employee not coming back form holiday.
Discussion
But if you have in writing the agreement that they would only be allowed to take the 3 weeks rather than the 4, then by magic once they are in Australia they state they are staying for 4 with no other reason to warrant this extra week. Would you not then have a case of gross miss conduct ?
Indeed, instant dismisal is rare - it would have to be theft or the like.
Sacking someone outright is bloody hard. At my previous client they had a guy who went on a work evening out, missed his last train home and failed to turn up for 3 weeks after that. Written warning, nothing more. Has done it a few times since, and they still can't get rid.
Sacking someone outright is bloody hard. At my previous client they had a guy who went on a work evening out, missed his last train home and failed to turn up for 3 weeks after that. Written warning, nothing more. Has done it a few times since, and they still can't get rid.
superlightr said:
got the t-shirt.
Staying on holiday without permission, is we were advised, serious bt not so serious as to give instand dismissal for.
a written warning, then if they do it again something else.
We only got to the written warning stage, the e/ee left soon after.
Gross Misconduct - what about "deliberate falsification of records/information"? Staying on holiday without permission, is we were advised, serious bt not so serious as to give instand dismissal for.
a written warning, then if they do it again something else.
We only got to the written warning stage, the e/ee left soon after.
I'll get some professional to view it and get some advice.
See if you can get any info on the travel information and if he had already planned to stay out in Aus regardless and was just paying you lip service.
If that does not work log onto his computer and start downloading porn and then sack him for that instead.
For reference I do not recommend the above it was just a suggestion.
If that does not work log onto his computer and start downloading porn and then sack him for that instead.
For reference I do not recommend the above it was just a suggestion.
Edited by The Walrus on Monday 30th July 14:05
Promote him on his return.
Seriously.
Promote into a position he can't do, then have weekly reviews of his performance and then sack him for gross stupidity.
Personally I think when he asked for 4 weeks you should have suggested 8, without pay. Where's the harm in being kind and reasonable ?
Seriously.
Promote into a position he can't do, then have weekly reviews of his performance and then sack him for gross stupidity.
Personally I think when he asked for 4 weeks you should have suggested 8, without pay. Where's the harm in being kind and reasonable ?
The employee was up-front and asked for 4 weeks holiday as wanted to go to OZ for presumably a once-in-a-lifetime trip. You refused his request, but thought had compromised with allowing him 3 weeks leave.
Employee (understandably) thinks that what they've asked for is reasonable, and you have been unreasonable to refuse it...so employee does what he'd intended to all along - but sends you an e.mail letting you know that he's taking an extra week. Quite often monthly air fare trips are a lot cheaper than 2 or 3 week ones, I personally think you were unreasonable in refusing him.
If you'd allowed him the extra week in the first place for his 'special trip' none of this would have happenned. Interesting thought - had he worked it so he was spanning 2 holiday year entitlements? or was it just he'd accrued the leave entitlement during that holiday year?
Employee (understandably) thinks that what they've asked for is reasonable, and you have been unreasonable to refuse it...so employee does what he'd intended to all along - but sends you an e.mail letting you know that he's taking an extra week. Quite often monthly air fare trips are a lot cheaper than 2 or 3 week ones, I personally think you were unreasonable in refusing him.
If you'd allowed him the extra week in the first place for his 'special trip' none of this would have happenned. Interesting thought - had he worked it so he was spanning 2 holiday year entitlements? or was it just he'd accrued the leave entitlement during that holiday year?
condor said:
If you'd allowed him the extra week in the first place for his 'special trip' none of this would have happenned. Interesting thought - had he worked it so he was spanning 2 holiday year entitlements? or was it just he'd accrued the leave entitlement during that holiday year?
Years ago when I worked for Lucas, a number of Brake Engineers went off on a 10 week treck across africa with friens from Land Rover, BL, Jaguar and Peugeot in cars they'd built and or prepared themselves. They saved up all bank holidays and 5 weeks holiday entitlement in one year and 4 weeks in the next year and spread it across 2 years entitlement.
They gave enough notice and whilst I'm sure there were local resource issues in thew 10 weeks it was accepted and allowed with little question.
If he was so valuable and essential to your business you couldn't let him take four weeks off how will you cope when you sack him and have no one while you recruit someone else.
You should have given him the four weeks in the first place. Give him a bollocking/warning by all means, but accept that it was your fault and move on.
You should have given him the four weeks in the first place. Give him a bollocking/warning by all means, but accept that it was your fault and move on.
Nah ignore that tripe abuot it being your fault. If he agreed to 3 weeks he agreed to it.
Many companies have policies of 14 days max holiday (incl weekends)
Don't know if you will get away with sacking him, but prepare a nice written warning and make him work like a dog when he gets back.
What business are you in? whats his job?
Edited to add: Also, pay his salary a week late every month, they dont like it up 'em Mr Mainwairing!
Many companies have policies of 14 days max holiday (incl weekends)
Don't know if you will get away with sacking him, but prepare a nice written warning and make him work like a dog when he gets back.
What business are you in? whats his job?
Edited to add: Also, pay his salary a week late every month, they dont like it up 'em Mr Mainwairing!
Edited by Conian on Monday 30th July 15:11
He wanted a month. Gave me 4 months notice of this.
I stated that I couldn't allow him a month - it's not like there area 4 others to take up his workload.
I have meplyed other people in the interim but it takes time to train etc.
I know "it is only a week" but what if it were 2 weeks, what if another menber of staff fanices going to Canada for 6 weeks?
As a business you have to take some difficult decisions.
Following this discussion, WE AGREED that he could extend his "normal" holiday by 1 week. It isn't "once in a lifetime" going to Oz FFS! the amount I pay him he could go regularly. He hasn't been putting the pennies in jar for five years.
He accepted this. Then basically kicks me in the nuts from several thousand miles away.
As an employer it is very disappoining when things like this happen. You follow the rules, sit the employee down try and see his point of view whilst being fair to the business and other employees, come to what you believe is accepted resolution to a difficult subject - and it means nothing.
I stated that I couldn't allow him a month - it's not like there area 4 others to take up his workload.
I have meplyed other people in the interim but it takes time to train etc.
I know "it is only a week" but what if it were 2 weeks, what if another menber of staff fanices going to Canada for 6 weeks?
As a business you have to take some difficult decisions.
Following this discussion, WE AGREED that he could extend his "normal" holiday by 1 week. It isn't "once in a lifetime" going to Oz FFS! the amount I pay him he could go regularly. He hasn't been putting the pennies in jar for five years.
He accepted this. Then basically kicks me in the nuts from several thousand miles away.
As an employer it is very disappoining when things like this happen. You follow the rules, sit the employee down try and see his point of view whilst being fair to the business and other employees, come to what you believe is accepted resolution to a difficult subject - and it means nothing.
it have him shot and be done with it.
This is essentially no different from an employee going awol; just not showing in for work. Permission HAS NOT been granted for the final week. The employee has breached the contract. I regularly see situations where people don't turn up for work, and are sacked with immediate effect. In this case, I'd be tempted to give a Final Written Warning, so any further misdemeanour will result in dismissal.
n.b. This is my personal opinion, not formal advice, and I don't want my legal ass sued off thank you very much! Unless you pay me, in which I will advise formally in writing.
n.b. This is my personal opinion, not formal advice, and I don't want my legal ass sued off thank you very much! Unless you pay me, in which I will advise formally in writing.
Edited by RichBurley on Monday 30th July 16:18
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