Sport 160 advice

Author
Discussion

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
I already own an s1, but i'm seriously contemplating a sport 160 thats for sale in the area. Not really that technically minded and just want to know what i should watch for when viewing? Any advice from the 160 guys? (not pointing any fingers)

I know that that the car has three previous owners (27,000 miles) and no full service history.

Cheers

Davey S1

13,209 posts

264 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
kill_zippy said:
I know that that the car has no full service history.

Cheers


I would walk away then unless its very cheap.

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
maybe i should quote the owner "full service history, but not a full Lotus service history".

What you think?

sneakypete

173 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Not worth it unless it has some kind of history. I saw a very nice 03 plate with low milage but no books - but went for a 52 with full history and a few more miles. Walk away. There's plenty out there with good histories.

sneakypete

173 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Aha. That's different. If it has been done on time by specialists then no problem.

paulwakinshaw

436 posts

250 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
apart from the usual S1 problems which you will be familiar with already, the S160 has some distinct differences.

First of all you need to find out if its a SVA or a WTVA model. Its probably not a SVA as only 50 were produced but you need to find out. If its a WTVA the ECU will be hiding in the boot and not the engine bay.

Both cars idle like a bit of a pig and have a tendency to kangaroo at lower revs. The best way to sort it is to fit verniers and get an Emerald fitted and mapped. this will probably set you back £1200 inc fitting but will be worth it just to make sure its running smooth. you might be able to wind a bit more power from it too.

Tyres are always a big issue with Elise owners, if it has some crap rubber on it means it has probably been looked after on a really tight budget and that can point to other budget cutting measures, as you say not all of the history is there. How much is the guy asking for it?

Wako

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Might be stooopid, but this is going to be my daily car.....

It has potenzas and the guy is asking £14,800.

paulwakinshaw

436 posts

250 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
£14,800 - lot of loot considering that even W plate standard S1's are going for £12500-£13000.

Ok, you get some snazzy seats, LSS, nice wheels, 150BHP (on WTVA Model) a Janspeed 4-2-1 manifold and thats about it over a normal S1 I think. Not worth it IMHO. Why do you fancy it?

If you keep your car (is it S1 or S2) you could throw £3k at the engine and have 160+BHP or spend £2k on the engine and £1k on the suspension upgrades and have a car of equal or better spec.

S160's seem to have an aura of exclusivity about them, like the holy grail of S1's but as with most thing Lotus, it's a clever marketing ploy of low volume specials that keeps the price high.

S Works has one and he seems to be really happy with his.

Wako

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
I like the colour (scandal green) compared to my silver and when i consider the fuss and time my car would be away to be upgraded it seems like the easy option. Plus resale value and yes, the exclusivity. The extras of course make it worth my while.....

paulwakinshaw

436 posts

250 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
well like I said budget £1200 for the bits and pieces to make it run nicely.

If its scandal green your gonnna get noticed!

Get the full spec from the guy selling, things like exhaust it has, brakes, suspension changes etc. Service history is essential and find out which specialist has been servicing it and come back here so that others can give you an idea on the specialist.

Wako

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
thanks for you help. Will get on the phone...

paulwakinshaw

436 posts

250 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
just seen it on auto trader - looks nice with black wheels.

ok, check/haggle list

Check exhaust - If mild steel check its not rotting and that includes manifold too.
Service history - find out where it was bought from, who has serviced it from new and where the last service was done
Cabelt - has it been changed, if not you want at least £400 knocked off as thats what a specilist will charge to do a C service.
general wear and tear - you know what your looking for here.
HGF - white slime under the oil filler cap and its going to die soon.

I am assuming your in scotland, where abouts?

Wako

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
The car is in Falkirk, which is 15 miles away from me in Midcalder. It does look like a nice car and i know it has a janspeed exhaust and k&n air filter, which i would swap for the ITG.

Its the double of another sport 160 that lives 2 minutes away from me.

paulwakinshaw

436 posts

250 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
ok, well ask all of the right questions and see where you get to. Also consider getting a specilist to look over the car to see if there are any hidden probs.

Wako

kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Here's an update.

The current owner bought the car from Indy car sales at 18k miles, and his friend's dad has been the one who has been servicing the car ever since(with items fron eliseparts). He did sound like he knew a bit about cars, and i dont know whether that would be a good or bad sign.

Do you reckon this is a no-go? He did say that someone travelled from London to have a look, but obviously decided against buying.

S Works

10,166 posts

260 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Right, first up, I echo MOST of what Wako says, but you certainly won't need to spend a grand+ on it unless its to replace wear and tear parts.

First, is it a Sport 160 or a Sport 160S. There is a difference, the former having 111s seats, victory ally's and the 160 engine, an LS can and a few other bits n bobs (spoiler fared in headlights etc).

The latter has all the above, plus LSS (running at 100/110), ARB, oil cooler and lightweight seats with alcantara inserts. Also most cars have the 2nd airbox removed and are de-catted to liberate the full 160 ponies (or thereabouts). Mine was RR'd last year at 158 which I think is pretty good. The 160S is also rarer, was more expensive and commands a premium on the used market of around £500-1k I'd say due to the above.

Personally I wanted a 160S even though there are a few good 160's around. The package was what I would have worked towards anyway and I like the fact that it is what it is, not a halfway house.

Why do I say you don't need to spend £1200? Well unless its a SVA car then you should not NEED to do this. Mine's had the 2nd airbox removed, is as it left the factory and despite being a bit lumpy on idle (which I just love) it's perfectly driveable. You just have to have some mechanical sympathy and adapt your style to drive around it's little idiosyncracies.

I spoke to Bruce (Ragtop Roadsters) about this whole verniers and Emerald thing (and also NItrons vs LSS) and he advised that sure it's a good thing if you want to play with it, but if the car's OK as-is, and you like the top end grunt then don't fiddle. If you want to move the powerband around then verniers is the way to go. I'm going to see how I get on with it for a few months and try to get into a car which has had this done in the meantime.

Anyway, Paul's notes on what to check are well noted - basically the same as for any other Elise. Also check around the underside of the front clam for grounding out, along the rear diffuser, and also check the inside of the front arches for fouling (most do this if running 100 on the front) because the LSS dampers are really too soft under load. I will be getting mine raised to about 110/120 soon and re-geo'd to compensate. If I start doing trackwork I'll consider nitrons, upgrading to Exige springs or doing the S2 kit.

Back to the car you're looking at. The price is WAY too high. With those miles and a non specialist or Lotus SH, you can bargain. Probably you should be looking to pay £12.5k to £13k. I paid £13.5ish for one with 24k on the clock, almost perfect nick and with full history from main dealers and reputable specialists. Also get it checked over by someone who knows these cars, not the AA or RAC.

Scandal Green is the mutts nuts - if you like it go for it.

Tim

P.S. for similar money, you could tune a 111s to nearly 160bhp with a good exhaust, CRP or sports cat and decent induction (IIRC). Think about that too as an option.

>> Edited by S Works on Thursday 14th July 09:30

Kill_zippy

Original Poster:

53 posts

239 months

Wednesday 13th July 2005
quotequote all
Thaks for all the above Tim. I really dont know why you are so generous with info, as it must take ages to type, but i really really appreciate the help.

I'd love to include a link to the car, as its on the auto trader site, but dont think its possible (certainly not for me). Perhaps you could take a glance yourself? Its in Falkirk, roughly 250 miles from you, and is scandal green.

tuscan_thunder

1,763 posts

256 months

Thursday 14th July 2005
quotequote all
kill_zippy said:
Here's an update.

The current owner bought the car from Indy car sales at 18k miles, and his friend's dad has been the one who has been servicing the car ever since(with items fron eliseparts). He did sound like he knew a bit about cars, and i dont know whether that would be a good or bad sign.

Do you reckon this is a no-go? He did say that someone travelled from London to have a look, but obviously decided against buying.


AVOID! 'that dealer' does NOT have a good reputation. I'm not sure how this goes with PH name and shame policy, but I seriously suggest you avoid this car.

S Works

10,166 posts

260 months

Thursday 14th July 2005
quotequote all
Kill_zippy said:
Thaks for all the above Tim. I really dont know why you are so generous with info, as it must take ages to type, but i really really appreciate the help.

You're very welcome mate. Why do I do it? a) because I love the marque and the Elise, b) because I'm a bit of a nerd, and c) because so many people have helped me in the past and I believe in karma

However, bear tuscan_thunder's words of advice. Suggest you email him privately for more info rather than speculate on the boards and break Ted's rules.

tuscan_thunder

1,763 posts

256 months

Thursday 14th July 2005
quotequote all
I won't be able to check my email which is linked to PH but the car in question sat at the aforementioned dealer for, I think, more than a year. this coupled with 'other issues' would put me off the car