Switching to an EV - realistic?
Discussion
Hi, apologies if this has been done before but couldn't find anything similar using the search.
Looking at getting a VW Golf for around £9k and I see that a few e-Golf's are now in my price range. It appeals as it's familiar like an ICE car and my partner would prefer that for our first EV.
We do around 40 miles a day maybe 5 times a week, most if not all of those trips start and end at home (it seems the e-Golf will do 100-140 miles on a full charge).
I can only charge on the 3 pin plug at the moment so what could I realistically get in the car charging for 6 hours at the cheap rate overnight? 2.5kw per hour x 6 hours = 15 kw say 50 miles? I can charge it every night, and there's usually a time where the car would not be used for 2 days so I could get 2 x 50 miles or whatever in it.
I would appreciate any advice, thanks!
Looking at getting a VW Golf for around £9k and I see that a few e-Golf's are now in my price range. It appeals as it's familiar like an ICE car and my partner would prefer that for our first EV.
We do around 40 miles a day maybe 5 times a week, most if not all of those trips start and end at home (it seems the e-Golf will do 100-140 miles on a full charge).
I can only charge on the 3 pin plug at the moment so what could I realistically get in the car charging for 6 hours at the cheap rate overnight? 2.5kw per hour x 6 hours = 15 kw say 50 miles? I can charge it every night, and there's usually a time where the car would not be used for 2 days so I could get 2 x 50 miles or whatever in it.
I would appreciate any advice, thanks!
E golf is a good introduction to evs, I had one for 2 years.
On a 13a socket it takes around 10 hours from completely empty, but realistically it’s normal that you have something left, in your case maybe 50% given your mileage, so your charging for less.
On octopus go you get 6 hours at cheap rate, 7.5p per kilowatt.
It’s perfectly doable and it’s a good car.
Personally I went for a 7kw charger after 3 months for convenience.
100 miles motorway for the 32kwh version is entirely reasonable and I saw 140 miles at its best communting.
On a 13a socket it takes around 10 hours from completely empty, but realistically it’s normal that you have something left, in your case maybe 50% given your mileage, so your charging for less.
On octopus go you get 6 hours at cheap rate, 7.5p per kilowatt.
It’s perfectly doable and it’s a good car.
Personally I went for a 7kw charger after 3 months for convenience.
100 miles motorway for the 32kwh version is entirely reasonable and I saw 140 miles at its best communting.
I don't think your calcs are a million miles out.
I don't know how efficient the golf is but some days I would guess you will struggle to get 3 miles per kwh (think cold, wet windy days).
In theory you would be ok if you can fully charge at some point in the week but you won't have much in the way of contingency mileage particularly if you drive it at the weekends too.
Personally I would probably be looking for something with a bit bigger battery. An e-208 comes up as an interesting choice in that kind of price range but you should be ok with the golf!
Edit to add a quick Google suggests over 3kwh on a granny charger on a golf which tallies with the poster above. This would make it a lot more comfortable for you...
Edited again to add: 3kwh only if your socket is up to the job. Note extension leads and granny chargers don't always mix and needs some proper research...
I don't know how efficient the golf is but some days I would guess you will struggle to get 3 miles per kwh (think cold, wet windy days).
In theory you would be ok if you can fully charge at some point in the week but you won't have much in the way of contingency mileage particularly if you drive it at the weekends too.
Personally I would probably be looking for something with a bit bigger battery. An e-208 comes up as an interesting choice in that kind of price range but you should be ok with the golf!
Edit to add a quick Google suggests over 3kwh on a granny charger on a golf which tallies with the poster above. This would make it a lot more comfortable for you...
Edited again to add: 3kwh only if your socket is up to the job. Note extension leads and granny chargers don't always mix and needs some proper research...
Edited by drgoatboy on Monday 24th February 12:53
Edited by drgoatboy on Monday 24th February 16:48
My generic calcs would be assume 2kW charging on a three pin, if 6 hours that's 12 kWh nightly, assume 3 miles/kWh so 36 miles added per day.
Anyway it's fine. My strategy would be to time the charger to come on when the cheap rate starts and then just charge til full. You may find that you end up consuming the occasional peak rate unit of electricity here and there. However even at 28p / kWh it's still cheaper than petrol, and the overall average cost will still be much lower for your use-case, since 80%+ of electricity will be off-peak.
I.e. you don't need to work out the calculations to the last watt-second in order to be confident you'll be comfortably in the black overall.
drgoatboy said:
Edit to add a quick Google suggests over 3kwh on a granny charger on a golf which tallies with the poster above. This would make it a lot more comfortable for you...
240V x 10A = 2400W = 2.4 kW net. Allowing for charger losses of 10-20%, that's 2-2.2 kW actually into the car.240V x 13A = 3120W = 3.1 kW net. So 2.5-2.8 kW delivered.
Although UK domestic wiring is nominally rated for 13A, generally to draw that much for hours on end is considered to be 'pushing it'. So most three pin chargers operate at 10A or less, however there are ones out there that will offer 13A. Depending on your wiring it may or may not be ok. If you search you'll find lots of passionate argument on this topic, ultimately up to each person to decide based on their circumstances how far they're comfortable going.
Just do the worst case scenario maths.
6 miles per hour added assuming 2kW in after losses and 3 miles/kWh in the winter used so you'll get 36 miles of range in those 6 hours of cheap charging.
Assuming 250 miles of use a week you'll want 300 miles.of range to offer a buffer so 50 hours total of charging, thats 42 hours of cheap and an hour or so a night of normal rate electricity.
6 miles per hour added assuming 2kW in after losses and 3 miles/kWh in the winter used so you'll get 36 miles of range in those 6 hours of cheap charging.
Assuming 250 miles of use a week you'll want 300 miles.of range to offer a buffer so 50 hours total of charging, thats 42 hours of cheap and an hour or so a night of normal rate electricity.
I don't have a dedicated home charger for my MG4 which I drive every day, all my charging is done via the granny charger on Octopus Go (00.30 - 05.30) and it typically adds 30-40 miles a day. On the rare occasion that's not going to be enough I just charge it longer and pay the higher price.
samoht said:
Although UK domestic wiring is nominally rated for 13A, generally to draw that much for hours on end is considered to be 'pushing it'. So most three pin chargers operate at 10A or less, however there are ones out there that will offer 13A. Depending on your wiring it may or may not be ok. If you search you'll find lots of passionate argument on this topic, ultimately up to each person to decide based on their circumstances how far they're comfortable going.
Agree with this. Have had a couple of sockets get a bit toasty at 13A so now charge at 8A overnight instead after a bit of testing as everything stays nice and cool to the touch. Fortunately our range needs fit with the reduced rate. Thanks all for the helpful replies. I will assume worst case around 36 miles 'cheap' then and top up the rest at the higher price if required.
There's a Sainsbury's nearby which is free charging, so can use that occasionally to top up and give the home plug a rest.
I do have another car as well (diesel) as a backup.
There's a Sainsbury's nearby which is free charging, so can use that occasionally to top up and give the home plug a rest.
I do have another car as well (diesel) as a backup.
We did exactly the same thing and went for an e-Golf as a safe toe in the water for our first EV, with my wife swapping from a mk7 1.4TSi Golf to a 21-plate e-Golf.
What sort of driving makes up the 40 miles per day? The car was hugely affected by motorway speed driving and cold weather (despite having the heat pump option).
In warm weather with slower driving (up to 60mph type a-road) without trying you should get over 4 m/kWh. So even accounting for charging losses, should get close to 50 miles in 6 hours.
In the winter with motorway though, things plummet far more noticeably than we've seen with the Born and ID3 we now have. I would say 6 hours would be nearer 30 miles.
Another option is to move to an electricity package which isn't limited to a window of charging. We're on Ovo Anytime and no time limit to the 7p/kWh EV charging rate.
What sort of driving makes up the 40 miles per day? The car was hugely affected by motorway speed driving and cold weather (despite having the heat pump option).
In warm weather with slower driving (up to 60mph type a-road) without trying you should get over 4 m/kWh. So even accounting for charging losses, should get close to 50 miles in 6 hours.
In the winter with motorway though, things plummet far more noticeably than we've seen with the Born and ID3 we now have. I would say 6 hours would be nearer 30 miles.
Another option is to move to an electricity package which isn't limited to a window of charging. We're on Ovo Anytime and no time limit to the 7p/kWh EV charging rate.
It might be worth spending a bit more, justified on the fuel savings, to get a newer, longer range version.
When you amortise it over the remaining warranty and all that, total cost per year looks better?
Plus in a two car household, you can save money by shifting journeys to the BEV, if it has the range, and extra journeys that you might not have done before suddenly become very cheap.
Spending £9k to be buggered about by a car that only marginally meets your needs seems silly to me, you could get a frugal petrol car for half that.
Depreciation is always a guess looking forwards to be fair.
But I think more of the older BEVs will be worth peanuts in a couple of years, as their range starts to decline and more newer choices appear on the used market. I could be wrong, some EVs may have hit a floor price.
When you amortise it over the remaining warranty and all that, total cost per year looks better?
Plus in a two car household, you can save money by shifting journeys to the BEV, if it has the range, and extra journeys that you might not have done before suddenly become very cheap.
Spending £9k to be buggered about by a car that only marginally meets your needs seems silly to me, you could get a frugal petrol car for half that.
Depreciation is always a guess looking forwards to be fair.
But I think more of the older BEVs will be worth peanuts in a couple of years, as their range starts to decline and more newer choices appear on the used market. I could be wrong, some EVs may have hit a floor price.
OutInTheShed said:
It might be worth spending a bit more, justified on the fuel savings, to get a newer, longer range version.
When you amortise it over the remaining warranty and all that, total cost per year looks better?
Plus in a two car household, you can save money by shifting journeys to the BEV, if it has the range, and extra journeys that you might not have done before suddenly become very cheap.
Spending £9k to be buggered about by a car that only marginally meets your needs seems silly to me, you could get a frugal petrol car for half that.
It's not really being buggered about though, just set it to start charging at the start of the peak rate period, charge to full, and accept you might pay 40p more occasionally. It's still a lot cheaper to run than a petrol.When you amortise it over the remaining warranty and all that, total cost per year looks better?
Plus in a two car household, you can save money by shifting journeys to the BEV, if it has the range, and extra journeys that you might not have done before suddenly become very cheap.
Spending £9k to be buggered about by a car that only marginally meets your needs seems silly to me, you could get a frugal petrol car for half that.
A car with a bigger battery won't help if it's still being driven daily, you'd need something more efficient for that. (It helps marginally in that if the car's not driven for a day or two it can accumulate more off-peak charge).
I agree it's worth considering the choice of a longer range car that could handle more trips, but for the use case considered and given the desire for another Mk7 Golf, it all sounds like a reasonable plan to me.
40 miles a day is mainly A roads and through towns and villages, no motorways.
I did not know about Ovo Anytime, that could work. The car could also be plugged in between 10am and 4pm, it only gets used for school runs both ways and then evening trips to sports practice, supermarkets, going to the in laws, that sort of thing. Weekends, more sports fixtures and days out.
I would rather spend less than £9k to be honest! I'm kind of hoping the smaller battery EVs are not for everyone so I can pick one up cheap.
I did not know about Ovo Anytime, that could work. The car could also be plugged in between 10am and 4pm, it only gets used for school runs both ways and then evening trips to sports practice, supermarkets, going to the in laws, that sort of thing. Weekends, more sports fixtures and days out.
I would rather spend less than £9k to be honest! I'm kind of hoping the smaller battery EVs are not for everyone so I can pick one up cheap.
One recommendation from me is build a habit for plugging it in, if you can. Just topping up for a few hours here and there will make a big difference when charging overnight at a slower speed. Dont need to keep it at 100% obviously, but it does make a big difference to keep it topped up.
I dont know about the e-Golf batteries, but many EV's dont have an issue with frequent lower charging since its slower and the BMS is able to do a good job. For a some EV's its constant high power charging that causes the degradation. Oh, and one more comment - get your head around letting it get low on charge. Charge for what you need and a little more for contingency - you dont need to charge to full each and every time. Took thick old me a while to figure that one out!
I dont know about the e-Golf batteries, but many EV's dont have an issue with frequent lower charging since its slower and the BMS is able to do a good job. For a some EV's its constant high power charging that causes the degradation. Oh, and one more comment - get your head around letting it get low on charge. Charge for what you need and a little more for contingency - you dont need to charge to full each and every time. Took thick old me a while to figure that one out!
Dave80s said:
40 miles a day is mainly A roads and through towns and villages, no motorways.
I did not know about Ovo Anytime, that could work. The car could also be plugged in between 10am and 4pm, it only gets used for school runs both ways and then evening trips to sports practice, supermarkets, going to the in laws, that sort of thing. Weekends, more sports fixtures and days out.
I would rather spend less than £9k to be honest! I'm kind of hoping the smaller battery EVs are not for everyone so I can pick one up cheap.
Anytime is less likely to charge during the daytime slot ( although no harm in plugging in then anyway if the car is just sitting there. The way it works is you set a daily time you want the car ready for and the amount you want it charged by then. We just have ours set to 100% by 7am. Obviously if it’s unacheivable, ie you need 12 hours straight charging to get from your starting charge to your desired level by 7am and you don’t plug in till 11 pm, then it won’t do it. Left to its own devices this way, then all car charging will be 7p/kWh. It only reverts to household rate if you ‘force’ it to ‘urgent charge’I did not know about Ovo Anytime, that could work. The car could also be plugged in between 10am and 4pm, it only gets used for school runs both ways and then evening trips to sports practice, supermarkets, going to the in laws, that sort of thing. Weekends, more sports fixtures and days out.
I would rather spend less than £9k to be honest! I'm kind of hoping the smaller battery EVs are not for everyone so I can pick one up cheap.
I have been doing the granny charger thing on a five hour off peak rate (midnight to 5.00am) since October and its very marginal for my 200 odd miles a week in the real world. You are continuously chasing a full charge. I then changed to doing a ten hours a night charge of which half is full price electricity, but a week ago I succumbed and decided to spend a grand on a 'proper' 7kw wall charger and stop having to be concerned about battery level every other day. Gets fitted Friday.
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