treated as finanical instruments by both speculators/buyers and dealers to understand where motivations lie in the current environment.
NoPaddleShiftForMe said:
My manual F430 alongside my manual LP640. I've had it over 5 years now and still can't wait for nice weekends to get her out. I have driven all the latest Lamborghini and Ferrari offerings and wouldn't swap. I also have a Sagaris and a new 911R coming in September. I think I'm done for a little while but would like an 08 -10 Viper too.
A man of very fine taste... you have just about the bestest examples of manuals from Lambo, Ferrari, and Porsche....
More pics of the lambo and 430 pls and cool name btw
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