Discussion
jdh1 said:
All this suff about Gallardo depreciation...is there any reason why they should depreciate any faster than another similarly priced car? Or is it simply the case that the car has tempted a lot of people out of their price comfort zone, and they're now finding out what other £120k+ car buyers knew all along?
Possibly because it was overpriced in the first place, dumb as we are, some of the purchasers of these cars do have an idea of "value" too. The 430 is not doing so well either, but then the state of the supercar market is not too healthy anyway.
To my mind though, it's due to these reasons:
Limited resale market - Ferrari have a reasonable number of dealers to bid for your car come resale, Lambo do not. Not a dig at Lambo London who are a great bunch of guys, but think about it, how many Lambos can they feasibly buy and stock for resale?
Warranty - the Gallardo has a 3 year warranty on UK cars, and 2 years on imports. Then, after that you are on your own. This is possibly most concerning to me, and if its not remedied before the 04 cars come out of warranty, watch it take a nose dive in prices even more, mainly due to...
Reliability - perception on these cars is that they are not as reliable as first touted, problems with clutch and other things have scared people off. The cost of a clutch is near £5k, thats a fair bit of dough especially if you end up buying one that's problematic with no help from Lambo UK. Lambo London will give great service on cars they have sold, but not so great on cars others have sold, where do you think most people will want to buy their Lambo from? What happens to cars left on other dealers forecourts, and why they will bid lower prices.
Lamborghini need to offer extended warranties on these cars to make them a better proposition and more dealers. This won't actually be detrimental to Lambo UK as they could then supply the majority of the UK cars new, but at least there is a better secondary market, and more buyers coming from other marques to a more trusted Lambo brand than it is now. I prefer a Gallardo, but keep looking to the 430 now. I think its uglier than the 360, but what other choice is there in the market? Heart says Gallardo, head says take the safer bet, the 430.
dealmaker said:
Don't forget there were a number of "speculators" and people (a la Chris Harris) who thought they could run a Gallardo "on the cheap" because of the high demand - trouble is too many of these sorts bought the car upseting the supply/demand curve.
Prices will no doubt stabilise over time - they probably are now - but anyone who thinks they can buy a NEW six figure supercar and NOT lose big money on it is kidding themselves frankly.
What about a 997 Turbo? Supercar but 100k or do you some of you not class this as a "supercar" ?
ninja_eli said:
All this suff about Gallardo depreciation...is there any reason why they should depreciate any faster than another similarly priced car? Or is it simply the case that the car has tempted a lot of people out of their price comfort zone, and they're now finding out what other £120k+ car buyers knew all along?
Possibly because it was overpriced in the first place, dumb as we are, some of the purchasers of these cars do have an idea of "value" too. The 430 is not doing so well either, but then the state of the supercar market is not too healthy anyway.
To my mind though, it's due to these reasons:
Limited resale market - Ferrari have a reasonable number of dealers to bid for your car come resale, Lambo do not. Not a dig at Lambo London who are a great bunch of guys, but think about it, how many Lambos can they feasibly buy and stock for resale?
Warranty - the Gallardo has a 3 year warranty on UK cars, and 2 years on imports. Then, after that you are on your own. This is possibly most concerning to me, and if its not remedied before the 04 cars come out of warranty, watch it take a nose dive in prices even more, mainly due to...
Reliability - perception on these cars is that they are not as reliable as first touted, problems with clutch and other things have scared people off. The cost of a clutch is near £5k, thats a fair bit of dough especially if you end up buying one that's problematic with no help from Lambo UK. Lambo London will give great service on cars they have sold, but not so great on cars others have sold, where do you think most people will want to buy their Lambo from? What happens to cars left on other dealers forecourts, and why they will bid lower prices.
Lamborghini need to offer extended warranties on these cars to make them a better proposition and more dealers. This won't actually be detrimental to Lambo UK as they could then supply the majority of the UK cars new, but at least there is a better secondary market, and more buyers coming from other marques to a more trusted Lambo brand than it is now. I prefer a Gallardo, but keep looking to the 430 now. I think its uglier than the 360, but what other choice is there in the market? Heart says Gallardo, head says take the safer bet, the 430.
well this is an excellent post.
The reliability was an issue on my car for sure- not just clutches but a myriad of other things and the cost of parts make Ferrari prices look somewhat underpriced- It was therefore a worry as to what would happen once out of warranty.
The point you raise about the secondary market is just spot on. With ferrari I had four trade bids and one private buyer, with the Lambo who will buy it?? lambo london or manchester - no. that leaves you with the secondary market or the hope that a private punter will acquire it and this is where the fundamental problem is.
With the costs involved and 04 cars with little warranty left will a private individual pay £95K from lambo UK safe in the knowledge they will help if it goes wrong- as indeed it will or 'save' £12K and buy one privately I rather suspect the former; in my case i had 12K of warranty work.
Obviously depreciation comes into the equation but its more a case of where the car can be placed and its this issue that really needs to be addressed.
We are all enthusiasts here and the only reason i bothered to post at all- lest i be accused of being a stuck record! is to make it clear to any purchaser that the situation with Lamborghini is quite unique and if you wish to acquire one make sure that you hit the main dealer on pricing as much as you can because its the differential in price previously refered to IN ADDITION to depreciation that one will suffer.
In two years since the launch Lambo should have got their act together and resolved these issues already.
bertie said:
Thanks, a quastion for any Gallardo owners with the sat nav.
Is the MP3 sd card slot standard or optional?
Ditto the bluetooth phone and TV?
Also from searching around I think the front end lift system is standard on US cars but not UK, correct??
Cheers.
MP3 slots and TV module are standard on SAT NAV equiped cars.
Bluetooth wasn't available until recently. You can get it retro fitted for about £400 from some of the Audi independants.
Despite some of the doom mongers, I'm sure you'll enjoy the car, I have
5to1 said:
MP3 slots and TV module are standard on SAT NAV equiped cars.
Bluetooth wasn't available until recently. You can get it retro fitted for about £400 from some of the Audi independants.
Despite some of the doom mongers, I'm sure you'll enjoy the car, I have
No doubt, but I wouldn't call it doom mongering, I'm considering one myself and have been through the same thought processes and evaluations. I'd still like one, but don't expect to have it longer than 1 year, so want some kind of "damage limitation" in place for myself. Of course it's not like they will stay on your hands, there will be a price point they will always sell at, it just depends on how much you don't mind losing, I guess.
The market is very different to what it was even 3 years ago.
In 2003 when I bought my 360 the choice of 100k cars was limited, 360, 911TT or a last DB7 if you really must.
Now the market is awash with options, F430,997, Gallardo, Bentley, DB9, AM V8 and any number of Merc **AMG
Supply and demand dictates that they are all loosing more than they used to.
The Lambo situation should improve when Sytner open their Birmingham dealer in a month or 2.
Anyway, to get back on topic..........only 3 days to go!!!
>> Edited by bertie on Tuesday 21st March 16:09
In 2003 when I bought my 360 the choice of 100k cars was limited, 360, 911TT or a last DB7 if you really must.
Now the market is awash with options, F430,997, Gallardo, Bentley, DB9, AM V8 and any number of Merc **AMG
Supply and demand dictates that they are all loosing more than they used to.
The Lambo situation should improve when Sytner open their Birmingham dealer in a month or 2.
Anyway, to get back on topic..........only 3 days to go!!!
>> Edited by bertie on Tuesday 21st March 16:09
A few varied points:
1) You can use 1 GB cards in the satnav unit with no problems
2) I bought my car from an independant - Lambo Manchester have been great, replacing the clutch, doing a few upgrades, leading me a car while mine was in for service etc - I just couldn't expect a better service.
3) I totally agree - Lambo really need more dealers in UK to underpin the market - hopefully this will change with time
4)Lambo UK are working on extended warr. and hope to have an offering later this year.
1) You can use 1 GB cards in the satnav unit with no problems
2) I bought my car from an independant - Lambo Manchester have been great, replacing the clutch, doing a few upgrades, leading me a car while mine was in for service etc - I just couldn't expect a better service.
3) I totally agree - Lambo really need more dealers in UK to underpin the market - hopefully this will change with time
4)Lambo UK are working on extended warr. and hope to have an offering later this year.
This whole post is like a stuck record with people whining about depreciation etc etc. The thing is why try and even attempt to justify buying a Murcielago/Gallardo/430 etc?? The fact is doing something like buying a top end supercar can never ever be justified because its one of the craziest financially foolhardy things you will ever do..I don't want to bleat on about this, but thats why I'll keep on doing massive miles in my Murcie (27K at the moment). I am far from made from money, but my heart rules my head and the day I start to justify finacially buying a Lamborghini I'll sell it and buy a flamin Porsche
amcphillips said:
If you don't like the depriciation then don't buy it. You could always hire one instead when you want one.
Good point. Or buy a supercar with a mate. Me and Rick own the 360 and he has it one month, then I have it the next. Everythings 50/50. Works fine. Then both of you share the depreciation.I'm surprised some of the guys on here have'nt done that with a Gallardo etc..
simonspider said:
If you don't like the depriciation then don't buy it. You could always hire one instead when you want one.
Good point. Or buy a supercar with a mate. Me and Rick own the 360 and he has it one month, then I have it the next. Everythings 50/50. Works fine. Then both of you share the depreciation.I'm surprised some of the guys on here have'nt done that with a Gallardo etc..
Who has their name on the V5 then? Obviously the registered keeper is not necesarrily the owner, just curious who did it!
Anybody crossing the floor of The (automotive) Vatican to sample the delights of such motoring papacy deserve great applause.
Because let's face it, few do not wish, at some point, to sample the dream and for this fellow, here it is.
Well done, Bertie, a triumph of quality decision making.
Because let's face it, few do not wish, at some point, to sample the dream and for this fellow, here it is.
Well done, Bertie, a triumph of quality decision making.
bertie said:
Well done, Bertie, a triumph of quality decision making.
I thank you, you're here for a good time not a long time I say!
Amen!
Enjoy the car Bertie, hopefully I'll have one by the end of the month too. Hope it doesn't come across as disagreeing with your decision (no way, I want one too! Gallardo or 430, depends on extendable warranty) but this is discussion and if we don't expect better from manufacturers we won't get.
If anyone is in a position not to give a shit at all about depreciation, repairs or running costs, then this discussion is, to them, moot. If a person doesn't have the financial means to not really give a shit, and I mean *really* not care, not just talk it, then it will always be a concern. You are not just buying the car, you are buying the reputation, the brand, and due to your trust in the marque. You don't want a car that is 4 months of a year in the workshop.
We are not talking about losing 10 or 20k (I think we're all man enough to handle that), we are talking about being able to enjoy the car, that includes resale, warranty and reliability. Enough of that though.
Congratulations on the car Bertie, are you getting the tubi? It sounds awesome with it. More of an F1 type sound than the 360. More immediate concern though; are you taking sleeping pills to help with the insomnia?
ninja_eli said:
Well done, Bertie, a triumph of quality decision making.
I thank you, you're here for a good time not a long time I say!
Amen!
......., are you getting the tubi? It sounds awesome with it. More of an F1 type sound than the 360. More immediate concern though; are you taking sleeping pills to help with the insomnia?
Cheers,
I quite fancy the Tubi,the only concernt is that it was made quite clear that they don't view it well with regards the warranty, it was also suggested that the larger bore and freer flowing nature of it can upset the engine management and cause an error.
To someone who designs and manufacturers engine management units that sound unlikely, but the warranty view is a concern.
The sleep could be an issue if it weren't for 2 things, firstly if I go on about it any more the wife IS going to kill me!
Second the 7 week old "organic alarm clock" otherwise known as our new daughter means sleeping at any available time is a distict possibility!
Roll on Friday.
bertie - do you live in the north of England?
Have you seen this meetup in August ?
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=253483&f=65&h=0
A guy with a yellow Gallardo like your new toy is says he is coming along to it.... bring yours along and it will look like twins. ;-)
Have you seen this meetup in August ?
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=253483&f=65&h=0
A guy with a yellow Gallardo like your new toy is says he is coming along to it.... bring yours along and it will look like twins. ;-)
bertie said:
Cheers,
I quite fancy the Tubi,the only concernt is that it was made quite clear that they don't view it well with regards the warranty, it was also suggested that the larger bore and freer flowing nature of it can upset the engine management and cause an error.
To someone who designs and manufacturers engine management units that sound unlikely, but the warranty view is a concern.
The sleep could be an issue if it weren't for 2 things, firstly if I go on about it any more the wife IS going to kill me!
Second the 7 week old "organic alarm clock" otherwise known as our new daughter means sleeping at any available time is a distict possibility!
Roll on Friday.
he he he congratulations on your daughter! I guess you now have two babies to spend lots of money on!!
WRT the warranty, Lambo Manchester are being economic with the truth frankly. Lambo London fit them for customers, have no problems on engine management and are happy with warranty as long as it is fitted by them.
Have a word with Manu @ Scuderia systems. He has sold so many Gallardo exhausts rumour has it he is moving into Buckingham Palace next week
Seriously, there are a few versions of the exhaust and it really does transform the car. Enjoy! (the car and the early morning wake up call, I'm told by mum it's one of the pleasures of life (the being woken up part!), I'm not convinced and I'm hoping my g/f isn't either, just yet!).
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