'Should I' tool
Discussion
Hi All,
Just wondering is there a tool online to advise whether which option - hybrid, PHEV or diesel, would be best for me?
I know Renault used to have a tool on the van section of their website but don't know how specific it is to me.
Current situation is that my regular commute is 13-16 miles (dependent on whether I avoid traffic on one section) and takes circa 40-50 mins. This morning, a fairly average 15 miles in 52 mins at an average speed of 18mph (according to the car). Also, do trips to clients/sites - for example Friday last week was 86 mile round trip to 3 sites. This is only once every couple of weeks though.
I've looked at a BMW i3 but have 3 children so would prefer a 5 seater rather than 4 although not totally necessary for the right car - my wife has a people carrier for family trips if needs be. Also, looked (on paper) at option of leasing a BMW 330e through my own ltd company but for other reasons, I'd rather keep the car my own rather than one leased/run through the business.
Quite like the look of the Mitsubishi Outlander - new shape or previous.
Tesla appeals also - have considered putting my name on the list for the new model.
Current car is a Skoda Octavia 2.0 TDI. Just wondering if I stick with diesel or go alternative? If staying with diesel, quite fancy a BMW 120d.
Charging at home not a problem with a normal household 13A supply fairly close to where the car would be parked overnight.
Any thoughts from the PH collective?
Just wondering is there a tool online to advise whether which option - hybrid, PHEV or diesel, would be best for me?
I know Renault used to have a tool on the van section of their website but don't know how specific it is to me.
Current situation is that my regular commute is 13-16 miles (dependent on whether I avoid traffic on one section) and takes circa 40-50 mins. This morning, a fairly average 15 miles in 52 mins at an average speed of 18mph (according to the car). Also, do trips to clients/sites - for example Friday last week was 86 mile round trip to 3 sites. This is only once every couple of weeks though.
I've looked at a BMW i3 but have 3 children so would prefer a 5 seater rather than 4 although not totally necessary for the right car - my wife has a people carrier for family trips if needs be. Also, looked (on paper) at option of leasing a BMW 330e through my own ltd company but for other reasons, I'd rather keep the car my own rather than one leased/run through the business.
Quite like the look of the Mitsubishi Outlander - new shape or previous.
Tesla appeals also - have considered putting my name on the list for the new model.
Current car is a Skoda Octavia 2.0 TDI. Just wondering if I stick with diesel or go alternative? If staying with diesel, quite fancy a BMW 120d.
Charging at home not a problem with a normal household 13A supply fairly close to where the car would be parked overnight.
Any thoughts from the PH collective?
Best thing to do IMO is just fire up Excel and start making some assumptions.
Try pin down your expected mileages. Work is an easy one to do for most as its a fixed distance twice a day for 5 days a week and 52-(holiday weeks) a year.
Other mileage is more difficult but generally most have a weekly routine so you can account for most of your mileage.
Then you just need data on fuel price, MPG and depreciation and ongoing monthly costs for the car and you can begin to work it all out.
It never works out for me though as my old shed of a volvo might cost £200-250 a month in fuel, a decent new car would cost that just in monthly PCP or lease before you put any fuel in it. The other running costs aren't different enough to help swing it. So be careful what you wish for lol as the numbers may just suggest you stay put!
If you dont have any fuel data of your own I have found HonestJohns real MPG to be ok for figures, but the best place to go is often SpritMonitor.de where the data collection is more thoroughly presented and done properly.
They're all only average figures though which normally works out well for me as I find my mix of driving to be well balanced between motorway work and local work.
Try pin down your expected mileages. Work is an easy one to do for most as its a fixed distance twice a day for 5 days a week and 52-(holiday weeks) a year.
Other mileage is more difficult but generally most have a weekly routine so you can account for most of your mileage.
Then you just need data on fuel price, MPG and depreciation and ongoing monthly costs for the car and you can begin to work it all out.
It never works out for me though as my old shed of a volvo might cost £200-250 a month in fuel, a decent new car would cost that just in monthly PCP or lease before you put any fuel in it. The other running costs aren't different enough to help swing it. So be careful what you wish for lol as the numbers may just suggest you stay put!
If you dont have any fuel data of your own I have found HonestJohns real MPG to be ok for figures, but the best place to go is often SpritMonitor.de where the data collection is more thoroughly presented and done properly.
They're all only average figures though which normally works out well for me as I find my mix of driving to be well balanced between motorway work and local work.
Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Monday 1st February 17:12
10-12k/yr is not really DPF-friendly mileage.
At that kind of mileage, just pick what you want to drive. Even something that only does a genuine 25mpg, you'll only be getting through less than a fiver of fuel a day. Depreciation/lease/maintenance/insurance will all add up to far more.
At that kind of mileage, just pick what you want to drive. Even something that only does a genuine 25mpg, you'll only be getting through less than a fiver of fuel a day. Depreciation/lease/maintenance/insurance will all add up to far more.
Cheers guys.
It is quite nice to be doing so few miles again. Nice to look at say a car with 50k on the clock and know that with good servicing that i can get a good few years out of it whereas in the past it's always been a case of looking at low milers that i'm going to hammer for 3-4 years.
Current motor, 56 plate Octavia 2.0 TDI is only on 82k and runs like a dream. Only issue is A/C doesnt work properly which isn't really an issue this time of year. It's a compressor issue apparently.
Only real problem with the Skoda is having my own business - it's not really the nicest thing to turn up at a clients office in! Hence i was looking for something 'sustainable'!
The real thing i'm trying to look at at the moment is how many times i'll go over 30 mph on a commute. This morning, with an average of 18mph, i reckon i did over 30mph just twice, for no more than 2 or 3 mins tops. So in say, a Prius, i'd be running on leccy most of the time - i think?
Keep looking at BMW 120ds, but based on whats been said above, a 120i is cheaper and may be a better option?!
Lots to consider and spreadsheets to do!
It is quite nice to be doing so few miles again. Nice to look at say a car with 50k on the clock and know that with good servicing that i can get a good few years out of it whereas in the past it's always been a case of looking at low milers that i'm going to hammer for 3-4 years.
Current motor, 56 plate Octavia 2.0 TDI is only on 82k and runs like a dream. Only issue is A/C doesnt work properly which isn't really an issue this time of year. It's a compressor issue apparently.
Only real problem with the Skoda is having my own business - it's not really the nicest thing to turn up at a clients office in! Hence i was looking for something 'sustainable'!
The real thing i'm trying to look at at the moment is how many times i'll go over 30 mph on a commute. This morning, with an average of 18mph, i reckon i did over 30mph just twice, for no more than 2 or 3 mins tops. So in say, a Prius, i'd be running on leccy most of the time - i think?
Keep looking at BMW 120ds, but based on whats been said above, a 120i is cheaper and may be a better option?!
Lots to consider and spreadsheets to do!
Can you just decide a car from a spreadsheet? Didn't the phrase 'man maths' originate from pistonhead's forums :-)
Choosing an electric vehicle could be purely on cost, but for many it's also about reducing emissions and the environmental benefits or being a pioneer. For many it's also about the driving experience which is very different to an IC powered vehicle.
For me it was a bit of all of these, plus I found the driving experience to be fun and more enjoyable on the crowded roads I'm faced with these days compared to an IC.
Go try one, and maybe man maths will come into play!
Choosing an electric vehicle could be purely on cost, but for many it's also about reducing emissions and the environmental benefits or being a pioneer. For many it's also about the driving experience which is very different to an IC powered vehicle.
For me it was a bit of all of these, plus I found the driving experience to be fun and more enjoyable on the crowded roads I'm faced with these days compared to an IC.
Go try one, and maybe man maths will come into play!
modeller said:
Can you just decide a car from a spreadsheet? Didn't the phrase 'man maths' originate from pistonhead's forums :-)
Choosing an electric vehicle could be purely on cost, but for many it's also about reducing emissions and the environmental benefits or being a pioneer. For many it's also about the driving experience which is very different to an IC powered vehicle.
For me it was a bit of all of these, plus I found the driving experience to be fun and more enjoyable on the crowded roads I'm faced with these days compared to an IC.
Go try one, and maybe man maths will come into play!
You're right. Choosing an electric vehicle could be purely on cost, but for many it's also about reducing emissions and the environmental benefits or being a pioneer. For many it's also about the driving experience which is very different to an IC powered vehicle.
For me it was a bit of all of these, plus I found the driving experience to be fun and more enjoyable on the crowded roads I'm faced with these days compared to an IC.
Go try one, and maybe man maths will come into play!
When I left my former job with my 2 year old Passat, with very little to spend on my own car - the only way to make it interesting (given the mileage I knew I'd do in Year 1) was to buy myself an automatic.
Similarly, this may be the case here.
I looked at Nissan Leafs earlier in the week, and ok, they're no Tesla or i8 but then again I'm not looking to buy an electric car to do sub 5 second 0-60 runs in!
sider said:
Only real problem with the Skoda is having my own business
if you own a business then the tax-breaks alone make a sub 75g/km vehicle pretty much a no-brainer.£5k subsidy https://www.gov.uk/plug-in-car-van-grants/overview
100% first year capital allowance https://www.gov.uk/capital-allowances/business-car...
Low BIK https://www.gov.uk/tax-company-benefits/tax-on-com...
However, if you are likely to do journeys of over 100 miles then you'll need to manage range anxiety for full BEV via on-route charge planning (or buy a £100 Tesla) or opt for a PHEV.
Bit of an update - I've just ordered an I8.
Only kidding - sorry.
However, I met a client this morning who turned up in a 15 plate Leaf Tekna. Got talking to him and he let me have a drive. Very impressed. Seemed to have all the kit on it and drove well. That said, I didn't really get it much over 40mph due to the roads we were on and the fact he'd not locked his office so we couldn't go too far.
He did however pass me his friendly salesman's details and I've made the call about a test drive - see what they come back with.
I'm thinking initially that the 0-60 time of an i3 is going to make that a more appealing car to me - but the Leaf is a 5 seater against the BMW's 4. Plus there's the big Tesla Model 3 announcement due later in March - perhaps it's worth holding onto the trusty old Skoda and saving a few pennies for that.
Lots of food for thought but first experience with electric motoring was good.
Only kidding - sorry.
However, I met a client this morning who turned up in a 15 plate Leaf Tekna. Got talking to him and he let me have a drive. Very impressed. Seemed to have all the kit on it and drove well. That said, I didn't really get it much over 40mph due to the roads we were on and the fact he'd not locked his office so we couldn't go too far.
He did however pass me his friendly salesman's details and I've made the call about a test drive - see what they come back with.
I'm thinking initially that the 0-60 time of an i3 is going to make that a more appealing car to me - but the Leaf is a 5 seater against the BMW's 4. Plus there's the big Tesla Model 3 announcement due later in March - perhaps it's worth holding onto the trusty old Skoda and saving a few pennies for that.
Lots of food for thought but first experience with electric motoring was good.
johnnyreggae said:
Are you sure this is going to work with a regular Leaf or are you going to look at the new slightly extended range version ?
Lots of threads here suggesting the standard is only good for about 75 miles of real use
Maybe not even that in winter.Lots of threads here suggesting the standard is only good for about 75 miles of real use
I have a Tekna and it's a surprisingly good car (Especially given the super-cheap PCP deal a year ago), but range is a limitation. Lesser models are less efficient still in winter due to their different heating system. Used prices have fallen like crazy which makes them great value, but at current trajectory they could be worthless in a couple of years (so potentially even better value if it suits your needs).
A typical day for mine is to school (1 mile), to work (1 mile in direction I've come from, then another 3) and return. Occasionally 5-10 mile trips. Furthest we've been was about 30 miles away, where we unexpectedly stumbled across a rapid charger in the only free parking spot (Ikea). With solar panels contributing to the charging cost, it's perfect for our needs.
If you need the occasional 80+ mile round trip, you'll need to use public charging facilities. Have a look at zap map and see what's available in your area. Bear in mind that anything other than rapid chargers could mean adding extra hours to your commute.
If you have warning of such trips, Nissan will provide you with a loan petrol / diesel car.
If you can't live with the limited range, I think the BMW 330e / MB 350e would make an appealing alternative. I almost got one of these for our second car, but ended up opting for something similar with a 6.2l v8 (kind of makes man-maths sense given it only covers about 3000 miles pa)
onedsla said:
If you can't live with the limited range, I think the BMW 330e / MB 350e would make an appealing alternative. I almost got one of these for our second car, but ended up opting for something similar with a 6.2l v8 (kind of makes man-maths sense given it only covers about 3000 miles pa)
Ive just gone the other way. Dropping my C63 and replacing it with a PHEV, killing two birds with one green (ish) stone.MrOrange said:
Ive just gone the other way. Dropping my C63 and replacing it with a PHEV, killing two birds with one green (ish) stone.
I can see the appeal, and imagine the C75 AMG (or whatever it will be by 2020) will be some kind of hybrid, and would make perfect sense. My 5 year old was desperate for a ride in to school in the C63 this morning but for 1 mile each way in traffic, it's the Leaf every time. If the AMG could do that on electric only power, it's a perfect all-rounder - even a 10 mile electric range would transform practicality for me. The other reason I didn't go for the 350e estate was that the boot lost out space to batteries, so didn't quite tick the space requirement box.I think you'll be waiting a while for the Model 3, 2-3 years at least.
For you, I'd recommend an ex-demo Model S and I'll tell you for why:
- The Tesla is premium and interesting enough to give right 'impression' to your clients for several years to come
- It is incredibly cheap to run; my weekly fuel bill has dropped from £80-£90/week in a BMW 335D to less than £10/week in the Tesla
- The mileage you are doing, in terms of journey length, could be a real issue in a Leaf or i3, but would be no problem in any Model S (70/85/90kwh variants).
- The tax incentives as a business owner/business user are huge for an EV car, compared to diesel or petrol options
- By going for an ex-demo/ex-loaner vehicle, you are technically still the first owner so will still benefit from the Govt EV grant (currently £5,000, dropping to £4,500 imminently I believe).
I'd strongly recommend a test drive and a browse of the stock available on the Tesla UK website (not the pre-owned, the Showroom models, here: https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/models/preowned?...
Enjoy
For you, I'd recommend an ex-demo Model S and I'll tell you for why:
- The Tesla is premium and interesting enough to give right 'impression' to your clients for several years to come
- It is incredibly cheap to run; my weekly fuel bill has dropped from £80-£90/week in a BMW 335D to less than £10/week in the Tesla
- The mileage you are doing, in terms of journey length, could be a real issue in a Leaf or i3, but would be no problem in any Model S (70/85/90kwh variants).
- The tax incentives as a business owner/business user are huge for an EV car, compared to diesel or petrol options
- By going for an ex-demo/ex-loaner vehicle, you are technically still the first owner so will still benefit from the Govt EV grant (currently £5,000, dropping to £4,500 imminently I believe).
I'd strongly recommend a test drive and a browse of the stock available on the Tesla UK website (not the pre-owned, the Showroom models, here: https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/models/preowned?...
Enjoy
onedsla said:
a 10 mile electric range would transform practicality for me.
^^^ this did it for me. I only get 15 miles or so on a charge but that translates into half of my journeys are on battery only. Whilst still being able to take on 500 mile trips without range anxiety.Ps: I have no boot space, though.
Mike_C said:
I think you'll be waiting a while for the Model 3, 2-3 years at least.
For you, I'd recommend an ex-demo Model S and I'll tell you for why:
- The Tesla is premium and interesting enough to give right 'impression' to your clients for several years to come
- It is incredibly cheap to run; my weekly fuel bill has dropped from £80-£90/week in a BMW 335D to less than £10/week in the Tesla
- The mileage you are doing, in terms of journey length, could be a real issue in a Leaf or i3, but would be no problem in any Model S (70/85/90kwh variants).
- The tax incentives as a business owner/business user are huge for an EV car, compared to diesel or petrol options
- By going for an ex-demo/ex-loaner vehicle, you are technically still the first owner so will still benefit from the Govt EV grant (currently £5,000, dropping to £4,500 imminently I believe).
I'd strongly recommend a test drive and a browse of the stock available on the Tesla UK website (not the pre-owned, the Showroom models, here: https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/models/preowned?...
Enjoy
I would second this. The Tesla is a fantastic car and you could use it for pretty much every use case. We missed out on a good demonstrator and then failed to find another one (in Switzerland). In the end we got a 2 year old i3 which meets our use case very well but we've kept an ICE in the garage for long trips. (Short trips were about 20,000km of 32,000 last year. The long trips are usually very long, 1500km + round trips)For you, I'd recommend an ex-demo Model S and I'll tell you for why:
- The Tesla is premium and interesting enough to give right 'impression' to your clients for several years to come
- It is incredibly cheap to run; my weekly fuel bill has dropped from £80-£90/week in a BMW 335D to less than £10/week in the Tesla
- The mileage you are doing, in terms of journey length, could be a real issue in a Leaf or i3, but would be no problem in any Model S (70/85/90kwh variants).
- The tax incentives as a business owner/business user are huge for an EV car, compared to diesel or petrol options
- By going for an ex-demo/ex-loaner vehicle, you are technically still the first owner so will still benefit from the Govt EV grant (currently £5,000, dropping to £4,500 imminently I believe).
I'd strongly recommend a test drive and a browse of the stock available on the Tesla UK website (not the pre-owned, the Showroom models, here: https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/models/preowned?...
Enjoy
The other option if you can is hold out until later in the year for one of the longer range battery cars. The ampera-e will be 200 miles, the i3 probably around 150 and I think there'll be a leaf at around 200miles. Technology is changing quite quickly in the EV space. I took the view we'd be 2+ years off seeing Model III deliveries.
Not sure how much service is in the UK. My i3 has come with the remainder of a 100,000km / 10 year free servicing package. Tesla servicing was pretty reasonable. The petrol saved + 1 less service a year on the ICE paid for the i3 (apart from the insurance).
Gassing Station | EV and Alternative Fuels | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff