Cycle Event Marshals
Discussion
BMWBen said:
Earlier this week I was riding down a 30 limit road with a tailwind... comfortably doing just over 30mph. There's a shared cycle path often with dog walkers and pushchairs scattered around... You can guess where this is going...
First car behind me goes for an overtake, without understanding that the cyclist in front of them is going rather quickly and fails to judge the amount of space they need. Oncoming traffic has to brake hard and take evasive action. To their credit they didn't just swerve into me. Oooh loook a cyclist is in my way, I must get past it as soon as possible.
Next car behind decides that this sorry debacle is *my* fault. So starts revving his engine and hooting. Then goes for an overtake, pulls in front of me... brake tests me and swears at me and gestures that I should be on the cycle path. Brake tests me again, then speeds off at over 40.
The sad thing is that this is what we've come to expect. It's a very disappointing situation.
A bunch of fit cyclists against a fat motorist soon had him wishing he hadn't acted like a c**t.
mickmcpaddy said:
This power that is bestowed on these marshals, is it a permanent thing or applied on a race by race basis?
If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
As I understand it; If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
- the organiser has to apply to the Police for permission to run the race at a specific time/place and that they will have accredited marshals at it.
- accredited marshals have been assessed by British Cycling, have appropriate First Aid certificates and to retain their accreditation marshal at least 5 approved events a year.
mickmcpaddy said:
This power that is bestowed on these marshals, is it a permanent thing or applied on a race by race basis?
If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
Permanent. Powers similar to 16th Century Land Owners. Ultimate power, granted by the Crown, seize assets as they please, run non-cyclists through with a sword and take the bed of any newly-wed virgin.If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
mickmcpaddy said:
This power that is bestowed on these marshals, is it a permanent thing or applied on a race by race basis?
If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
AFAIA marshals should be be accredited and even then the local plod has to give permission for them to stop traffic for each specific race. It's the motorist's choice if they stop or not. Pretty bloody-minded not to though.If its permanent can they just rock up wherever they want and start a race.
The Accredited Marshal scheme is being rolled out across the country, and the intention is that all road races will have at least 2 marshals, but preferably all Accrediteds on the key junctions (invariably a left turn - only the closed road races will have racers turning right) .
Think of them as having the same powers as a lollipop man - they can legally stop traffic, and report drivers who fail to stop. The police do take their reports seriously.
Despite our best efforts, they are not armed.
As for cycle races - the earlier poster was correct - you need a Police Permit, on a course which has been risk assessed by BC and the police. There will usually be an officer (Traffic Management Advisor or similar) in each force who will liaise with event organisers and British Cycling, same officer usually deals with exceptional loads, fun runs, large military convoy liaison etc.
This is set out under the Cycle Racing on Highways (amendment) Regulations 1995 (under this racers can be prosecuted if they fail to adhere to observe mandatory traffic signs and regulations - so it polices the cyclists and organisers as well)
It's getting more streamlined but there's quite a bit of paperwork - you can't just chuck a race on.
The police usually prefer accredited marshals to be in attendance, and will usually ask for the NEG riders to be covering the race as well. Probably several of you guys on here- many ex plod or MoD who do a sterling effort of managing traffic as outriders to the peloton.
As someone who organises these races, we don't take it for granted and appreciate drivers who are patient, the work of the police and NEG and the locals.
anyhow, back to lurking...
Think of them as having the same powers as a lollipop man - they can legally stop traffic, and report drivers who fail to stop. The police do take their reports seriously.
Despite our best efforts, they are not armed.
As for cycle races - the earlier poster was correct - you need a Police Permit, on a course which has been risk assessed by BC and the police. There will usually be an officer (Traffic Management Advisor or similar) in each force who will liaise with event organisers and British Cycling, same officer usually deals with exceptional loads, fun runs, large military convoy liaison etc.
This is set out under the Cycle Racing on Highways (amendment) Regulations 1995 (under this racers can be prosecuted if they fail to adhere to observe mandatory traffic signs and regulations - so it polices the cyclists and organisers as well)
It's getting more streamlined but there's quite a bit of paperwork - you can't just chuck a race on.
The police usually prefer accredited marshals to be in attendance, and will usually ask for the NEG riders to be covering the race as well. Probably several of you guys on here- many ex plod or MoD who do a sterling effort of managing traffic as outriders to the peloton.
As someone who organises these races, we don't take it for granted and appreciate drivers who are patient, the work of the police and NEG and the locals.
anyhow, back to lurking...
Labradorofperception said:
The Accredited Marshal scheme is being rolled out across the country, and the intention is that all road races will have at least 2 marshals, but preferably all Accrediteds on the key junctions (invariably a left turn - only the closed road races will have racers turning right) .
Think of them as having the same powers as a lollipop man - they can legally stop traffic, and report drivers who fail to stop. The police do take their reports seriously.
Despite our best efforts, they are not armed.
As for cycle races - the earlier poster was correct - you need a Police Permit, on a course which has been risk assessed by BC and the police. There will usually be an officer (Traffic Management Advisor or similar) in each force who will liaise with event organisers and British Cycling, same officer usually deals with exceptional loads, fun runs, large military convoy liaison etc.
This is set out under the Cycle Racing on Highways (amendment) Regulations 1995 (under this racers can be prosecuted if they fail to adhere to observe mandatory traffic signs and regulations - so it polices the cyclists and organisers as well)
It's getting more streamlined but there's quite a bit of paperwork - you can't just chuck a race on.
The police usually prefer accredited marshals to be in attendance, and will usually ask for the NEG riders to be covering the race as well. Probably several of you guys on here- many ex plod or MoD who do a sterling effort of managing traffic as outriders to the peloton.
As someone who organises these races, we don't take it for granted and appreciate drivers who are patient, the work of the police and NEG and the locals.
anyhow, back to lurking...
Thanks for your input, when you say 'race' though, dies this also apply to club time trials?Think of them as having the same powers as a lollipop man - they can legally stop traffic, and report drivers who fail to stop. The police do take their reports seriously.
Despite our best efforts, they are not armed.
As for cycle races - the earlier poster was correct - you need a Police Permit, on a course which has been risk assessed by BC and the police. There will usually be an officer (Traffic Management Advisor or similar) in each force who will liaise with event organisers and British Cycling, same officer usually deals with exceptional loads, fun runs, large military convoy liaison etc.
This is set out under the Cycle Racing on Highways (amendment) Regulations 1995 (under this racers can be prosecuted if they fail to adhere to observe mandatory traffic signs and regulations - so it polices the cyclists and organisers as well)
It's getting more streamlined but there's quite a bit of paperwork - you can't just chuck a race on.
The police usually prefer accredited marshals to be in attendance, and will usually ask for the NEG riders to be covering the race as well. Probably several of you guys on here- many ex plod or MoD who do a sterling effort of managing traffic as outriders to the peloton.
As someone who organises these races, we don't take it for granted and appreciate drivers who are patient, the work of the police and NEG and the locals.
anyhow, back to lurking...
Time trials tend to be much less regulated (though you still need the permit).
Usually it's a case of having the course risk assessed and signed off by the police. A typical club 10 should just require a note early season with a list of the intended dates to the Police - often this will be done en-block by the local area committee.
There are various regs to be adhered to - one is that riders must set off at least 1 minute apart (often it's 2 so it's unusual to step outside this requirement).
A larger event such as an open 25 will usually require a specific sign off. It's more of a formality really so the local nick know what's going on. They're usually early on a Sunday, on an A road, so we often get a traffic car turning up to kill time, check we're behaving (but really it's because there's usually tea and cake).
TT courses tend to not vary much, so it's quite straightforward to meet the regs in the RTA 88/91 and Cycle Racing Highways 1960.
The history of road racing and TTing in the UK is pretty interesting - TTing was borne out of a ban on racing due to some aristo's horse getting startled back in 1900 and flump. Riders would turn up at pre-arranged coded venues, and start 2 minutes apart. Since they had a reasonable gap, it could not be claimed they were racing each other. Even now, the courses have a code and we all meet wearing pointy hats in the full moon to sacrifice mountain bikers......
Given that it was a team support car.
Unable to avoid a traffic island?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/44028217
Just look at the car's trajectory.
The team's direcor should be charged with DWDCA.
Maybe it's not just competitors who are taking the dodgy stuff...?
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/mar/05/team...
Labradorofperception said:
Even now, the courses have a code and we all meet wearing pointy hats in the full moon to sacrifice mountain bikers......
You'd have to catch us first! I can ride my MTB on the road but your skinny tyred fun sponge will be floundering when I'm escaping through sun dappled singletrack 
Paulm4 said:
Labradorofperception said:
Even now, the courses have a code and we all meet wearing pointy hats in the full moon to sacrifice mountain bikers......
You'd have to catch us first! I can ride my MTB on the road but your skinny tyred fun sponge will be floundering when I'm escaping through sun dappled singletrack 
Undecided yet as to whether this...
...is a best of both worlds tool for extending my ride boundaries and wringing more fun out of riding, or a worst of both worlds compromise where it's too slow to be a road bike, but not sturdy/nimble enough to be much use as a MTB.
But it's running 38c (half-inch) tyres and copes well with local single track, although not as quickly as my MTB would.
Paulm4 said:
Labradorofperception said:
Even now, the courses have a code and we all meet wearing pointy hats in the full moon to sacrifice mountain bikers......
You'd have to catch us first! I can ride my MTB on the road but your skinny tyred fun sponge will be floundering when I'm escaping through sun dappled singletrack 
So it happened to me today.
There was a large cycle event taking place today in the county where I live. My understanding of the event is that it covers 100 miles or so in a circular route and was electronically timed.
There were marshalls in high viz at every corner to make sure the cyclists took the correct turns.
The roads were mostly 60mph and through occasional 30mph zones.
It was all fine, and I didn't mind the 2000+ cyclists (apparently there were nearly 3000). Took my time getting past the riders and tried to give as much space as possible and so on.
But the one thing did piss me off, was that on one long straight where the riders joined the A-Road that I happened to be on, there were two marshals who simply stepped out into the road in front of me and made me stop so that a bunch of riders could cycle right out into the road without having to slow down or look for traffic, despite them crossing a 'Give away' as they joined the main road at speed.
This was repeated every time riders approached.
They didn't have red flags or anything apart from a high viz vest on.
There were no road signs indicating that main road traffic may have to stop.
So my question is:
As a motorist, how do I know if the Marshals have the right to stop traffic for the cyclists or not?
Lord Marylebone said:
So it happened to me today.
There was a large cycle event taking place today in the county where I live. My understanding of the event is that it covers 100 miles or so in a circular route and was electronically timed.
There were marshalls in high viz at every corner to make sure the cyclists took the correct turns.
The roads were mostly 60mph and through occasional 30mph zones.
It was all fine, and I didn't mind the 2000+ cyclists (apparently there were nearly 3000). Took my time getting past the riders and tried to give as much space as possible and so on.
But the one thing did piss me off, was that on one long straight where the riders joined the A-Road that I happened to be on, there were two marshals who simply stepped out into the road in front of me and made me stop so that a bunch of riders could cycle right out into the road without having to slow down or look for traffic, despite them crossing a 'Give away' as they joined the main road at speed.
This was repeated every time riders approached.
They didn't have red flags or anything apart from a high viz vest on.
There were no road signs indicating that main road traffic may have to stop.
So my question is:
As a motorist, how do I know if the Marshals have the right to stop traffic for the cyclists or not?
What was the event? I'm genuinely surprised that such a sizeable event was on mostly 60mph roads. Events of that size usually go to great lengths to stick to low speed, quiet B-Roads.There was a large cycle event taking place today in the county where I live. My understanding of the event is that it covers 100 miles or so in a circular route and was electronically timed.
There were marshalls in high viz at every corner to make sure the cyclists took the correct turns.
The roads were mostly 60mph and through occasional 30mph zones.
It was all fine, and I didn't mind the 2000+ cyclists (apparently there were nearly 3000). Took my time getting past the riders and tried to give as much space as possible and so on.
But the one thing did piss me off, was that on one long straight where the riders joined the A-Road that I happened to be on, there were two marshals who simply stepped out into the road in front of me and made me stop so that a bunch of riders could cycle right out into the road without having to slow down or look for traffic, despite them crossing a 'Give away' as they joined the main road at speed.
This was repeated every time riders approached.
They didn't have red flags or anything apart from a high viz vest on.
There were no road signs indicating that main road traffic may have to stop.
So my question is:
As a motorist, how do I know if the Marshals have the right to stop traffic for the cyclists or not?
I did the Tour de Yorkshire sportive last Sunday week, there was less than 5% on A-roads, and in 140km, I don't think we touched a 60-limit road.
Ares said:
What was the event? I'm genuinely surprised that such a sizeable event was on mostly 60mph roads. Events of that size usually go to great lengths to stick to low speed, quiet B-Roads.
I did the Tour de Yorkshire sportive last Sunday week, there was less than 5% on A-roads, and in 140km, I don't think we touched a 60-limit road.
The event is was called the Fred Whitton Challenge according to a brief google search.I did the Tour de Yorkshire sportive last Sunday week, there was less than 5% on A-roads, and in 140km, I don't think we touched a 60-limit road.
https://www.fredwhittonchallenge.co.uk
The vast majority of the Lakes/Cumbria is National Speed Limit, and only slowing to 40/30 when in villages and towns, which are sometimes few and far between.
To have an event in the heart of the Lakes on a Sunday when the place is utterly rammed with 60mph tourist traffic on really quite narrow old roads seems like the opposite of fun for me.
3000 cyclists spread over 110 miles of busy roads meant drivers were (more or less) having to get past 20-30 or so cyclists every mile.
I've noticed that one part of the route was a closed road, but that only forms a relatively minor uphill section out of the whole route.
The race was all day from 6am to 6pm.
I reiterate I personally have no issues with cyclists enjoying an event, and I try to give them all the room they need, be patient and all that sort of thing, but it did cause chaos in the lakes that day, and many motorists aren't like me... they just see hundreds of cyclists for mile after mile and the 'squeezing past them at speed' I witnessed was frightening at times.
Like I said, it was just the traffic being stopped by marshalls that annoyed me, and I want to know where I stand for next time.
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