Land Rover Series III Rally Car. (Yes really)
Discussion
Hello!
Tis a frequently told story but non the less apologies for the length!
In January 1973 Brian Fulton supplied a 1972 88" hard top reg to the National Trust in Cumbria. They used it for shunting duties round Fell Foot park beside Windermere.
It didn't get registered for many years and was put on the road in the 80's by which is was getting on a bit and shifted on.
In 1994 a man called Adrian Loxam bought it as 2nd car which did a lot of laning and offroading in general.
A pair of Lucas 20/20 lamps, capstan winch and some 7.50 SATS were all that was needed for good times!
This is long before the CROW or even the NERC act and many trips were made up great passes such as Walna Scar and Garburn.
Is was a trip up the Garburn pass that changed all that. Adrian and and a few others were near the top one winters day and got out to admire the view and have a chat.
Unfortunately the handbrake in the 88" let go and the still with the drivers door ajar the landy rolled off the pass and went a very very long way.
This was the result:
A team of people recovered it and Adrian did actually drive it off the pass!
Now a lot of people would have given up at this point with this motor but Adrian had a background in rallying and liked the idea of Hillrallying. (He like many had seen that episode of "old" Topgear with Tony Mason inteviewing Ian Sykes in his mental leafer.) I'd love to have a copy of that clip but anyway...
The wreck of the series 3 was taken to a workshop and a big rebuild started:
A Bettaweld external cage and truckcab were fitted along with a lot of new bodywork! All the required safety gear of buckets, harnesses, fire extingquishers went in and then he got to the engine.....
The 3 bearing block was getting it a bit tired so a 5 bearing engine was found and put in. I've said before a 2286 engine and a A series engine are quite similar well it turns out Minisport were willing to do a balanced crank and super light flywheel for the engine!
A friend took an old cylinder head and did a nice job of porting and general gasflowing it. ACR tuning supplied heavy duty valve springs as well so it sounds like a bag of spanners and always will. A set of tubular manifolds were fitted that included a 4-2-1 exhaust manifold onto a big bore performance exhaust from Roland Marlow.Fuel was fed via whopping SU carb and a K&N.
Leaf springs were still LR at this stage with Monroe heavy duty shocks all round.205R16 Stone County diamonds were the tyres of choice (shame they're all but banned now).
The first event was the 1997 Scottish Hillrally. Things didn't quite got to plan. It ate halfshafts for breakfast, lunch and dinner and on the next to last stage it broke one to many and they couldn't go on. With the overdrive in this to and a quarter petrol was doing over 60mph while in low box!
After that came the Welsh Hillrally. A different co driver this time who unfortunately got involved with a tow rope during the event and injuring his leg to the point where they had to retire.
The 1998 Scottish was up next with another new co-pilot...driver. Katy Mas
ter had been co driving on stage rallies both Katy and her husband Neil were friends of Adrian's.
Once again things didn't go well. Back then there was a famouse stage a Clow featuring the "1000ft climb" which claimed the front diff. This was replaced however engine mountings were broken the the point where one or more were needing changing per service.
During the afternoon run round the gearbox kept jumping out of 4wd and Katy ended up holding it for 3 stages (not sure how!). A return to service showed that all engine and box mountings were totalled and only the handbrake linkage the yellow knob (with Katy) and the exhaust was holding it all in! Mounts were drilled out an M12 bolts were put in and have done the trick since!
The Welsh that year was worse. A hard landing shattered both front shafts with the bits welding themselves in the stub axle. The service crew managed to source and change the front axle overnight but the next day both front shafts broke again and then the rear broke as well! Game over again.
A Salisbury (with anti tramp arrangement) was fitted to the rear and the Chandlers Tour of Lincs was entered. This shortlived event was special in that it was both a Stage Rally and a Hillrally with some parts of the event being run at the same place. Even the vehicles got to set of head to head at one point. The sight of a Group A Escort Cosworth with full anti lag etc being left standing by a Rivet buggy was eyeopening apparently!
Another heavy landing on the first day bent the front left chassis leg in two places but fortunately they managed to the finish (admittedly in last place!)
The Scottish went a little better that year although conditions were poor. While trying to tow another racer out Katy manage to fall off the track not doing her back any good but they carried on only to run late and miss a re fuel.
Some CB work with the chase crew and Adrian's celebral friend Simon worked out that if the two and a quarter could manage 6mpg in the next few stages they'd just make service.
It didn't make it with 200yards to spare. A quick run round with a can got it going but the next day the weather really turned with some competitors including Bowlers etc never making the finish.
While all this happened Adrian was also using the racer on the road now and again. Adrian had stopped at a little pub the lakes called the Outgate Inn. As he left he put his foot down and the noise brought attention to a load of students playing snooker in a hall next to the road with a large chapel style window looking onto the road.
One of the students was me. I could only see the top half but the cage and the spare wheel hinted at something purposeful and I liked it. Fate it seems, has patience.
Foot and Mouth gave the chance to address some issues. The Salisbury was proving to be strong so the front axle was upgraded to a military spec casing and 24spline shafts (+ 11" brakes) along with parabolics all round with Decarbon shocks. A homemade snorkel also was fitted (one that could survive the odd knock!) as the K&N was prone to blocking.
Fame came when a write up (which made the vehicle appear to be the Jonah on wheels which it was at the time) was in Land Rover World on 2001:
In fact there was enough time to build a 105" coiler buggy but sadly it never made it past the rolling frame stage.
It didn't matter though as Team "Smut" was up and running well! Adrian had also done some digging and it now had it's proper age related plate as it has been a shunter for so much of it's life moving boats - "OJM946L"
2002 Adrian upgraded the cage and fitted door bars (getting in and out was a bit interesting to say the least) and by the end of 2003 the Series 3 had something not a lot of series 3's have these days. A Stage Rally Log book! It took some doing as those in command at the MSA viewed it as a commercial vehicle and thus is banned but some common sense and a lot of cajouling by a friendly scrutineer won in the end.
The first event was Grizedale Stages 2003 which featured "that roll":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN85X9TiImM
I'd started doing road rallies by then and knew Katy and Neil. When I dug the series 3 that is now my trialer back out the barn and coverted it from Student transport to off road toy I met Adrian and Simon as well in "CROC" Cumbrian Rover Owners Club.
Both Simon and Adrian ran range rovers and had done all the necessary courses etc to be approved LPG installers. One issus the racer had was that the SU had never really worked properly and the mixture was always a compromise. An LPG kit solved all that in a stroke and the compression could be wound up with no issue of pinking. It went even faster!
In 2005 quite a few stage rallies were entered including the Malcolm Wilson the Lion Stages and as always the Grizedale.
Ok it was slow compared to the rally cars but importantly it was never last either. Being built for hillrallies made it nicely tough for doing the "smooth" forest rallies.
I was servicing for Adrian on the Malcolm Wilson 2005 and at the time I was writing the club newsletter.
[i]Imagine in the scene: It’s bitterly cold, windy and beginning to snow. Simon Hobson, Alex
Cowsill, Neil Master and myself are sheltering behind the open hatchback of Neil’s car
watching the hard work going on in the car park around us.
To our left an Impreza rally car arrives and expires on the spot with smoke billowing from its
orifices. To our right a team of lads run round working on a Metro 6R4 (hmmm 6R4…dribble),
it’s eaten it’s tyres, and the spare which lives under the bonnet is proving difficult to change.
(Probably because the front end, where the spare lives is looking a bit dog eared and the front bumper looks shredded.)
Across the car park someone’s straightening the sump guard and gear linkage on a Peugeot 205
which, like the Mk2 Escort beside it, is missing its exhaust system and back bumper.
This is the harsh reality of doing the Malcolm Wilson Rally in a car. Alex quietly surveys this
scene of expensive engineering destruction and says: “If I was going rallying I’d definitely use a
Land Rover”. Never a wiser word spoken!
Given the cost of an entry fee for a stage rally why on earth would you do it in a £30,000 car that
will do it’s best to self destruct by the first bend? OK Adrian Loxam’s Series 3 wasn’t the fastest
thing through the forests, (or the slowest, I might add) but I get the impression Adi and Katy had
fun and of course the slower your motor the more competitive driving time you get. Last year I
worked out that competitive driving time on the Cumbria Classic Caper rally cost me about £8.50
a minute. (yep I thought “ouch” too) But if you were in something quick it would be over a
tenner!
Anyway all this got me thinking about that old saying about how Land Rovers are so versatile.
Not just as work horses but in motorsport in general.
CROC, like North Lakes 4x4 maybe primarily a trialing club but I think we should never ignore
the other fun things you can do in a Landy…… Steady now, all those with depraved minds……
The green (or black) oval is obviously common in Winch Challenges, Comp Safari’s and Hill
rallies. But as well as this they often appear in every sort of rallying created. I can’t think of any
vehicle that in near standard form has competed in so many different motorsport disciplines.
Especially one that was originally designed for use as a small tractor!
It’s quite ironic, that given the media hype surrounding modern “form over function” softroaders:
If you set out to own a genuine ”Sport Utility Vehicle”……..
……..You should really be buying live axled Landy![/i]
After that Adrian had an accident in his daily driver (A 3.9 range rover) and yes he was fine and in true style as the rangie was a cracker prior to the crash he started work on building a Range Rover rally car. Having seen it in progress it's going to be loud and surprisingly light!
But that meant the Series 3 had to go. I couldn't buy as I'd just rebuilt my series (again) to go historic rallying in (which was to be turned back into a trialer in the end) and then bought another house and so it went back into the magazines and it passed into dark hands.
The doors bars as it was used as toy by someone who wasn't really well versed in these things. It was spotted around south lakes getting slowly worse.
When it began to missfire plugs and leads were changed and it was driven until it literally stopped under a tree in a village near Kendal. And that's where it stayed. The overdrive had been taken out as well.
2 months passed by which point it was out of Tax and MOT and 1 week away from being taken by the police and scrapped. It's last week before the reaper came was the week was the "Car's the Star show" which I like go to with the club stand Simon was there and I heard that Katy Master had been rung up about this land rover “abandoned” (it still had her name on the side).
Katy was the show organiser so after getting the details I went for drive and found it. Trouble is the owner was now missing and no one knew where he lived. I got to do "The Prisoner" line in the nearby pub when the barmaid asked what I'd like and I could reply "Information....."
The owner was desperate to get rid especially when it wouldn't even fire up to clamber onto my trailer. I gave him some notes and off he tottered/staggered. I didn't care that it looked in a bad way and didn't run I HAD TO SAVE IT!
Once home I found the chassis to be pretty good (only where high speed stones have chipped the chassis were there any issues. It’s not great but it’ll do. Bulkhead was fine. The engine however had an inch of head gasket missing between pot 3 and 4!
I rebuilt the head and cleaned everything up and put it back together. It runs like a dream! Admittedly a very cammy/no torque at tickover/twitchy dream but smooth none the less.
The cage was rubbed down and galvafroided straight away and shortly afterwards I put some new wing outers on to tidy it up a bit more. The back axle needed a full rebuild and the rear prop was shot to so a normal series 3 back axle with pegged diff has gone in/
Work continued bit by bit as I was still working on our cottage but things were looking rosy for it.
A full repaint is in order as well as the colour I started to use I don't like so much. Back to bronze green I think
After a repaint (still not happy really but it'll do) it looked like this minus the number boards:
Come October sporting a Simon BBC ignition we did the Solway Historic Rally.
Cracking day although at 120competative miles very long in such a loud motor.
Thanks to my brilliant wife calling the notes faultlessly all day meant no penalties and so we came 11th overall!
And 1st in class beating the big engined Escorts and Triumphs!!!!
We came in just over 2 mins behind the fastest car and nearly 6 mins in front of the slowest which is nice. Never stood a chance on any test even the gravel ones but consistancy pays off!
Some Photos (taken by a kind mate who was at the Rowrah tests) It was so wet in the morning the wipers were understeering!
Back in the afternoon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedd...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedd...
After the rally to help with the tighter stuff I fitted a Detroit Truetrac in the back along with stiffer dampers all round as well as stiffer rear parabolics and I can confirm it does donuts rather well! :
Also thanks to Roland at ACR tuning I got the bits to rebuild the carb and it now runs on petrol of a fashion certainly well enough to be used on road link sections should LPG getting low.
It went back in the garage for a few months while I carried on doing trials and came back out for this summer. I treated it to a VIP100 LPG trimmer which as hugely improved the running but does nothing for the economy.
We then threw an entry into the Lakeland Classic and found this was a different kettle of fish with some of the top classic rallying boys as well.
I set off from South Cumbria for a gentle drive through the county to the start some 46 miles away. Got almost half way when the misfiring kicked in big style and it all came to a halt. One dizzy in super retarded mode! A quick bit of timing and one very tight pinch bolt later and it was running better than ever.
Sat at 50mph on the northern roads and stopped at Rheged fuel station. It was virtually full when I set off...and about 48miles had past and 24 litres went in. Today was going to be interesting!
Got signed on at Penrith amongst the amazing collection of motors and was presented with War and Peace or the rally pack as it's known. I'm glad I'd taken 3 clipboards!
There was 13 "tests" on private land some of which were literally flat out stages intermixed with 4 sections of Average speed on the more remote and challenging roads around the Eden Valley.
Thing is the normal road sections are given in Tulip diagram form which is easy to follow. The against the clock bits on the road you get handed in coded form as you sign on.
So for example for one 7 mile section all you have to know exactlydown to which side of the junction to drive on was this:
Start: MR91/580133
58 12 MS N590095S N596062NW G 59
And then you have to average 30mph for say 3.2 miles....then 23mph for 2.4 miles etc and at any point you'd round a corner and pull up at a unknown Marshal point to the exact second. It only takes a cyclist or tractor and that 30mph becomes something quite different.
So with maps plotted my dear wife turned up having followed up in the Puma 90. 13 test diagrams to annotate some of which looked like mind benders and we lined up just outside for the first test round a lot of brand new trucks!
I have to thank the lads from the Young Guns forum for these pics:
Some of the turns were too tight to get the back end out early without using a hydraulic handbrake. Which are currently banned for no sporting reason anyone can think of.
Non the less it went well and off we went down the road. Next test was tighter still and the one after that was on very loose shale. Good fun but still needing a handbrake really!
First regularity came up and 4 seconds after we'd been counted down by the marshal our stopwatch froze. Which meant doing the whole thing on guesswork! I think we lost about 90 seconds which is a lot.
Next couple of tests and wife had a uncharacteristic freeze on one of the tests as the diagram didn't seem to plot onto the test. This resulted in I think a number of crews blasting into a farmyard after about 1.5miles flatoutness only to find the chicane cone that looked like it should be up the yard right next to the gateway he'd just flown through. Cue some reversing and confusion!
That test was still impressive.
The last regularity before lunch was over the roads that thread between the two carriageways on the M6 before turning to the infamous Bretherdale road that meets with the Breasthigh greenlane. The farmers permission had been granted but after dropping a mere 4 seconds I think Bretherdale proved a challenge after getting stuck behind a big gay boingy 4x4 and then encountered haytiming contractors driving New Hollands flat out which is scary enough in a Land Rover with a whopping great cage but in a period non caged mini I'd have been pooing myself because with such hold ups by the end the speeds required are not something I'm going to detail.
Lunch was at the excellent Tebay Services and fueled with Beef and Stilton pie we set off for an afternoon of rallying heaven. The test at oddendale quarry was rough, loose and the landy slid about with it's tail out exactly as I wanted it too. Finished the test laughing like a maniac. After that we did a reverse of the long farm test with the odd placed cone. Knowing where it was and the fact that it was mostly down hill meant some interesting speeds even for the landy. What the Lotus Sunbeams and Mk2 Escorts were pulling god knows! We got into flat 4th a couple of times which is good considering you can enter in a road car.
Some other tests near Lowther Park may have meant some brushes with scenery put I just kept the foot down.
Arrived back at Penrith tired and deaf. Wife headed home while I relaxed for a bit at the feast afterwards and saw some provisional results.
44 crews entered. Not all doing the full event but I was told we got 17th overall. More than happy with that!
Oh and it averaged about 10mpg over the whole day. It might go faster than it did a few weeks ago but blimey can it sup!
There's still a funny rattle like piston slop but it's getting no louder so I will do my best to ignore it while I sort out another engine for the future.
Couple of rallies planned in October/November.
Tis a frequently told story but non the less apologies for the length!
In January 1973 Brian Fulton supplied a 1972 88" hard top reg to the National Trust in Cumbria. They used it for shunting duties round Fell Foot park beside Windermere.
It didn't get registered for many years and was put on the road in the 80's by which is was getting on a bit and shifted on.
In 1994 a man called Adrian Loxam bought it as 2nd car which did a lot of laning and offroading in general.
A pair of Lucas 20/20 lamps, capstan winch and some 7.50 SATS were all that was needed for good times!
This is long before the CROW or even the NERC act and many trips were made up great passes such as Walna Scar and Garburn.
Is was a trip up the Garburn pass that changed all that. Adrian and and a few others were near the top one winters day and got out to admire the view and have a chat.
Unfortunately the handbrake in the 88" let go and the still with the drivers door ajar the landy rolled off the pass and went a very very long way.
This was the result:
A team of people recovered it and Adrian did actually drive it off the pass!
Now a lot of people would have given up at this point with this motor but Adrian had a background in rallying and liked the idea of Hillrallying. (He like many had seen that episode of "old" Topgear with Tony Mason inteviewing Ian Sykes in his mental leafer.) I'd love to have a copy of that clip but anyway...
The wreck of the series 3 was taken to a workshop and a big rebuild started:
A Bettaweld external cage and truckcab were fitted along with a lot of new bodywork! All the required safety gear of buckets, harnesses, fire extingquishers went in and then he got to the engine.....
The 3 bearing block was getting it a bit tired so a 5 bearing engine was found and put in. I've said before a 2286 engine and a A series engine are quite similar well it turns out Minisport were willing to do a balanced crank and super light flywheel for the engine!
A friend took an old cylinder head and did a nice job of porting and general gasflowing it. ACR tuning supplied heavy duty valve springs as well so it sounds like a bag of spanners and always will. A set of tubular manifolds were fitted that included a 4-2-1 exhaust manifold onto a big bore performance exhaust from Roland Marlow.Fuel was fed via whopping SU carb and a K&N.
Leaf springs were still LR at this stage with Monroe heavy duty shocks all round.205R16 Stone County diamonds were the tyres of choice (shame they're all but banned now).
The first event was the 1997 Scottish Hillrally. Things didn't quite got to plan. It ate halfshafts for breakfast, lunch and dinner and on the next to last stage it broke one to many and they couldn't go on. With the overdrive in this to and a quarter petrol was doing over 60mph while in low box!
After that came the Welsh Hillrally. A different co driver this time who unfortunately got involved with a tow rope during the event and injuring his leg to the point where they had to retire.
The 1998 Scottish was up next with another new co-pilot...driver. Katy Mas
ter had been co driving on stage rallies both Katy and her husband Neil were friends of Adrian's. Once again things didn't go well. Back then there was a famouse stage a Clow featuring the "1000ft climb" which claimed the front diff. This was replaced however engine mountings were broken the the point where one or more were needing changing per service.
During the afternoon run round the gearbox kept jumping out of 4wd and Katy ended up holding it for 3 stages (not sure how!). A return to service showed that all engine and box mountings were totalled and only the handbrake linkage the yellow knob (with Katy) and the exhaust was holding it all in! Mounts were drilled out an M12 bolts were put in and have done the trick since!
The Welsh that year was worse. A hard landing shattered both front shafts with the bits welding themselves in the stub axle. The service crew managed to source and change the front axle overnight but the next day both front shafts broke again and then the rear broke as well! Game over again.
A Salisbury (with anti tramp arrangement) was fitted to the rear and the Chandlers Tour of Lincs was entered. This shortlived event was special in that it was both a Stage Rally and a Hillrally with some parts of the event being run at the same place. Even the vehicles got to set of head to head at one point. The sight of a Group A Escort Cosworth with full anti lag etc being left standing by a Rivet buggy was eyeopening apparently!
Another heavy landing on the first day bent the front left chassis leg in two places but fortunately they managed to the finish (admittedly in last place!)
The Scottish went a little better that year although conditions were poor. While trying to tow another racer out Katy manage to fall off the track not doing her back any good but they carried on only to run late and miss a re fuel.
Some CB work with the chase crew and Adrian's celebral friend Simon worked out that if the two and a quarter could manage 6mpg in the next few stages they'd just make service.
It didn't make it with 200yards to spare. A quick run round with a can got it going but the next day the weather really turned with some competitors including Bowlers etc never making the finish.
While all this happened Adrian was also using the racer on the road now and again. Adrian had stopped at a little pub the lakes called the Outgate Inn. As he left he put his foot down and the noise brought attention to a load of students playing snooker in a hall next to the road with a large chapel style window looking onto the road.
One of the students was me. I could only see the top half but the cage and the spare wheel hinted at something purposeful and I liked it. Fate it seems, has patience.
Foot and Mouth gave the chance to address some issues. The Salisbury was proving to be strong so the front axle was upgraded to a military spec casing and 24spline shafts (+ 11" brakes) along with parabolics all round with Decarbon shocks. A homemade snorkel also was fitted (one that could survive the odd knock!) as the K&N was prone to blocking.
Fame came when a write up (which made the vehicle appear to be the Jonah on wheels which it was at the time) was in Land Rover World on 2001:
In fact there was enough time to build a 105" coiler buggy but sadly it never made it past the rolling frame stage.
It didn't matter though as Team "Smut" was up and running well! Adrian had also done some digging and it now had it's proper age related plate as it has been a shunter for so much of it's life moving boats - "OJM946L"
2002 Adrian upgraded the cage and fitted door bars (getting in and out was a bit interesting to say the least) and by the end of 2003 the Series 3 had something not a lot of series 3's have these days. A Stage Rally Log book! It took some doing as those in command at the MSA viewed it as a commercial vehicle and thus is banned but some common sense and a lot of cajouling by a friendly scrutineer won in the end.
The first event was Grizedale Stages 2003 which featured "that roll":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN85X9TiImM
I'd started doing road rallies by then and knew Katy and Neil. When I dug the series 3 that is now my trialer back out the barn and coverted it from Student transport to off road toy I met Adrian and Simon as well in "CROC" Cumbrian Rover Owners Club.
Both Simon and Adrian ran range rovers and had done all the necessary courses etc to be approved LPG installers. One issus the racer had was that the SU had never really worked properly and the mixture was always a compromise. An LPG kit solved all that in a stroke and the compression could be wound up with no issue of pinking. It went even faster!
In 2005 quite a few stage rallies were entered including the Malcolm Wilson the Lion Stages and as always the Grizedale.
Ok it was slow compared to the rally cars but importantly it was never last either. Being built for hillrallies made it nicely tough for doing the "smooth" forest rallies.
I was servicing for Adrian on the Malcolm Wilson 2005 and at the time I was writing the club newsletter.
[i]Imagine in the scene: It’s bitterly cold, windy and beginning to snow. Simon Hobson, Alex
Cowsill, Neil Mas
ter and myself are sheltering behind the open hatchback of Neil’s carwatching the hard work going on in the car park around us.
To our left an Impreza rally car arrives and expires on the spot with smoke billowing from its
orifices. To our right a team of lads run round working on a Metro 6R4 (hmmm 6R4…dribble),
it’s eaten it’s tyres, and the spare which lives under the bonnet is proving difficult to change.
(Probably because the front end, where the spare lives is looking a bit dog eared and the front bumper looks shredded.)
Across the car park someone’s straightening the sump guard and gear linkage on a Peugeot 205
which, like the Mk2 Escort beside it, is missing its exhaust system and back bumper.
This is the harsh reality of doing the Malcolm Wilson Rally in a car. Alex quietly surveys this
scene of expensive engineering destruction and says: “If I was going rallying I’d definitely use a
Land Rover”. Never a wiser word spoken!
Given the cost of an entry fee for a stage rally why on earth would you do it in a £30,000 car that
will do it’s best to self destruct by the first bend? OK Adrian Loxam’s Series 3 wasn’t the fastest
thing through the forests, (or the slowest, I might add) but I get the impression Adi and Katy had
fun and of course the slower your motor the more competitive driving time you get. Last year I
worked out that competitive driving time on the Cumbria Classic Caper rally cost me about £8.50
a minute. (yep I thought “ouch” too) But if you were in something quick it would be over a
tenner!
Anyway all this got me thinking about that old saying about how Land Rovers are so versatile.
Not just as work horses but in motorsport in general.
CROC, like North Lakes 4x4 maybe primarily a trialing club but I think we should never ignore
the other fun things you can do in a Landy…… Steady now, all those with depraved minds……
The green (or black) oval is obviously common in Winch Challenges, Comp Safari’s and Hill
rallies. But as well as this they often appear in every sort of rallying created. I can’t think of any
vehicle that in near standard form has competed in so many different motorsport disciplines.
Especially one that was originally designed for use as a small tractor!
It’s quite ironic, that given the media hype surrounding modern “form over function” softroaders:
If you set out to own a genuine ”Sport Utility Vehicle”……..
……..You should really be buying live axled Landy![/i]
After that Adrian had an accident in his daily driver (A 3.9 range rover) and yes he was fine and in true style as the rangie was a cracker prior to the crash he started work on building a Range Rover rally car. Having seen it in progress it's going to be loud and surprisingly light!
But that meant the Series 3 had to go. I couldn't buy as I'd just rebuilt my series (again) to go historic rallying in (which was to be turned back into a trialer in the end) and then bought another house and so it went back into the magazines and it passed into dark hands.
The doors bars as it was used as toy by someone who wasn't really well versed in these things. It was spotted around south lakes getting slowly worse.
When it began to missfire plugs and leads were changed and it was driven until it literally stopped under a tree in a village near Kendal. And that's where it stayed. The overdrive had been taken out as well.
2 months passed by which point it was out of Tax and MOT and 1 week away from being taken by the police and scrapped. It's last week before the reaper came was the week was the "Car's the Star show" which I like go to with the club stand Simon was there and I heard that Katy Mas
ter had been rung up about this land rover “abandoned” (it still had her name on the side).Katy was the show organiser so after getting the details I went for drive and found it. Trouble is the owner was now missing and no one knew where he lived. I got to do "The Prisoner" line in the nearby pub when the barmaid asked what I'd like and I could reply "Information....."
The owner was desperate to get rid especially when it wouldn't even fire up to clamber onto my trailer. I gave him some notes and off he tottered/staggered. I didn't care that it looked in a bad way and didn't run I HAD TO SAVE IT!
Once home I found the chassis to be pretty good (only where high speed stones have chipped the chassis were there any issues. It’s not great but it’ll do. Bulkhead was fine. The engine however had an inch of head gasket missing between pot 3 and 4!
I rebuilt the head and cleaned everything up and put it back together. It runs like a dream! Admittedly a very cammy/no torque at tickover/twitchy dream but smooth none the less.
The cage was rubbed down and galvafroided straight away and shortly afterwards I put some new wing outers on to tidy it up a bit more. The back axle needed a full rebuild and the rear prop was shot to so a normal series 3 back axle with pegged diff has gone in/
Work continued bit by bit as I was still working on our cottage but things were looking rosy for it.
A full repaint is in order as well as the colour I started to use I don't like so much. Back to bronze green I think
After a repaint (still not happy really but it'll do) it looked like this minus the number boards:
Come October sporting a Simon BBC ignition we did the Solway Historic Rally.
Cracking day although at 120competative miles very long in such a loud motor.
Thanks to my brilliant wife calling the notes faultlessly all day meant no penalties and so we came 11th overall!
And 1st in class beating the big engined Escorts and Triumphs!!!!
We came in just over 2 mins behind the fastest car and nearly 6 mins in front of the slowest which is nice. Never stood a chance on any test even the gravel ones but consistancy pays off!
Some Photos (taken by a kind mate who was at the Rowrah tests) It was so wet in the morning the wipers were understeering!
Back in the afternoon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedd...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedd...
After the rally to help with the tighter stuff I fitted a Detroit Truetrac in the back along with stiffer dampers all round as well as stiffer rear parabolics and I can confirm it does donuts rather well! :
Also thanks to Roland at ACR tuning I got the bits to rebuild the carb and it now runs on petrol of a fashion certainly well enough to be used on road link sections should LPG getting low.
It went back in the garage for a few months while I carried on doing trials and came back out for this summer. I treated it to a VIP100 LPG trimmer which as hugely improved the running but does nothing for the economy.
We then threw an entry into the Lakeland Classic and found this was a different kettle of fish with some of the top classic rallying boys as well.
I set off from South Cumbria for a gentle drive through the county to the start some 46 miles away. Got almost half way when the misfiring kicked in big style and it all came to a halt. One dizzy in super retarded mode! A quick bit of timing and one very tight pinch bolt later and it was running better than ever.
Sat at 50mph on the northern roads and stopped at Rheged fuel station. It was virtually full when I set off...and about 48miles had past and 24 litres went in. Today was going to be interesting!
Got signed on at Penrith amongst the amazing collection of motors and was presented with War and Peace or the rally pack as it's known. I'm glad I'd taken 3 clipboards!
There was 13 "tests" on private land some of which were literally flat out stages intermixed with 4 sections of Average speed on the more remote and challenging roads around the Eden Valley.
Thing is the normal road sections are given in Tulip diagram form which is easy to follow. The against the clock bits on the road you get handed in coded form as you sign on.
So for example for one 7 mile section all you have to know exactlydown to which side of the junction to drive on was this:
Start: MR91/580133
58 12 MS N590095S N596062NW G 59
And then you have to average 30mph for say 3.2 miles....then 23mph for 2.4 miles etc and at any point you'd round a corner and pull up at a unknown Marshal point to the exact second. It only takes a cyclist or tractor and that 30mph becomes something quite different.
So with maps plotted my dear wife turned up having followed up in the Puma 90. 13 test diagrams to annotate some of which looked like mind benders and we lined up just outside for the first test round a lot of brand new trucks!
I have to thank the lads from the Young Guns forum for these pics:
Some of the turns were too tight to get the back end out early without using a hydraulic handbrake. Which are currently banned for no sporting reason anyone can think of.
Non the less it went well and off we went down the road. Next test was tighter still and the one after that was on very loose shale. Good fun but still needing a handbrake really!
First regularity came up and 4 seconds after we'd been counted down by the marshal our stopwatch froze. Which meant doing the whole thing on guesswork! I think we lost about 90 seconds which is a lot.
Next couple of tests and wife had a uncharacteristic freeze on one of the tests as the diagram didn't seem to plot onto the test. This resulted in I think a number of crews blasting into a farmyard after about 1.5miles flatoutness only to find the chicane cone that looked like it should be up the yard right next to the gateway he'd just flown through. Cue some reversing and confusion!
That test was still impressive.
The last regularity before lunch was over the roads that thread between the two carriageways on the M6 before turning to the infamous Bretherdale road that meets with the Breasthigh greenlane. The farmers permission had been granted but after dropping a mere 4 seconds I think Bretherdale proved a challenge after getting stuck behind a big gay boingy 4x4 and then encountered haytiming contractors driving New Hollands flat out which is scary enough in a Land Rover with a whopping great cage but in a period non caged mini I'd have been pooing myself because with such hold ups by the end the speeds required are not something I'm going to detail.
Lunch was at the excellent Tebay Services and fueled with Beef and Stilton pie we set off for an afternoon of rallying heaven. The test at oddendale quarry was rough, loose and the landy slid about with it's tail out exactly as I wanted it too. Finished the test laughing like a maniac. After that we did a reverse of the long farm test with the odd placed cone. Knowing where it was and the fact that it was mostly down hill meant some interesting speeds even for the landy. What the Lotus Sunbeams and Mk2 Escorts were pulling god knows! We got into flat 4th a couple of times which is good considering you can enter in a road car.
Some other tests near Lowther Park may have meant some brushes with scenery put I just kept the foot down.
Arrived back at Penrith tired and deaf. Wife headed home while I relaxed for a bit at the feast afterwards and saw some provisional results.
44 crews entered. Not all doing the full event but I was told we got 17th overall. More than happy with that!
Oh and it averaged about 10mpg over the whole day. It might go faster than it did a few weeks ago but blimey can it sup!
There's still a funny rattle like piston slop but it's getting no louder so I will do my best to ignore it while I sort out another engine for the future.
Couple of rallies planned in October/November.
rhinochopig said:
We had an s1 and an s3 lweight and the one question I have is how the hell do you dial in some opposite lock when rallying. The steering box on a landy is the slowest and most vague ever fitted to a road vehicle.
Fascinating write up thanks.
Cheers all!Fascinating write up thanks.
Its not a problem winding the oppo lock on its running out of lock that's the issue!
I rebuilt the steering box as one of the first jobs and everything steering wise is set up as best as possible and its quite direct! Last MOTing man complimented me on it he said it had been a while since he done one that wasn't as slack as a wizards cuff.
It's still too heavy though! Own fault for running bigger offset rims I suppose.
Good point! That's where it had stood for some considerable time:
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Milnthorpe&hl=...
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Milnthorpe&hl=...
Would be interesting to see how a Man Cruiser would do to be honest.
Because we're now competing in historics in the Pre Jan 1975 class it means the only Man Cruiser you could enter something like this:
Which maybe very lovely but at rallying? Hmmm.
Because we're now competing in historics in the Pre Jan 1975 class it means the only Man Cruiser you could enter something like this:
Which maybe very lovely but at rallying? Hmmm.
Edited by Landyphil on Saturday 25th August 20:51
I don't think anyone got a Bowler through the log booking process for rallying prior to the big clamp down on framing (all that effort just to ban Andy Burton's Pug 306).
They've been used as course cars but without a stage logbook it's a non starter which is a big shame.
John Cockburn used a 5 litre Tomcat for a few events such as the Tour of Mull in 2003 but it was subsequently told not to come back I believe.
The running gear found it's way into a 2 door range rover to be allowed:
They've been used as course cars but without a stage logbook it's a non starter which is a big shame.
John Cockburn used a 5 litre Tomcat for a few events such as the Tour of Mull in 2003 but it was subsequently told not to come back I believe.
The running gear found it's way into a 2 door range rover to be allowed:
A bittersweet rally report in some respects as there is scant chance I’ll be able write another for sometime. But what a way to bow out for a break!
The Solway Historic.
Run by WigtonMC the Solway Historic Rally was originally run as “The Cockermouth Revival Rally” and rasied money for Cockermouth town post it’s 2009 flooding.
It then evolved into the Solway Historic rally and is a “Tests only” rally meaning there is no competitive element on the public roads just an overall time schedule with 12 or so special tests at various private venues from Airfields to Kart Tracks around North and West Cumbria.
Things weren’t looking good the week before as, to seek answers to the noises within I stuck a videoscope down the sparkplug orifices and found my bores looked like this!
This would explain why an engine that should be making about 190psi was making between 50-90psi compression! It’s never been fast but it was getting very “flat”. But the bores were bizarrely smooth so we took a chance and so I set off on a cold Sunday morn to head up to Rowrah Kart Track with Tray following later in the Defender…carrying spares!
The journey was not one I will remember fondly being deafened and then frozen as the voltmeter in the cab was saying worrying things so the heater remained off. With a straight cut box and wing mirrors that kept steaming up I nearly ended up having an indiscretion on the way there with another classic so it was apologies when I got to Rowrah!
Most rally cars were already there when I lined up for scrutineering still getting the odd funny look from rally crews that hadn’t seen the landy before. Scrutineering passed with so much as a iffy front right indicator which was just a loose bulb we got handed all the paperwork and went upstairs and sat with Richard Craig and Peter Leary running Richard’s MGBGT.
The tests were similar to last years with a few additional ones and best off all some split/merge laps of Rowrah to finish the day off. As long the engine lasted that long!
The sun was well out and beginning to dry the rather cold slippy track when we lined up for the start of test 1 and 2. A reverse lap of Rowrah. Twice. As soon as the marshal got to “two” on his countdown all sympathy for the engine went, 3000rpm and lift the clutch. Get to the first corner on the first test and JEEESUS come in a bit too hot there!
Understeer noted I kept it a bit smoother on the turn in to help the old girl and we sailed round (well it looked like we were tacking anyway) about 4 seconds faster than the dry lap last year. Those new rear springs were worth it!
All the guys and gals from the Young Guns Classics forum had arrived in proper cars to see Richard and myself give it a go. Cheer us on and it’s to the fine work of Calum Barrow, Frazer Kinghorn, Adam Griffin, Andrew Wright and Alex Backhouse that I have these fine photomagraphs.
Tests done it was out onto the road for a blat up to Broughton Quarry which was looking rather slippy. Even with knobblies I could play tunes with the amount of wheelspin in 2nd! Not bad with the engine like it was!
As feared the top of the quarry despite being large had the cones about 5mm apart or so it seemed which with no handbrake made progress slow dropping a lot of time at by going out on the last but one cone gave it room for me plant it to get it sideways and power out a bit quicker Good fun up and down the track though!
A fly round the big concrete slab at Scaryport and we were off to the soft gravel of the old motel and woodyard at Moota. Bit tighter than last time due to a big pile of hardcore but great fun and it with the sun lowish through the trees very photogenic it would seem!
After that it was off to Wigton itself for lunch halt and a test in the auction mart one again on very smooth soft gravel. On the way there though we came across the sad sight of Richard and Peter stopped with a fuel pump problems. A few electrical investigations removed some possible faults and Richard said we may as well be on our way.
The test at the auction mart was murder last year for the landy but with no steering damper and new tyres it didn’t seem that bad. Still a HUGE problem not being able to do handbrake turns though as some of the other competitors skipped round the cones pulling on that central steering handle!
http://youtu.be/VgjPcyN7gnU
We had a little picnic in the sun and warm (really is the end of October?) outside and watched the action before heading back out and up to Kirkbride airfield.
I may have err sort of gone off a touch during both of those tests as the landy even when not understeering has a turning circle bigger than the concrete bits. Just as well it’s designed to go offroad! Marshals did seem to be laughing quite a lot which shows our work there was done!
It’s a long way from Kirkbride to Maryport if you’re not using any main roads really but a slightly longer test at Maryport went nicely even if we were flagging a bit by then. Managed to get a nice bit of power oversteer which on concrete shows the engine was still pulling as much as it could!
The next test was a new one at Wellington Farm near Cockermouth. Felt at home looking at all the mud but still didn’t select 4wd. Kills what little turn in we have…..and for once maybe I should have depressed my little yellow knob (Cue “Oooh Errr” type comments)
Lifted the clutch at about 2500rpm and then went straight for second…..sometime later we’d moved a few feet and had got most of the way up to the codeboard before the wheelspin subsided. As we flew up the first corner which was a bit unsighted I went in a little hot and slid wide. Not wishing to incur any penalties by hitting the border markers I hit the brakes and backed up maybe a yard or two before deploying all the horses we had…in 2nd….and after we’d sunk about 8inches in about 5 seconds it began to move slowly off. A quick glance in the wing mirror showed the sort of ruts I’d expect at a Comp Safari. Any guilt for the next crew coming along was forgotten as the we were constantly sliding about but it felt good.
The last corner was a 270 degree round the last cone and it looked very cut up and on a slope Threw it in and planted it in 2nd and the diff worked it’s magic perfectly. Back end came round and we did the lot with the steering about straight. Lovely.
The marshal at the end asked what engine we had. Seemed slightly bemused by the fact it’s a tired knocking 2 and a quarter in there.
After a random route up the fells and back it was the final blast round Rowrah running the right way with two laps and split and merge. Given that the car in front was a mini and the car behind a Lancia Fulvia the idea of dicing with a Land Rover flat out seemed to not appeal so we had the track to ourselves mainly. Engine sounded a little more rattly so changed up a bit earlier on every shift.
Last year this little switchback was a 2nd gear job. This year it was a slight dab of brakes on the way in and then flat in 3rd bouncing off the kerbs.
We crept back to the car park and it all went nice and quiet. Rally done! 25th o/a which’ll do.
A check of the LPG gauge showed it was pretty much empty. Not great in West Cumbria where LPG is clearly too advanced for all but 1 station in the whole region that closes on a Sunday!
Racer doesn’t really run well on petrol as I still can’t get the carb spot on and given that it would be getting dark and I wasn’t sure of how much electricity was spare we made a quick dash for home.
As it turned out it was a faulty connection on the voltmeter thankfully and by keeping the throttle light we got home in sort of one piece!
And that as they say is that. Plan is to put it back in storage and start what could be a lot changing of bits. New engine block/bottom end at the very least which gives me chance to look at whether the gearbox casing is OK. Overdrive could do with a rebuild as could the bearing in the transfer box I’m guessing. Finally there’s a hub or two to rebuild as well.
It will return. Just not quite sure when!
The Solway Historic.
Run by WigtonMC the Solway Historic Rally was originally run as “The Cockermouth Revival Rally” and rasied money for Cockermouth town post it’s 2009 flooding.
It then evolved into the Solway Historic rally and is a “Tests only” rally meaning there is no competitive element on the public roads just an overall time schedule with 12 or so special tests at various private venues from Airfields to Kart Tracks around North and West Cumbria.
Things weren’t looking good the week before as, to seek answers to the noises within I stuck a videoscope down the sparkplug orifices and found my bores looked like this!
This would explain why an engine that should be making about 190psi was making between 50-90psi compression! It’s never been fast but it was getting very “flat”. But the bores were bizarrely smooth so we took a chance and so I set off on a cold Sunday morn to head up to Rowrah Kart Track with Tray following later in the Defender…carrying spares!
The journey was not one I will remember fondly being deafened and then frozen as the voltmeter in the cab was saying worrying things so the heater remained off. With a straight cut box and wing mirrors that kept steaming up I nearly ended up having an indiscretion on the way there with another classic so it was apologies when I got to Rowrah!
Most rally cars were already there when I lined up for scrutineering still getting the odd funny look from rally crews that hadn’t seen the landy before. Scrutineering passed with so much as a iffy front right indicator which was just a loose bulb we got handed all the paperwork and went upstairs and sat with Richard Craig and Peter Leary running Richard’s MGBGT.
The tests were similar to last years with a few additional ones and best off all some split/merge laps of Rowrah to finish the day off. As long the engine lasted that long!
The sun was well out and beginning to dry the rather cold slippy track when we lined up for the start of test 1 and 2. A reverse lap of Rowrah. Twice. As soon as the marshal got to “two” on his countdown all sympathy for the engine went, 3000rpm and lift the clutch. Get to the first corner on the first test and JEEESUS come in a bit too hot there!
Understeer noted I kept it a bit smoother on the turn in to help the old girl and we sailed round (well it looked like we were tacking anyway) about 4 seconds faster than the dry lap last year. Those new rear springs were worth it!
All the guys and gals from the Young Guns Classics forum had arrived in proper cars to see Richard and myself give it a go. Cheer us on and it’s to the fine work of Calum Barrow, Frazer Kinghorn, Adam Griffin, Andrew Wright and Alex Backhouse that I have these fine photomagraphs.
Tests done it was out onto the road for a blat up to Broughton Quarry which was looking rather slippy. Even with knobblies I could play tunes with the amount of wheelspin in 2nd! Not bad with the engine like it was!
As feared the top of the quarry despite being large had the cones about 5mm apart or so it seemed which with no handbrake made progress slow dropping a lot of time at by going out on the last but one cone gave it room for me plant it to get it sideways and power out a bit quicker Good fun up and down the track though!
A fly round the big concrete slab at Scaryport and we were off to the soft gravel of the old motel and woodyard at Moota. Bit tighter than last time due to a big pile of hardcore but great fun and it with the sun lowish through the trees very photogenic it would seem!
After that it was off to Wigton itself for lunch halt and a test in the auction mart one again on very smooth soft gravel. On the way there though we came across the sad sight of Richard and Peter stopped with a fuel pump problems. A few electrical investigations removed some possible faults and Richard said we may as well be on our way.
The test at the auction mart was murder last year for the landy but with no steering damper and new tyres it didn’t seem that bad. Still a HUGE problem not being able to do handbrake turns though as some of the other competitors skipped round the cones pulling on that central steering handle!
http://youtu.be/VgjPcyN7gnU
We had a little picnic in the sun and warm (really is the end of October?) outside and watched the action before heading back out and up to Kirkbride airfield.
I may have err sort of gone off a touch during both of those tests as the landy even when not understeering has a turning circle bigger than the concrete bits. Just as well it’s designed to go offroad! Marshals did seem to be laughing quite a lot which shows our work there was done!
It’s a long way from Kirkbride to Maryport if you’re not using any main roads really but a slightly longer test at Maryport went nicely even if we were flagging a bit by then. Managed to get a nice bit of power oversteer which on concrete shows the engine was still pulling as much as it could!
The next test was a new one at Wellington Farm near Cockermouth. Felt at home looking at all the mud but still didn’t select 4wd. Kills what little turn in we have…..and for once maybe I should have depressed my little yellow knob (Cue “Oooh Errr” type comments)
Lifted the clutch at about 2500rpm and then went straight for second…..sometime later we’d moved a few feet and had got most of the way up to the codeboard before the wheelspin subsided. As we flew up the first corner which was a bit unsighted I went in a little hot and slid wide. Not wishing to incur any penalties by hitting the border markers I hit the brakes and backed up maybe a yard or two before deploying all the horses we had…in 2nd….and after we’d sunk about 8inches in about 5 seconds it began to move slowly off. A quick glance in the wing mirror showed the sort of ruts I’d expect at a Comp Safari. Any guilt for the next crew coming along was forgotten as the we were constantly sliding about but it felt good.
The last corner was a 270 degree round the last cone and it looked very cut up and on a slope Threw it in and planted it in 2nd and the diff worked it’s magic perfectly. Back end came round and we did the lot with the steering about straight. Lovely.
The marshal at the end asked what engine we had. Seemed slightly bemused by the fact it’s a tired knocking 2 and a quarter in there.
After a random route up the fells and back it was the final blast round Rowrah running the right way with two laps and split and merge. Given that the car in front was a mini and the car behind a Lancia Fulvia the idea of dicing with a Land Rover flat out seemed to not appeal so we had the track to ourselves mainly. Engine sounded a little more rattly so changed up a bit earlier on every shift.
Last year this little switchback was a 2nd gear job. This year it was a slight dab of brakes on the way in and then flat in 3rd bouncing off the kerbs.
We crept back to the car park and it all went nice and quiet. Rally done! 25th o/a which’ll do.
A check of the LPG gauge showed it was pretty much empty. Not great in West Cumbria where LPG is clearly too advanced for all but 1 station in the whole region that closes on a Sunday!
Racer doesn’t really run well on petrol as I still can’t get the carb spot on and given that it would be getting dark and I wasn’t sure of how much electricity was spare we made a quick dash for home.
As it turned out it was a faulty connection on the voltmeter thankfully and by keeping the throttle light we got home in sort of one piece!
And that as they say is that. Plan is to put it back in storage and start what could be a lot changing of bits. New engine block/bottom end at the very least which gives me chance to look at whether the gearbox casing is OK. Overdrive could do with a rebuild as could the bearing in the transfer box I’m guessing. Finally there’s a hub or two to rebuild as well.
It will return. Just not quite sure when!
Not a great update here.
Rebuilt rear hub which had somehow crapped a rear oil seal but must have only done it in the last few miles so bearing saved.
Compression test with oil in the bores showed no improvement but oil appeared in the inlet manifold! At least the bores aren't leaking under compression...just the valves! :roll:
Knowing at least that the valves were passing and that was the source of the compression lost off came the head and valves were dropped.
bks!
Yup it's all looking poo and that's one of the better inlet seats!
8 new valves ordered (and some optimism) combined with new springs. Head runs double springs and a comparison of new main springs and old ones showed the old ones were both softer and ever so slightly shorter.
So set to lapping it on. Pot 1 and 4 took no time at all and went just fine.
(Pot 1 shown on the right)
Cylinder 2 and 3.......didn't look good. Seats slightly more pitted and would not lap well. Eventually though a clear ring was formed on all valve seats.
When it came to test though: Cold cranking Pot 1 to 3 145 to 150psi........ OK but not great given how much head isn't there.
Pot 4 which looked one of the better ones you could hear leaking the charge out with obvious low compression.
Confirmed that there was nothing odd going on rocker/cam wise by backing the tappets right off so the valves were DEFINATELY fully closed under the compression stroke.
Not happy!
Fortunately it looks like I might be getting a stock head which if it's half decent will do for the time being while I see if a proper job can be done on the very high compression head in the longer term.
Rebuilt rear hub which had somehow crapped a rear oil seal but must have only done it in the last few miles so bearing saved.
Compression test with oil in the bores showed no improvement but oil appeared in the inlet manifold! At least the bores aren't leaking under compression...just the valves! :roll:
Knowing at least that the valves were passing and that was the source of the compression lost off came the head and valves were dropped.
b
ks!Yup it's all looking poo and that's one of the better inlet seats!
8 new valves ordered (and some optimism) combined with new springs. Head runs double springs and a comparison of new main springs and old ones showed the old ones were both softer and ever so slightly shorter.
So set to lapping it on. Pot 1 and 4 took no time at all and went just fine.
(Pot 1 shown on the right)
Cylinder 2 and 3.......didn't look good. Seats slightly more pitted and would not lap well. Eventually though a clear ring was formed on all valve seats.
When it came to test though: Cold cranking Pot 1 to 3 145 to 150psi........ OK but not great given how much head isn't there.
Pot 4 which looked one of the better ones you could hear leaking the charge out with obvious low compression.
Confirmed that there was nothing odd going on rocker/cam wise by backing the tappets right off so the valves were DEFINATELY fully closed under the compression stroke.
Not happy!
Fortunately it looks like I might be getting a stock head which if it's half decent will do for the time being while I see if a proper job can be done on the very high compression head in the longer term.
Thought I'd start 2013 on a positive note so this morning tootled into the garage and inspected the "racing" head as I wanted to know what made cylinder 4 compression go down. 99% sure it was valves not seating despite more lapping that a spoilered Corsa in Doncaster so took the valves back out.
This was the scene: Looked pretty good!
I also had the chance to compare the standard head that Dengieboy of this shire so kindly donated to the cause. As well as the fact that this head is 4mm thinner than the standard 7:1 head it doesn't really come out in the photos but the standard heads seem to have a "step" in the head where the valves seats sit.
The inlets on this one are as smooth as a cashmere codpiece all the way to the valves themselves with quite a bit more valve guide tube showing over standard. Quite a porting job!
On the exhaust ports there appears to be about 10mm more valve guide tube showing and once again it's all been smoothed and ported (as well as hardened valve seats for unleaded/LPG).
The more I looked the more I couldn't work out why pot 4 was dud. It also hit home how well done this head compared to a standard head. Roland Marlow from ACR had supplied the bits but the head was made by a bloke called Mark Ibbotson I've been lead to believe. Who last time I heard was in Australia!?!
Decided a sure fire way to test it was to put the valves back in and fill all 8 ports with petrol. In theory a good valve seat would never let petrol out.
Low and behold all ports in cylinder 1,2 and 3 were totally petrol tight.
Inlet valve on cylinder 4 started slowly weeping but exhaust valve number 4 piddled it out about as fast I poured it in even though the seat and valve faces looked spot on!
Quick bit of lapping work (just a few mins) and the exhaust valve was absolutely petrol tight. Spot on!
Gave inlet valve the same treatment refitted it and dropped some petrol back in.....
bks!
Back out the valve came and gave it a lot of lapping, and them some more for good measure.
Re assembled, in went the petrol and it seemed petrol tight.
Left it for an hour or so like the others and this was all that could be seen (Apologies for the poor photo):
Bit of moisture around the edge, as good as it's going to get and hopefully as the pressure forces are on the valve face not the back.
Going to give this fancy head another chance.
Will see what sort of figures it makes in a few days hopefully.
Incidently the copper traces that can be seen between pot 3 and 4 was the traces of the copper head gasket that been decimated and ignored by the bloke who owned it between Adrian and myself. Head's straight as a die but the copper remains in the machining marks.
This was the scene: Looked pretty good!
I also had the chance to compare the standard head that Dengieboy of this shire so kindly donated to the cause. As well as the fact that this head is 4mm thinner than the standard 7:1 head it doesn't really come out in the photos but the standard heads seem to have a "step" in the head where the valves seats sit.
The inlets on this one are as smooth as a cashmere codpiece all the way to the valves themselves with quite a bit more valve guide tube showing over standard. Quite a porting job!
On the exhaust ports there appears to be about 10mm more valve guide tube showing and once again it's all been smoothed and ported (as well as hardened valve seats for unleaded/LPG).
The more I looked the more I couldn't work out why pot 4 was dud. It also hit home how well done this head compared to a standard head. Roland Marlow from ACR had supplied the bits but the head was made by a bloke called Mark Ibbotson I've been lead to believe. Who last time I heard was in Australia!?!
Decided a sure fire way to test it was to put the valves back in and fill all 8 ports with petrol. In theory a good valve seat would never let petrol out.
Low and behold all ports in cylinder 1,2 and 3 were totally petrol tight.
Inlet valve on cylinder 4 started slowly weeping but exhaust valve number 4 piddled it out about as fast I poured it in even though the seat and valve faces looked spot on!
Quick bit of lapping work (just a few mins) and the exhaust valve was absolutely petrol tight. Spot on!
Gave inlet valve the same treatment refitted it and dropped some petrol back in.....
b
ks!Back out the valve came and gave it a lot of lapping, and them some more for good measure.
Re assembled, in went the petrol and it seemed petrol tight.
Left it for an hour or so like the others and this was all that could be seen (Apologies for the poor photo):
Bit of moisture around the edge, as good as it's going to get and hopefully as the pressure forces are on the valve face not the back.
Going to give this fancy head another chance.
Will see what sort of figures it makes in a few days hopefully.
Incidently the copper traces that can be seen between pot 3 and 4 was the traces of the copper head gasket that been decimated and ignored by the bloke who owned it between Adrian and myself. Head's straight as a die but the copper remains in the machining marks.
Been very busy of late with work/ other motors but the important bit of news:
IT'S ALIVE!
Sounds much better as well.
Compression while cold back to 160psi and more than acceptable. But compression at running temp as per manual is still comically low....however I'm beginning to think I'll ignore that reading. For the simple reason that the reading on the same cylinder can vary as much as 70psi within 20 seconds of each other.
Methinks when warm the compression tester isn't sealing properly.
Going to retorque the head now it's been warm once reset all the tappets again and then start to set up all the fueling again.
Hopefully it'll be back on the road soon.
And now I think it's time to spout forth the very much aspirational plan.
We might be giving up historic rallying for the foreseeable:
I want to have a go at breaking a bit of a record. It might take many many years if not at all but if you don't try....
So on the 15th of June I'll be donning the full race suit and (providing the Scrutineers have a sense of adventure) will be racing up Barbon hillclimb against the Porche's/ Caterhams etc as fast as that tired old engine will carry me.
Obviously I'll be coming last but as long as I finish that's what matters.
When I first met Adrian and his racer (in fact many years before it became mine) I'd seen it switch to stage rallying and thought it would be quite amusing to do as varied amount of motorsport events as possible. As times gone on and rules have changed it dawned on me that now more than ever it's difficult to have one vehicle that could at least enter if not be competative at many many disiplines. There's roughly 30 different motorsport permits under the MSA banner.
To attempt to even get close to doing them all it's going to be a 4x4 for the offroad events such as trials and hillrallies/ comp safari's. A 2wd buggy could do some of the speed events offroad wise but then how many 2wd buggies would get a Stage Rally Logbook or be allowed on a production car autotest?
So really you need a production 4x4 of some sort. But then to sign onto the historic permits it needs to be pre 1981 really pre Dec 1974.
To make it easier to sign onto a modern road rally permit something with a normally aspirated 4 pot as well.
Couple that with the very small number of pre 1974 4x4's that have a Stage log book and given that V8's are now a no no for getting a stage logbook it rules out the early Range Rover and Series Landy's like many 4x4's of the day were homologated as commercial vehicles.
Once again it's difficult to logbook a commercial motor but the racer slipped through and having already done the stage rallying thing which is fortunate as that's one of the more expensive events ticked off!
The list in my mind would be this:
Offroad:
Multi Venue Hillrally - Done Various - GKN Scottish/Welsh/Tour of Lincs
Single Venue - Hillrally
Comp Safari - Done Various
Cross Country Trial (MSA don't differentiate RTV/CCV...fortunately!) - Done CROC events such as an RTV at Seatle.
Tyro Trial
Point to Point (rare as hens teeth...died out?)
Challenge/Punch event
Timed Trial (still going in the North East just)
Rallying:
Forest Stage Rally - Done Various - Malcolm Wilson/ Grizedale Stages/ Lion Stages
Tarmac Stage Rally
Single Venue / Multi use Forest Rally
Single Venue / Multi use Tarmac Rally
Road Rally
Historic Road Rally with Tests - Done - Devils/ Lakes Classic / Solway Historic
Targa Rally (new for 2013)
Navigational Rally
Scatter Rally
Economy Rally (ha ha!)
12 Car Rally
Sporting:
Hillclimb (Hence Barbon)
Sprint
AutoSolo
Autotest
Production Car Autotest
Gymkhana - Done - The War of the Roses
Autocross
Rallycross (errr could be challenging that)
Drag Race (Comedy)
Production Car Trial....if I'm allowed.
And finally a circuit race but not sure how I'll manage that one.
So a big list with a few expensive ones ticked off. Could take years to do some of the expensive events but there's plenty that can be done cheaply. Plan is to just to quietly tick them off.
So that's the future plan for the racer. To complete as many different types of motorsport as possible and possible make some sort of unofficial UK record.
IT'S ALIVE!
Sounds much better as well.
Compression while cold back to 160psi and more than acceptable. But compression at running temp as per manual is still comically low....however I'm beginning to think I'll ignore that reading. For the simple reason that the reading on the same cylinder can vary as much as 70psi within 20 seconds of each other.
Methinks when warm the compression tester isn't sealing properly.
Going to retorque the head now it's been warm once reset all the tappets again and then start to set up all the fueling again.
Hopefully it'll be back on the road soon.
And now I think it's time to spout forth the very much aspirational plan.
We might be giving up historic rallying for the foreseeable:
I want to have a go at breaking a bit of a record. It might take many many years if not at all but if you don't try....
So on the 15th of June I'll be donning the full race suit and (providing the Scrutineers have a sense of adventure) will be racing up Barbon hillclimb against the Porche's/ Caterhams etc as fast as that tired old engine will carry me.
Obviously I'll be coming last but as long as I finish that's what matters.
When I first met Adrian and his racer (in fact many years before it became mine) I'd seen it switch to stage rallying and thought it would be quite amusing to do as varied amount of motorsport events as possible. As times gone on and rules have changed it dawned on me that now more than ever it's difficult to have one vehicle that could at least enter if not be competative at many many disiplines. There's roughly 30 different motorsport permits under the MSA banner.
To attempt to even get close to doing them all it's going to be a 4x4 for the offroad events such as trials and hillrallies/ comp safari's. A 2wd buggy could do some of the speed events offroad wise but then how many 2wd buggies would get a Stage Rally Logbook or be allowed on a production car autotest?
So really you need a production 4x4 of some sort. But then to sign onto the historic permits it needs to be pre 1981 really pre Dec 1974.
To make it easier to sign onto a modern road rally permit something with a normally aspirated 4 pot as well.
Couple that with the very small number of pre 1974 4x4's that have a Stage log book and given that V8's are now a no no for getting a stage logbook it rules out the early Range Rover and Series Landy's like many 4x4's of the day were homologated as commercial vehicles.
Once again it's difficult to logbook a commercial motor but the racer slipped through and having already done the stage rallying thing which is fortunate as that's one of the more expensive events ticked off!
The list in my mind would be this:
Offroad:
Multi Venue Hillrally - Done Various - GKN Scottish/Welsh/Tour of Lincs
Single Venue - Hillrally
Comp Safari - Done Various
Cross Country Trial (MSA don't differentiate RTV/CCV...fortunately!) - Done CROC events such as an RTV at Seatle.
Tyro Trial
Point to Point (rare as hens teeth...died out?)
Challenge/Punch event
Timed Trial (still going in the North East just)
Rallying:
Forest Stage Rally - Done Various - Malcolm Wilson/ Grizedale Stages/ Lion Stages
Tarmac Stage Rally
Single Venue / Multi use Forest Rally
Single Venue / Multi use Tarmac Rally
Road Rally
Historic Road Rally with Tests - Done - Devils/ Lakes Classic / Solway Historic
Targa Rally (new for 2013)
Navigational Rally
Scatter Rally
Economy Rally (ha ha!)
12 Car Rally
Sporting:
Hillclimb (Hence Barbon)
Sprint
AutoSolo
Autotest
Production Car Autotest
Gymkhana - Done - The War of the Roses
Autocross
Rallycross (errr could be challenging that)
Drag Race (Comedy)
Production Car Trial....if I'm allowed.
And finally a circuit race but not sure how I'll manage that one.
So a big list with a few expensive ones ticked off. Could take years to do some of the expensive events but there's plenty that can be done cheaply. Plan is to just to quietly tick them off.
So that's the future plan for the racer. To complete as many different types of motorsport as possible and possible make some sort of unofficial UK record.
Edited by Landyphil on Thursday 14th February 20:59
Engine still sounds odd but will be giving it a go on The Devils Own Rally this Sunday
Here we go again!
Car No Driver Navigator Car Class Car Class
1 Paul Wignall Jayne Wignall Porsche 911 Expert Historic
2 Ross Butterworth TBC Ford Escort Expert Historic
3 David Marsden Mike Garstang Ford Cortina GT Expert Historic
4 Tot Dixon Maureen Dixon Morris Mini Expert Historic
5 Ian Curwen Gareth Williams Ford Escort Expert Historic
6 Tony Harrison Ayrton Harrison Proton Satria Expert Modern
7 Tom Wilcox Pete Johnson Toyota Starlet Expert Modern
8 Steve Entwistle Bob Hargreaves Austin Mini Cooper Expert Historic
9 David Agnew Graeme Mactavish Porsche 911 Expert Historic
10 Tony Tomlinson Andrew Makinson Talbot Sunbeam Lotus Expert Classic
11 Steve Mitchell Ian Mitchell Peugeot 205 Expert Modern
12 Peter Birtles Richard Goodacre Volvo Amazon Expert Historic
14 Paul Brereton Maurice Ellison Ford Escort Semi Historic
15 Graeme Cornthwaite Steve Aspin Morris Mini Semi Historic
16 David Alexander Stephen Perry Vauxhall Viva HB Semi Classic
17 Dave Whitaker TBC Nissan Sunny GTI Semi Modern
18 Mark Burton John Burton MG Midget Semi Historic
19 Chas Stansfield Martin Harwood Triumph TR3A Semi Historic
20 Stephen Byrne David Byrne Lancia Fulvia Semi Historic
21 Phil Griffiths James Clewer Landrover Semi Historic
22 Jon Hill Michael Pears Vauxhall Corsa Semi Modern
23 David Winter Sally Winter Ford Fiesta Semi Modern
24 Simon Farrar Dean Philips Ford Puma Semi Modern
25 Scott Wragg John Coulson Proton Satria GTI Semi Modern
26 George Eland Ian Eland Alfa Romeo GTV Semi Historic
27 Tom Vipond Chris Woods Peugeot 206 GTI Novice Modern
28 Brian Bradley Paul Makinson Mini Novice Classic
29 Geoff Fletcher Keith Fletcher Vauxhall Corsa Novice Modern
30 Robert Iveson Les Golding Peugeot 205 Novice Modern
31 John Howarth Joe Jazmik Jaguar XK150 Novice Historic
32 Steve Wright Jonathan Riseborough Ford Escort Novice Classic
33 Chris Wright TBC Mazda MX5 Novice Modern
34 Jon Stynes Kieron Stynes Rover Mini Novice Modern
35 Sean Bramhall Phill Gough Austin Healey 100-6mm Novice Historic
38 Nathan Darbyshire Jonathon Ashworth Mazda MX5 Novice Modern
36 Danny Cowell TBC Ford Escort Modern
37 Steve Palmer Jack Palmer Ford Fiesta Tourer Modern
Navigational Permit (one more ticked off the list above!) so a somewhat varied entry!
Here we go again!
Car No Driver Navigator Car Class Car Class
1 Paul Wignall Jayne Wignall Porsche 911 Expert Historic
2 Ross Butterworth TBC Ford Escort Expert Historic
3 David Marsden Mike Garstang Ford Cortina GT Expert Historic
4 Tot Dixon Maureen Dixon Morris Mini Expert Historic
5 Ian Curwen Gareth Williams Ford Escort Expert Historic
6 Tony Harrison Ayrton Harrison Proton Satria Expert Modern
7 Tom Wilcox Pete Johnson Toyota Starlet Expert Modern
8 Steve Entwistle Bob Hargreaves Austin Mini Cooper Expert Historic
9 David Agnew Graeme Mactavish Porsche 911 Expert Historic
10 Tony Tomlinson Andrew Makinson Talbot Sunbeam Lotus Expert Classic
11 Steve Mitchell Ian Mitchell Peugeot 205 Expert Modern
12 Peter Birtles Richard Goodacre Volvo Amazon Expert Historic
14 Paul Brereton Maurice Ellison Ford Escort Semi Historic
15 Graeme Cornthwaite Steve Aspin Morris Mini Semi Historic
16 David Alexander Stephen Perry Vauxhall Viva HB Semi Classic
17 Dave Whitaker TBC Nissan Sunny GTI Semi Modern
18 Mark Burton John Burton MG Midget Semi Historic
19 Chas Stansfield Martin Harwood Triumph TR3A Semi Historic
20 Stephen Byrne David Byrne Lancia Fulvia Semi Historic
21 Phil Griffiths James Clewer Landrover Semi Historic
22 Jon Hill Michael Pears Vauxhall Corsa Semi Modern
23 David Winter Sally Winter Ford Fiesta Semi Modern
24 Simon Farrar Dean Philips Ford Puma Semi Modern
25 Scott Wragg John Coulson Proton Satria GTI Semi Modern
26 George Eland Ian Eland Alfa Romeo GTV Semi Historic
27 Tom Vipond Chris Woods Peugeot 206 GTI Novice Modern
28 Brian Bradley Paul Makinson Mini Novice Classic
29 Geoff Fletcher Keith Fletcher Vauxhall Corsa Novice Modern
30 Robert Iveson Les Golding Peugeot 205 Novice Modern
31 John Howarth Joe Jazmik Jaguar XK150 Novice Historic
32 Steve Wright Jonathan Riseborough Ford Escort Novice Classic
33 Chris Wright TBC Mazda MX5 Novice Modern
34 Jon Stynes Kieron Stynes Rover Mini Novice Modern
35 Sean Bramhall Phill Gough Austin Healey 100-6mm Novice Historic
38 Nathan Darbyshire Jonathon Ashworth Mazda MX5 Novice Modern
36 Danny Cowell TBC Ford Escort Modern
37 Steve Palmer Jack Palmer Ford Fiesta Tourer Modern
Navigational Permit (one more ticked off the list above!) so a somewhat varied entry!
The Devils…..
The Devils Own Rally is one of those rallies that’s evolved in it’s many decades from early days as a Road Rally being won by Tony Mason up to the days of the Motoring News and Mexico Championship.
Now run as a Historic I’ve never got round to actually driving on it! Sat in the silly seat but not the one with the steering wheel!
With life in general being a bit busy I wasn’t planning to enter it to be honest but then it came out on a Navigational Permit and that’s one on the list of permits to be done….. so entry in!
Main difference would be that the shouting from the passenger seat wouldn’t be my dear wife but an old friend who used to do 12 cars with us. Never sat in the landy and not been on the maps in 10 years. Could be fun!
Week leading up to the rally I managed to get some new side mounts for the passenger seat that bolted to the existing rails. Seat was always “a bit Douglas Bader” in it’s mounting position.
Revalved head and reset fueling meant an average tootling round before the event at over 20mpg!!! Ironic as there were over 4 chances on route to fill up with LPG.
Sunday morning started cold…and white! With some excitement I set off for the Heaves Hotel near Kendal in the snow wondering if it would play a part in the day’s proceedings.
The line up at the Heaves was excellent with everything from Healey 100/6’s 2x911’s as well as the usual mini’s and escorts.
A mix up with the paperwork meant we were shuffled to later down the order. At least that means lots of tyre marks to follow!
First test was at a farm near Burton. Tight and muddy was the best way of describing it. Test was called out just right. Still needing a handbrake for those tight turns though! Second one was the only true tarmac test of the day! The finish was on a long 90 right and for some reason the marshal’s seemed to back away as the landy ducked and dived under braking towards the line.
After that it was regularity time. We lined up north of Kirkby Lonsdale on a quiet road and we let a few cars go in front (mistake!). I knew this section contained forestry but thinking it’s just a 30mph regularity job should be fine.
Made it to the first control pretty much spot only dropping 4 seconds. But shortly after that caught our minute man…and then another…and then another…and then another!!! God knows what had happened to the guy 4 minutes ahead of us but if I was minutes down I’d have had it absolutely lit.
Once we got into the forest the presence of a Land Rover grill in the rear view mirror seemed to work and we started getting past giving us time to start putting a bit of pace on but still arrived at the end stuck in traffic. About 39 seconds lost!
Second run through the woods was a very different affair. The little group were were in pulled over and let the landy line up first. Yellow knob down. Roll it forward and wait for the minute to come up. Lifted the clutch and buried the throttle. 30mph through the woods might seem easy but with controls to stop and get signatures for as well as the fact the snow had melted leaving the gravel very loose meant keeping it a quick as poss.
Poor old landy isn’t exactly quick up the hills but as soon as it flattens out or downhill then flat out! In 4wd turn in on gravel at speed can be very 50/50. With no centre diff it’s either understeer or oversteer, The former being the axis of evil which could end in the scenery the latter being the way.
I erred on the side of caution and either dropped a gear or gave a bit of a dab to get the weight forward and get it turned in with a touch of oversteer. Must have worked as we only dropped 17seconds. 10th quickest overall!
Slid up the final control all 4 wheels locked to be commended by the marshal, apparently some crews that were dropping time like us were just tootling up the final control. Weird.
The trip north meant sleet and snow began to fall but sadly not stick. Two tests runs twice up at Hardendale Quarry was great but oh so tight for the landy. And oh so cold parked up waiting!
Did it second time in rear wheel drive and had to slow things down into the tight stuff and get it booted round on the “power”. Still wasn’t enough at times but some of the gravel piles proved surprisingly handy for widening the route……
A long cold drive down the A6 back to Kendal meant another twice run test through a farm. Mix of tarmac and mud on concrete was short but sweet!
Back at the hotel over a nice Roast Beef dinner it turned out the first regularity had been annulled which was a great shame as it was have punted us up the results a bit.
Either way seeded 21st. Came 21st! Had the first regularity stood maybe 17th or something like that.
A cracking set of tests read superbly by the chap in the passenger seat and a great atmosphere despite the cold weather.
Next event should be much warmer if things go to plan.
And I’ll be needing this:
The Devils Own Rally is one of those rallies that’s evolved in it’s many decades from early days as a Road Rally being won by Tony Mason up to the days of the Motoring News and Mexico Championship.
Now run as a Historic I’ve never got round to actually driving on it! Sat in the silly seat but not the one with the steering wheel!
With life in general being a bit busy I wasn’t planning to enter it to be honest but then it came out on a Navigational Permit and that’s one on the list of permits to be done….. so entry in!
Main difference would be that the shouting from the passenger seat wouldn’t be my dear wife but an old friend who used to do 12 cars with us. Never sat in the landy and not been on the maps in 10 years. Could be fun!
Week leading up to the rally I managed to get some new side mounts for the passenger seat that bolted to the existing rails. Seat was always “a bit Douglas Bader” in it’s mounting position.
Revalved head and reset fueling meant an average tootling round before the event at over 20mpg!!! Ironic as there were over 4 chances on route to fill up with LPG.
Sunday morning started cold…and white! With some excitement I set off for the Heaves Hotel near Kendal in the snow wondering if it would play a part in the day’s proceedings.
The line up at the Heaves was excellent with everything from Healey 100/6’s 2x911’s as well as the usual mini’s and escorts.
A mix up with the paperwork meant we were shuffled to later down the order. At least that means lots of tyre marks to follow!
First test was at a farm near Burton. Tight and muddy was the best way of describing it. Test was called out just right. Still needing a handbrake for those tight turns though! Second one was the only true tarmac test of the day! The finish was on a long 90 right and for some reason the marshal’s seemed to back away as the landy ducked and dived under braking towards the line.
After that it was regularity time. We lined up north of Kirkby Lonsdale on a quiet road and we let a few cars go in front (mistake!). I knew this section contained forestry but thinking it’s just a 30mph regularity job should be fine.
Made it to the first control pretty much spot only dropping 4 seconds. But shortly after that caught our minute man…and then another…and then another…and then another!!! God knows what had happened to the guy 4 minutes ahead of us but if I was minutes down I’d have had it absolutely lit.
Once we got into the forest the presence of a Land Rover grill in the rear view mirror seemed to work and we started getting past giving us time to start putting a bit of pace on but still arrived at the end stuck in traffic. About 39 seconds lost!
Second run through the woods was a very different affair. The little group were were in pulled over and let the landy line up first. Yellow knob down. Roll it forward and wait for the minute to come up. Lifted the clutch and buried the throttle. 30mph through the woods might seem easy but with controls to stop and get signatures for as well as the fact the snow had melted leaving the gravel very loose meant keeping it a quick as poss.
Poor old landy isn’t exactly quick up the hills but as soon as it flattens out or downhill then flat out! In 4wd turn in on gravel at speed can be very 50/50. With no centre diff it’s either understeer or oversteer, The former being the axis of evil which could end in the scenery the latter being the way.
I erred on the side of caution and either dropped a gear or gave a bit of a dab to get the weight forward and get it turned in with a touch of oversteer. Must have worked as we only dropped 17seconds. 10th quickest overall!
Slid up the final control all 4 wheels locked to be commended by the marshal, apparently some crews that were dropping time like us were just tootling up the final control. Weird.
The trip north meant sleet and snow began to fall but sadly not stick. Two tests runs twice up at Hardendale Quarry was great but oh so tight for the landy. And oh so cold parked up waiting!
Did it second time in rear wheel drive and had to slow things down into the tight stuff and get it booted round on the “power”. Still wasn’t enough at times but some of the gravel piles proved surprisingly handy for widening the route……
A long cold drive down the A6 back to Kendal meant another twice run test through a farm. Mix of tarmac and mud on concrete was short but sweet!
Back at the hotel over a nice Roast Beef dinner it turned out the first regularity had been annulled which was a great shame as it was have punted us up the results a bit.
Either way seeded 21st. Came 21st! Had the first regularity stood maybe 17th or something like that.
A cracking set of tests read superbly by the chap in the passenger seat and a great atmosphere despite the cold weather.
Next event should be much warmer if things go to plan.
And I’ll be needing this:
Edited by Landyphil on Friday 22 March 21:07
A “paperwork exercise” update today!
My “bucket list” of motorsport events was gleaned really from me going through The Blue Book and making a list from there.
While this was all well and good there were a few questions regarding some permits. I knew that single venue rallies had a specific permit to normal stage rallies but there were a few unknowns so decided to ring up Colnbrook house and the MSA themselves.
While I will admit to anyone that I don’t agree with some of regs that have been implemented by the MSA (Hydraulic handbrakes….. WHY GOD!?! WHY!?!)
I’ve always found the guys and gals who actually run the show in terms of administration etc to be absolutely fantastic and extremely helpful both whether dealing with them as a competitor or organiser.
I did feel a little sorry for the chap on the phone who probably thought I was a nut case but he hid it well! A quick chat revealed that the best course of action would be to go off the insurance lists.
The MSA have an online price list for insurance (which I’ve always found to be cheap but maybe that’s just me) based on the different permits available.
This is where it could go wrong as there isn’t just a permit for each type of event but each “level” of event be it Clubman, National B, National A etc. so there are 100’s of permutations!
I’d already decided that this was about completing an event in as many different “disciplines” as possible in the same vehicle with minimal or no changes to the current spec, not what I do as the driver. So whether it’s a Clubman event or National A it will count as the same.
So going off the MSA list this is as it stands with an example of an event (although there may be many!) for each one where complete.
Autotest Production Car
Autotest
Autocross
Rallycross
Hillrally - Chandlers Tour of Lincs 2002
Orienteering
Point to Point
Comp Safari - ARC Nationals 2000
Team Recovery
Timed Trial
Cross Country Vehicle Trial - CROC Seatle 1997
Tyro Trial
Gymkhana - War of the Roses 2005
Circuit Race
Training Race Event?
12 Car Rally
Navigational Scatter
Targa Rally
Road Rally
Road Rally Navigational - Devils Own Rally 2013-04-03
Road Rally Historic - Solway Historic 2011
Road Timed to less than 1 minute
Special Stage Rally - Malcolm Wilson Rally 2005
Multi Use Special Stage Rally
Rally Time Trial
Speed (Hillclimb or Sprint)
Drag Race
I can’t find Targa Rallies listed but have added it anyway!
This could take some time…….
My “bucket list” of motorsport events was gleaned really from me going through The Blue Book and making a list from there.
While this was all well and good there were a few questions regarding some permits. I knew that single venue rallies had a specific permit to normal stage rallies but there were a few unknowns so decided to ring up Colnbrook house and the MSA themselves.
While I will admit to anyone that I don’t agree with some of regs that have been implemented by the MSA (Hydraulic handbrakes….. WHY GOD!?! WHY!?!)
I’ve always found the guys and gals who actually run the show in terms of administration etc to be absolutely fantastic and extremely helpful both whether dealing with them as a competitor or organiser.
I did feel a little sorry for the chap on the phone who probably thought I was a nut case but he hid it well! A quick chat revealed that the best course of action would be to go off the insurance lists.
The MSA have an online price list for insurance (which I’ve always found to be cheap but maybe that’s just me) based on the different permits available.
This is where it could go wrong as there isn’t just a permit for each type of event but each “level” of event be it Clubman, National B, National A etc. so there are 100’s of permutations!
I’d already decided that this was about completing an event in as many different “disciplines” as possible in the same vehicle with minimal or no changes to the current spec, not what I do as the driver. So whether it’s a Clubman event or National A it will count as the same.
So going off the MSA list this is as it stands with an example of an event (although there may be many!) for each one where complete.
Autotest Production Car
Autotest
Autocross
Rallycross
Hillrally - Chandlers Tour of Lincs 2002
Orienteering
Point to Point
Comp Safari - ARC Nationals 2000
Team Recovery
Timed Trial
Cross Country Vehicle Trial - CROC Seatle 1997
Tyro Trial
Gymkhana - War of the Roses 2005
Circuit Race
Training Race Event?
12 Car Rally
Navigational Scatter
Targa Rally
Road Rally
Road Rally Navigational - Devils Own Rally 2013-04-03
Road Rally Historic - Solway Historic 2011
Road Timed to less than 1 minute
Special Stage Rally - Malcolm Wilson Rally 2005
Multi Use Special Stage Rally
Rally Time Trial
Speed (Hillclimb or Sprint)
Drag Race
I can’t find Targa Rallies listed but have added it anyway!
This could take some time…….
In terms of motorsport this will be the last update for a while I guess. For reasons that will become obvious we decided that the plan to do Barbon Hillclimb on the 14th of June wasn’t really viable.
BUT two more events have been ticked of what some folk have called my motorsport “bucket list”:
Tyro trials are a fairly new permit designed “… for shiny vehicle and newbies to the sport. It involves negotiating through 12 sets of gates without hitting any or stopping forward motion. The terain the course is set out on is non dangerous and non damaging.”
These are the words of the a local 4x4 club that run Tyro’s. So the other weekend I let a little air out of my icle BFG AT’s and tootled down the road to be met with this sort of entrant…
Only 3 of the 20 or so drivers were running AT’s the rest being on Special Tracks or similar….and for good reason. It was like trialing 10 years ago. Not mental but quite some terrain for a Tyro!
Despite having to go everywhere with 4 totally clogged tyres the old girl didn’t do so bad. With so little grip and an engine that’s not really suited to trials meants lots of Clarkson style “Powerrrr” wheelspin. Embarrassing but it worked quite well. Clipped a 7 gate with my wing mirror as it’s bounced on one section putting me well away from the sharp end but as this was only meant to be a “finish” event to tick off another permit it didn’t matter so much.
Trouble is by the end I was well into the swing of things and ended up on a section through trees, downhill and about 18” of pure slape mud. The choice at the bottom was simple. Go over a rock that was about metre across pulled out by the previous competitor or try to for the fallen tree stump on the left hand side…….well the passenger door was tired anyway!
Nice gouge right down the door end to end. Combined with an increasing flappy door top I’ve ordered a new door!
Anyway event done..and Tyro my arse! No results to be found as yet but doesn’t matter.
Fast forward a couple of days and it’s event number 2.
Unsurprisingly the landy has never done an Autotest certainly I have to evidence of it. So with a local grass autotest just up the road run by Wigton MC it was too good an opportunity to miss.
I even took the drivers door top off to allow a bit of elbow room!
A little rain during the day and sunshine in the evening made the long grassed field robust enough not to really cut up….but as for grip. There wasn’t any. None. There was more grip on those trial sections.
Running in rwd to compete with the rwd entries meant lots and LOTS of revs and very little movement. Rarely in a straight line as well.
I strapped a camera to the front which vibrated a bit too much but here’s a little clip to show what it was like. Despite almost no apparent motion still managed 10th o/a out of 22 and fastest rwd!
ZERO TRACTION!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhemwPoSCio
It was an absolute hoot and with the cones not being set stupidly close apart meant you didn’t HAVE to have a handbrake unlike a few rally tests to say the least.
This was meant to be another event just to “tick off” so say it’s done but to be honest if they’re set up like that one was I’d like to think I’ll be doing some grass autotesting again!
So the list now looks like this:
[i]Autotest Production Car
Autotest – Black Beck Grass 2013 WigtonMC
Autocross
Rallycross
Hillrally - Chandlers Tour of Lincs 2002
Orienteering
Point to Point
Comp Safari - ARC Nationals 2000
Team Recovery
Timed Trial
Cross Country Vehicle Trial - CROC Seatle 1997
Tyro Trial – Park Gate Santon Bridge 2013 NL4x4
Gymkhana - War of the Roses 2005
Circuit Race
Training Race Event?
12 Car Rally
Navigational Scatter
Targa Rally
Road Rally
Road Rally Navigational - Devils Own Rally 2013-04-03
Road Rally Historic - Solway Historic 2011
Road Timed to less than 1 minute
Special Stage Rally - Malcolm Wilson Rally 2005
Multi Use Special Stage Rally
Rally Time Trial
Speed (Hillclimb or Sprint)
Drag Race[/i]
Other than a bit of titivation I’ll be taking a break from motorsport and the racer to try something new and much more noisy and expensive, with long hours, sleepless nights etc.
The racer will return. In the meantime the bottom end of the engine is clearly need of a rebore so I’m on the lookout for a 5 bearing petrol bottom end as I’d like to build up a new “race spec” bottom end prior to swapping them so condition isn’t too important.
BUT two more events have been ticked of what some folk have called my motorsport “bucket list”:
Tyro trials are a fairly new permit designed “… for shiny vehicle and newbies to the sport. It involves negotiating through 12 sets of gates without hitting any or stopping forward motion. The terain the course is set out on is non dangerous and non damaging.”
These are the words of the a local 4x4 club that run Tyro’s. So the other weekend I let a little air out of my icle BFG AT’s and tootled down the road to be met with this sort of entrant…
Only 3 of the 20 or so drivers were running AT’s the rest being on Special Tracks or similar….and for good reason. It was like trialing 10 years ago. Not mental but quite some terrain for a Tyro!
Despite having to go everywhere with 4 totally clogged tyres the old girl didn’t do so bad. With so little grip and an engine that’s not really suited to trials meants lots of Clarkson style “Powerrrr” wheelspin. Embarrassing but it worked quite well. Clipped a 7 gate with my wing mirror as it’s bounced on one section putting me well away from the sharp end but as this was only meant to be a “finish” event to tick off another permit it didn’t matter so much.
Trouble is by the end I was well into the swing of things and ended up on a section through trees, downhill and about 18” of pure slape mud. The choice at the bottom was simple. Go over a rock that was about metre across pulled out by the previous competitor or try to for the fallen tree stump on the left hand side…….well the passenger door was tired anyway!
Nice gouge right down the door end to end. Combined with an increasing flappy door top I’ve ordered a new door!
Anyway event done..and Tyro my arse! No results to be found as yet but doesn’t matter.
Fast forward a couple of days and it’s event number 2.
Unsurprisingly the landy has never done an Autotest certainly I have to evidence of it. So with a local grass autotest just up the road run by Wigton MC it was too good an opportunity to miss.
I even took the drivers door top off to allow a bit of elbow room!
A little rain during the day and sunshine in the evening made the long grassed field robust enough not to really cut up….but as for grip. There wasn’t any. None. There was more grip on those trial sections.
Running in rwd to compete with the rwd entries meant lots and LOTS of revs and very little movement. Rarely in a straight line as well.
I strapped a camera to the front which vibrated a bit too much but here’s a little clip to show what it was like. Despite almost no apparent motion still managed 10th o/a out of 22 and fastest rwd!
ZERO TRACTION!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhemwPoSCio
It was an absolute hoot and with the cones not being set stupidly close apart meant you didn’t HAVE to have a handbrake unlike a few rally tests to say the least.
This was meant to be another event just to “tick off” so say it’s done but to be honest if they’re set up like that one was I’d like to think I’ll be doing some grass autotesting again!
So the list now looks like this:
[i]Autotest Production Car
Autotest – Black Beck Grass 2013 WigtonMC
Autocross
Rallycross
Hillrally - Chandlers Tour of Lincs 2002
Orienteering
Point to Point
Comp Safari - ARC Nationals 2000
Team Recovery
Timed Trial
Cross Country Vehicle Trial - CROC Seatle 1997
Tyro Trial – Park Gate Santon Bridge 2013 NL4x4
Gymkhana - War of the Roses 2005
Circuit Race
Training Race Event?
12 Car Rally
Navigational Scatter
Targa Rally
Road Rally
Road Rally Navigational - Devils Own Rally 2013-04-03
Road Rally Historic - Solway Historic 2011
Road Timed to less than 1 minute
Special Stage Rally - Malcolm Wilson Rally 2005
Multi Use Special Stage Rally
Rally Time Trial
Speed (Hillclimb or Sprint)
Drag Race[/i]
Other than a bit of titivation I’ll be taking a break from motorsport and the racer to try something new and much more noisy and expensive, with long hours, sleepless nights etc.
The racer will return. In the meantime the bottom end of the engine is clearly need of a rebore so I’m on the lookout for a 5 bearing petrol bottom end as I’d like to build up a new “race spec” bottom end prior to swapping them so condition isn’t too important.
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