87 year old who shot wife.
Discussion
Consultant psychiatrist James Warner said paraphrenia was an older person's version of schizophrenia in which people lose contact with reality.
Therefore diminished responsibility.
He's going to a mental health institution, not a prison.
He's had a result
Three meals a day, full board, no visiting restrictions.
Lottery win.
He sorted till he's 93
Edited by stuttgartmetal on Wednesday 24th August 22:24
stuttgartmetal said:
He's going to a mental health institution, not a prison.
He's has a result
Three meals a day, full board, no visiting restrictions.
Lottery win.
He sorted till he's 92.
I doubt he will see it as a win! Much better to be there than prison but at what a price for him to pay. Every day knowing what he did and having had to go through the legal process to get where he is.He's has a result
Three meals a day, full board, no visiting restrictions.
Lottery win.
He sorted till he's 92.
A sad case, sad outcome and one that will be repeated
1\2 the problem with the NHS is they won't let people die,my dad had all his faculties right up to the day he died but the last 3 months were awful , constant pain,inability to move or go out.
then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
wack said:
1\2 the problem with the NHS is they won't let people die,my dad had all his faculties right up to the day he died but the last 3 months were awful , constant pain,inability to move or go out.
then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
With the greatest of respect for you and anyone else who has gone through similar (I have too), it really isn't as simple as isolated anecdotal "open and shut" cases make it seem.then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
There is a reason euthanasia isn't legal and it's not because the State wants to arbitrarily punish people. Every case where euthanasia is a consideration is going to be unique, and were it procedure then there is definitely the potential for abuse from malicious parties who have Power of Attorney, etc. How can you be absolutely sure without a shred of doubt that a decision someone makes about ending their life is unambiguously their own, when they are of sound mind to make it, etc. How do you legislate for these unique circumstances?
I like to think that doctors already make things "go more smoothly" where they can, but even doing that exposes them to considerable risk - professional and criminal.
Edited by Durzel on Wednesday 24th August 23:24
Durzel said:
ith the greatest of respect for you and anyone else who has gone through similar (I have too), it really isn't as simple as isolated anecdotal "open and shut" cases make it seem.
There is a reason euthanasia isn't legal and it's not because the State wants to arbitrarily punish people. Every case where euthanasia is a consideration is going to be unique, and were it procedure then there is definitely the potential for abuse from malicious parties who have Power of Attorney, etc. How can you be absolutely sure without a shred of doubt that a decision someone makes about ending their life is unambiguously their own, when they are of sound mind to make it, etc. How do you legislate for these unique circumstances?
I like to think that doctors already make things "go more smoothly" where they can, but even doing that exposes them to considerable risk - professional and criminal.
sums the clinical reality of it up , and it;s not been helped by the wwailing in the Fail etc over the LCP ... There is a reason euthanasia isn't legal and it's not because the State wants to arbitrarily punish people. Every case where euthanasia is a consideration is going to be unique, and were it procedure then there is definitely the potential for abuse from malicious parties who have Power of Attorney, etc. How can you be absolutely sure without a shred of doubt that a decision someone makes about ending their life is unambiguously their own, when they are of sound mind to make it, etc. How do you legislate for these unique circumstances?
I like to think that doctors already make things "go more smoothly" where they can, but even doing that exposes them to considerable risk - professional and criminal.
Edited by Durzel on Wednesday 24th August 23:24
wack said:
1\2 the problem with the NHS is they won't let people die,my dad had all his faculties right up to the day he died but the last 3 months were awful , constant pain,inability to move or go out.
then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
With respect and sorry to hear about your dad but why wasn't a TEP/DNACPR in place? This would have allowed him to slip away.then he has to go to hospital for tests, his circulation was that bad his foot had gangrene, he was in agony so was given the choice of having it off or waiting for the gangrene to kill him.
he chose to have it off , my opinion on the reason why is he thought the pain would go away but it didn't , he could still feel pain in his foot even though it wasn't there.
then he had a heart attack , so what did they do, took him to theatre and fitted a pacemaker.
he came round and asked what had happened ,when they told him they'd restarted his heart he said i wish you hadn't, they sent him home, he had 2 weeks of pain and then he died
the thing that annoys me about the NHS is they keep people alive who have no quality of life but won't pay for drugs that could give a terminally ill mum another 3 months with her kids
These forms are so misunderstood. Used correctly many older folk could be given dignity at the end of life instead of a lot of very invasive procedures. Hold their hand as they pass away instead of rib breaking cpr, brain damage and distress for most (and death anyway shortly afterwards).
Not about mental issues, but relevant in a broader sense.
From this article on the BBC: - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35667355
"The third moral outrage I imagine the future espying is our cruelty to the ill and aged in our fetish for surgical intervention. Modern scientific medicine is a mostly unmixed blessing, and anyone who longs for the metaphysical certainties of medieval times should be compelled to have medieval medicine for his family. But no blessing is entirely unmixed, and I suspect that our insistence on massive interventions for late-arriving ills - our appetite for heart valves and knee replacements, artificial hips and endlessly retuned pacemakers - will seem to our descendants as fetishistic and bewildering as the medieval appetite for bleeding and cupping and leeching looks to us now.
Yes, of course, we all know people whose lives have been blessedly extended and improved by artificial joints and by those wi-fi pacemakers. But our health system is designed to make doctors see the benefits of intervention far more clearly than their costs. Not long ago I was reading these words from a doctor about the seemingly benign practice of angioplasty procedures for heart patients: "It has not been shown to extend life expectancy by a day, let alone 10 years - and it's done a million times a year in this country." Every age puts up a fight with mortality - and every subsequent age looks back, and shudders at the weapons the past ones used."
From this article on the BBC: - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35667355
"The third moral outrage I imagine the future espying is our cruelty to the ill and aged in our fetish for surgical intervention. Modern scientific medicine is a mostly unmixed blessing, and anyone who longs for the metaphysical certainties of medieval times should be compelled to have medieval medicine for his family. But no blessing is entirely unmixed, and I suspect that our insistence on massive interventions for late-arriving ills - our appetite for heart valves and knee replacements, artificial hips and endlessly retuned pacemakers - will seem to our descendants as fetishistic and bewildering as the medieval appetite for bleeding and cupping and leeching looks to us now.
Yes, of course, we all know people whose lives have been blessedly extended and improved by artificial joints and by those wi-fi pacemakers. But our health system is designed to make doctors see the benefits of intervention far more clearly than their costs. Not long ago I was reading these words from a doctor about the seemingly benign practice of angioplasty procedures for heart patients: "It has not been shown to extend life expectancy by a day, let alone 10 years - and it's done a million times a year in this country." Every age puts up a fight with mortality - and every subsequent age looks back, and shudders at the weapons the past ones used."
JumboBeef said:
With respect and sorry to hear about your dad but why wasn't a TEP/DNACPR in place? This would have allowed him to slip away.
Thanks for making me aware of this, sadly. Then had a google - this NHS internal guidance is worth a read if this situation is likely to arise:https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
snobetter said:
Not long ago I was reading these words from a doctor about the seemingly benign practice of angioplasty procedures for heart patients: "It has not been shown to extend life expectancy by a day, let alone 10 years - and it's done a million times a year in this country."
I have seen many a life saved by angioplasty, ie: they would have died imminently if it had not been done. I have also seen people lives greatly improved by this procedure, ie: no more angina. No more chest pain. More enjoyment out of life.Something tells me someone has been misquoted somewhere.....
Ken Figenus said:
JumboBeef said:
With respect and sorry to hear about your dad but why wasn't a TEP/DNACPR in place? This would have allowed him to slip away.
Thanks for making me aware of this, sadly. Then had a google - this NHS internal guidance is worth a read if this situation is likely to arise:https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
I'll put this statement here (for everyone, not you Ken), please consider it for a moment: we are all going to die.
Everyone goes: yeah, of course we are, I know that. But try to talk to family about an aged family member with multiple morbidities they say no no no we want everything done, of course we want him/her to be resuscitated if their heart stops, why wouldn't we? He/she is all we've got.
Or some Doctors/other health care professionals avoid these conversations. I once met a 100 year old lady with many health problems and the nursing home said there wasn't a TEP in place as they were still waiting to have that discussion with the family. She'd been there 8 years.....
We are all going to die. All of us. We hope it will be when we are old but some people die when they are young. For old people at end of life, and for those with untreatable conditions (or when treatment options have been exhausted) we cannot change the fact of death, the only thing we can change in some cases is the manner of death.
An elderly person in a nursing home, with heart failure, COPD, diabetes etc is going to die. Their heart will stop. You can choose to let them go peacefully.
Or you can say no no no do everything save their life. It is not their time to die. Dragging them onto the floor, breaking their ribs, sticking tubes down their throat, sticking needles in them, drilling into their bones, filling them with drugs, it not going to save their life. It is going to make their death horrific, for them, their family and indeed the medical staff. The very small number of times the resus works, these patient are nearly always brain damaged and never wake up, only to die a couple of days later out of sight in some side room at hospital.
I'm a paramedic and having to attempt resus on patients such as these is truly horrible. If only family understood what 'do everything you can' actually meant.
Resuscitation works in people who are otherwise healthy (or at least mostly healthy). I have resused people from young to late middle age. The oldest successful resus I have done was a person in their mid 60's. Yet, the majority of resus is done on the elderly with multiple health issues, where there is so little hope of a meaningful outcome it is almost zero.
I feel everyone in nursing homes should have TEP forms and that we should all of us have open and frank conversation with doctors as we, or our loved ones, age.
Durzel said:
There is a reason euthanasia isn't legal and it's not because the State wants to arbitrarily punish people. Every case where euthanasia is a consideration is going to be unique, and were it procedure then there is definitely the potential for abuse from malicious parties who have Power of Attorney, etc. How can you be absolutely sure without a shred of doubt that a decision someone makes about ending their life is unambiguously their own, when they are of sound mind to make it, etc. How do you legislate for these unique circumstances?
I like to think that doctors already make things "go more smoothly" where they can, but even doing that exposes them to considerable risk - professional and criminal.
Objective processes based around individual circumstances are hardly insurmountable. Look at the application of law, the application of mental health powers etc. I like to think that doctors already make things "go more smoothly" where they can, but even doing that exposes them to considerable risk - professional and criminal.
Several states in the US have managed it (well Physician aid in dying IIRC), so I don't think it's beyond our capability to do so, too.
JumboBeef said:
The problem is different areas of the NHS work to different TEP/DNACPR criteria. It's a nightmare. I hope Ken your Dad did eventually pass away pain free....
I'll put this statement here (for everyone, not you Ken), please consider it for a moment: we are all going to die.
Everyone goes: yeah, of course we are, I know that. But try to talk to family about an aged family member with multiple morbidities they say no no no we want everything done, of course we want him/her to be resuscitated if their heart stops, why wouldn't we? He/she is all we've got.
Or some Doctors/other health care professionals avoid these conversations. I once met a 100 year old lady with many health problems and the nursing home said there wasn't a TEP in place as they were still waiting to have that discussion with the family. She'd been there 8 years.....
We are all going to die. All of us. We hope it will be when we are old but some people die when they are young. For old people at end of life, and for those with untreatable conditions (or when treatment options have been exhausted) we cannot change the fact of death, the only thing we can change in some cases is the manner of death.
An elderly person in a nursing home, with heart failure, COPD, diabetics etc is going to die. Their heart will stop. You can choose to let them go peacefully.
Or you can say no no no do everything save their life. It is not their time to die. Dragging them onto the floor, breaking their ribs, sticking tubes down their throat, sticking needles in them, drilling into their bones, filling them with drugs, it not going to save their life. It is going to make their death horrific, for them, their family and indeed the medical staff. The very small number of times the resus works, these patient are nearly always brain damaged and never wake up, only to die a couple of days later out of sight in some side room at hospital.
I'm a paramedic and having to attempt resus on patients such as these is truly horrible. If only family understood what 'do everything you can' actually meant.
Resuscitation works in people who are otherwise healthy (or at least mostly healthy). I have resused people from young to late middle age. The oldest successful resus I have done was a person in their mid 60's. Yet, the majority of resus is done on the elderly with multiple health issues, where there is so little hope of a meaningful outcome it is almost zero.
I feel everyone in nursing homes should have TEP forms and that we should all of us have open and frank conversation with doctors as we, or our loved ones, age.
Fantastic post!I'll put this statement here (for everyone, not you Ken), please consider it for a moment: we are all going to die.
Everyone goes: yeah, of course we are, I know that. But try to talk to family about an aged family member with multiple morbidities they say no no no we want everything done, of course we want him/her to be resuscitated if their heart stops, why wouldn't we? He/she is all we've got.
Or some Doctors/other health care professionals avoid these conversations. I once met a 100 year old lady with many health problems and the nursing home said there wasn't a TEP in place as they were still waiting to have that discussion with the family. She'd been there 8 years.....
We are all going to die. All of us. We hope it will be when we are old but some people die when they are young. For old people at end of life, and for those with untreatable conditions (or when treatment options have been exhausted) we cannot change the fact of death, the only thing we can change in some cases is the manner of death.
An elderly person in a nursing home, with heart failure, COPD, diabetics etc is going to die. Their heart will stop. You can choose to let them go peacefully.
Or you can say no no no do everything save their life. It is not their time to die. Dragging them onto the floor, breaking their ribs, sticking tubes down their throat, sticking needles in them, drilling into their bones, filling them with drugs, it not going to save their life. It is going to make their death horrific, for them, their family and indeed the medical staff. The very small number of times the resus works, these patient are nearly always brain damaged and never wake up, only to die a couple of days later out of sight in some side room at hospital.
I'm a paramedic and having to attempt resus on patients such as these is truly horrible. If only family understood what 'do everything you can' actually meant.
Resuscitation works in people who are otherwise healthy (or at least mostly healthy). I have resused people from young to late middle age. The oldest successful resus I have done was a person in their mid 60's. Yet, the majority of resus is done on the elderly with multiple health issues, where there is so little hope of a meaningful outcome it is almost zero.
I feel everyone in nursing homes should have TEP forms and that we should all of us have open and frank conversation with doctors as we, or our loved ones, age.
My mum recently passed, we were lucky as we had already spoken with her about resus and where to draw the line and let her go with dignity. When she arrived at the hospital the last time we could tell it was going to be the last time. The respite doctors had a word with us all and were happy that the correct decision was being made, they made her comfortable and I do like to think they helped her on her way. She passed with dignity and a loving family around her and we couldnt thank the hospital enough for their compassion.
Now compare that to the chap who was in the next room, who's family were shouting and screaming for someone to do something to help their dad/uncle/etc.... The guy was at least 70 and had the look of someone who was dying (that vacant face, waxy palor etc..), but his family shouted and screamed that something should be done. Until he too passed away, the family then were in the hallway shouting about law suits and malpractice because their relative was dead and not sat up chatting away to them.
Giving a loved one a dignified end with love and compassion is how it should be.
This old chap kinda crossed the line with shooting his old wife in the eye though!
Ken Figenus said:
JumboBeef said:
With respect and sorry to hear about your dad but why wasn't a TEP/DNACPR in place? This would have allowed him to slip away.
Thanks for making me aware of this, sadly. Then had a google - this NHS internal guidance is worth a read if this situation is likely to arise:https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
1. make a clinical decision on limiting / ceasing treatment options
2. have 'that' chat with the patient and/or family
JumboBeef said:
The problem is different areas of the NHS work to different TEP/DNACPR criteria. It's a nightmare. I hope Ken your Dad did eventually pass away pain free....
I'll put this statement here (for everyone, not you Ken), please consider it for a moment: we are all going to die.
Everyone goes: yeah, of course we are, I know that. But try to talk to family about an aged family member with multiple morbidities they say no no no we want everything done, of course we want him/her to be resuscitated if their heart stops, why wouldn't we? He/she is all we've got.
Or some Doctors/other health care professionals avoid these conversations. I once met a 100 year old lady with many health problems and the nursing home said there wasn't a TEP in place as they were still waiting to have that discussion with the family. She'd been there 8 years.....
We are all going to die. All of us. We hope it will be when we are old but some people die when they are young. For old people at end of life, and for those with untreatable conditions (or when treatment options have been exhausted) we cannot change the fact of death, the only thing we can change in some cases is the manner of death.
An elderly person in a nursing home, with heart failure, COPD, diabetes etc is going to die. Their heart will stop. You can choose to let them go peacefully.
Or you can say no no no do everything save their life. It is not their time to die. Dragging them onto the floor, breaking their ribs, sticking tubes down their throat, sticking needles in them, drilling into their bones, filling them with drugs, it not going to save their life. It is going to make their death horrific, for them, their family and indeed the medical staff. The very small number of times the resus works, these patient are nearly always brain damaged and never wake up, only to die a couple of days later out of sight in some side room at hospital.
I'm a paramedic and having to attempt resus on patients such as these is truly horrible. If only family understood what 'do everything you can' actually meant.
Resuscitation works in people who are otherwise healthy (or at least mostly healthy). I have resused people from young to late middle age. The oldest successful resus I have done was a person in their mid 60's. Yet, the majority of resus is done on the elderly with multiple health issues, where there is so little hope of a meaningful outcome it is almost zero.
I feel everyone in nursing homes should have TEP forms and that we should all of us have open and frank conversation with doctors as we, or our loved ones, age.
Good post mate - completely agree. To be fair my reasoning is to be empowered to help manage what I perceive as the default 'resuscitate/operate/revive' position of the professionals. Maybe this isn't really the practical case but it is the default 'safe' position despite it maybe not being in the best interests of a 90 year old with dementia and mets. That day hasn't come but every single decision must be in his best interests; the family has discussed and is aligned and crucially aligned with his views too. I'll put this statement here (for everyone, not you Ken), please consider it for a moment: we are all going to die.
Everyone goes: yeah, of course we are, I know that. But try to talk to family about an aged family member with multiple morbidities they say no no no we want everything done, of course we want him/her to be resuscitated if their heart stops, why wouldn't we? He/she is all we've got.
Or some Doctors/other health care professionals avoid these conversations. I once met a 100 year old lady with many health problems and the nursing home said there wasn't a TEP in place as they were still waiting to have that discussion with the family. She'd been there 8 years.....
We are all going to die. All of us. We hope it will be when we are old but some people die when they are young. For old people at end of life, and for those with untreatable conditions (or when treatment options have been exhausted) we cannot change the fact of death, the only thing we can change in some cases is the manner of death.
An elderly person in a nursing home, with heart failure, COPD, diabetes etc is going to die. Their heart will stop. You can choose to let them go peacefully.
Or you can say no no no do everything save their life. It is not their time to die. Dragging them onto the floor, breaking their ribs, sticking tubes down their throat, sticking needles in them, drilling into their bones, filling them with drugs, it not going to save their life. It is going to make their death horrific, for them, their family and indeed the medical staff. The very small number of times the resus works, these patient are nearly always brain damaged and never wake up, only to die a couple of days later out of sight in some side room at hospital.
I'm a paramedic and having to attempt resus on patients such as these is truly horrible. If only family understood what 'do everything you can' actually meant.
Resuscitation works in people who are otherwise healthy (or at least mostly healthy). I have resused people from young to late middle age. The oldest successful resus I have done was a person in their mid 60's. Yet, the majority of resus is done on the elderly with multiple health issues, where there is so little hope of a meaningful outcome it is almost zero.
I feel everyone in nursing homes should have TEP forms and that we should all of us have open and frank conversation with doctors as we, or our loved ones, age.
You cant fight the circle of life but you can do your very best for those you love to smooth the journey.
My mother had a stroke. She had a scan and the bleeding was continuing. An operation was possible but didn't go ahead. My belief is that my mother decided against it.
She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
Derek Smith said:
My mother had a stroke. She had a scan and the bleeding was continuing. An operation was possible but didn't go ahead. My belief is that my mother decided against it.
She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
Well said!She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
Derek Smith said:
My mother had a stroke. She had a scan and the bleeding was continuing. An operation was possible but didn't go ahead. My belief is that my mother decided against it.
She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
Such a pragmatic, mature, responsible and kind approach Derek. We owe it to society to further develop legislation and practice along these lines. We are often kinder to animals based on the same good and kind values...She had almost her whole family around her the day before she died; her two sons, her two daughter-in-laws, all but one of their kids - my youngest was on tour in Oz.
The following day we turned up to find her unplugged and completely unresponsive. We were told she would probably not last the day. My brother and I, with our wives, went to the coffee shop to discuss what we should do when we got a text to return to the ward. It brought the four of us closer, or even closer. Not a bad epitaph, mum.
The rotten thing about getting old is that it becomes a bit of a burden to know that when you die you will hurt those closest to you, your loved ones, the most.
My mother, in her way, took some of the pain away from us.
I don't know the answer to the problem of undignified death, but I do know we haven't got it right at the moment. I've seen what paramedics do to those who've collapsed on the street - doing their job to the best of their ability - I hope I don't go that way, especially in front of my loved ones.
I am going to die. I want it to happen in a way that puts the least pressure on those still alive. My government should stop reading the tabloid press and do something about it.
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